PlayStation 3: T-minus 3 months, not started manufacturing
By Ryan Block 
posted August 22nd 2006 2:12AM
posted August 22nd 2006 2:12AM
Pretty bold move, Hirai, to admit that you're less than three months out from the global launch of what could be one of the most expensive propositions Sony has ever undertaken -- and you haven't even started manufacturing. According to Kaz, who recently spoke with GameSpot, Sony "haven't started manufacturing yet. Some of [their] ops guys were actually just in China, and also in Japan just reviewing the [production] lines and everything else." Oh, great, you've got two million units to whip up and you're still in the review process. That's over 660,000 units a month if they start, um, tomorrow. Look, we're not saying it can't be done, but unless the hefty price tag of the Blu-ray behemoth outstrips consumer interest, it seems like we could be in for some serious shortages come the holiday buying season.[Via GamesIndustry.biz]
What has sony been doing right lately anyway? Aside from releasing pink old products...
-Taylor
They are seriously messing up...
there wont be any shortages because no one is going to spend $800 after tax and a game for a playstation 2 with the 2 crossed out and a 3 inserted. Most kids (and adults) gamers dont care about blu-ray, especially enough to fork over that kind of dough.
"there wont be any shortages because no one is going to spend $800 after tax and a game for a playstation 2 with the 2 crossed out and a 3 inserted."
this is probably the MOST RETARDED comment i've EVER seen on engadget. they probably wont buy it but how is a PS3 a ps2? (maybe you're thinking about backwards compatibility hmmm...)
...anyways yes sony is pretty stupid for waiting this long
You know, Sony has made one wrong turn after another. The Sony fan boys have been bragging about how good this thing is going to be, but with the price tag they are going to come out with, and the fact that just about everything Sony has been doing as of late has literally been blowing up (Dell Batteries), I am wondering how well this thing will really sell.
I know Sony Fan Boys will be there, and formally being one I hope it does well, for the sake that Sony continually fails in many areas, but I am happy with my XBOX 360, and unless something amazing comes out and the PS3 is REALLY worth it, I think that Sony will once again fail, loosing the lead to it's competitors.
I mean they could have had some AMAZING MP3 players, but they didn't want to support MP3's, and required you to convert (in a painfully slow process). They killed their wonderful PDA line, although that was a good choice because of the decline of the standalone PDA. They release their own memory cards, keeping many people from buying their cameras for the fact of having to buy new memory. They put spyware on discs. Heck they continually make choices to "protect" their content, which just kills their possibility for making wonderful and easy to use products. Wrong decision, wrong decision, bang, there goes the lead to competitors... I think I am going to sell my Sony stock, oh wait, I did that just before the spyware incident...
So, that equates to a total of 15 consoles completed every minute?
Or, one complete every 4 seconds?
I hope they've hired faster assembly line workers.
Vaporware???
Seriously, dare I say it? I feel like at this point they're gonna be like me and my papers, come the night before, fall asleep (we've just been lazy up to this point), wake up in the morning with nothing to show.
Please Sony, prove me wrong.
Evan, what you're saying makes sense, but I think it won't be just $800...
Assuming you won't upgrade your TV and/or surround sound speaker system, which can easily cost thousands, this is probably what you will end up buying:
1 PS3 + at least 1 extra controller + at least 1 memory card/stick + at least 1 PS3 game + at least 1 BD movie. Then pay tax.
All that add together will be very close to, if not over, $1000. You won't be satisfied with only 1 game and/or 1 BD movie, which means you will very likely be spending way more than that...
I'll wait for the Phantom game console.
-Taylor
In other words, there's going to be about fifteen of these things ready at launch, meaning they'll have to be distributed by no-holds-barred steel cage matches that get broadcast on pay-per-view. Winner gets the right to buy a PS3, assuming they still have $600 after the hospital bills...
The PS3 will sell out for sure on the first day and will create the eBay fever where people will make killer profits because of the holiday craze (which I plan to capitalize on)
Michael,
I take it you meant "formerly", rather than "formally"?
Also, it's "losing", not "loosing."
Interestingly:
"Microsoft's first Xbox 360 did not roll off the assembly line last year until 69 days before the on sale date of Nov. 22."
So, Sony may have a slight advantage over the 360 launch. However, there's no doubt there will be shortages everywhere. It just remains to be seen how big these shortages will be.
http://money.cnn.com/2006/07/05/commentary/column_gaming/index.htm?section=money_latest
can't wait to get that PS3. 3 more months and I'm going to be in heaven.
