A port of desktop IE to Windows CE is nothing new. There have been ports of desktop IE to Windows CE since CE version 2.12 in 1999 (IE 4.01) and Internet Explorer 6.0 for Windows CE first started shipping with Windows CE 4.2 back in 2003 along with a few minor updates in CE 5.0 and 6.0. It actually shipped with 3 different OS versions...

I never understood why MS kept hacking at their Pocket IE browser and just did not give up on it years ago and use the desktop based IE CE (with modifications) 3 or more years ago...

The truth is, IE 6.0 could have shipped with the original edition of Pocket PC 2003 if MS wanted it to. Why they never even talked about it in relation to Windows Mobile until now is beyond me. Maybe they thought the hardware was not yet up to par at that point or it could not render for small screens well enough... Who really knows? But in my view, its rather telling that they dropped support for the Pocket IE engine in embedded versions of WinCE completely with version 6.0.

I dunno. This article isn't too clear which desktop version of IE it is they are talking about porting, though. Maybe they are working on porting IE7 afterall... If so, if would be nice to have an update for embedded use and I'd hope they would also make it availabe to their embedded versions of Windows CE in the future if they did port it. (Or maybe it would not be so nice considering how badly it performs on some laptops...)

Guys, as far as I can tell this thing does NOT run Windows Mobile 6. It runs plain Windows CE 6.0!!!

I can't believe Engadget would make a mistake like that when the page they link to even says what OS its using right there!

For those that are not aware, there is a BIG difference.

Windows CE is a general purpose embedded OS while Windows Mobile is an open consumer-targeted standardized general purpose

(but still embedded) computer operating system (like Windows XP) based on the Windows CE kernel/OS. Windows Mobile is a subset of the basic core WinCE OS with its own specific enhancements like a word processor, PIM suite, etc. to create a full PDA platform.

Windows Mobile 6 is basically just WM5 "Second Edition" and is not all that different from the original WM5 other than some enhanced OS/end user features and APIs like HTML email in Pocket Outlook, enhanced Inking APIs, etc. Put simply: Windows

Mobile 6 still uses the same Windows CE 5.x OS that Windows Mobile 5 does. Its just prettier and has a few updated apps.

Because Windows Mobile is a "standard platform" much like Windows XP and is targeted at everyone from consumers to businesses, the OEM has little freedom to customize anything. MS can't afford to let OEMs break compatibility between different devices or else applications that run on one manufacturer's device would not work on another. About their only choice are what additional MS applications that can bundle along with whatever third party applications they decide to ship.

There is very little freedom to make the OS look and work how they want and they certainly can't edit the source code of core GUI components like the Shell or window manager because of the need for all WM devices to be "standard" and look and work exactly the same.

This Meizu device likely uses its own custom shell or at least runs a modified version of the Standard Explorer shell in the background. An OEM would NEVER be permitted to change/replace something as critical as the shell (shell32.exe on Pocket PC) with Windows Mobile. On the other hand, with vanilla Windows CE, its EXPECTED.

If this thing were running a Windows CE "standard platform" from Microsoft like Windows Mobile, I doubt Meizu could have ever given it such an iPhone-like GUI or even have offered a decent customized web browser or media player to differentiate itself from other PDAs.


This Meizu device is in fact using a newer CE kernel than even Windows Mobile 6. CE 6 is the CE kernel/OS that will likely be a part of some future Windows Mobile version like 7 or 8. (and codename "Photon")

For these reasons alone, I can see why Meizu would not even consider Windows Mobile for this device:

For one, the only web browser that Windows Mobile offers is Pocket Internet Explorer (IE mobile). There is no ability to customize this and it kinda sucks anyway. Plain WinCE offers the OEM either Pocket IE or Internet Explorer 6.0 CE. IE CE is a direct port of the desktop Internet Explorer engine to Windows CE with only minor differences from what the desktop builds offer. While there is a source code sample for a browser host EXE, OEMs are actually encouraged to create their own custom browser GUI hosing the IE6 engine. Even in WM6, Pocket IE STILL can't even open a second page (intentionally) and its HTML rendering engine is far inferior to desktop IE or Safari even with newly added AJAX support. On devices with small screens like the Treos or QVGA P/PC phones, this may be OK and matter a little less but on a device like the Meizu, I can see why they would especially prefer a desktop browser. Especially if they want to compete with something like the iphone's Safari.

Another reason I see is codec support. Embedded CE gives the OEM the option of using pretty much any of the codecs that are available to desktop Windows Media Player including DVD playback support. Pocket PC's Windows Media Player offers basically WMA/WMV, MP3 and that's about it. Plus, the OEM has litte ability to customize anything.

