http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/ Engadget Comments for Toshiba introducing SD-friendly players for flash card movies that no one buys http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2012 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
they couldn't profit off of HD DVD, so they are pushing digital distribution, especially through their own channels.

sorry, this seems like a poor solution. ]]>Jan 3rd 2009 4:05PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 4:04AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
What Toshiba is banking on is that long term SD will be cheap enough that you'll be able to buy, say, a 128Gb card for around $10, and then just load it up with movies either at a kiosk or using some kind of Hollywood approved secure software at home. SD has DRM mechanisms (CPRM) built in, and it's somewhat more robust (to put it mildly) than optical media, and you could add a reader to most modern HDTVs for around $1 - and wouldn't increase the dimensions of the TV.

So if it wasn't for the high cost of the cards it would make a lot of sense to distribute movies on the format. That's pretty much the only aspect of the technology that's stopping it from being popular, and it does appear that time will fix that.

Murph should stop being an ass. This is potentially a very exciting technology that could do a great deal to bring HD to the masses in a way that satisfies everyone. While the media may be expensive, the hardware isn't, this kind of thing can be used to bring about sub-$50 portable movie players. It means future TVs can (and will) have players built in alleviating the need for a separate player. It means small laptops will be able to play movies (removing the optical drive from smaller laptops, even premium laptops, is fairly common these days), and do so with amazing energy efficiency.

There is no downside, except that in 2009 the media is just a little bit pricy.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 8:08AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
TVs have been built with VCRs/DVDs/Blu-ray players for a while now. You also can't just throw a reader on a TV and expect it to play HD videos. There still has to be processing.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 12:29PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Most TVs do NOT include built-in DVD or Blu-ray drives, and it's unlikely the majority ever will as it adds a significant amount to the cost of them. TVs already have MPEG2 HD decoders, and in all likelihood the cheap, commodity, chipsets used in TVs will ultimately support VC-1 and H.264 anyway. Which means that adding the functionality of "playing a movie from an SD card" to a normal TV design involves making a $1 change to the hardware (adding the slot), and a small change to the firmware (to read from the slot, decode the DRM, follow the menus and send the results to the existing decoder.) It's quite easy to see a situation where virtually every TV, from the cheapest $100 15" ATSC 480i CRT to a premium $5,000 1080p120 plasma, will support an SD card, built-in.

Can you really say the same about DVD or Blu-ray?

And here's the other point. The other day, EHD (Murph, actually, in a rare post filled with common sense) posted comments on the difficulty getting Blu-ray to go mainstream. Why is Blu-ray having trouble? Because it's not a seismic shift from DVD, unlike the shift from VHS to DVD. It adds nothing in terms of convenience, indeed the need for constant firmware updates means it actually subtracts from the movie buying experience.

Movies - CONTENT - on SD cards however could be a seismic shift.

Which makes Murph's attack on Toshiba all the more saddening. The real underlying reason why EHD is so Blu-ray positive is not because it's a good format - it isn't. That's why it has so many detractors. It's expensive, it's locked out to all but the big publishers, it's still a mix of differing standards making it impossible to know that every feature of a BD disc will be supported by your system, and it's full of gotchas like BD+.

EHD is Blu-ray positive because it's the only format left. And therefore they feel obliged to support the stupid ----ing piece of cr-p because if Blu-ray fails, HD in the home - at least in terms of people being able to buy movies - fails, or at least, that's how they see it. So we get Darren Murph's constant attacks on Toshiba for not bankrupting itself by spending billions on a format it knows to be a likely failure, which ultimately is what this is.

And EHD is so blinkered in its support for Blu-ray, it will attack all newcomers and potential competitors.

This is a technology that has the potential to actually work. It could actually persuade people to switch from DVD without going 100% to online, transitory, types of technology. Download the movie to an SD card, keep the card, watch it anywhere. Fill a single 128Gb SD card with five to ten HD movies, with full DTS sound and 1080p24 Blu-ray/HD DVD quality video. Download some of them via official Internet services. Copy some to the SD card from your video store. Maybe even record some from the TV. And watch it on every TV from the cheapest to the most expensive. Watch it using the SD card slot on your cellphone. Watch it using the slot on your 60" Plasma TV.