Don't be shocked when Sony falls into 3rd place this time. Things are shaping up to be a perfect storm and Sony's other screw-ups are coming back to haunt the company in a very nasty way.
Guess sometimes 3rd Generation Babies from SONY just "Don't Come When They Should"...
Parents could be blamed, But then again Electronics are not Humans or are They ?...
I love the internet. Everybody's an expert at everything!
I think for our sake that even if the product is delayed, they better not be releasing a faulty systems. I know there's going to be lots of lemon systems as they haven't been even done productions. I can seriously wait a month or so just as long as they make the system trouble free.
I have the feeling this is a disaster waiting to happen.
Sorry but if they have left it so late to begin manufacturing how possibly can they spend enough time testing these manufactured machines for defects? Are they just going to make them, package them, ship them, sell them and then have to repair them?
I can see there being a lot of problems with the first.. maybe even the second wave of these consoles.
Bottom line is, gamers are angry with what Sony are doing and so are the game developers.
Bad move Sony... Very bad move.
Alex, where might i ask did you come up with nearly $1000 for the items you listed. Lets go through this. I'll even do it with high prices
PS3 - $600
Game - $70
Controller - $60
Movie - $40
Memory stick $70
That totals to $840, and as you can see, I am giving some high sticker prices for those. And why would you need a memory stick when all PS3's have a HDD. Unless you live some where where you have a 13%+ sales tax, it isnt going to amount to $1000. Please dont post crap like that.
And for the other whiners, as Opiate said, Microsoft didnt start 360 production until a little over 2 months before launch. You are also forgetting that sony isnt the only one late out of the gate, Nintendo is in the same place. I dont care what you guys say, im probably going to try to get 3 PS3's when they come out, keep one, and sell the others, then buy an HDTV.
Hmm...did Sony (or IBM or whoever) ever manage to bring up the success rate in Cell processor production ? I seem to recall only 1 in 6 were actually up to snuff. Wouldn't it be ironic/amusing if just when Sony needs to start banging out PS3's like greased lightniing they have to give the factory works half days off because they can't get enough cell processors (not to mention BluRay drives)to keep the lines going...
I dunno "Draous"...using 8.25% for the sales tax YOUR (admitedly top end) prices come out to $909.30. If something cost $9.10, in casual conversation I'd probably quote the cost as $10. Same ratio, different amount.
But it is true, funny math and fuzzy logc not withstanding, the distance between $900 and $1000 is far more significant that the difference between $9 and $10...
Then again if we're talking about purchasing on launch day you'd have to factor in the time expended in line. Likely more than a day, and most working people make more than $100 in a day.
Or perhaps a $50 pre order charge to avoid standing in line. And if production falls below pre order sales, maybe you end up having to do both...
But take all this "crap" with a grain of salt...it is just my opinion...
So basically Sony needs to have manufactoring plants running 24/7 to live up to their forecasts for number of systems at launch. Meaning there has to be workers working long ungodly shifts, or multiple workers working shorter shifts. Either way, that means more money has to be spent on Sony's part in order to pay for extra hours and worker's salaries.
Stupid Fricking Idiots. If production started three months ago, PS3's would be cheaper for all of us, Sony would have spent less money, and there would have been enough systems to go around, as well as enough demand for a cheaper selling system.
F U Sony. If I get a PS3, I WILL sell it on EBAY, and use the money to buy myself a DS and games, a Wii and games, and a 360 and games, and a flat screen Hi-Def TV.
I hate Sony so much right now it's unreal.
I don't know why most of you are complaining about it. If there are extreme shortages, just wait. Actually you would want to wait, so Sony can work out all the bugs and ship a rev b. Plus there aren't going to be that many exciting games around launch time.
I also don't understand why there are complaints about the system. It isn't even out yet. People can have the right to complain about the Xbox 360, it's out and people have experienced it. You never know, you might actually like the PS3.
So give it a break. Claim all your hate until after you played the system, the games and compared it to the others. Then you have the right to say something about it.
It's like you're saying a car has horrible handling and YOU HAVE NOT EVEN DROVE IT YET. Sure you know how it looks, a guess on how it would perform (but even then you don't know for sure) and can be given all the specs from the manufacturer. But you still won't know until you are behind the wheel.
So everyone CHILL OUT.
Draous in my country we have 19% VAT so it's not unreal...
danj3ris: "Either way, that means more money has to be spent on Sony's part in order to pay for extra hours and worker's salaries."
