Sony claims Blu-ray "winner" in format war

That's it folks, let's pack it up and go home: the format war is over. Or at least so says Sony, which is bragging about some solid numbers from the month January. Reportedly two Blu-ray Discs were sold for every one HD DVD last month, and while HD DVD standalone players still edge out Blu-ray by a slight margin, PS3 sales have given the Blu-ray camp a solid win for the month. Numbers are still hard to read, due to disparate launch titles and quantities for Blu-ray and HD DVD, but the 25 Blu-ray movies and 11 HD DVD movies give a good impression of the current trend. Reportedly HD DVD sales are growing, just not as fast and Blu-ray, and Sony seems to think they have it in the bag: "We have a critical mass of content, we have the biggest mass of consumer electronics companies in the world supporting this format. That has moved Blu-ray into the forefront." And despite the fact that Universal Studios is still holding out on putting its movie on Blu-ray -- the last of the studios to do so -- Sony would like to let consumers know it's alright to come out of hiding. "The message that we're going to put out to the consumer now is, now it is safe to make a choice. No more fence-sitting is needed." We can't blame Sony for trying to spin these numbers as a win, it's pretty clear that consumers are wary of committing to one format while another is still alive and kicking, but we're afraid this might be calling the game a tad prematurely.

[Via Engadget HD]

[Dave @ Feb 13th 2007 8:56PM]

Tactile media is dead.

[FreeRange @ Feb 13th 2007 9:00PM]

I swear I've seen way too many "buy one, get one free" deals on the Blu-ray movies to think believe they aren't selling the same amount and claiming two times the sales because they gave the rest away. And they aren't even good movies but if you're going to buy Crank why wouldn't you take your free copy of Ultraviolet? Apart they are $25 but when you do the math they were each only $12.50 so that's not a bad deal for a Blu-ray movie, is it? Technically, has Sony just sold two movies? No, but I bet that's not how they count `em.

[JV @ Feb 13th 2007 9:02PM]

Betamax also outsold VHS in the first few years. I'll hang out here on the fence, thanks.

[Someone @ Feb 13th 2007 9:57PM]

Let's not forget, VHS had more industry support. Blu-Ray currently has more industry support than HD-DVD, and with Blu-Ray's stronger sales HD-DVD's support is bound to get weaker.

[Kev50027 @ Feb 13th 2007 9:06PM]

This is BS. Engadget, the war IS over, there are FAR more Blu-Ray players out in the wild than HD-DVD players. There is no "spinning of numbers", the only spinning of anything is facts, on Engadget's part.

I swear, any time Sony says anything positive, Engadget calls them out on it. I'm sick of this!!

You can't argue with the numbers, Engadget, no matter how tight you hug your Xbox 360 HD-DVD drive.

[Memo @ Feb 14th 2007 1:00AM]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but the last format war between VHS and Beta was ultimately decided by the porn industry who went with VHS. And guess who the porn industry chose as their standard. Its most likely game over for Sony. Enjoy your PS3.

[Steven @ Feb 13th 2007 9:07PM]

The reason why blu ray is "winning" (and I use that term lightly) is because that's all that anyone is promoting. When was the last time you were able to even find the HD-DVD titles or players? I went to 4 stores before I found one.

[humpty @ Feb 13th 2007 9:07PM]

The HDDVD section at my HMV is shrinking everytime i go there while the BD section expands; ditto for the future shop. Plus, the helpful folks there are pushing BD and dissing HDDVD all the time.

Its only a matter of time now... bye, bye HDDVD.

[Mike @ Feb 13th 2007 10:21PM]

I shop at Best Buy and Circuit City. I have been to a BUNCH of different stores in the metro-Atlanta area and every Best Buy is equally stocked in both formats.

One local Circuit City EXPANDED their HD DVD section by a factor of two, brining it in line with their Blu-ray selection.

Things may be different where you live... not everywhere.

[Vimal @ Feb 13th 2007 9:08PM]

You know, every time Sony opens their mouth about how good or better their products are, thats when things start to go down hill for them! It is this high and mighty attitude that will be their downfall. I am surprised they haven't learned their lesson yet.

[Kyle @ Feb 13th 2007 9:23PM]

blu-ray ownes....
and if the war is over and blu-ray won, that means i made my perdiction right about 2007 :) yay

[Javaflash @ Feb 13th 2007 9:23PM]

These 2 groups will soon find out they both lost.

Cheap storage + fat bandwidth will make optical discs irrelevant.

