Zune 2's user interface gets inspected

As we all twiddle our thumbs while waiting for the next-generation of Zunes to ship out, ZuneRama has pointed out a number of user interface changes to tide you over. Notable differences include the volume setting reaching 40 (versus 20 on the existing models), album artwork when browsing by Album looks bigger than on the current firmware and when advancing from one track to another, the album art for the new track slides in from the right in a "wipe" transition. Granted, most of these changes aren't apt to make or break your experience with the new players, but if you're interested in checking out the full list, the read link's got the goods.

[DickHardknocks @ Oct 11th 2007 11:09AM]

What bothers me more than anything with the ZUNE is that Microsoft missed out on the opportunity to offer WiFi sonng downloading - and Apple came along and did it with the Touch.

How did Microsoft put a Wifi adapter in this thing and make that obvious error?

Also, ZUNE should be able to access online radio like the SANSA CONNECT.

[Homeboy @ Oct 11th 2007 12:13PM]

I'm a bootlegger and don't care for wireless song purschasing. I'm very happy about the WiFi syncing though, which is a superb feature I'll be taking full advantag off.

[Matthew F @ Oct 11th 2007 1:01PM]

that's called "thief" not "bootlegger"

[Abscissa @ Oct 11th 2007 4:00PM]

No, a "thief" removes objects from someone else's possession. The correct term is "bootlegger" or "copyright infringer" (or "pirate" if he turns around and redistributes it). It's still illegal and still bad and still has a victim, but it's not thievery.

Murder is illegal and bad and victimizes someone just like bootlegging, but that doesn't make bootlegging "murder". Same goes for "stealing"/"thievery".

[boing @ Oct 11th 2007 11:20AM]

"Notable differences include the volume setting reaching 40"



i remember being impressed when they only went to 11.....

[Rususeruru @ Oct 11th 2007 11:41AM]

CRANK IT ALL THE WAY TO 11! +10 pts to you sir for the SpinalTap reference.

I welcome the new volume setting, it should increase the overall range of settings.

[Le Master @ Oct 11th 2007 12:08PM]

Haha, did you have a Diamond Rio too?

I remember paying like over $200 for that bad boy and it only played about TEN songs. It also had to be plugged in via a parallel port. That was only like 7-8 years ago, it's insane how fast the tech industry is moving.

[Ricardo @ Oct 11th 2007 11:19AM]

there is firmware 2.2 and beyond for adding those features and GAPLESS.

Zune 30 owner

[LiQuiD_FuSioN @ Oct 11th 2007 12:21PM]

Gapless on the Zune? I'll believe it when I see it.

At least the iPod supports it.

[Jonathan-DBOSS @ Oct 11th 2007 11:23AM]

The PMP market is a fierce as any other market out there. Zune 2's gonna be another fierce competitor now, sure the iTouch seems sexy, but I'm rooting for the Zune. Microsoft seems to know what they're doing.

[DickHardknocks @ Oct 11th 2007 11:31AM]

NO THEY DON'T EITHER...

#1 Microsoft backed HD-DVD but didn't support it to the point they would install an HD-DVD player in the ELITE or any other model. Add-on's suck and no one intelligent wants to get an HDDVD drive that lacks full 1080p .

#2 Microsoft entered the ZUNE into the battle against Ipod 2 years too late and because of that, Ipod commands the DAP market.

Why is it that you have the most widely used internet browser and the most widely used Operating systems BUT, you are too damn dumb to go after the DAP market aggressively with software YOU are controlling?


There are plenty of other errors Microsoft is Making and the fact you can't use ZUNE's wifi to download songs over LAN wireless is RIDICULOUS. Microsoft should also make a ZUNE PHONE but unless I'm on their design team its gonna suck.

[DickHardknocks @ Oct 11th 2007 11:34AM]

NO THEY DON'T EITHER...

#1 Microsoft backed HD-DVD but didn't support it to the point they would install an HD-DVD player in the ELITE or any other model. Add-on's suck and no one intelligent wants to get an HDDVD drive that lacks full 1080p .

Had MS embedded a HDDVD drive in the 360, it would have helped HDDVD's market penetration. You can say whatever bad about the PS3 you want, but the one thing you cannot say is that PS3 didn't help get Blu Ray players into millions of homes before HDDVD players got there.

