Apple's 20 / 23 / 30-inch Cinema Displays get bumps, price cuts

Looks like there was still a little bit that didn't make it into Steve's keynote yesterday that'll make it a little easier to sink a couple grand into a new Mac Pro: Apple's 20, 23, and 30-inch Cinema Displays all got price cuts and spec bumps. Their 20-inch is now down to $699 from $799, their 23-inch is way down to $999 from $1,299, and their 30-inch is way, way freaking down to $1999 from $2499; likewise, the 20-inch now has a 300cd/m2 brightness, up from 250cd/m2, while the 23 and 30-inchers hit a 400cd/m2 brightness up from 270cd/m2; all have a 700:1 contrast ratio, up from 400:1. Still not quite competitive enough to best Dell's 800:1 contrast ratio / 300cd/m2 20-inch 2007WFP, their 1000:1 contrast ratio / 450cd/m2 24-inch 2407WFP, but the 3007WFP 30-inch is a at a comparable 400cd/m2 brightness and 700:1 contrast ratio -- so but they sure are trying. How you like 'dem Apples?

[Via TUAW]

[Tim UF @ Aug 8th 2006 10:26AM]

not to mention:
(Apple aesthetics) > (Dell aesthetics)

[Mike @ Aug 8th 2006 10:31AM]

Not competitive in terms of brightness and contrast? As always, take these numbers with a grain of salt. It's well know fact that there is no standard for measuring brightness and contrast, not to mention that manufacturers NEVER report these accurately.

If anything, Apple's numbers are honest; Dell's are not. I have seen both the 20" Cinema Display and Dell's 20" from last year. The Dell had higher numbers, though both panels were virtually identical. What does that tell you?

[Alex @ Aug 8th 2006 10:33AM]

100 bucks off the 20" in the US maybe - only 20 quid here in the UK.

Grumble grumble.

[Brendan @ Aug 8th 2006 10:34AM]

You guys never mentioned the 30" got a price cut of $500??

[Jared @ Aug 8th 2006 10:41AM]

How long has the 30in model been $1999? I was at the local Apple Store this weekend and they listed at $2500.

[Brendan @ Aug 8th 2006 10:42AM]

"How long has the 30in model been $1999?"

1 day!

[Thataboy @ Aug 8th 2006 10:53AM]

The 30" was just reduced yesterday.

The 23" and 30" displays are pretty competitively priced. The 20" is still too expensive.

Of course, you can get good quality LCDs from other manfacturers for less.... but they are almost universally ugly. It boggles the mind that a company will put a gorgeous LCD panel in a cheap, bulky plastic enclosure. The Dells are especially ugly, but budget-priced Viewsonics, Acers, Samsungs, etc., are bad too. The only attractive non-Apple panel I've seen are the Sony ones, and they cost as much as, or more, than the Apples.

Would it kill these companies to put some thought into design? Rip Apple off if you must, but these bulky plastic things are an eyesore.

[Robert @ Aug 8th 2006 10:55AM]

the 20" uses the same samsung panel as the dell but dell has always said they had better numbers. The dell lcds have much more problems with the backlighting and dead pixels too. Still the dell is a bit cheaper but doesnt look near as good.

[bob @ Aug 8th 2006 10:58AM]

airport extreme was price cut to!!!

[Joe Loy @ Aug 8th 2006 11:00AM]

They couldn't mention the Apple 30" price drop because it is now cheaper than the standard price of a Dell 3007WFP 30", and that would make engadget the fury of angry Dell/PC fans trying to proclaim that you can get a cheap Dell 30" with rebates and such... The anti-Apple sentiment is very thick around here lately.

[Dolomite @ Aug 8th 2006 11:01AM]

With the recent string of spontaneous combustion and exploding computers, it is of some comfort that the metal enclosure should be somewhat more fire resistant than the plastic found on Dell.

[cycomachead @ Aug 8th 2006 11:02AM]

wow.. this is nice
Although the was only a $50 drop in the EDu price for the 20, so still out of my range, being I just got the MacBook
but this was a good move
yeah Dells are bad
And I think the 20 is still a little too much
I don't know about numbers and such, I know that the brightness has gone up pretty much regardless of the numbers (logic)- and that's good

yeah Nec makes a few nice displays too, but they can be way more than Apple, so the LaCie, but still more expensive
Al least it feels good lookin at an Apple display

[KawF @ Aug 8th 2006 11:02AM]

Seriously.... I want one of these (30")... if only they'd make them at 40+ inches. Just imagine it. A "TV" with 1600p (2560x1600) resolution. The dell has an HDMI-input and the apple as far as I know has DVI so it should be possible to hook up any HDMI source to it, unfortunatley without support for HDCP then perhaps. Then again, I'm not certain about HDCP on the Dell-screen either.

