TiVo + Netflix: Together forever
Hugeness. They've been making noise about doing video-on-demand before, but TiVo actually took everybody's advice
and is teaming up with Netflix to introduce a new service where if you subscribe to both TiVo and Netflix you'll be
able to get your DVDs delivered to you directly over the Internet rather than having to wait for the discs to arrive
through the mail (you will have to wait a few hours for the movie to download to your TiVo's hard drive). The deal
hasn't been totally finalized yet (it's still awaiting approval of TiVo's board of directors), but we're still sorta
dealing with all the weirdness of the two companies actually listening to what people were telling them and teaming
up—we never thought it'd actually happen.
[Via BoingBoing]
Filed under: Home Entertainment
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
barrett @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
that for 20 bucks a month you could legally download unlimited movies? i thought that you could copy stuff off the tivo, i could be mistaken
Ian Firth @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
Another horrible idea for people who can't be bothered to walk to their mailbox.
Is downloading a movie for 5 hours really that much better than waiting one or two days for it to arrive in the mail ?
What about people using Comcast who monitor bandwidth consumption. Those downloading 5GB movies daily will quickly have their accounts disabled for excessive use.
Fox Neilson @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
I am currently a DirecTivo user, as well as a NetFlix user, and I am very excited about this.
It is not a matter of being lazy. It is the fact that I don't want to wait 3 days to get a movie. I am going to walk to my mailbox every anyway.
I just hope that DirecTV doesn't prevent the DirecTivo's from using this service. I can see them doing that since they have their own pay per view service. But I have NEVER and will NEVER use it. It doesn't compare at all to netflix.
As far as the ability to copy, yes, chances are you will be able to simply download a movie, and copy it to a PC. That doesn't change anything though. Its not like its hard to copy a rented DVD currently. It just makes it a little faster I guess.
Loraan @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
"Is downloading a movie for 5 hours really that much better than waiting one or two days for it to arrive in the mail?"
Yes, and here is why: postage makes up a significant part of Netflix's expenses. Because of this, Netflix is rumored to intentionally delay shipping movies to users who return movies too quickly, pushing their "cost-per-movie" below a certain threshold. While this hasn't been confirmed, it is interesting to me that I have turned around the exact same number of movies, plus or minus 1, each month that I have had Netflix. This is consistent with my turnaround time falling below a certain threshold and me being throttled back. If movies are delivered digitally, then shipping and handling cost approaches zero for Netflix, meaning that heavy users like myself can rent as many movies as we have time to watch.
Another advantage of digital delivery is that you can rent movies more on a whim. Example: friends call up and say, "how about we come over tonight for a movie," but you just mailed back all your Netflix movies and the rest won't come for two days... or your friends will hate the movies you've got. With digital delivery, you can download a movie in time for your friends to arrive that evening. You can't do that with mail.
What about when you get a movie in the mail and after twenty minutes, you realize that it sucks? With digital delivery, you can return it and have another one the next morning.
What about when you get a scratched DVD and only figure it out in the last fifteen minutes of the movie. Instead of having to wait for a five-day turnaround time to see the climactic ending, you can... oh wait--digital downloads don't get scratched!
Digital delivery rocks over DVDs in so many ways that it is unbelievable. It's not just about laziness. In fact, the only way that digital delivery doesn't rock more than DVDs is that it's harder for "pirates" to copy digital downloads, whereas copying DVDs is trivial. Not that I would copy DVDs, of course, because I always obey the law like a good citizen. Always. Always. 100%.
PixelBrat @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
Loraan brought us some EXCELLENT points. Very well said! This is an awesome idea and heavy Netflix users like myself cannot wait for it to happen!!
Bill Klinger @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
I with you Loraan! This is going to be great. In addition to the positive features you mentioned, here are few more.
Tivo and Netflix will now be able to offer the equivalent of PPV. Im sure at first this service will only be for Netflix subscribers. However the door is open to have a Rent as you go solution and unlike other PPV solutions, it would not cost Tivo-Netflix anything more to allow the user to keep the rented movie for longer amounts of time. Current PPV solutions are implemented by download on the fly services. Tivos will be download once so no additional bandwidth is required for longer service periods.
Tivo will now be able to deliver the equivalent of cables VOD. This should help gain new Tivo and Satellite subscribers because another Cable Only service will no longer be cable only.
The more service Tivo can offer, the more likely people are to get away from cable service. Example, I am a Comcast subscriber because I want HD services, and I am unable to get HD locals off the air. Since I am currently a cable subscriber, it is much cheaper and easier to use Comcasts DVR system even though it sorely lacks compared to Tivo. However, a Tivo with Netflix service, HD compatible, and using the CableCARD standard, I would only need the Cable for the HD and SD feed. I would not need their cablebox , program guide, or DVR ever again.