Not going to happen with DVD or Blu-ray.

Could happen with SD, if the media becomes cheap enough.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 8:54PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Unforunately such a thing already exists. DIVX certified players can play encrypted movies off DVD, USB, SD or whatever inputs the player has. Certified devices have a player key which the content must be encrypted to, but otherwise the principle is similar. The movie could be preloaded onto a USB key or SD slot, or be downloaded and copied onto the storage. Believe it or not, even the PS3 enables this. But it hasn't exactly taken off yet although some studios have signed content distribution deals. I don't see yet another variation on the idea doing any better.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 4:24AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
If Toshiba announced this and pushed for this back in 2003-2004, this would've been an incredible idea and would've been much more successful. ]]>Jan 3rd 2009 3:24PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 5:28AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 9:22AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
1) They are friggin small (compared to a disc). That type of shit gets lost.

2) digitablt complained about scratches. I hate that too (Netflix I'm looking at you), but SD cards have contact points that get dirty and can stop working. Simple enough to clean, but does J6P know what to do?

I agree with squiggles about the energy savings this could bring, though.

*3) Oh, those talking about encryption. Guess what. Every encryption method thus far (for media) has been broken. Just because you put something on an SD card doesn't mean the hackers won't get it.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 9:50AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/2) J6P doesn't know how to use an eraser?
3) With SD, the encryption can be different for every single SD card. So yes, it could be broken, for a single card/player combo, but not for every single copy of the moive.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 10:05PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
The only thing this guy does is tell lies, pretend he knows anything (which hostory has shown clearly is not the case) and insults people.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 10:01AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 10:05AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Like it or not, Toshiba is going to be pushing this HARD. How many movies encoded @ 1080p with Lossless audio can you fit on to a 32/64/96/128GB SD Card?

For that matter who says you have to limit the content to a particular screen resolution? Pop your SD card into a Red Box (or Blockbuster Box) Select your desired screen resolution, audio codec, swipe the debit/credit/gift card, accept the EULA and take the movie home.

For the time being, in car SD based players are the perfect way to watch those digital copies.]]>Jan 4th 2009 3:08AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
just another Toshiba distraction trying to steal blu-ray's CES 2009 thunder.....nothing to see here, move along......

BTW: where is Toshiba's BFF Microsoft? aren't they part of the HD DVD / movies on SD Flash Cards movement? did Microsoft's pockets suddenly get shallow or is Toshiba really going it alone on this one?]]>Jan 3rd 2009 10:15AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 1:18PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
However Microsoft did get its way with VC-1. It's a decent video codec but it should not have been mandatory for either HD format when AVC already existed. These days MS are trying to push / inflict VC-1 in other ways such as ensuring Silverlight *only* supports VC-1 (and other WMP proprietary codecs), not AVC. ]]>Jan 3rd 2009 3:18PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Microsoft's XBox 360 was ready for launch long before an HD DVD could have been put in it and so they could not have launched with an HD DVD drive.

You really mean that you would have preferred them to have been much delayed & to launch very late, just like Sony did with their PS3. ]]>Jan 3rd 2009 3:47PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
I bet it would have been pretty easy to just through a drive in the 360 that would have worked with HD DVD as well and then later given an update for movies. The difference in launch was less than 5 months. Its also obvious that HD DVD would have won with an internal drive in the 360.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 6:59PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 10:54AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 2:08PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Easy way to increase capacity over the disc and think about it, what a simple way to gain huge noise heat and power reductions, whats the bet this will be the future for gaming!
Realistically a games console with a spinning disc could become 'so yesterday' overnight

Movies will just be an added bonus but I'm sure MS will give those a nudge along as well.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 9:22PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Huge reductions in noise, heat, power AND size. M'soft ould substantially reduce the size of the 360 console as well, huge potential improvements and good economic sense.]]>Jan 4th 2009 8:04PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 12:16PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Seems like some folks just can't bear a different point of view.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 12:36PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
I find it kind of disturbing that instead of everyone cheering progress and future advancements in digital storage and distribution and overall convenience for consumers, a large percentage of people simply would rather continue supporting pretty ancient methods with a lot of flaws of their own and all this just because they cheer one company or out of simple prejudice.

