http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/ Engadget Comments for Air Force chief proposes testing "pain guns" on unruly Americans http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2008 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 12:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 12:46PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
completely "sane citizens" are known to brutally attack officers of the law when they feel like it...]]>Sep 13th 2006 12:50PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/While no doubt Wynne does not have a finely tuned schmooze generator like politicians do, Im also fairly confident that the AP took this out of context for more impact.

If you are going to criticize, offer an alternative. I mean really, are you going to test it on puppies and rabbits?
Or should we just go back to putting bullets in people. Ive got no problems with that.]]>Sep 13th 2006 12:53PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
:)) LETS SEE YOU BEAT THOSE FREEDOM ZONES NOW!!! :x]]>Sep 13th 2006 12:56PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 12:57PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
Seriously though, shouldn't it be tested on the people that will be using the weapon. How else are to exactly know how much pain you will be dishing out?

Of course, I think that when a cop tazers you, for every half second you get tazered, he should get a millisecond - to his nuts...]]>Sep 13th 2006 12:59PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Snelgrove]]>Sep 13th 2006 1:02PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
maybe you just prefer to be shot at and lose an arm or a leg! ]]>Sep 13th 2006 1:03PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 1:11PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
If the "non lethal" weapon is too dangerous/harmful that its use wouldnt be tolerated in his own country then its a big contradiction to use it in another country as such.

]]>Sep 13th 2006 1:16PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 1:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
Not ONCE does he propose to use it on Americans here in the US. He is actually promoting the use of non-lethal weapons and saying that if we're not willing to use it on ourselves, it shouldn't be used.]]>Sep 13th 2006 1:36PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
1) If people were rioting in your city, would you rather the police use lethal or non-lethal methods to stop it? This new pain ray is on par with tear gas. Probably safer and less prone to hitting unintended people.

2) They've already done extensive testing on volunteers. But it still makes sense to use it locally first, because you know there will be people who say "THE PAIN RAY MADE ME GO BALD!" or some such nonsense.]]>Sep 13th 2006 1:39PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 1:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 1:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
I heard of a guy who got shot 9 times before he even hit the ground by a cop who thought he was reaching for a gun.
He was actually reaching for his wallet.]]>Sep 13th 2006 1:52PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 1:53PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
Next question?]]>Sep 13th 2006 2:00PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 2:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
But in a world where cops shoot rubber bullets to mock peaceful protesters [http://abcnews.go.com/US/LegalCenter/story?id=2296783&page=1], does anyone think they're not gonna have some fun with a "pain ray"? And what will that do for people's respect of policemen, or respect for the law?]]>Sep 13th 2006 2:11PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
I'm appalled by the current climate of "let's stifle dissent because anyone who notices I'm a nincompoop must love terrorists," so I'm automatically suspicious that this will be used on peaceful protestors. But if there is a riot that justifies intervention, this guy has the right idea.]]>Sep 13th 2006 2:37PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
The Secretary of the Air Force is a civilian political position, not a member of the military. Thus Mr. Wynne may stand for election some day. FDR was an Assistant Secretary of the Navy before becoming president.]]>Sep 13th 2006 3:02PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
If you actually read the article, rather than just hysterically react to it, you'll see that there is no quotation from him saying we should use those weapons on Americans. If you read what he actually said -- and not what some AP dimwit interpreted him to say.

He is simply explaining why we should NOT use them in foreign countries: we'd be criticized if we used crowd control measures somewhere else that American cops don't use in the US. And since US cops don't use those weapons, US armed forces should not use them for crowd control either. (You disagree with that statement?)

He goes on to say the USAF will NOT fund those weapons further unless medical researchers resolve problems of injuries they have caused in the past. (Does that sounds like he's eager to use them?)

Looks to me that he is not at all *proposing* that those weapones be used in the US -- that's nothing but wild, unwarranted misinterpretation from the AP reporter. That is not what he said.

With that in mind, read his ACTUAL quote:
"If we're not willing to use it here against our fellow citizens, then we should not be willing to use it in a wartime situation,"

Do you disagree with what he said? Does that statement make him an A-hole?
]]>Sep 13th 2006 3:10PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
I am ashamed to be associated (however distantly) with these comments.

]]>Sep 13th 2006 3:38PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 3:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
...We are the Mods! We are the Mods! We are, we are, we are the Mods!]]>Sep 13th 2006 3:56PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
if your participating in this kind of action I think you deserve a nice bean bag shot to the face to put your lights out. Or you could the crap beat out of you with a nightstick... that works to.]]>Sep 13th 2006 4:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
Second, if you have respect, and understand the consequences of using the weapon you are carrying, you are are less likely to use it against someone, unless it is absolutely required.