That is why the PS2 was so great. When PS2 came out, DVD players still cost over $800. PS2 was purchased by many as an inesxpensive DVD player solution.

#2 Microsoft entered the ZUNE into the battle against Ipod 2 years too late and because of that, Ipod commands the DAP market.

Why is it that you have the most widely used internet browser and the most widely used Operating systems BUT, you are too damn dumb to go after the DAP market aggressively with software YOU are controlling?


There are plenty of other errors Microsoft is Making and the fact you can't use ZUNE's wifi to download songs over LAN wireless is RIDICULOUS. Microsoft should also make a ZUNE PHONE but unless I'm on their design team its gonna suck.

[eric @ Oct 11th 2007 12:07PM]

I didn't realize HD-DVD had anything to do with this story.

[John @ Oct 11th 2007 12:58PM]

are you disappointed that MS isn't shoving HD DVD down your throat? I was pretty psyched...

[getagrip15 @ Oct 15th 2007 3:43PM]

Comment

[Sam Stone @ Oct 11th 2007 11:41AM]

Funny how people seem to LOVE the underdogs...

[Pablo @ Oct 11th 2007 12:23PM]

Of course they do, real competition makes everyone raise the bar.

[Quix @ Oct 11th 2007 12:09PM]

Especially when the "love" is artificially generated by the underdogs themselves. Anyone ever wonder why there are so many Zune-related blogs/fan sites? Are they all funded by Microsoft? It seemed strange when the Zune launched last year that so many fan sites were *already rolling* on launch day. It seems there are more Zune sites than iPod sites, and the iPod has been out 6 years and outsells Zune by orders of magnitude.

Classic Microsoft astroturfing? Typical faux hipness and bogus popularity facade from the Nerds in Redmond? You decide.

[Woody56292 @ Oct 11th 2007 6:01PM]

I love when conspiracy theorists claim company's are astroturfing. Rather than that more logical approach, that is to say, people actually like the zune...
also, I see dozens of apple blogs, which talk about the ipod, and i see plenty of people write pro-ipod posts, despite it ( imo ) not being the best player or software on the market. ( I will grant that they have the best store )

-Woody

*btw hey microsoft if you wanna pay me for my pro-zune post, please email me at [e-mail] =D

[Eric @ Oct 11th 2007 12:06PM]

Jesus Christ, why is no one ever satisfied with what is out there? You can not demand a feature on a product. Just because there are people in forums and on blogs that would love a certain feature, there are thousands (or millions if you are Apple) of consumers out there that have no idea or could care less about having a certain feature. Bottom line is that if you want a certain feature on your DAP then buy the brand that you want instead of bashing one brand for not supporting it. You've never heard of anyone saying, "I demand you make a 500HP engine for my Ford Focus like you do for the Mustang Shelby!"

[C. Lee Smith @ Oct 11th 2007 12:16PM]

(sarcasm)
Wahhhhhh! Why are there SO many postings about the Zune?!? Can we get a separate non-Zune feed?!? Engadget must favor the Zune because there's more postings about it instead of the iPhone this week!!!! Wahhhhh!
(/sarcasm)
Oh, you say it's because Microsoft has actually created something (or done something) of interest to a large number of consumer electronics lovers?!? Ok, never mind.

[JC @ Oct 11th 2007 1:30PM]

Nice Artie impersonation!

BaBa Booey!

[Justin @ Oct 11th 2007 1:11PM]

Repeat after me: it's not the number of articles; it's the tone of the articles.

Speaking of number of articles, though...was there ever a review of the Archos 605 here? And I mean a real review, not a "hey this just came out and here's a link" type of article.

[skant @ Oct 11th 2007 1:24PM]

agreed, i want some Archos 605 versus cowon, versus zune versus ipod comparison. come on engadget, let's see what you'd buy if you were out there in the market this very second.

[C. Lee Smith @ Oct 11th 2007 1:28PM]

The answer is yes. Here's the link: http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/14/archos-605-and-405-details-hands-on/

Unless the word choice is excellent, the "tone" of any written material is usually subject to a great deal of subjectivity. It depends on what you want to believe before you read it. We certainly shouldn't expect excellent word choice from a blog.

[bob e @ Oct 11th 2007 1:07PM]

It is great to see so much positive press on the Zune. Much more so than last year with gen 1. The new iPods look so boring and tired.