Truly stunning.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 1:05PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 3:20PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
HD DVD isn't dead.

Not in the sense the Blu-ray boys want it to mean it isn't.

HD DVD ROM 51 (the triple layer ROM disc) is alive & well & still being refined & developed by the DVD Forum.

So next time you hear that very funny 'rumour' (put about by the Blu-ray boys) that Microsoft are going to be putting a Blu-ray drive in the 'XBox 720' you'll know what's really happening. They'll never pay a Sony/BDA royalty for Blu-ray.

No doubt they'll have an SD drive or 2 for those bigger sized SD drives that are on the way too? ]]>Jan 3rd 2009 3:37PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Microsoft's XBox 360 was ready long before HD DVD was and so they could not have launched with an HD DVD drive.

You really mean that you would have preferred them to have delayed & launch late, like Sony did. ]]>Jan 3rd 2009 3:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
SD isn't going to remain small or expensive forever. If I were Toshiba, I'd start with movies formatted @ 480p w/DD and 720p w/DD+ 1.5mbps. When the cards got bigger they could ramp up to 1080p & 2160p with TrueHD. As the resolution goes up, the players and the media form factor don't have to change.

Blu is fine, but if I can get 1080p or 4k without buying a new player every time screen resolution changes, I'm in.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 10:18PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 3rd 2009 8:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Regardless of who is producing this or pushing it, that should mean nothing, this is not another format war, and whether it makes it or not remains to be seen, but it certainly has massive potential and makes spinning disc technology seem like a gramophone by comparison.

Wouldn't it be funny if in a year or so, this tech is really catching on and it proved to be a big thing, with these comments etched into history there will be 'some' here on rather lofty pedestals wiping rather large amounts of egg off their faces.]]>Jan 3rd 2009 10:02PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 4th 2009 12:09AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
While Streaming it Nice and getting better. The Bandwidth just isn't there, the addition of CAPS is really going to limited HD streaming, especially quality HD streaming. Some of them caps are only 25 gig's, to around 250 gigs now for Comcast. Your also only streaming at home. Want to watch the move anyplace else and your out of luck. Your back to a Disc base format, or a SD card! I'm all for this and would jump on right away. If it was as good as HD DVD, I'd drop Blu-Ray like a rock!!! ]]>Jan 4th 2009 6:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
I also doubt, ultimately, that lossless is the dealbreaker many HD fans think it is. See my comment here:

http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/12/30/what-blu-ray-needs-to-do-in-2009-in-order-to-gain-ground/comments/16342592/

Something like a well mastered DTS stream, clocking in at around 500Mb per hour, will give you superb 20-bit surround sound with an excellent dynamic range. Add Blu-ray/HD DVD quality video to that, and you're looking at a video stream size of around 5Gb per hour for 1080p24 video. Most movies, including a single, excellent, soundtrack, and a BD/HD DVD quality 1080p24 video, will weigh in at under 10G. Want more sound? Well, again 500Mb per hour isn't going to add much to the transfer time, and realistically, most people will just want something like a commentary sound track as their additional track, which really doesn't have to be DTS, it could be 100Mb per hour DD.

Think about it. Download that from the Internet. Or get it from a Kiosk. Two minutes? For DVD quality, definitely. For 720p, probably. For 1080p24, well, perhaps, perhaps not, but if you really want that quality, waiting a few extra minutes isn't going to be a big deal for a movie you intend to keep. Or, y'know, you could just download it at home.

It's a beautiful idea, you have to admit it.]]>Jan 5th 2009 10:06AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 5th 2009 10:06AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
And all I need it to buy a new player again for lower quality and supply the media myself? Looks like a true winner.