That is it, case closed, and if you actually read the article you would understand that. ]]>Sep 13th 2006 4:31PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
In this psychotic 'this or that' society yes, non lethal is better than lethal. No long term effect is better than serious injury.

Let me fit your crazy logic: should we be seeking to do less harm, or no harm?

The scary part of all of this is not the typical humanitarian side of what amount of pain is acceptable to inflict. The humanitarian issue that should come up is one of technology, which makes this a perfect story to have here on engadget. At what point do we start accepting government sanctioned mind control? At what point does our humanity, our very thoughts, become subject to government control? If a 'pain gun' is acceptable than certainly 'pacify guns' are.

It's about the evolution of technology, and how some seem determined to put it down a path that is at least shaky moral and ethical progress and possibly irreversible de-evolution.

Until then, it's worth a dark humor laugh. Thanks Engadget, JOB WELL DONE AGAIN!
]]>Sep 13th 2006 4:34PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 13th 2006 8:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
http://sethf.com/infothought/blog/archives/001067.html]]>Sep 14th 2006 12:46AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.innercity.freeserve.co.uk/Friendly%20riot.jpg from a British Scooter club.
And, no, you can't test your "pain guns" on us either. ]]>Sep 14th 2006 5:07AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
"Basically my point to them was (that) we need to start using that here in the United States on Americans."

Wynne needs to be removed from office pronto. The 'taken out of context' spin is just that, spin and damage control.

The Soviets and the Nazis would test weapons on civilians. It's no surprise that Neocons would do the same.]]>Sep 14th 2006 5:20AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
He is clearly not proposing we go out and start doing Nazi ezperiments on civilians in order to test weapons. He is merely pointing out the political issues of using what might seem to be the very humane solution -- non-lethal wapons.

(Again, if you criticize what he is saying, then I guess you insist we just be content to kill people and never bother employing non-lethal measures).

He's only guilty of forgetting for a moment that there are plenty of idiots just looking for a reason to scream about stuff like this.
]]>Sep 14th 2006 12:18PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
What a dick.]]>Sep 14th 2006 2:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
Are you people unable to comprehend what he said? And are you reality-challenged? Sorry to be rude about it, but the media has a habit of changing many people's comments to gain attention. Sometimes you need to read the actual transcript to learn what really was said before you go out and make wild assumptions.]]>Sep 15th 2006 12:49PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/Sep 15th 2006 12:58PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
Here's a really radical idea. How about making society more inclusive, so the poor are less likely to riot? Instead of zapping them with the pain weapon.]]>Dec 27th 2006 11:09AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/
how, precisely? Didn't project x, you know, destroy EVERYTHING?

Incidentally, Ayn Rand logic is no standard to judge the world by. ]]>Feb 6th 2008 5:03PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/13/air-force-chief-proposes-testing-pain-guns-on-unruly-americans/meant. MANY OF US ARE AWARE THESE WEAPONS THEY WORKED OUT THE KINKS USING US CITIZENS AS GUINEA PIGS.

Please note update info above which added
Secretary may actually be advocating against any use of these types of weapons at all.

What Secretary Wynne might be actually doing is
just providing sometype of lip service of a
show of professing to be an advocate against these
type of weapons. Notice the Update DOES NOT
ACTUALLY STATE WHETHER OR NOT HE MAY BE AN
ACTUAL ADVOCATE, JUST THE WORD "MAY".
---------
As their are other OFFICIALS right at this moment
calling on our government to open an investigation, and who are actively ADVOCATING AGAINST THE USE OF EXPERIMENTING N TESTING THESE TYPE OF DIRECTED ENERGY, EM,
ULF, ELF, PYSCHOTRONIC WEAPONARY (EVEN CHEMTRAILS) OF THEIR EXOTIC WEAONARY
DEVICES AND USING US CITIZENS AS UNKNOWN GUINEA PIGS, Secretary Wynne IS NOT currently ONE OF THEM
who is adding his voice advocating his support into
opening any type of investigation.

Representative Jim Guest of Missouri is calling
on all of our elected officials to stop the unlawful experimenting n testing of these DEW
Exotic Weaponary on US Citizens. Only a few have
stepped forward, like Senator Ted Kennedy, to be
ACTUAL ADVOCATES FOR THE CITIZENS OF THE US.
Secretary Wynne has been emailed on numerous
occasions ASKING/URGING HIS help to open an investigation
into this matter by a number of our other elected
officials.
A TRUE ADVOCATE WOULD OF STEPPED UP AND ADDED
HIS VOICE DEMANDING AN INVESTIGATION BE OPENED
ON THIS MATTER.


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