[John Doe @ Feb 13th 2007 9:37PM]

Ad to that some nice tight DRM so I can't take my media over to a friends house to watch. Thanks but fuck digital downloads, at least the "legal" variant.

[Dave @ Feb 13th 2007 9:33PM]

Yes. The war is over--and the PS3 is the best console. Everybody just give up now. Accept mediocrity. Sony commands you.

[imaballa @ Feb 13th 2007 9:37PM]

FreeRange: Research firm's like NDP have said free Blue-Ray movies are not calculated into the total sales figures such as Talledaga Nights.
Duh of course nobody would count free movies as sold movies.

JV: Actually it would be more accurate to compare Blue-Ray to VHS(4 hours of VHS record time) and HD-DVD to BetaMax(1 hour of Beta record time). Why VHS won was because of the higher recording capacity. Get it? Blue-Ray higher capacity?

Humpty: Thats kick a$$ marketing strategy, 7 of the big studios supporting Blue-Ray, only 1 exclusive for HD-DVD. More backing more movies more selection!

Vimal: I have yet to see any other company "open their mouth" and say something bad about themselves.
Don't be a hater.

[Patrick @ Feb 13th 2007 9:55PM]

@imaballa

>> JV: Actually it would be more accurate to
>> compare Blue-Ray to VHS(4 hours of VHS record
>> time) and HD-DVD to BetaMax(1 hour of Beta
>> record time). Why VHS won was because of the
>> higher recording capacity. Get it? Blue-Ray
>> higher capacity?

Actually, it'd be more accurate to see who the pron industry is backing since THAT is what won the last format war. Currently the porn industry back HD DVD. See where this is going? kthnxbye.

-p-

[Someone @ Feb 13th 2007 9:48PM]

If the trend of sales continue, it looks like Blu-Ray will become the winner. I haven't bought any next-gen format hardware so I don't have any stake in who wins, but the numbers don't lie and Blu-Ray is increasing the gap. I just hope this doesn't go to Sony's head, considering they took a big hit for incorporating it into the PS3.

[Christian @ Feb 13th 2007 9:49PM]

Holo disc will take over all...
Reason why HD-DVD is lagging is because they're releasing so little amount of movies! Blu-ray just keeps popping one out in 4 or 5 movies at a time (maybe less sometimes).

[BigZ @ Feb 13th 2007 9:52PM]

The porn was the winning factor in formats for VHS. Almost every porn studio has picked HDDVD.

[Someone @ Feb 13th 2007 10:46PM]

Let's see...HD-DVD's backing from most porn studios and Universal Studio's exclusive support vs. Sony Pictures, MGM, Disney and 20th Century Fox's exclusive support. I think I'll stick to Pirates of the Caribbean, Spider-man, and internet porn.

[yale @ Feb 13th 2007 10:44PM]

umm but the difference is that back when the VHS and Beta battle happened, there was no interenet so VHS and Beta were the only ways to watch porn, and VHS was cheaper. Now the internet is the main venue for distributing porn so they wont decide the outcome its the consumers taht will decide it

[Jeff @ Feb 13th 2007 9:55PM]

Wasn't this posted on Slashdot like two weeks ago?

[Mike @ Feb 13th 2007 9:59PM]

"You know, every time Sony opens their mouth about how good or better their products are, thats when things start to go down hill for them!"

Actually they open their mouths well after the poop hit the fan. Currently the PSP and PS3 are wildly successful. If Sony says it, it must be true. To be fair, I bought a PSP a few months ago...although I only bought it for homebrew capabilities. I already had to mod the d-pad because the thing has a definite design flaw that Sony refuses to address or even admit to.

[mean2u @ Feb 13th 2007 9:59PM]

Well I like Sony and all but it will be hilarious if they lose, so everyone should bookmark this article for future reference.

[imaballa @ Feb 13th 2007 10:02PM]

FreeRange: Research firm's like NDP have said free Blue-Ray movies are not calculated into the total sales figures such as Talledaga Nights.
Duh of course nobody would count free movies as sold movies.

JV: Actually it would be more accurate to compare Blue-Ray to VHS(4 hours of VHS record time) and HD-DVD to BetaMax(1 hour of Beta record time). Why VHS won was because of the higher recording capacity. Get it? Blue-Ray higher capacity?

Humpty: Thats kick a$$ marketing strategy, 7 of the big studios supporting Blue-Ray, only 1 exclusive for HD-DVD. More backing more movies more selection!

Vimal: I have yet to see any other company "open their mouth" and say something bad about themselves.
Don't be a hater.

[SmilingAssassin @ Feb 13th 2007 10:03PM]

Somebody tell them I will personally NEVER own a BluRay player.

