http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/ Engadget Comments for Better Place tests its EV battery switching stations on Tokyo cabbies http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2012 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 27th 2009 12:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/..
...]]>Aug 27th 2009 12:28PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 27th 2009 12:29PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/
That's you all below me....

AHAHAH!!!]]>Aug 27th 2009 12:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 27th 2009 12:54PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/
You can't be first twice, so you just called yourself a fool.]]>Aug 27th 2009 1:52PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 27th 2009 12:33PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 27th 2009 12:35PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 27th 2009 12:38PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 27th 2009 12:29PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/epic picture lol]]>Aug 27th 2009 12:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/
I hope they do go all electric first so we can study in real life all the benefits and mistakes.]]>Aug 27th 2009 12:59PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/]]>Aug 27th 2009 10:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/
The deal with Europe, as far as I've seen, is more in support of Denmark. Denmark, as a nation, produces more "clean" electric power than probably anywhere in the world. As a result, they produce so much that they actually are selling electricity to neighboring nations as they have so much excess. Their goal for supporting the electric car infrastructure is to attempt to find a way to source more of the electricity out to their own people. With some of the discussion looking towards using electric vehicles, in the future, as storage receptacles where energy can be pushed to and pulled from a "smart network" (electricity culled from or sent to the areas where demand is most needed at any given time), the general idea in Denmark is to be able to use the batteries in cars as storage canisters for the excess electricity produced, which can either power the car or... at some point in the event of a shortage, have the energy sent back out to the grid while the car is plugged into the grid in "hibernation" mode. With Better Place's agenda being more akin to a wireless Telco applied to both the infrastructure and their monthly service plan, they're even contemplating the idea of subsidizing the car's sales. For pure electrics (i.e. Leaf, any Renault electrics, and Tesla) and even vehicles like the Volt (and it's Opel/Vauxhall derivatives) as well as Fisker, that could well be the arena that helps pave the way for greater success for cars that, due to tech costs, are priced outside of their market range in comparison to their gas competition. If Better place can knock $10k off of the costs then those cars suddenly become more reasonable to more people, any ability to drop the price more than that = icing on the cake.

With all of that said... while I prefer the philosophy of a Hydrogen fuel cell as I'm not at all comfortable with the traditional flaws of battery technology and their memory, life span, and shrinking performance over the batteries lifespan (and no I don't buy the commentary on Li-ion or Li-po; as having owned cell phones with Li-ion batteries the same battery memory and lifespan issues are still prevalent)... it remains to be seen just how far the fuel cell tech will scale to become reasonable. While admittedly, cars like the Volt and Leaf are ridiculous at $40,000-ish a piece (the Tesla Model S being a luxury car at $50k makes more rational sense... if I was GM, I would've skinned the Volt as a Cadillac first and waited for the tech to scale, a $40k Chevrolet [not a premium brand] that's smaller than a Cobalt isn't that appealing IMHO), I doubt you'd see many FCX Clarity's selling at what the technology currently sells at (some say the current FCX Clarity tech is in the $80,000-100,000 range) either. That said, the ability to pull into a "comfort zone" of a refueling station, roll up to a pump, fill your car up with a tank of hydrogen, and drive away is something that's very "homey" compared to what we all generally do today.

The advantage to the Clarity though is pretty simple. Extended range electric car = generator powered, which still relies on gas. While fuel cells still rely on the expense of fossil fuels at this time to extrapolate hydrogen, the fuels in question are more abundant and altogether cheaper, and a fuel cell vehicle's range and performance doesn't diminish nearly as much as a battery-powered electric vehicle over a longterm lifespan. By comparison... gasoline has a shorter lifespan and is tied to foreign oil. To achieve greater energy independence, the Volt is still an epic fail if you have to go anywhere with some range and effectively run in gas-mode. It might be less of an epic fail than a conventional gasoline car... but in the end, a fail is a fail.

By comparison though... fuel cell vehicles need a national network of suppliers. With the gas and oil refiners on-tap to build Hydrogen stations (likely even retrofitted into existing gasoline stations) and effectively reap the rewards of investing in the infrastructure and building pumps for it at existing gasoline stations, your Citgo, Shell, Exxon/Mobil (which also has an investment in battery technology purchased during the timeframe of the GM EV1's production), BP/Amoco, Volero, etc. are looking at cutting the foreign oil more and more out of the picture and yet, still looking to remain viable long-term into the future. If they don't invest the significant boatloads of profits and cash that they've made over the last 20-30 years... in the future, the profits will eventually dry up as the transition from gasoline is inevitable, the public has spoken, and it's just a matter of time 'til one of the choices hits. It is in their best interests to remain ahead of the game... and they may be just as willing to subsidize fuel cell vehicles, initially, as Better Place has been discussing as a possibility for their electric car sales infrastructure.

I wouldn't even doubt it if electric recharging receptacles (for pure EV's) aren't similarly equipped at their refueling stations as an option to make sure they are involved one way or another. That said... until there's a way to get maximum range on a 5 minute recharge, the viability of plugging into the socket is still less palatable than quickly refilling a hydrogen tank and getting on the road. For that I agree with rento, although from a pricing standpoint... pure EV's are getting closer to the market with a subsidy than fuel cells (and assuming Better Place's battery swap plans pan out, it could render some of the niggling issues with electric moot... esp. since Better Place owns the battery which you rent from them), which would take a considerable subsidy by the current petroleum takers (or Honda, assuming they deliver a home refueling station... they still need to hope for a national infrastructure to augment that though). It's like HD-DVD vs. Blu Ray, each have their advantages and it's a race against time to get penetration to sway the market towards their standard vs. the alternative. For that, you can be sure the automakers are sure to keep their irons in all of the fires.]]>Aug 28th 2009 12:19AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Anyway thanks for pinpointing denmark.
]]>Aug 28th 2009 7:52PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Now back to the regularly scheduled program, The A Team..

;-)]]>Aug 28th 2009 4:02PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/
This is a nice attempt but with fail written all over it. Hydrogen fuel cell powered vehiclesl will win this round.]]>Aug 27th 2009 6:46PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/Aug 28th 2009 9:51AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/]]>Aug 28th 2009 7:55PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/27/better-place-tests-its-ev-battery-switching-stations-on-tokyo-ca/
this is before you take into account that hydrogen in itself is very hard and inefficient to process into fuel, fuel stations that need to be built, specialized tanks needed to hold the hydrogen, oh and the price of all this. Which is high.

Let's just say if you thought the Tesla was a bit out of reach for the average person in terms of price then the hydrogen car might as well be on the moon.]]>Aug 30th 2009 12:31AM