On my planet, having a factory run more shifts results in an proportional increase in production... The amount of money spent per produced unit should be roughly the same no matter how slow or fast the production is. In fact, if you set up an assembly line, why not use it 24-7? That's about as cost effective as one can get, innit?
And correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this whole thing more or less standard procedure nowadays? They'll be able to change specs up until three months before launch if needed, and they wont have to store the damn things for half a year before they start making a profit out of them.
All companies strive to decrease the time their products spend collecting dust on some shelf, especially companies like sony, apple, dell... What do you do with a thousand crates of unsold 5th gen iPods when gen 6 arrives? Put them in the discount bin? It's expensive to stockpile stuff, and one'll end up with a large pile of useless surplus when the next New Cool Gadget® hits the market.
This is just irresponsible. Period. Shipping out dev kits early can be understood, but not making any consoles 3 months before launch is just plain stupid.
They can't sell a record breaking amount of units if they don't have the units.
Then take into account the consoles with manufacturing problems. Glad I'm waiting 2 years to buy one.
@ caligo:
Yes, but this isn't some device that is going to be replaced in 5-7 months... it's going to be around for 6 years or more.. having a surplus of units during it's launch isn't going to hurt anyone considering they are ALL going to sell... all of them. If you have more units out during this holiday then you cut back on other people profiting off your products via ebay (which is a lost customer since all profits made go to that greedy F***).
"I also don't understand why there are complaints about the system. It isn't even out yet. People can have the right to complain about the Xbox 360, it's out and people have experienced it. You never know, you might actually like the PS3."
I understand and see your point here. I do have a valid counter for myself however. I have NEVER liked the feel of the Dual Shock controller. Sony could not even find a valid way to change the desing of their controller, that is a huge turnoff for me. It has always felt to small, had a bad layout, and just overall not been comfortable.
This alone makes me not all that excited to jump on the PS3 bandwagon. I can also say that looking at the launch lineup, most of the games will already be out on the Xbox 360 by the time the PS3 releases, so if I am interested in them I will already own them. The handful of exclusives do not interest me at all.
Now this is not to say I will not eventually buy a PS3, I will just more than likely be waiting for a price drop and/or some games that appeal more to me and are not also on the 360.
I've got a bad feeling about this. Ramping up to 24/7 production with a product which has a lot of past the bleeding edge components (BluRay, cell processor etc.) for a hard deadline sounds like a formula for high defect rates and design flaws. In this regard the 360 is a harbinger, look at the problems in the first batch of production of that unit.
The worst part is that Sony has recently fallen down on quality control, which they were previously famous for. Dead pixels on the PSP, exploding batteries, BluRay drives that won't play BluRay movies, and don't get me started on Vaios. The PS3 may turn out to be the Edsel of consoles.
@Joe
Having a surplus of units months before the actual launch will still mean more money spent on storage facilities – and thus a more hefty pricetag once they actually start selling the units.
"Yes, but this isn't some device that is going to be replaced in 5-7 months... it's going to be around for 6 years or more.." This is not quite the case. Since the release of the PS2 in 2000 there's been 16 hardware revisions (see for example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_2#Hardware_revisions). Hence a new hardware config every 3-4 months or so... Units retaining the same basic funcionality (i.e. being able to play PS3 games and BluRay movies) will be around for six years or so. The initial hardware config'll certanly be gone after a few months.
If there happens to be a problem with the initial hardware config you'll not want to find out when you've just stockpiled 10 million units. Heck, Sony could end up doing like Atari after the disastrous release of their ET game, and using the useless units as landfill...
As mentioned by one of the previous posters, the manifacturing of the XBox 360 started 96 days before launch. I don't really see the difference between that launch and that of the PS3. Plus, releasing less units than there's demand for during the launch of a new gaming console is hardly something unusual. It helps create a hype. People camping outside the store, long lines, ridicously overpriced consoles for sale on eBay... It's all great publicity, and it wont cost Sony a dime. Most gamers will buy a PS3 eventually anyway, weather they manage to get hold of one at launch day or not.
Sony could produce a zillion units if they wanted, it'd all be a matter of contracting a larger number of factories to produce the PS3 components and assemble the hardware. They would still start production three months from launch date. The number of units avalible at launch is the number of units Sony wants to be avalible. Simple as that.
Have any of you people ever heard of Just In Time and/or lean manufacturing? It's a principle used by nearly every major corporation these days. In a nutshell you manufacture a product so it arrives in the marketplace "just in time" to meet demand. So basically the product goes from the assembly line to shipping, to store shelves. The advantages lie in the fact that by doing this you avoid the cost of having to store your product in a warehouse while waiting for it to go to market, and production can be adjusted as the market fluctuates so you aren't stuck with a warehouse full of items that aren't in demand.