[DanMan @ Feb 13th 2007 10:03PM]

If HD-DVD is doing so badly why did the HD-DVD pre-order of The Departed reach #24 on Amazon's DVD sales ranking(as of 3 days ago). Its clear if more HD-DVD movies are released then they can compete, but sadly it's only a matter of time. I pray as a HD-DVD owner that they have dual disc or dual drives.

[Rauthentic @ Feb 13th 2007 10:09PM]

Accept mediocrity ??? isnt Blu-ray superior to HD-DVD...???

[imaballa @ Feb 13th 2007 10:10PM]

Bigz: I see your still hung up on old news, current analyst have refuted the "Porn won the VHS" argument. VHS won because Beta was not long enough to even record a football game. People want tapes they can pop in and start recording their favorite show without having to worry about time constraints, 1 hour is a very short time.
Plus, you over estimate porn. Porn sales via internet greatly overshadow than hardcopy orders.

This time around majority of movie studios are backing Blue-Ray this is going to be a key factor. When majority of the contents are on Blue-ray consumers will go with the format which they can buy their favorite movie.

[Andrew Fong @ Feb 13th 2007 10:13PM]

But regular DVD continues to whoop both HD formats ... How long will it take for BD to pass up DVD? And by then, will BD already be obsolete?

[h0mi @ Feb 13th 2007 10:20PM]

Sales of BD and HD Dvd discs have yet to reach 1 million combined (this may change in the next week or so). These numbers are too small to be especially meaningful.

[imaballa @ Feb 13th 2007 10:20PM]

Andrew Fong: Thats a easy one to answer.
In a couple years by law all broadcast must be in Hi-Def. Already many consumers are purchasing Hi-Def TV in droves, in a few years it will only be inevitable that most TV consumers will have will be Hi-Def(also the price should drop accordingly).
With Hi-Def TV the demand for Hi-Def content will be inevitable. Hi-Def players should replace DVD.
Within the next few years you may find yourself at BestBuy buying a $60 Blu-Ray player. Thats what happened to DVD players.

[Patrick @ Feb 14th 2007 7:52AM]

Cite please? Currently AFAIK, all boradcasts will have to be DIGITAL but that is not the same as hi-def. If you know otherwise, give me a link.

And no, 480p is not hi-def.

-p-

[Mike @ Feb 13th 2007 10:21PM]

So, you're sitting here telling us that there are X number of players out there, yet provide ZERO statistics to back it up.

Don't post made up numbers either... we want hard core sales data.

You are writing a check your butt can't cash right now.

[Yubal @ Feb 13th 2007 10:26PM]

If I had a PS3 I would buy blu-ray movies, as well as a blu-ray burner, and burnable blu-ray meida. The same can be said if I had a xBox 360 with HDDVD drive. Now that both are hacked, let it be for us, and bring the one with the most capacity!

[3rdsun @ Feb 13th 2007 10:34PM]

Why can't they all get along, why can't we have more than one disc format, isn't technology suppose to improve things, do we want a BD or HD DVD monopoly so there investors can screw us, why can't we have a multiformat player so the consumer can feel at ease (I know LG makes one), do these companies take us for fools? I'm tired of asking questions.

[Falcom @ Feb 13th 2007 10:35PM]

I really dont care. DVD with an upconvert player is fine for me. I'd rather have HD On-Demand cable anyway. I've considered getting a HDDVD player for my xbox, and $ for $ its the best deal i have right now, but really, it just isn't worth it.

[lynx.me @ Feb 13th 2007 10:36PM]

If you're able to really determine the success of the format this early into the race, well why not take a gander at Sony's PS3 Sales compared to any of the other nextgen video game systems out on the market.
If they were to gauge things that way no one would possibly see a future for the PS3 but we all know that down the line the early figures dont mean squat. Cocky bastards. Victory cant be declared so early in the fight.

[Sanjin @ Feb 13th 2007 10:37PM]

Purely from the consumer's point of view, wouldn't you want the better one to stay. Better resolution, more space...

[Martin @ Feb 13th 2007 10:43PM]

Purely from a consumer point of view wouldn't you want a company that doesn't screw over it's customers (SONY) to NOT win

[remymtn @ Feb 13th 2007 10:42PM]

So people who bought a HD DVD for their xbox 360 paid just as much for a ps3? I thought they said xbox 360 was cheaper? :)

[Mike @ Feb 13th 2007 10:46PM]

Ok people... HOW ON EARTH can you claim a winner or "stronger sales" based on ONE MONTH OF DATA?