I have already pre-ordered 2 of the new Zunes...

[Omari @ Oct 11th 2007 5:39PM]

Ok...just a few random thoughts...

1. A max volume of "40" doesn't necessarily mean it will play twice as loud as the old version with a max volume of "20." Frankly, they could play at exactly the same level. Not saying it will. I'm just saying.

2. If the Zune DID integrate Explorer and DID have the ability use it's WiFi to download tracks over a LAN, where exactly would the files be downloaded from? There is no iTunes Music Store equivalent. Not attempted to bash Microsoft. Just saying it seems pointless to work on the downloading aspect before they have created a similar WiFi Music Store -> iPod -> iTunes -> iPod customer experience. When Apple developed their user experience it's doubtful they utilized a silo approach.

3. Just a side note on the external HD-DVD drive (and "feature overkill" in general)...GREAT move by Microsoft, in my opinion.

When all the hardware components are installed in one device, the company is forced to sell the product at a premium price. The premium price alone effectively eliminates it from consideration for a lot of people. Then there are other demographics to consider. To use myself as an example, I bought a 360 for the video gaming only. I'm not interested in watching movies on it at all. I don't want an integrated anything that improve my video gaming experience. IMO, it's the equivalent of the "No integrated FM tuner on the " complaint. Why would I want an FM tuner on my digital music player? I can listen to ANYTHING I like, WHEN I like, as OFTEN as I like. I'm dating myself a bit, but let's go back about 20 years to the cassette walkman. An FM tuner on a walkman was silly to me for the same reasons an FM tuner seems silly on a digital player. I can listen to ANYTHING I like, WHEN I like, as OFTEN as I like. Why would I want an FM tuner?

[404error @ Oct 11th 2007 4:15PM]

No iTunes equivalent? What about the Zune Marketplace? The Zune pass option would work great with a Wifi store as well.

[freakmarket @ Oct 12th 2007 9:22AM]

A lot of people have radio programs they listen to ... if you are not duct taped to a stereo system when they are on it's great to have a FM tuner on your MP3 player. Just because you have no use for it doesn't mean there aren't thousands of other people who do.

[insertAlias @ Oct 11th 2007 8:54PM]

Of course it wont play twice as loud. It means that you have twice the control that you used to have...you get closer to the perfect volume you want.

[C. Lee Smith @ Oct 11th 2007 1:32PM]

Ah, lowest ranked, eh? I see the Microsoft astroturfers don't like being called out.

[Raymond @ Oct 11th 2007 6:01PM]

Nah, people just naturally don't like you.

[V3LOCIP3D3 @ Oct 11th 2007 2:30PM]

Actually the iPod store is either going to be wiped out by the record companies soon, or it's going to be completely revamped. Zune marketplace is already offering 14.95/mo subscription plans for unlimited downloads, which could be ideal for downloading over a LAN.
My props to microsoft for getting into the ring and offering a zune alternative. and not just an alternative, a step up in my opinion. That's why the underdogs are the best, because they're willing to do anything to become number one . . and apple just sits there and doesn't even try. Think about it . . . the ipod 80gb and 160gb still have 2.5" screens, no wireless, horrible headphones, no fm tuner, horrible sound quality, and a dated interface and they sell it for the same price. Open your eyes and stop getting caught up with the mac fad. Stop calling mac innovative, you're making a fool of yourselves.
I think microsoft has finally taken the cake with this one, whether they're number one in sales or not, they still have the best on the market. DVD video out, premium headphones, the best looks and interface in the business, wirelessly share podcasts and songs, huge screen, use your zunepass on multiple PCs, FM tuner that's integrated instead of costing 40 bucks . . . I love that microsoft can and will do anything to become number one. Same with the xbox, which gates never saw a dime out of.

[Dextro @ Oct 11th 2007 5:11PM]

Dude, a store like the ITMS is what music companies need nowadays! It's not getting wiped out at all. Please inform me and everybody else why on earth that would be happening?
Because of something like the ZunePass ... with unlimited downloads? Well unlimited as long as you keep paying every month. If the contract is broken, say byebye to your music. WOW what a great solution huh??