(There may a hint of sarchasm in the above statements). ]]>Jan 4th 2009 8:02PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 4th 2009 9:46PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
If I have to wait more than 2 minutes I'm outta there (unless I have to do some grocery shopping)]]>Jan 4th 2009 9:50PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
For this theoretical speed the copy time for 10GB would still be 5 minutes. If you want lossless, multiple soundtracks or a good bit rate like on Blu-ray/HD-DVD you can easily double or triple this size.

Off course the future holds greater speeds for SD cards but if we have to wait 2+ years I’ll take optical media that is available right now.
]]>Jan 5th 2009 12:27AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 5th 2009 12:45AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Gus, I don't think everything needs to be full "better than Blu-ray" from the start. 720p, with a decent codec (DTS! DTS!) will be enough for 99% of the population and would mean file sizes of around 3G per hour of content. Transferring 6G to an SDHC card shouldn't take that long.

I also doubt, ultimately, that lossless is the dealbreaker many HD fans think it is. See my comment here:

http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/12/30/what-blu-ray-needs-to-do-in-2009-in-order-to-gain-ground/comments/16342592/

Something like a well mastered DTS stream, clocking in at around 500Mb per hour, will give you superb 20-bit surround sound with an excellent dynamic range. Add Blu-ray/HD DVD quality video to that, and you're looking at a video stream size of around 5Gb per hour for 1080p24 video. Most movies, including a single, excellent, soundtrack, and a BD/HD DVD quality 1080p24 video, will weigh in at under 10G. Want more sound? Well, again 500Mb per hour isn't going to add much to the transfer time, and realistically, most people will just want something like a commentary sound track as their additional track, which really doesn't have to be DTS, it could be 100Mb per hour DD.

Think about it. Download that from the Internet. Or get it from a Kiosk. Two minutes? For DVD quality, definitely. For 720p, probably. For 1080p24, well, perhaps, perhaps not, but if you really want that quality, waiting a few extra minutes isn't going to be a big deal for a movie you intend to keep. Or, y'know, you could just download it at home.

It's a beautiful idea, you have to admit it.
]]>Jan 5th 2009 10:06AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 5th 2009 10:08AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
If they want to sell movies in Blu-ray quality or better (same bit rate and lossless sound tracks) on SD cards for the same price as a Blu-ray or less then I don't mind, but I won't stand in line waiting for it to copy to my own card.

]]>Jan 5th 2009 11:14AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
Yes, HD DVD and Blu-ray tends to sound "better" than the equivalent DVDs, but that's because they were mastered better. They sound better when played on an HD A2 through a SPDIF connection.]]>Jan 5th 2009 11:59AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 5th 2009 6:17PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
But around the price of SD cards. I honestly do not think it is possible to produce a 50GB+ SD card for around 1-2$ like it is possible with optical media for a long time to come.

I don't undestand why so many actually even consider to buy mp3 files (or even worse, DRM files from Apple and/or MS). I would not consider buying anything else than lossless formats (like on the old CD) and since some of the business is moving online I don't undestand why they cant offer a lossless or even extended formats like the same music in better quality (bit depth, lossless, more speakers like SACD allowed etc.

]]>Jan 5th 2009 9:39PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/
There's no reason for it to be as expensive as Blu-ray. The distribution costs will be lower, the media costs (for the publisher) will be non-existent. I don't have the figures in front of me, but last time I looked the cost of each Blu-ray disc - minus the content - came to around $5. $2.50 of that is just the cost of pressing the disc. Add a dollar for AACS, and another couple for licensing fees, and it's a fairly expensive proposition. SD still requires the licensing fees, but the rest just doesn't apply. The costs to the retailer are lower. The media costs are non-existent. They can sell low volume and high volume movies alike. If the studios want to make the same amount of money per sale, they can probably cut the cost by $5-10 over Blu-ray. And it should sell better because it's cheaper, so they'll make even more money.