During that month, Best Buy had a Buy One Get One Free deal. Gee... I WONDER what that will do for their "sales" numbers?

Let's pull out collective heads out of our asses and see this for what it is: one month of sales data being used as part of a PR campaign to convince consumers to choose Blu-ray.

I own both formats, so before you go screaming "troll", check yourself. This war is FAR from over, especially when you consider that LG just released the first dual format player. Also CONSIDER the fact that the HD DVD camp has a TON of Asian manufacturers lined up to crank out affordably priced HD DVD players.

What happens when the market is flooded with sub $500 HD DVD players while the Blu-ray camp struggles to break the $800 mark? (save for the PS3 and Samsung BD-P1000, the former being sold at a loss and the latter about to be discontinued)

Blu-ray backers will have to lower prices to compete, else they risk being blown out of the water when consumers choose the less expensive hardware. Regardless, this war will get much nastier before a winner is declared. It's entirely possible that we have two formats just like we do with DVD+R and DVD-R. The two are so similar that you can't go wrong with either one.

[PSPRulz @ Feb 13th 2007 10:46PM]

I remember a number of news articles about the strong sales of UMD movies when the PSP was released. http://www.mp3newswire.net/stories/5002/umd.html

The strong Blu Ray sales are probably a result of many PS3 owners purchasing at least one movie. Just like PSP owners did with UMDs...I don't think anyone would consider the UMD format a winner.

[k0a10 @ Feb 13th 2007 10:57PM]

A "just the facts" without trying to be hip, and without bling/military/human interest fluff would suit me fine. Ther's really enough happening as it is. Oh, and to Engadget, if you don't know what you're talking about, which happens all too often, don't open your mouth, just the facts _please_.

Thanks for the tip, I will check these sites.

Psst, some innovative features, like things I've seen on sites 10 years ago would be nice. Look at a site like storagereview.com, they collect discreet values over time so you can compare and profile things. You can then do things like _intelligently compare_, as well as features like "automatically notify me when a gsm mobile with gps, wifi, usb host, at least 320x200 touchscreen and weighs not more than 120g becomes available," as well as forming interest groups. Smart, useful. Not smart-assed, not trying to stir up controversy that wastes my time.

[k0a10 @ Feb 13th 2007 11:13PM]

And another thing..

I am #)$(*#()$* glad when one company copies another company's good feature. It can go too far and innovation can be stifled, but everyone copies everyone and there is so much ground to be covered before the gadgets we waste our time on are even half decent, it is stupid to not just accept that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and move on to seeing what is unique - like a lower price point, different market, etc.

To competition.

[moory777 @ Feb 13th 2007 10:58PM]

I don't wish to add fuel to the mass-flaming going on here, but a few too many people are waxing lyrical about 'more space'.

In case anyone is not yet aware, Blu Ray uses older Mpeg2 format to encode the content, which takes up a lot more space than the more efficient Mpeg4 that is used by HD-DVD. As an example, maybe some are familiar with HD .ts (mpeg2) and x264 (mpeg4) files that are avaliable on the inetrnet nowadays: a 2-hour HD feature in 720p can take up to 8gb or more of space when encoded an mpeg2 .ts stream, whereas typically it would take around 4gb as an x264 file. Picture quality is identical in both cases.

Basically, you're talking apples and oranges - different code requires different capacity. As for any claim of 'better resolution' - let's be cear - all movies released on either formats are encoded as 1080p/24fps - there is no such thing as 'better' resolution.

[SickNic @ Feb 13th 2007 11:27PM]

What else is there to buy for PS3 owners? They have 1 decent game out and a bucnh of mediocre multiplats. Hell, I'd be buying up blu-rays too so my $600 system didn't sit there collecting dust...

[Peter Payne @ Feb 13th 2007 11:34PM]

WHICH format will get the damn movies I want, by which I mean Lord of the Rings and Star Wars? That will decide this whole thing.

[uwilloz2me @ Feb 13th 2007 11:53PM]

Link......
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/business/la-fi-porn12feb12,1,7526606.story?ctrack=1&cset=true

As the opposing camps pushing the next generation of DVDs try to win audiences, they are furtively pursuing the affections of the multibillion-dollar porn industry.

Since the advent of home video, adult entertainment has played a key role in the adoption of new consumer technology. Porn companies, for instance, helped VHS trump Betamax in the '70s. More recently, they began streaming online video long before television networks.

So backers of the rival — and incompatible — HD DVD and Blu-ray formats are trying to entice porn producers to adopt their respective technologies. Even if they're not proud of it.