No wireless on the iPods? Well wireless on the Zune's is soooo great 'cause you can't really do anything with it. Sure you can share songs with a fellow Zune owner, ... that is if you can find one. The 2,5 and 3,2" inch screens don't really make that much of a difference. It's still way to small to watch something on it.

Horrible sound quality, wtf is that about? As far as i know Msoft hasn't even released any specs on that subject. Same with the premium earphones. What makes them premium?
I am in no way saying that the iPod's earphones are very good but what makes these premium?

I'll stop right here. If you want me to tackle the other "features" you described; please leave a reply, i'll be glad to do so.
I don't even own an iPod. But dude, open your eyes, there are better players out there. The iPod isn't the only pmp, the Zune isn't going to become the 2nd one any time soon.

And lastly please tell me one thing, just ONE thing that is innovative about the Zune? Don't call macs non-innovative. The discussion is about iPods and Zunes, not Macs and PC's. Enough bandwidth is getting wasted on that subject every freakin second.

BTW: Msoft will indeed do anything to be number one. They even get convicted because of it.

[Raymond @ Oct 11th 2007 6:06PM]

Boy, someone's really got their panties in a bunch.

[Dextro @ Oct 11th 2007 6:59PM]

Wow so has mommy forgotten to kiss you goodnight tonight?
Panties in a bunch?? Really clever .. you should go work at Msoft, i've heard they're really innovative.

[V3LOCIP3D3 @ Oct 11th 2007 7:02PM]

@ Dextro
Mr. Dextro, I won't be too hard on you, because apparently you're new to electronics. Now that you've crawled out from under your rock, maybe you should pick up a newspaper or watch the news. Here's a link to get you started: http://www.marketwatch.com/News/Story/Story.aspx?guid=%7B47106C06-C418-4B7F-8371-F9DBFAA6B415%7D&siteid=mktw

Enough said there. Sound quality? Well since I'm not an educated audiophile, and don't have the equipment or money to test it, I will refer you to Marc Heijligers' "HifiVoice":

He did tests that "reveals that the iPod sounds "closed". Instruments have less timbre (especially in the treble region), sound sources are less focussed, the bass is less under control, treble shows a bit sibilance, there is spatial information, and the whole has less drive."

"comparing loss-less compressed audio with lossy compression . . . From the first notes it is immediately clear that lossy compression on good hifi equipment is a big step backwards. Sound sources start to intermix, sounds from instruments can hardly be distinguished from their reverb, treble sound muffled, and the whole lacks excitement, involvement and sophistication."

And now the iPod classic has been rated worse than the 5G and have tests to support that the "audio part of the iPod classic is seriously flawed!"

Wifi kicks ass. Your iPod doesn't have it so shut up. But the radio? the bigger screen? better interface? yeah, your iPod doesn't have that either, I can see why you're so frustrated.

The Zune is innovative because, and I know I'm not mistaken, it is the first MP3 player to incorporate all those features into a single device, and so far it's the only one.

Leave the debating to the pros. Stop wasting your breath and do some reading next time you decide to post a rant.

[Dextro @ Oct 12th 2007 4:55AM]

Lol, very nice. Comment on the poster instead of the post.
The music companies can demand what they want, will that mean the end of the ITMS? Do you have some kind of glass bowl? Reality check? It's business, they'll negotiate. Apple won't do anything to kill off the store.

That sound quality stuff is all very nice, but where are the data about the Zune? Has anyone performed such tests on the Zune? Is there any data around to confirm your assumptions?

I think i just explained to you why the WiFi didn't kick ass, same goes for all the rest you summed up. The FM radio has been criticized several times in this thread alone.
Besides, the "better interface" is very subjective and criticizing the iPod on its interface is kinda daring i believe.

On a lighter note, READ my previous answer. I don't own an iPod!!! So MY iPod doesn't have all that crap.
You are quite the pro here. What features are innovative again? Oooh incorporating them into one device? Wooow the big screen, the interface, the mp3 player and the FM radio. Good god the guys who came up with that are serious geniuses. Probably the same kind of Pro's you refer yourself to.