Still, that's some amazing resolution on those screens. And at that price. Sweet.

[z @ Aug 8th 2006 11:03AM]

seems apple 20'' is 14ms and dell 16ms, does that make a difference?

[Jeff @ Aug 8th 2006 11:12AM]

These numbers are all pretty meaningless, in all honesty. It would be great if you could really get a real contrast ratio spec but the problem is you're trying to glean meaningful info without a reference point. It's like saying one car has an acceleration ratio of 100 and another has an acceleration ratio of 120. What the hell does that mean? Nothing, because you don't know what gear that's measured in, what speed the cars are travelling when it's measured, etc.

You need one more piece of info in order to make these monitor stats meaningful, and that's the black point. That spec is available but it's not usually published in press releases. I don't know what it is for Apple's vs. Dell's displays, or anybody else's. But that's the reference point that you need.

"Brightness" is meaningless on its face because all LCD's are too bright. I have Apple's "old" 23" Cinema Display HD and I have the brightness level turned down to about 50% and even that's borderline too bright (it's both inaccurate for doing photo or other graphics work and also just plain bad for the eyes). So you can pretty much just ignore this spec.

Contrast is important but you need to know the reference point. Without it, one display could barely be able to approximate grey and it could still have better contrast than one that got close to true black strictly by the use of overly powerful backlights (so the top part of the contrast range would be completely unuseable, but would still make it into the spec). You need to know the bottom of the range, which is by far the more important these days.

[master_of_fm @ Aug 8th 2006 11:24AM]

@ShermDidIt

you must be reading about the early rev 2407s (A00 & A01), the rev A02 are much better and are not plagued by the problems of the earlier revs

@Thataboy

most of the WUXGA monitors out there are in really ugly cabinets, but the Dell 2407 is probably the next best display aesthically to the Apple 23 inch. While the 2405 was ugly, the 2407 has a nice black bezel and I think looks really sharp.

but for general use, gaming, and the functionality of the display you really cant beat the price. both Extremetech and Bit-Tech had really good reviews of the 2407WFP and both said that there are better monitors out there but currently you cant beat/value of the display. And after having mine for almost a week now it pains me to come to work since I have 18" NEC at my desk.

[shaun @ Aug 8th 2006 11:35AM]

ooooohhhh!

I can't wait to see the new mail stationary and to-do's in all that 30 in glory!

[William McIntosh @ Aug 8th 2006 11:41AM]

no i sight .still?

[Fraser @ Aug 8th 2006 11:42AM]

I really like the apple displays, and would buy one if i wasn't so skint!
I don't know about the competition, but apple monitors have the advantage of having desktop firewire/usb on the monitor, which to me would be very practical: I know its only a small thing, but its those thing that make the difference between 2 near-identical products!!

[Phobos @ Aug 8th 2006 11:42AM]

Too bad you have to pay $30 more to make these things vesa compliant, something almost every other company has standard.

[TIMMAH! @ Aug 8th 2006 11:45AM]

For the price of the Apple 20", you could have gotten a dual Dell 20" setup for about $50 more in the last sale that they had (2007FP for around $250 - and this is not even the widescreen one so you're actually getting about 13% more pixels than the 2007FPW.)

[TIMMAH! @ Aug 8th 2006 11:48AM]

Sorry, that should have read "$350" for the Dell 2007FP. The Apple screen is way overpriced.

[LukeA @ Aug 8th 2006 12:06PM]

@TIMMAH!

May I introduce you to the comma?

[Aviva @ Aug 8th 2006 12:15PM]

Well, Apple is more conservative in their spec estimates (on displays) than Dell is anyway. Plus, these are S-IPS panels, so it makes the comparison even harder... 20" one is overpriced, though. But, I might get a 23" one with my student discount.

[ZAMBONO @ Aug 8th 2006 12:17PM]

Could it be that there are new monitors coming with the i-sight built in. that would be a very nice touch from Apple and would further differntiate it from the competition since they are quite similar right now. I actually don't think that a new monitor with isight is coming because if so the price drop and a spec bump wouldn't have made sense. Business wise you would have lowered the price but left the spec bump to the new model with the isight. Maybe in 6 months.