This is what Sony is doing. The PS3 is not in trouble, and production is not delayed. From my experience they are actually right on time with their manufacturing time frame.
Im sorry but Sony hasnt done much wrong apart from remaking the design of the controller the bommerang was better. Sony has begun production this is a cover up to make microsoft think its a head of Sony. Also i have tested a ps3 and can confirm the unit is fantastic yes it does have a loud fan however not as loud as original ps2 the games i tested are good maybe not as good as they can be because developers havent had the time needed to explore the tech in the ps3.
The controller sucks to be honest but ive also tried the first incarnation they showed last year and it was much better my only hope is some1 produces it in the near near future!! the blueray player is very good both on current tv's and models with HDTV option i look forward to seeing many extra's on the disks.
i can say that at the end of my test playstation 3 is much better than xbox360 from the moment u turn it on it speaks quality and the future if gaming.
on another note expect psp2 soon
I am a recent 360 owner, and I have no plans to buy a ps3. I waited until after E3 to make my choice and couldn't be happier. That said, I hope PS3 does very well.
I don't understand why people think that in order for someone to win, everyone else has to lose. The market is far big enough to support choices and those choices benefit the consumer.
Whether you hate Sony and the PS3 or not, the fact that they are offering a blu-ray player forced MS to add HD-DVD. That's a choice for consumers. Yea us!
Even in the likely event that you hate Bill Gates, the success of Xbox Live has led to Sony creating their version for the PS, which would not be likely otherwise.
At the end of the day the consumer has more rights and choices because they both desperately want to separate us from our money.
Sorry this is so long... but I love this site, and I'm getting a little tired of the blind hate.
Root for your team (i know i am) but respect the other guys, because if want the Xbox 720 to be great, you need the PS4 to push it. Once there is only one choice we are screwed.
"I understand and see your point here. I do have a valid counter for myself however. I have NEVER liked the feel of the Dual Shock controller. Sony could not even find a valid way to change the desing of their controller, that is a huge turnoff for me. It has always felt to small, had a bad layout, and just overall not been comfortable."
I can agree with your counter point, but the PlayStation has so many other controllers to choose from other than Sony's. Sure they lack quality as they are third party. But there are alternatives and some are decent (think Logitech). In any case, I do think the 360 has a great controller. It's a definitely improvement over the regular Xbox S-Type and original double potato.
There are still awful controllers out there. While the GameCube's controller feels ok in your hands. It has cheap buttons and a very odd layout.
But as the system as a whole, no one can judge it until they use it.
Plus the controller is in the hands of millions. Some even prefer it over other controllers.
I'll be honest though, I'm actually more interested in the Wii controller.
@monopole
Haha since when was Sony famous for quality control? Maybe like 10+ years ago.
In the last decade their products have always looked nice but always ended up breaking rather quickly.
So I see this becoming like the first two years the PS2 was out around Christmas time when people bought theirs as early as possible and as many of units as possible to sell them at the 5000 USD amount that i remember hearing about.
@JinKazama: That would mean XBox and Nintendo fanboys would have to have a lick of sense to understand this. I work in the shipping business and see this every day. Boxes come off the line and are placed in a truck to be shipped wherever they are needed the same day. Less warehousing space = less cost and overhead. It's a perfectly logical business model.
Trying to explain real life to fanboys is a losing battle unfortunately. They will believe only the "news" opinions that fits there argument.
"Im sorry but Sony hasnt done much wrong apart from remaking the design of the controller the bommerang was better." uhh, what about making the price so high, normal gamers wont be able to afford it?
about the "it wont cost 1000 dolars" guess what, i think you want more than 1 frickin game! oh sure the graphics look good, but how long are you going to hang on to 1 game!?! 1 would want at least 5 or so.
So um, since this was posted on slashdot yesterday and it was noted that only the "NEGATIVE" aspect of the whole interview was posted. That negative is in quotes because the COMPONENTS for the PS3 have been and are being produced, but the completed units haven't started on the assembly line yet.
Yes, explaining real life to fanboys is a losing battle, But lets try and stop the FUD. Just in Time shipping REDUCES production cost.
Xbox360 and PS3 games have all been the same price.
More FUD stopping truth, another time.
