http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/ Engadget Comments for Nokia asks court to dismiss part of Apple patent lawsuit http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2012 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:03PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:06PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/They are just trying to win part of the "arguement" before they see the courts...]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:46PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/where's that Contracts are not important is mentioned here, what's mentioned here is that apple trying to distract the court from the real case which is patent infringement ]]>Mar 12th 2010 4:14PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Hopefully it gets settled and that's that.]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:06PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
I foresee a multi year exclusive cross licensing deal in the works.

The people really making out here, are all the corporate lawyers, in billable hours.

Ya' know, I should have gone to law school.]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:08PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:08PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Only one of the federal cases is on hold -- in addition to the case here, all of the patents in the ITC case were added as well. That's the case which is on hold. It's a procedural circus.]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:12PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Is it a coincidence that the trials will occur in the year of the Mayan-predicted Apocalypse?]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:14PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:23PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:24PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
It's in the lawyers' interest to drag this out. More money to be made the longer and more complicated it gets. ]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Now you know why the world ends.]]>Mar 12th 2010 6:47PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
It's just the damn number of infringements.]]>Mar 12th 2010 8:38PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:34PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/me too]]>Mar 12th 2010 4:37PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 15th 2010 9:24AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:39PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/vigilante justice is the future of America's tarnished civilization]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:41PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 11:04PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
I have no idea... but i lol'd at it again today. ]]>Mar 15th 2010 11:21AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Apple hints Nokia wants to license some of its patents, but doesnt state which ones. Nokia in fact have some of its own patents on touchscreen...]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 3:43PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Whilst that's a bit harsh I do feel Jobs is going the same way he did last time. Focus on design, produce epic products, over-focus on some aspects of those products, get lunch stolen by competitors, get fired.

I wonder if he could make a second comeback though?]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:44PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
I don't think he could. He's been busy making Apple a well-oiled machine capable of putting out a hot new product that the market eats up every few years (with minor revisions annually). I think Apple could run a good while without him, but if they started to go downhill I'd imagine it would be too late in his life to make a return. ]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:58PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Honestly, I have been wondering if people have all forgotten the mess he drag Apple into in the 80s. Apple was on the verge of extinction by the middle of the 90s.... and guess what, Microsoft has to pity them.

Ah well.... grudgingly, I'll have to say without that fund infusion, the iPhone would not have change the game in mobile phones.

Anyway, from a legal standpoint, right now, Nokia has about 25% advantage over Apple in the dispute, since they have provided the license to other mobile phone manufacturers all these years.

Apple might just get what is coming to them for a long time now. Apple should never pretend to be a football player when it is a weak-knee nerd.]]>Mar 12th 2010 4:46PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
As for the patent thing, sorry but Nokia are the ones being a-holes here. They license the tech to other people for a fee. Apple on the other hand is expected to pay a fee AND cross licencse patents. Fair is that everyone gets the same (or roughly the same deal). Fair is not demanding more from one company because you are jealous of their success.]]>Mar 12th 2010 5:57PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 6:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Uh, most of it was down to Jobs. You might want to think about why the board lost confidence in him.]]>Mar 13th 2010 5:58AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Well look at IPR deals made by anyone of the big three you will find that the majority involves a cross license and a cash royalty. So its the same deal and the fee is around 5% of ASP. .

]]>Mar 13th 2010 6:37AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/You think Apple should "get rid of Steve Jobs" ? Are you nuts?
Or is that just the Apple-hater in you dreaming out loud? ]]>May 7th 2010 6:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Look up how AAPL stock developed from the time Steve Jobs was kicked out of Apple in 1985 and until his return in 1997.
Then compare this to how AAPL stock has developed since Steve's return in 1997 and up untill today.