Last summer, a group pitching Blu-ray visited the Canoga Park offices of Wicked Pictures, whose films include "As Sleazy as 1-2-3" and "Womb Raiders." Wicked executive Jackie Ramos said the Blu-ray proponents spent hours explaining how the movie studio could benefit from releasing Blu-ray DVDs, which deliver dramatically higher picture quality than conventional discs.

But what amused Ramos was the warning that came after the presentation — "They said, 'We can help you, but remember: We were never here.' "

Versions of that message keep popping up as the backers of Blu-ray and HD DVD court the porn industry. Giants with a stake in the outcome include the likes of Microsoft Corp., Toshiba and Sony Corp.

The lengths to which they are going — and won't go — provide one way to measure the progress of the fiercest format war since VHS versus Betamax.

The porn industry has helped the HD DVD camp stay in the game despite support for Blu-ray from big electronics companies and Hollywood.

The battle is still young. Demand for the next-generation DVDs won't really take off until more people own televisions that can take advantage of the superior picture quality. And this month's introduction of an LG Electronics player that can handle either type of next-generation DVD — along with Warner Home Video's unveiling of a new hybrid "Total Hi Def" disc that holds both formats — suggests that the fight could last far longer than first predicted.

HD DVD, whose backers include Microsoft, Toshiba and General Electric Co.'s Universal Pictures, was out of the gate first. But since December, when Sony's PlayStation 3 and other devices that play Blu-ray movies began shipping in volume, Blu-ray disc sales have taken the lead.

Blu-ray has every major Hollywood studio except Universal (some are issuing in both formats). And with 710,000 PlayStation 3s and dedicated players sold through the end of the year, Blu-ray now has about four times as many homes to play in as HD DVD does.

But it is still too early to write off HD DVD, especially with inexpensive players due later this year from Chinese manufacturers, said Tom Adams, president of Adams Media Research. "HD is going to beat Blu-ray to $300 and $200 — all the prices that start unlocking all the segments of population that will buy," he said.

With the race this close, it stands to reason that both sides are paying close attention to the porn kings of the San Fernando Valley. By some estimates, adult titles make up 10% or more of the $24-billion annual market in traditional DVDs.

Plus, anyone wondering who would most appreciate pictures that appear crisper than real life had only to witness a briefing at the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas last month by LG Electronics, maker of the expensive players for either format. None of the presenter's points gripped the audience like the slow-motion HD DVD video of a model emerging from a swimming pool, every drop glistening as it fell from her white bikini.

Most U.S. porn producers are getting their feet wet with HD DVD.

During those hushed meetings with the producers, HD DVD and Blu-ray promoters insisted on secrecy as they touted the features of their respective formats. Each was sensitive to concerns specific to adult entertainment, such as how to edit out the surgical scars that would otherwise be far too visible.

But the HD DVD side went further, providing training and unofficially connecting the studios with the factories known as replicators, which stamp out discs from a master copy.

The porn industry is having trouble finding replicators to press Blu-ray DVDs.

HD DVD production methods are built on the old DVD standards, so the older machinery can be retooled to make the next-generation discs. But Blu-ray requires expensive new equipment. That's why there are only eight or so Blu-ray replicators in the world.

For Vivid Entertainment Group, the physical production of Blu-ray discs will come to about 35% of those movies' budgets, compared with 15% for HD DVDs and 10% for a standard DVD, said Vivid Chief Executive Steve Hirsch.

Even if a porn studio wants to pay extra for Blu-ray, Sony and Walt Disney Co. make it hard.

Sony manufactures Blu-ray discs but won't do it for adult titles. And Disney requires the replicators it uses to pledge not to use the same machines and employees to publish porn. Disney has its reasons: In the past, porn snippets have accidentally shown up on Disney titles. Neither company would comment for the record about porn.

Since Disney uses most of the biggest U.S. Blu-ray replicators, L.A.-based Vivid, the only adult producer to promise some Blu-ray discs, has been forced to range far afield.

"The Blu-ray people are making it very difficult for the adult guys," Hirsch said.

On the other hand, that may just be because they can afford to be difficult.

If HD DVD mounts a serious comeback, executives at two mainstream Blu-ray studios said, Sony and Disney will consider giving the porn makers a little more quiet help.


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[Steve @ Feb 14th 2007 12:04AM]

ROTFLMAO!!! Chimps are running Sony PR these days right? That must be it.

Oh and I declare myself Overlord of Universe and 2007 Stanley Cup Champion. Shit that was easy. I'll expect the Cup in the morning or I will destroy the planet.