It amazes me that techies are complaining about the price. I can understand the average consumer but engadget readers complaining about the PS3's price is borderline ridiculous. Nobody bats an eye at the $2500 to $3000 PC gaming rigs a lot of us own. How many of us dropped $300-$400 on an ipod (which by the way only plays music)? And have we highly intelligent engadgeteers forgotten basic math. The get a 360 up to the PS3's specs in included hardware (wireless, hard drive...) is about $500-$600, don't believe me drop by your nearest Best Buy and price it out.
Get off it already, becuase all you naysayers know that no later than six months after launch you'll have one in your living room hidden under a black sheet so all your local MS & Nintendo fanboys don't call you a traitor all the while playing Resistance fall of man for hours.
If I remember correctly, Sony said the only thing that prevented them from launching on Spring was because of HDCP for the Blu Ray. So, What happen with all the systems that were almost ready for the Spring launch?
@ Art Vandelay
"The get a 360 up to the PS3's specs in included hardware (wireless, hard drive...) is about $500-$600, don't believe me drop by your nearest Best Buy and price it out."
Why would you want to use WiFi for online gaming? Believe me it's not worth it. Since I don't use WiFi for gaming, why should I foot the bill for something I'm not going to use? Atleast the Xbox gives you a choice.
I am not even going to read these comments. I am sure it is all fanboyism, "Sony is the haxxor!" followed by "sony is a;sofkjsda;oif!!!!!!!.!" Yes, that's what they are saying. All I am saying here is that sony is being dumb and a wii bit cocky for not starting producing yet. It's all very fishy, and it makes me believe that this just might be the beginning of the end for the Playstation series.
The problem with the oft-mentioned "69 days before launch" for the 360 still doesn't hold water for the PS3. Did you see the final dev kits yesterday? They can't even fit the components in that ugly George Foreman Grill, much less start rolling them off the production line.
That being said; yes, I'll probably be buying a PS3 in a couple of years when MGS4 comes out...Next-Gen Kingdom Hearts, etc.
But, truthfully I'd rather go out and buy a PS2 for the time being so I can play Guitar Hero when I want.
And maybe I'll play some other games with that awful Dual-Shock controller that gives me granny hands after playing for extended periods of time.
Jared,
Please don't speak of what you don't know. Dev kits are not PS3's...they are the PS3's internal components with larger hard drives, debug software, middleware, and a bunch of other stuff so that developers can save mock builds of games, test control options, reprogram...
So a large dev kit is irrelevant to the production readiness of the PS3. Trust me when I see the PS3 is on schedule.
Art Vandelay (great name btw) is correct. I should have worded my statements better.
Bottom line: We haven't seen any PS3's finished and in the case and won't for awhile.
Is it just me, or are these guys so arrogant that they are up to the point that they just don't care? :-)
Seriously though, I think SONY needs to be humbled a bit. Perhaps the PS3 will bomb (not likely) or Wii or 360 sales will completely outnumber the PS3's.
I really think that they've either lost focus on the market or are just plain drunk with power. Either way I hope they get spanked by either Nintendo or M$.
First of all I have to say I am surprise at the ignorance of engadget readers. I guess FUD does influence people no matter how ridiculous/incorrect it is.
Let me explain something to you guys, Sony already has the PS3 components being delivered to it's factories. What they haven't started working on is putting things together because they are still reviewing that process. This is a major manufacturing company that are experts in electronics manufacturing, yet you have twelve year old brats (that's what most of you sound like) saying how big of a mistake this is. Ask any expert on the subject and they would tell you there is nothing wrong here just a case of the media making side quotes sound apocalyptic.
Yields: CPU yields always start out low and continue upwards. That's just the way manufacturing these types of chips are. Don't believe the FUD, is extremely normal.
Then is the price comparisons. Did you forget there is a 500 dollar version which offers everything the premium 360 and much more (Blu-Ray, free online gaming, Bluetooth, Linux, web browser, better processor, more exclusives)?
PS3 $500/$600
Game $60 (no reason to believe is any higher. Resistance probably)
Movie $20 (Amazon has blu-ray movies at 19.99 price right now go look it up)
Don't need an extra controller simply because I'm playing solo/online like most people and I have no idea what the controller price will be.
Then I buy it online which is TAX FREE currently (Amazon here I come) and what do you know, it comes out to exactly: $580/$680 USD + maybe $10 shipping unless you get a free shipping deal. If you are paying more than that this holiday season then you should be ashamed to even comment here as I thought you were web/technically savvy.
I see lots and lots and lots and lots of defective PS3's on the horizon.