Another limitation of Windows Mobile is MS's insistence that any high resolution device (like VGA Pocket PCs) must enable that stupid pixel doubling mode. For those that don't know, this makes a VGA screen display no more data than QVGA unless an app is written to handle it. This is equivalent to making the font size on your desktop 100pt so that your 800x600 monitor offers no more screen real estate than 320x240 (or less)! While WM6 did recently introduce "support" (IE, MS will let you sell a device with such specs) for a screen resolution like this Meizu, I really doubt they would want to bother with WM for this reason alone. If using plain CE, they don't have to worry about what MS thinks about the general population's ability to see small high resolution screens and just do what THEY want and THEY need. Applications run on the thing should display in all their high resolution glory compared to WM's dumbed down "hidpi" modes that basically just make the fonts huge and icons prettier.

I'm sure these and others are why Meizu choose plain Windows CE over the much more limiting (to an OEM) Windows Mobile for Pocket PC.


To sum this all up:
Windows Mobile takes a "one size fits all" approach and limits the OEM and consumer intentionally while Windows CE is like building a structure with Lego blocks. You only pick the pieces you need or want for the specialized device you are developing and exclude the rest.

Now, that is not to say you can't build a powerful general purpose PDA platform with plain Windows CE. Its just not its ONLY purpose like Windows Mobile. If you want, you can build a platform as complete as WM or a tiny OS without even a GUI for a vending machine. For things like POS terminals or vending machines, it would be silly to have all the Windows Mobile apps like Pocket Word when you just want to tell the user how much change he gets. ;)

WTF? Why are they using Windows CE 4.2? Why not 5.0 or even the new 6.0? Sure, 5.0 does not add much...but if its the same price to license...why not just use CE 5.0?

Windows CE is certainly not a downside! Most Windows CE devices like this are easily hacked into something resembling a Pocket PC (or better in this thing's case) and often have much more freedom in hardware design than a true Pocket PC as they do not need to follow the strict hardware guidelines an OEM must follow for a Pocket PC. (Hence the 480x272 screen, etc) I just hope the thing has a battery so its portable and more useful as a PDA/Tablet. If it has USB host, as it sounds, thats even better! It means things like WiFi, USB hard drives and even USB touch screens should be very possible!

But really, if THAT is going to be its final price, you would honestly be better off with just buying a nice fully featured Pocket PC or Handheld PC like the HTC Univeral or Psion Netbook Pro along with a bluetooth GPS reciever and save yourself the hassle of hacking it just to be a PDA with navigation. I think you can get the Psion Netbook Pro which have an 800x600 touchscreen, WinCE 4.2, USB host, and a CF and SD card slot for a pretty decent price on eBay these days.

Regarding seeing an "Illeagal Operation" or something similar:

Windows CE should be a pretty stable OS if the OEM knows what the hell they are doing. And sadly, I admit, I have seen more than my fair share of badly done and buggy Windows CE OS images. That is not the fault of the OS but more the stupidity of the developers using it.

As it is a general purpose embedded OS, you should not even know what OS the device is running if the OEM knows what they are doing.
But really, if you saw such an error on another one of these Windows CE "PNA" (Personal Navigation Assistant) devices its likely because there was some program running from the SD card and you removed it. ;) I'm sure Linux or any other OS would do the same if you suddenly removed a disk containing a running program. Think before saying such things and bashing the OS just because its Microsoft.

As its running Navigon software, I imagine it will have about the same capabilities as Navigon on any other WinCE device like a Pocket PC... (Maybe more if they designed is just for this device) Just visit the Navigon site and google for reviews of the software on Pocket PC to get a better idea of what the software is capable of and its map support. Based on the reviews I have read its pretty good software and some prefer it over TomTom Navigator. TomTom is overrated, anyway. ;)

Like it or not, there is more and better navigation software for Windows CE (Mainly ARM Pocket PC these days) than any other OS out there. Forget Linux (Unless you count embedded as used on TomTom's devices) or Windows XP. Seriously, CE has at least 30 different road navigation products available worldwide... (Not to mention Aircraft, off road, marine mapping applications and other more specialized software as well) Many companies that have started in the consumer Navigation software market like Navigon are now also starting to sell OEM versions of their apps for bundling with these navigation systems.

Just to prove a point: Some folks are so desperate for something decent on Windows XP that they are running TomTom in the ARM Pocket PC emulator for their CarPCs... IMO, thats pathetic... ;)

And hey, if you don't like the Navigon software it ships with, you can always just install TomTom Navigator if you want. The Pocket PC version of TomTom Navigator should work fine. :)

As for why all these companies "think they can make a better product" than TomTom or Garmin... I think its pretty simple: Its cheap, easy and fast to do so. From what I can tell, all a company has to do to get in this market is:
1. Design or outright rebrand a PDA-like hardware design that is Windows CE compatible.
2. Licence Windows CE 4.2, 5.0 or 6.0 core for $3 USD and port it to their hardware.
3. Bundle/preinstall an OEM version of one of the many available Windows CE navigation packages and perhaps throw an OEM Video/Audio player on board to add features.
4.?????
5. PROFIT!