[V3LOCIP3D3 @ Oct 12th 2007 11:33AM]

Daxtro, you're making a fool of yourself. I know nothing will shut you up about your precious iPod, but here it goes:

First, in a comparison of Zune 1.0 and the iPod 5.5 on the TIMES ONLINE, they gave the Zune a 5/5 on Sound & Vision, and the iPod 2/5. Quoting: "Just when you think the Zune is out for the count, it dusts itself down. The Microsoft player sounds superb, which reveals a gaping Apple weakness: each successive generation of iPod has sounded weedier. And once it’s toe-to-toe with this beefy new challenger, it seems sonically anaemic."

Second, I remember you saying "If you want me to tackle the other "features" you described; please leave a reply, i'll be glad to do so." . . . So then you reply a day later with nothing . . I was hoping for a good argument, but instead you avoid the topic completely by cleverly saying "I think i just explained to you why the WiFi didn't kick ass, same goes for all the rest you summed up."
Actually you didn't. You failed to say anything wrong with wifi. I can trade songs with other people with Zunes. Yep, that's a plus. Can you trade songs with your 16 year old friends, Daxtro?

I also have an FM radio, which I can listen to sports and the news. Your iPod still sucks. I can view my podcasts on a 30% larger screen (and your argument to that was: it doesn't matter, which, unless you're an idiot, it definitely does.) Your iPod still sucks. And give me another player with everything the Zune has? You can't do it, so it's an innovation. That was your question wasn't it? It's an innovation because nobody else has done it before.

Still like your iPod more than the Zune Daxtro? If you do, I'm pretty sure you're delusional, cuz your iPod just got PWNED.

[Omari @ Oct 12th 2007 9:34AM]

Yes, there is the Zune Marketplace, but I'd still have to say there isn't an WiFi iTMS equivalent. The Zune Marketplace is fine for computer-based purchases and browsing, but it wouldn't translate well when scaled down to a Zune-sized Internet Explorer window. So yes, technically MS has somewhere to download music from, but it's not a Zune-optimized solution. For the Zune to be truly competitive here, MS not only needs to answer the question "Can customers download music on their Zune?" but "What is the customer experience like when downloading music on their Zune?"

On a side note, the last thing MS should do is bring IE and all it's baggage to the Zune platform. It's bad enough they can't remove it from the Windows OS. IMO, if they do implement a web browsing solution for the Zune, they should start from square one.

[Omari @ Oct 12th 2007 9:37AM]

Attached this to the wrong thread. Anyway...

Yes, there is the Zune Marketplace, but I'd still have to say there isn't an WiFi iTMS equivalent. The Zune Marketplace is fine for computer-based purchases and browsing, but it wouldn't translate well when scaled down to a Zune-sized Internet Explorer window. So yes, technically MS has somewhere to download music from, but it's not a Zune-optimized solution. For the Zune to be truly competitive here, MS not only needs to answer the question "Can customers download music on their Zune?" but "What is the customer experience like when downloading music on their Zune?"

On a side note, the last thing MS should do is bring IE and all it's baggage to the Zune platform. It's bad enough they can't remove it from the Windows OS. IMO, if they do implement a web browsing solution for the Zune, they should start from square one.

[Sirocco @ Oct 11th 2007 6:59PM]

Omari emphatically states: "I can listen to ANYTHING I like, WHEN I like, as OFTEN as I like. Why would I want an FM tuner?"

That's you. Some people prefer to be surprised. Also, radio provides news and live talk.

Also, a max volume of 40 may correspond to a LOWER max volume. I asume that the increments will be more subtle. Frankly I prefer that the change in volume be noticeable with each increment. Maybe fewer was better.

[Sirocco @ Oct 11th 2007 7:07PM]

FM increases perceived value, even if it's never actually used. More people want an iPhone without the phone than want DAP's without FM - ergo the "Touch".

[V3LOCIP3D3 @ Oct 11th 2007 7:31PM]

I use radio particularly for news updates on the go (via NPR news), weather, and sports. Not so much for music. But it is very valuable to me when I travel. Secondly, for mac to monopolize all of the additional features and make you pay for add-ons, such as a $40 radio addition . . that personal pisses me off. Because it is clear they are only doing that to their own advantage and screwing its customers. Where as other, more notable companies incorporate such features in their devices and charge the same price. Why are iPods still popular? Because of 16 year old, trendy kids who don't know what's best. i.e.: Apple's target demographic

[Craig @ Nov 14th 2007 2:53PM]

Can the Zune be used like a flashdrive? Store and transfer data?