That tells the whole story about Steve Jobs' importance to Apple.]]>May 7th 2010 6:50PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Nice one Nokia.]]>Mar 12th 2010 3:56PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
]]>Mar 12th 2010 4:10PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Nokia will provide the license to Apple, just that Apple (the spoilt brat) doesn't want to accept the terms, it wants to dictate them.]]>Mar 12th 2010 4:48PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/It seems to me that Jobs feels that his patent for touching his own device is more valuable than nokia's patent for touching everyone else.. lol]]>Mar 12th 2010 4:54PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 4:23PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 4:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/You must be right here.
a lot more in the game.
Apple uses patented technology from Nokia, knows about it as the previous discussions entail, is not happy about the asked "price" - whatever that price was - gets mad (SJ must have had a bad day then) and says, the hell with it, we going to use them anyway.

on the other side. Nokia is obligated to licenses at a fair price it's patent to anyone who asks. which they did. fair price is subjective as a phrasing could be.
fair priced TV for your poorest neighborhood might be 500$ .
while fair price for selling a Tv to Bill gates might be 2000$.

in any case, apple did wrong and obviously (due to what the patents are for wireless use)
for the fact that Nokia used Apple patents , well, for the too broad patents, that is questionnable, as they should be voided anyway.

for the other few, they are so specific, that the court has to judge.]]>Mar 12th 2010 4:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Indicates Nokia knows Apple has defensible patents.]]>Mar 12th 2010 5:42PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 5:45PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/Mar 12th 2010 6:40PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
Nokia holds patents for parts of the UMTS/GSM and LAN technologies. "Some" of these patents are part of the GSM standardization group and ETSI using the FRAND policy for licensing.

MANY companies provided patented technologies including Nokia (alot of it was Nokia). all of this tech was pooled together to create GSM, and out of that a GSM standardization group.

My questions are:

1) why is nokia the only one suing, or why is the standardization group and ETSI sitting on the side lines for this. Wouldn't these groups be more vocal about IP infringement used in its standards?

2) If my thinking is correct and Apple is infringing IP from a standard that is made up of multiple companies tech. Why does Nokia decide the licensing fee.......... Or how does Nokia get to ask for Apples patents when Nokia would be the only company benefiting from a patent swap?


I seem to be missing the logic of how this is only between Nokia and Apple? Nokia wasn't the ONLY company to invent GSM. It took alot of tech from many, many companies, if you you infringe on 1, your also infringing on 10 others. I know these patents in this suit are VERY broad, but even the patent for "data transmission in a radio telephone network" describes the use of other patented IP in its summary. why arent they suing Apple?

This seems like a strange licensing dispute to me. But it does throw up a red flag to me if Nokia "was" asking for a patent swap. Nokia has to license them as being a standard. But Apple has no benefit in licensing there patents. Nokia would know this, why even ask?

i Think there's more to this story, in 15 years we'll find out.



]]>Mar 12th 2010 9:03PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
1) Because it's not the groups problem, every member has to license their patents themselves.

2)Royalty is based on the share of standards-essential IPR larger player has invested more in R&D and should there by get more compensation.

]]>Mar 13th 2010 6:57AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/
1) But a 3G Patent Licensing Program is already in place so each patent does not have to be licensed separately. thats the point, its many many companies hold patents to make up the 3G standard. It would take forever to negotiate licensing for each individual patent and it wouldn't be in fair practice for competitors.

2) My question isn't about share of standards that are essential. - Its you already have UMTS/GSM standardization group working under FRAND policy for licensing AND a Patent Licensing Program. Its how does 1 patent holder dictate licensing fees for a body of standers. The Patent Licensing Program already states loosely that fees run from $1-$2 depending on which of or all 5 categories are to be licensed.

Patent programs and licensing fees are not my area of expertise so i know im missing something. It just seems strange to get in a licensing dispute when things are already well documented in a set standard.
]]>Mar 21st 2010 10:17AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/12/nokia-asks-court-to-dismiss-part-of-apple-patent-lawsuit/even if nokia offers to license fairly this does not mean that apple has to license fairly or even at all. so this is a no win situation for nokia, so it's best for them to have apple take the phone portion out of their phones and just sell them as ipod touch. then again apple has always claimed they invented everything http://technologizer.com/2010/03/08/the-secret-origin-of-windows/]]>Mar 13th 2010 3:33AM