As far as audio: I take it you didn't read what I wrote, otherwise you would have commented upon it, so I'll recap the issues here.

MP3 is a poor example, because it's generally a re-compression of a 14 bit 44kHz audio source using some of the earliest sound compression techniques. It's also never really been used as a movie soundtrack distribution system. What I'm talking about is full rate DTS. Here's the thing:

FR DTS is about 500Mb per hour, for regular 20bit 44kHz audio.

PCM (two channel) is also 500Mb per hour, which makes it around 1.3Gb per hour for 5.1, however that audio will be lower quality than FR DTS because PCM at that rate is only 14-16 bit, not 20bit. Up it to 20bit, and we're talking close to 2Gb/hour, four times as poor as DTS.

You would normally be able to halve those figures if you compress that audio with a so-called "lossless" codec, though both DTS HD MA and TrueHD aren't that efficient given their attempts to support backward compatibility, but you're still talking about twice the rate of FR DTS.

Now, here's the problem: virtually nobody can tell the difference. DTS is not MP3. Hell, Dolby Digital isn't MP3. These are good codecs, and enormous amounts of studies have been done demonstrating that people generally can't tell the difference between the two.

Now, you say, at this point, "Squiggleslash you dummy, I can hear the difference between Blu-ray and DVD and it's like night and day!"

Damned right. Blu-ray (and HD DVD) do sound better than DVD. HD DVD sounds better on most DVDs I have of the same content on my set up too.

My set up is an HD A2 with a Kenwood receiver.

Kenwood. That's the company that stopped making receivers years ago.
HD A2. That's the HD DVD player that doesn't have analog 5.1 outputs.

How, then, can I hear surround sound on that set-up if the receiver is too old to support HDMI, and the HD A2 isn't feeding the Kenwood with an analog signal?

Answer: Because the HD A2 is converting the audio to full rate DTS before feeding it to the receiver via a TOSLINK cable.

So, my HD DVDs sound better than my DVDs despite the fact that they're being played using a DVD codec. (Worse still, a DVD codec that's being run on the fly, automatically, rather than monitored and tweaked by a team of audio engineers)

Why is that happening? Because they're started caring about the audio quality on the HD disc formats. On DVDs, the studios were trying to squeeze around three different soundtracks (different languages) AND a commentary or two onto the disc coupled with the movie itself. In practice, they had around 1Mb/second to play with for that audio, all that audio, around 250kbps per stream. Of course DVD audio sucked. It wasn't the compression, it was the over-compression, the poor mastering, the "soften the sound because otherwise the listeners will be able to hear how over-compressed this is" crap.

Ok, with that said:

So you go into a store, and you say "I'd like to order 'Star Wars Episode Minus Two: The Prequel of Sith', here's my SD card". The store is going to copy it to the card "while you wait". Or maybe you're downloading it from the Internet, who knows? Anyway, here's the thing:

- What stops the store from letting you choose the quality of the transfer?

Imagine if you can say "I want 720p, with 7.1 DTS MA", or "I want 1080p, with 128kbps stereo Dolby Digital", or "I want 480p with DTS".

You can't say that with DVD or Blu-ray. Both require that the studio support everything you'd want up front. That's why DVD audio sucks - because the studio was to squeeze four soundtracks onto the disc together with the video stream because it has no way of knowing who's going to listen to it.

But if you're going to copy movies to SD cards, well, all you need is to support each option on the hard drive of the device that loads the movies onto the cards. Include 480p, 720p, and 1080p H.264 video streams, and Dolby Digital 5.1, FR DTS, and DTS MA HD (or whatever) of each sound track the user is interested in.

Pick a movie. Pick the quality. "I want 720p, DTS English, and DD5.1 Director's commentary. Oh, and add the "Making of" extras package." Hit the "Load to card" button. You have it your way. There's no good reason why that cannot happen.
]]>Jan 6th 2009 9:14AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/03/toshiba-to-intro-sd-friendly-players-for-flash-card-movies-that/Jan 11th 2009 2:53PM