http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/ Engadget Comments for Intel X25-M SSDs slowing down with extensive use? http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2012 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:15PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:17PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:18PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
As was stated below it may take a generation or 2 for the kinks to be worked out.

Because of the UNKNOWN about lifespan and long term performance use.. (And price) I will stick to standard HD's.]]>Feb 19th 2009 1:34PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:40PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:40PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/The shocking thing is that the write speed can drop down to as low as 20MB/s from 250MB/s.

That is a LOT slower than a old 500gig spinner I have.

And also, you cant fix the issues from within the OS, you have to move your whole OS off, then write one large file over the SSD, and even then, sometimes that wont fix the drive. meaning you have to do a deep format to reset it to factory condition.

Also it looks like its just the intel SSDs that are effected atm, the same thing that causes them to have such high speeds is the same thing that causes this problem.]]>Feb 19th 2009 1:40PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
How do they get real world stress test and results if nobody in the "real world" is using them? Early adopters are just as much part of the process of refinement as the corporate R&D.]]>Feb 19th 2009 1:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/I don't doubt that a ssd can get slower over the time cause of wear leveling or something else but definitely not due to fragmentation and I doubt that the performance can drop that much under normal working conditions.]]>Feb 19th 2009 1:52PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 2:46PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/]]>Feb 20th 2009 8:49PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
Secondly, Check out the reviews of OCZ drives like the Vertex.. They seem to hold up well.

Finally, drives that use SLC flash won't have this problem as they write much faster...]]>Feb 20th 2009 3:28AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:17PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:17PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:18PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 3:55PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:25PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
that's all i have to say about that.]]>Feb 19th 2009 1:36PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:39PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 4:32PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:27PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/I think they are saying that the issue is the algorithms that speed up the drives are impacted by the fragmentation issue, not the drives capability of reading the data on a fragmented hard drive. The algorithm is mucking up the seeks to fragmented data. That said, the sector remapping and wear level algorithms would seem to do the same thing, that is, making sure you don't write too much crap to one area of the drive while not using another area... making defragging first probably pointless as the goal is to prevent those areas from being used in the first place.

Perhaps this is where they could take a lesson from non solid state drives and implement buffering data or only using complete blocks in isolating data... (disk waste, but performance improvements)]]>Feb 19th 2009 2:02PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
I'm a little skeptical that this is a big problem. Yes, it does mean that you won't always experience maximum rated speed with an SSD (which many people thought was guaranteed), but I think that part of the problem is that right after imaging your drive, the system doesn't know which blocks are the "hot" ones. As you actually use the drive, the blocks that are used the most will be treated best and end up grouped properly in pages and run at full speed.]]>Feb 19th 2009 1:49PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 1:50PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 2:27PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 2:31PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 2:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/]]>Feb 19th 2009 3:19PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/]]>Feb 19th 2009 3:17PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 8:00PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
The owner is personal friends with some people who work at OCZ who just so happens to be pushing some new SSD drives out AND who happens to be the only one on the net to do a preview... Seems pretty odd to me.
I have personally worked with both the Apex and Intels, the Intels are hands down better.]]>Feb 19th 2009 3:37PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 4:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 4:33PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 4:44PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
I like mine. I do, however continue reliable and regular backups.]]>Feb 19th 2009 4:51PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 5:00PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
This article is showing that your speed will decrease with time as the drive is used because the wear levelling algorithm places so much data in different locations, that when you benchmark the drive later in life, it's nowhere near what it was initially.
]]>Feb 19th 2009 5:33PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
And it's Eli, not Gundry. I barely know you.]]>Feb 19th 2009 5:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 7:15PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
It simply doesn't matter if the files are scattered all over that precious flash ram as the access time will always be the specified 1 ms.]]>Feb 19th 2009 5:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 5:28PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
I've heard that if you fill some of their drives with data, you will almost immediately see a substantial slowdown in performance.]]>Feb 19th 2009 5:35PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
http://www.experts-exchange.com/Storage/Hard_Drives/Q_24159694.html

If anyone can shed light on this and assist, I'd be grateful.

Thanks!]]>Feb 19th 2009 6:03PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Sorry guys, but the SSD is a nice technology but you have to pay for it.
Spend a huge amount of money and get a good but very expensive SLC SSD which may work, but who knows, or spend a lot of money and get a new, beta MLC SSD which does not work, but looks nice on the paper. Or spend only a bit of money and buy a HDD which will work and with a bit of system and OS optimization you won't notice a difference between HDD and SSD (except boot up times, but who boots a system nowadays, sleep mode is the solution)
I don't want to be a beta tester for SSD products. Maybe in one or two years they will release working products, but I can wait.]]>Feb 19th 2009 6:32PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
Another problem is wear, as flash devices wear, they take longer and longer to do both program and erase operations (by the nature of the flash device). So, eventually they will slow down, but nowhere near as slow as regular HDDs (notice the article did not mention the amount of slowdown). The problem you want to avoid is one part of the device going bad long before the rest of the device goes bad making the whole device unusable. In order to prevent this, wear-leveling is employed to ensure that the whole device ages at the same rate. The process of wear-leveling results in data being moved around (in the background). This movement, if inneficient, results in the device actually aging faster because of all of the inneficient movement of data.

Also, an HDD defragmentation routine does not understand the block/page issues in a flash device. It just assumes you can overwrite data and group it together. In an SSD, there must be some sort of mapping as a request for data at location X should alway return the same data and a write to location X should always update that data. But from above, you cannot overwrite a page in flash so the data must actually be written to a new location in the flash device and the mapping table will be changed to show that data at location X which used to be at physical location Y is now at physical location Z. So, an HDD defragmentor will see the location X, but the underlying (hidden) structure of the flash is completely different. So an HDD would reorder data, but in the underlying flash, it would probably result in even more fragmentation that the SDD defragmentor would try and fix. Having an HDD defragmento run on a SSD does not make any sense.

And then, there are a lot of other things under the hood which could affect peformance. Since nobody in their right mind would let out their trade secrets, it is unlikely that one would ever get a reasonable response, other than guesses, as to why the SSD is really slowing down. (For example, as the SSD gets more fragmented, are there inneficiencies in the SSD FW or HW that would start to show up, etc.).
]]>Feb 19th 2009 7:11PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/
Also Diskeeper claims to have a routine to defragment SSDs. Perfectdisk claims they are simply consolidating free space.

Should I believe any of these?

What can I do to keep my SSD in shape?

Thanks. ]]>Feb 19th 2009 7:59PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 7:11PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/19/intel-x25-m-ssds-slowing-down-with-extensive-use/Feb 19th 2009 7:54PM