http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/ Engadget Comments for GM developing home-based hydrogen filling station http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2008 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 12:42AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 2:24AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
Hope not.]]>Oct 4th 2006 1:19AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 1:54AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
An exploding laptop battery sucks, but an exploding hydrogen cell, well...that's a lot worse.


Seriously, how is a home-based Hydrgen station even safe? What next, a home nuclear reactor core DIY kit?!]]>Oct 4th 2006 2:13AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 2:28AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Apr 24th 2008 9:40PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 2:23AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
We already have an in-house refueling station, it's called an electric socket.

And the car that runs on it isn't a prototype from GM, but a production car from Tesla Motors.

see:
www.teslamotors.com

James
Alternative Energy Blog]]>Oct 4th 2006 3:18AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 3:22AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.switch2hydrogen.com/

'nuff said.]]>Oct 4th 2006 3:30AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.autobloggreen.com/media/2006/09/nf---gm---hpump2.jpg . Thats right, they are actually going to DILUTE the pure fuel to extract more money by selling the undiluted (or less diluted) version as "premium" or "performance" hydrogen, despite that all you would REALLY nead for more performance is to make the fuel cell sip the hydrogen faster. Hah!

Don't buy into the 'Hydrogen Hype'. It's only goal is to maintain the current fuel supply dynamics, which as we know all too well, puts all the power into the corporations hands, and they then put it firmly into your pocket.

Again, don't buy into the 'Hydrogen Hype'. Now here's the truth, the REAL promise lies with batteries and supercapacitors. Battery technology is advancing so fast today that buy the time that even the minimal viable amount of the hydrogen-based infrastructure is in place, batteries and supercaps will offer FAR greater performance,range and reliability than any of todays internal combustion engines or even tomorrows hydrogen technologies. And the infrastucture won't cost a cent, because it's ALREADY THERE!

Just think how little the 'hydrogen economy' has to offer when compared to batteries and supercapacitors!]]>Oct 4th 2006 3:35AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Feb 7th 2007 7:53AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
GM wants to supply the hardware AND the content.

If GM decides to build the hydrogen infrastructure in addition to these home based units THEN we might be getting somewhere. It might not be a bad idea. The company that does things FIRST usually winds up with the largest market share.]]>Oct 4th 2006 3:50AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 10:06AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 4:14AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
Plus the article on Batteries - problem there is most of our power comes from coal. I don't know if Hydrogen production is any better - but I know electricity production isn't much better then driving a gas car. . .]]>Oct 4th 2006 5:20AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/If you are interested you may want to look at
www.esb.ie/main/about_esb/grid_daily.jsp
it even shows seasonal demand.]]>Oct 4th 2006 6:32AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/ As far as having a hydrogen producing apparatus in your home being prohibitively dangerous, there a tons of science experiment kits aimed at kids 12 and up that allow you to produce hydrogen in your own home. Of course the units featured in this article produce substantially more gas, but I doubt it will take much more care to keep from exploding them than it does to keep from exploding the science kits. Which is aparently a feat deemed possible for a 12 year old child.

As for larger question of fuel cells...

Well...I suppose the infrustructure has to start somewhere. And in 'supply and demand' it's a costly gamble to start with supply and hope for demand. So I suppose it makes sense for early adopters to be mildly self sufficient.

But there's a serious flaw in this model. You won't be able to go very far from home, as home will be your only source of fuel. Not a huge problem for multi-car households, but that doesn't describe everyone.

But this limitation will make potential buyers hesitant to invest so much in a car whose use is severely limited. Which means these vehicles will remain rare even when they become available, which will stifle growth in demand for hydrogen at the filling station...which will slow the spread of hydrogen availability in a downward spiral leading back to gasoline.

As things stand now I tend to think electric cars will win out as the alternative energy source for automobiles. Because hybrids address this very concern. They can run entirely on gasoline, just like any other conventional car. So even if you can find a place to plug in (not that all hybrids offer that as a recharge option) you still have all the utility of a 'normal' car.

If cars that run purely off hydrogen are to succeed, it will take a very carefully planned marketing and distribution strategy. These cars would need to be heavily marketed in and around areas with HUGE poppulations of commuters. ie In the suburbs around major cities. The auto industry/vehicle manufacturers will probably need to make deals with various petrol companys to have gas stations on both ends of the commute provide hydrogen. BIG price incentives will also need to be offered along with already low sticker prices at the dealership will be REQUIRED to get people to buy the vehicles. Tax breaks from the government would help as well. ie, these new fuel cell vehicels need to be cheap enough to buy and run that people can afford to keep their old gasoline cars around for if they want to go farther than half a talk of hydrogen will allow.