Because its so fast and easy for them to bring something like this to market, they can easily get SOMETHING out there in a matter of months. And anything short of the hardware and software licence/development costs is pure profit! ;) It seems to be quite a bit like the PC market, really. Companies like Ferrari, etc. really have nothing to do with the software or hardware being used but it gets their name out there. ;)

At least the Windows CE based-Pocket PC Phones can run all that nice Windows CE software that has been available for the ARM processor builds of consumer WinCE OSes since 1998/1999 or so. AFAIK, the first consumer WinCE device with an ARM processor was the HP Jornada 820 Handheld PC Professional device that was released in 1998. For those that didn't know or never realized, Windows CE is a VERY backwards compatible OS (far more than Symbian/Epoc based on what I have read about them) and as long as the program you wish to use did not use some crazy undocumented API that was broken/changed/depreciated in newer versions of the OS, most older software should run fine even on the latest Windwows CE 5.01 based WM5/WM6 Pocket PCs. Even the newest devices will still run most of the software made for that very first ARM Handheld PC from all those years ago. Not to mention PalmOS apps via the amazing PalmOS simulator Styletap ( www.styletap.com )as well as all those silly Java phone Midlets via one of the many MIDP-compliant VM's for CE.

For those that are curious, here are 2 examples of what a Windows CE 2.11 for Handheld PC Professional program would look like on a modern WM5 Pocket PC. As you can see, the Pocket PC shell will even move the taskbar to the bottom to better accomodate the application. If Windows CE 1.0 supported ARM, I'm sure such old programs would still run fine on a Pocket PC. I bet many CE 1.0 MIPS programs run fine on all of these new MIPS WinCE 5.0 PMPs that are popping up left and right from Korea. :)

http://www.geocities.com/giant_bootleg_defensor/CE/MenuFixedWM5.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/giant_bootleg_defensor/CE/pnotepadHPC.jpg

What does this iPhone have? Based on everything we have heard, it seems to actually be closed to any kind of 3rd party software?! Does it even have a Java VM for crappy cellphone games and apps like GMail Mobile? (Though, I must admit that MultiTouch sounds kinda interesting and I doubt its something CE will be supporting anytime soon even if it is more or just a novelty than anything too useful. Even though this thing claims to be based on OSX, which of course has much more desktop-level software than Windows CE, none of it is compiled for ARM. And if Apple won't allow 3rd party developers near it, none of it will be, either! :P Sure, it may be based on a BSD kernel and will obviously be hacked... but in all honesty, I'd rather have TomTom Navigator on WinCE ( www.tomtom.com ) than Roadmap on UNIX ( http://roadmap.digitalomaha.net/ ) if you get my drift. ;)

Thats a cute little WinCE PDA...and I love how they say the flash memory can be upgraded by the user! (unless they just mean it has a CF/SD slot) Without a D-pad, it will suck for gaming unless those rubber side things are hiding one somewhere. It sounds like this thing is almost as customizable as one of those "made to order" laptops from Dell but in Windows CE PDA/PNA form. Wifi and Bluetooth options sound really nice as well. I have no idea what "u-Blox GPS" is, though.

I dunno but it looks like it at least has a higher resolution than most of the 320x240 WinCE PNAs. I'd wager its AT LEAST 480x272 like the Blufin and some of the other CE PNAs and PMPs out there. It at least looks like that to me. I think "seeing pixels" is more the result of a bad angle or photo that was taken way too close than anything else. I'm sure its as crisp as the Blufin PMP/PDA's screen.

PS: Based on the presence of Internet Explorer 6.0 CE, it It looks to be running Windows CE 5.0 Professional rather than the bare minimum CE core...So they at least must want to sell this thing as more than a PMP/PNA I'd guess. Maybe they will even sell it with the Windows CE OS "unlocked" and let you install 3rd party programs, etc.

Bah... Its annoying that all these newer Windows CE powered "AIO" GPS navigation devices are dropping the d-pads... It will make them useless for playing games that need lots of buttons once they are hacked/"opened up". I guess its fine for Pocket PC games that rely heavily on the touchscreen, though. ScummVM games would be OK, I suppose.

Woo! Its a real H/PC! (Or at least the closest modern device we have had since the NEC/NTT Docomo Sigmarion 3) It would be a bit better with a keys shaped more like a normal keyboard, though.

Bah... Why do all the cool devices have to be asian only. :( All we ever get here are boring old Pocket PCs of which OEM's have very little freedom to innovate hardware-wise(though, MS is getting better...Windows Mobile for Pocket PC OEMs are still only permitted to use a few "supported" resolutions)

At least with the (now dead) Handheld PC 2000 Platform or a custom Windows CE OS, the OEM has the freedom to do whatever the hell they want. Damn compatability, I say! Most Pocket PC programs will run with hacks anyhow. If there was a MS supported standard platform for Handheld PCs again life would be so much easier... but oh well... I can live with hacks. They are half of the fun anyhow. :P

I can at least hope we get some easily hackable WinCE PNAs with keyboards in the states someday.... (Hey, a keyboard would make inputting addresses easier! Or, at least that is my excuse for having one.)

It seems this device has been added to the supported device list of Wincesoft's GAPI For HPCs so I assume it has already been "opened up" to allow you to run 3rd party WinCE apps. :)

http://wincesoft.de/html/gapi_for_hpc_s.html