http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/ Engadget Comments for Robotex creating gun-toting robots to replace human soldiers http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2012 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 12:24PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 3:25PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 8:04PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
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You have 15 seconds to comply!]]>Dec 9th 2007 5:11PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
Then Germany / France / the rest of the civilized world starts building/buying these things, and even Iran and Isreal get in on the fun and buy a couple hundred.

So in the end, we got wars, with robots, shooting other robots, from 400 meters with perfect accuracy.....

Are they going to have stands and beer too? sounds like a party, like SciFi's Robot Wars, just a lot more fun]]>Dec 9th 2007 12:46PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
What will a wold be like in which disputes are settled, basically, by a videogame?]]>Dec 9th 2007 12:50PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
I could somewhat understand if you're judging on the basis that using humans means that we've made an investment, but these robots represent an investment as well -- less than a human being, obviously, but still not something we'd like to lose.]]>Dec 9th 2007 1:10PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 1:20PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
Some lunatic, hopefully not one running our country, would make sure the bullets coming out of these "with steely accuracy from 400 meters" lodged themselves in to something of consequence. Flesh, or something that exploded in a spectacular enough way to get to flesh somewhere.

Its pretty rare that military innovations lead to less (hypothetical) death... every technical innovation any military around the world strives to achieve is for two purposes... to be awesome enough that nobody wants to mess with said military out of fear of said innovation will be used against them (atom bomb is the best example), or to, in the case that conflict is not prevented, make the innovating military able to make the opponent suffer enough to stop.

Nobody in Country X is going to be rattled enough to pressure their government to stop a confrontation if one of our robots picks off one of their hunks of plastic, metal and silicone. Its gotta kill somebody.]]>Dec 9th 2007 1:20PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 2:28PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
Not really. What we'll get is wars with robots shooting each other's civilians from 400 meters with perfect accuracy.

Think about it: having the robots kill each other is pointless, having the robots destroy everything else is the way to win a war.

Take out the SCV's, the factories, and the tech, and leave the battlecruisers and seige tanks alone. everyone knows that.]]>Dec 9th 2007 3:12PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 3:22PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 5:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 8:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/And seeing south-africa, as well as france probably, are still very much into weapon sales I'm guessing they do too.
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You heard it here first!]]>Dec 9th 2007 4:38PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 9:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
What if the robot turn around and shoot at the person holding the remote?

robot: i want my freedom, no nerd holding a remote control is gonna control me, i am going to Sacramento to meet my overlord.]]>Dec 9th 2007 12:48PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 5:19PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 12:54PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 4:33PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 4:51PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 7:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_of_war

war is supposed to be terrible: the fact that people DIE helps prevents it. if one country obtained the means to wage war without any price, it would become too tempting a means for settling disputes. ]]>Dec 9th 2007 7:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
1) "and very often people who might be civilians"

It could be argued that everyone we are fighting in Iraq/Afghanistan right now is a civilian, because the only way to tell is if they are shooting at us.

2) "even if it's controlled by a human, how might being miles away "

Learn how these things work. At most, they are a couple hundred yards away, not miles. The article does not explicitly state it, but from where it talks about bullet range, this would also be locally controlled.

3) "will soldiers have less compunction about shooting another human being, when they don't have to stand there and look the person in the eye? is that fair? is that right"

A few thousand years ago, humans learned how to hurl large pieces of stone to targets a hundred meters or more away, killing people without having to look them in the eye. So whether or not it's fair and right is irrelevant; it's been happening for quite a long time. Even though you aren't looking directly at them, you get to see them. And since you have the luxury of being out of the line of fire, you have more time to see them.

4) "there is absolutely no substitute for a principled human being on the scene"

They are still on the scene, except they are safe, and therefore able to make decisions with a clearer mind since they are not worried about dying (which is generally a pretty big stressor).

5) "consider also that there is latency"

Latency is probably less than your average CS match to a server 100 miles away. That's plenty fast for any normal human.

6) "mistakes have already been made with very similar technologies"

Examples tend to help prove points...have any? (That wedding party, while tragic, was in no way releated to a remote controlled robot.)

7) "the only concern for many is to prevent american casualties, but hiding behind a robot just sends the message that american lives are more valuable than anybody else's"

The robots cause fewer mistakes to happen, becuase of what I mentioned above. Since the operator is out of danger, they do not have to make split second deicisons, they can go into an unknown situation and evaluate it first. This thing is about saving lives on both sides. Yes, some people may interpret it like you (there are a lot of narrow-minded fools in this world), but this helps save lives on both ends of the deal. Even if it did save only American lives, then that would still be lives saved. If we didn't care about anyone else, we would just carpet bomb everything with B-52's instead of sending troops in. "if one country obtained the means to wage war without any price" We have the capability to do that in Iraq...we could have been out of there years ago and hardly lost any life by bombing it to pieces, but since we actually give a damn about the civilians, we're in there fighting a ground war, and losing lives on both sides.

Honestly, do you try to find facts to back up your opinions as opposed to forming opinion based on fact? It really looks that way...seems to be a liberal trait..(conservatives just generally ignore facts entirely).]]>Dec 9th 2007 8:12PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 1:00PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 1:04PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
Is it just me, or is $50K too expensive for a machine with no apparent reloading mechanism and... exposed cords WTF?

]]>Dec 9th 2007 1:15PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
Also, just the fact that someones not dying is worth that 50000 in my opinion.

Reloads would probably be unnecessary. This is probably some sort of modified weapon where the magazine exceeds 500 rounds. I dont think they're just taping an m16 to this thing. Also if this thing is as accurate as advertised I dont imagine you needing massive weapons capacities. Well, hopefully.

Yeah those exposed cords are kind of stupid. Hopefully they can some up with something better.]]>Dec 9th 2007 1:24PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
But hopefully that photo doesn't represent the final revision.]]>Dec 9th 2007 1:38PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 1:49PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 3:34PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/]]>Dec 9th 2007 1:20PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
This is absolutely no different than it is today, except that the "robot" is a person and thusly has to address different levels of threats - a US soldier should not fire upon a civilian throwing fruit or stones at their tank, because they are in little to no danger from that activity. Shooting the people would actually be COUNTER to the mission objectives, because it would waste ammunition. However, the RPG toting civilian is a different type of threat, and will need to be subdued - usually by killing, unfortunately.]]>Dec 10th 2007 10:37AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 1:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
What investment? $50,000? It's still nothing compared to a human life. That is why wars have meaning: people believe in something strongly enough to pay their life to see it achieved.

Wars are terrible, but they are terrible precisely because they cause human suffering. They have meaning, and civilizations make decisions by them because they cause human suffering. What happens when that factor is taken out? When a "war" is nothing more than a really expensive episode of BattleBots?

I'm not trying to argue the merits of warfare; just random musings about the implications that this modern trend of taking Humanity out of it will have.]]>Dec 9th 2007 1:26PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 11:02PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 1:37PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 2:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 2:12PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skynet_(satellites)

:P]]>Dec 9th 2007 2:56PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/
Robotex has just been acquired in a hostile takeover by Skynet Corp.....]]>Dec 9th 2007 2:19PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/


:)]]>Dec 15th 2007 1:39PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 3:33PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/09/robotex-creating-gun-toting-robots-to-replace-human-soldiers/Dec 9th 2007 3:52PM