Also, the types of vehicles offered initially will have to feed into this commute centric model. Remember the Honda CRX ? A tiny little 2 seater with tons of cargo space ? Now imagine every one of those needlessly huge SUVs you see in the morning commute with 1 person in them replaced with one of those, running on a fuel cell. The SUV stays in the garage or driveway until it's time to go on vacation. (Which will cause most peoplet o realize that they only fully utilize it 2 - 3 times a year, which will help people realize they are wasting money on these machines...)

If they can get THAT going, the hydrogen infrastructure will branch out from that commute area, and then more traditional sedans and passenger vehicles will sell with fuel cell technology.

It's either something like that, hybrids, or a mad scramble to build the infrastucture AFTER the oil runs out.

And knowing the way things go in the US, I rather expect the later...]]>Oct 4th 2006 7:48AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
Sign me up for that.
]]>Oct 4th 2006 10:08AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
When it comes to which machine I want to make the highly explosive gas in my home I will probably side with Honda on this one.

]]>Oct 4th 2006 10:18AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Oct 4th 2006 2:07PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/I have a Alternative Fuel Vehicle (AFV) that I re-fuel in my garage right now.
It is a Honda Civic GX http://www.civicgx.com and is refueled at ~$1 a gallon overnight by Phill http://www.myphill.com]]>Oct 4th 2006 6:40PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.switch2hydrogen.com/]]>Oct 4th 2006 8:37PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
This really is old news. I personally think switchtohydrogen.com is just another in the long line of "look hydrogen works and will be available in May 2006 so be on the lookout..."(i.e.: BS)sites. This site is real. I met the owner, seen a couple of vehicles. He lives in SLC, Utah and has to out of state to get H2. As I said in my post, if GM was serious, it could put this into production.]]>Jan 25th 2007 9:10PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/I think I would prefer electric cars more.
That way "filling it up" is much much cheaper, and the price doesn't fluxuate because of some middle east garbage. Hell, Theres a growing market for personal power methods, like having your own solar panels on your roof or a mini wind turbine in your backyard.

But at the very least at least electric cars...even if I plug them into the grid, which is powered by coal...I mean...The US has anough coal to last around 250 years...why shouldn't we use it.]]>Oct 5th 2006 1:09AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
As far as the home hydrogen makers, you can 'demo' hydrogen production with a 12v battery, 2 wires, and a glass of water. We're not splittin' the atom here, just a couple of water molecules...WHY it's taken GM or any of the other in the Big 3 to get off their hineys and do this is a head-scratcher, but I'm happy to see SOMEthing besides 50 more years of oil-company government...]]>Oct 28th 2006 5:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Honda is preparing to sell a production model fuel cell vehicle in 2008. We should lobby our state governments to put these fuel stations along major state thorougfares. I'd like to see a partnership of all the states from Massachusetts down to Virginia to put these Hydrogen Fuel Stations along the i-95 corridor in the megalopolis. ]]>Dec 8th 2006 2:54PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Jan 9th 2007 12:59AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
Let the market know when you're serious.]]>Jan 25th 2007 9:00PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Mar 22nd 2007 11:51AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/
With a view to maximizing efficiency, I wonder if the device is designed to be in any way connected to a home's hot water and/or general heating.

Generating hydrogen from electricy presumably involves some loss of energy.

I'd guess that most of this waste energy would take the form of heat in the water that the hydrogen electrolysis was occuring in.

Why not therefore use the hot water in home heating? This could be done either directly into a homes hot water system (or the system could even replace a standard hot water system) or if chemicals added to improve the electrolysis preclude this then the heat could surely still be captured indirectly.

It may be an obvious statement, but I find it exciting that if a fuel cell and wind an/or solar power were also added to this system, a home could be truly "off grid". The home could store excess energy generated from wind or solar power when household requirements are lower than energy production. Conversely it could release the stored energy when it's requirements are higher than the home is capable of producing.]]>Oct 4th 2007 8:08AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Simply search Homemade hygrogen.. LOTS of youtube videos..

MMMmmm Big companies can't regulate all uses ;;lol.]]>Nov 10th 2007 5:56PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Jun 8th 2008 9:58PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/04/gm-developing-home-based-hydrogen-filling-station/Hydrogen is produced by boiling water. We all have the ability to do that at home. The oil companies are very afraid of this because they don't get a cut if we do. It is easier to make hydrogen than any other means of fueling cars. Your old 1984 chevy can be modified to burn hydrogen, which has 4 times the fuel economy of gasoline. Water is the most abundant substance on earth and guess what is left behind when hydrogen is burned? More Water.
Hydrogen is the answer, especally if we use solar and wind to boil the water in the first place. I'm not a green nut. I like a good deer steak as much as Ted Nugent but this is the answer. For those who hate the oil companies and the Arab nations we are pumping all our money to, This is the answer.]]>Sep 2nd 2008 3:01PM