[ZAMBONO @ Aug 8th 2006 12:19PM]

Oh and I am writing from a 30 Apple right now, and needless to say its stunning. Space for all the engadget blogs and work simultaneously. lol

[ShermDidIt @ Aug 8th 2006 12:48PM]

@master_of_fm:

I wish I was just speaking of the early revisions of the 2407 but read further and see that the issues haven't really been resolved. I can say from first-hand experience that I do notice the gradient banding issue and backlight uniformity problems on my roomates 2407. The HPL2335 has better, more accurate color, better viewing angle, no input lag, and a better technology IPS panel as opposed to MVA. My roomate wishes he bought the 2335 but is really happy with the great deal he got for the 2407. You'll find a lot of 2407 users ignoring the 2407's problems because of it's awesome price. The 2335 has issues with backlight bleeding (which I fortunately haven't had problems with)but personally, I'm waiting for the new S-IPS panels to come out to upgrade. If you don't need the extra inputs, the Apple panel is still the better technology.

[Jeff Foster @ Aug 8th 2006 1:03PM]

Still no iSight? boooo!

If they're going to be premium-priced, they may as well have some neat features.

and Apple's displays, aesthetically, are FAR superior than any of their competition, but i'm not sure it's worth the price.

[master_of_fm @ Aug 8th 2006 1:25PM]

@ShermDidIt

I tried searching for info on input lag for the 2407 and I can really find anything, with mine i have no input lag whatsoever. the one instance i could find regarding input lag was that the guy just didnt have a video card that could push 1920x1200 in games. plus i bought mine through Costco.com, so if at any time for any reason I am unhappy with it I just box it up and take it back to my local costco. also like computer parts themselves, something better and cheaper will always come along. you just have to buy what gives you the best value for what you do. if i was a professional photographer i wouldnt have even considered the 2407.

btw the way HP has a new WUXGA monitor the LP246 it has dual dvi inputs and specs that are better than the 2407, but no details on the what technology the panel uses

[d3 @ Aug 8th 2006 1:47PM]

higher brightness != better quality

[Ninja-Joe @ Aug 8th 2006 1:48PM]

There's something to be said for the height adjustment standard on dells, absent on the apples. I would take inferior aesthetics over inferior ergonomics any day.

[mingt @ Aug 8th 2006 2:46PM]

Wait a minute graphic pros? The apples have a huge silver frame and is very distracting. Esp in a dual setup. Unless your buying purely for looks alone. I have dual 24"dell 2405 that i bought each for $750 new. Dells have a less than 1" black matte frame perfect for dual setups plus i magic marker out the dell logo(which is hideous). The image is great. Plus all the inputs, 1080i, PIP, and adjustability. Ill tell you that my xbox 360 in widescreen HD looks amazing on it (components).

[Gilbert Jonathan Garcia @ Aug 8th 2006 6:53PM]

dell, apple, whateva. I got a 21 inch Gateway monitor with 300 cd/m2 brightness and 1000:1 contrast ratio. its got a 16:10 aspect ratio and it can be turned 90 degress, i can hook it up to my powerbook or my desktop via dvi, vga or s-video, has component and even composit imput aswell, along with a picture in picture and not to shabby 1680x1050 resolution. and it only cost me $499. screw apple and dell.

[Serpent @ Aug 8th 2006 8:21PM]

I'm hoping for some new models pre-ps3 release.

If Apple add iSight and HDCP, it's game over!

[Bret Baptist @ Aug 9th 2006 1:47AM]

I think the newer Samsungs are really attractive too.

The Samsung 244t gets great reviews and looks awesome to boot. It also has a ton of connectors and adjustments.

http://www.samsung.com/Products/Monitor/LCD_Multi_Function/LS24BRBABXAA.asp

[keith waddington @ Aug 9th 2006 3:19AM]

To be honest it's better that the new displays do not have isight because then apple would drop the stand alone cam. The isight cam seems expensive until you use it. the built in mic has noise cancellation so it ignores the other persons voice coming out of your speakers and prevents a feedback loop. So you can chat with no headset. The isight also has auto focus: the built in models and web cams for windows have fixed focus.

So the stand alone iSight is a real winner and the first time you video conference with a relative/friend in a far away place, with perfect smooth video and audio in perfect syc, with video so clear you can go full screen on a 20 inch display, well the cost of it seems like nothing and you will wonder why you waited so long to buy one.

Of course you need a mac and ichat for all this, but really it's amazing.

waddo

http://www.waddo.net/

[slick @ Aug 9th 2006 9:19AM]

I 2nd Bret's comment about the rave reviews Samsung 244t has been getting.
I'm gonna get one.

[ShermDidIt @ Mar 3rd 2008 9:53PM]

The 2407 is not up to snuff. Just read all the user reviews/gripes on hardforum. Dell's inflated numbers don't add up to much when my HPL2335 (same panel as previous apple lcds) bests the dell in every way.