This may be a great solution for TV stations to send there aired programs without the need for recording via Tivo. With the rise in popularity of DVR service, many broadcasters have been looking for ways to securely send content to DVRs for a variety of reasons and with or without service charges. With Tivo-Netfix being the first to market, it gives them a jump of securing these types of services.
Wayne @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
Why does Tivo need Netflix? Couldn't they just start this service on their own? To make this service work you would need a license that different from buying and renting DVDs anyway. Couldn't Tivo get this license as easily as Netflix? Just doesn't make sense to me.
skallas @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
These will not be DVDs. A double-sided DVD is 9.4 gigabytes.
I'm not sure what they will be when you get them, but they probably will have to be re-encoded bringing in nasty things like loss of quality, features, etc.
Warren Buckley @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
Obviously, duh, the download isn't going to be dvd format-sized downloads. It'll likely be divx and 700mb+, which is much more manageable. To watch something on your set, in decent quality, it doesn't have to be a huge resolution 'cause most sets can't handle it anyway.
Most people would give up a bit of dvd quality in order to have a movie conveniently and not have to return it at a specific time. This isn't for the lazy -- TiVo is for the busy. It lets you enjoy quality tv, rather than just watch more tv and surf looking for things.
I don't know where you live, but today I paid $5.35 to rent a dvd that had few extras and was mostly dialogue, so surround sound wasn't important. If I could have gotten it on my TiVo for less money (and had it indefinitely to watch over) I would have gone that route. Just so long as it's not pan and scan for god's sake.
Mark Williamson @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
I actually wrote about this back in April... here is the link to what I wrote then:
http://techwalk.blogspot.com/2004/04/netflix-tivo-partnership-waiting-to.html
I have written subsequent articles that state that TiVo's biggest problem is that 75% of their user base is from DirecTV where they won't be able to offer these types of services.
Ian Firth @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
You people aren't actually satisfied with a low bit-rate DivX copy of a movie are you ?
I guess I'm not the type of person in their target market.
branden @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
I've never heard that this was a known problem, but I have been suspecting it myself! When I first subscribed to netflix, my movies would get from California to Hawaii in 2 days, and take 2 days to get back. So with a day or two to watch the movies, my total turn-around time was 1 week. With the 5 at a time plan, I was able to rent 5 movies per week. Two months after I subscribed, the discs suddenly started taking 4 or 5 days to get here and another 4 or 5 to get back, making my total turn around time just under 2 weeks, halving the number of movies I could rent per month (basically doubling the cost of the rentals).
I put my account on hold and wrote to them about the shipping taking forever. They blamed it on the USPS, but other things were getting to me fast enough. They ended up shipping me one last batch of DVDs after I put my account on hold, and these ones mysteriously got here in two days again. I reactivated my account and for awhile the discs were arriving in 2 days again. Now they are back to 4-5 days each way.
If someone could prove this, I think it might be grounds for a class action.
Nicholas Frota @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
it's a nice idea, for sure. but i don't think it would be unlimited movies... there should be a cap on it.
it would be nice if the cap was the same as the snail mail solution, 3 movies per turn. you gotta delete one movie on your tivo, to get another one.
but sadly, i think when ppl start enjoying the combo, the MPAA suit guys will come over and raise the copyright, or something like that. I assume that if they see ppl having fun with their stuff, they automatically think "time to charge more".
OTOH, think about some other possibilities... netflix has a good selection of anime series, and dvd tv series... what if we could break the concept of "one dvd" (it's all digital anyway) and start downloading just the episodes we want?
and, what are the rules to be added on netflix library? because when you talk about dvd, you have huge initial costs, but when it's all digital, you could have amateur productions stored on netflix system, because the fee is on each transfer (less than snail mail, but...)...
adding it to some viral marketing tools (like, "send to a friend" "add to your queue", etc), I can imagine some indie movies begging to enter the netflix bandwagon... in the same way cdbaby is striking a deal with itunes store, to license indie music.
because, you know, what convinced me to go to netflix was the wide selection of foreign movies... you should know how /hard/ it is to look at something not-american here in the USA...
Chris @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
I like the idea, but I don't see how this could be effectively done with todays bandwidth limits. I barely ever transfer files from one Tivo to another because the lame USB 1.0 port makes an hour show take 2 hours to transfer over my wireless network (with an "excelent" signal). I just don't see this taking off with such a bandwidth bottleneck. Maybe when we all have 30MB/s internet connections.
Honestly, when you want to watch a movie, what is more convenient... sitting there for 5 hours (i.e. changing your intended schedule) to watch a most likely compressed and atrifacty movie... or driving 5 minutes to blockbuster for the real thing? You could drive there, watch 2 or 3 movies and return then before 1 movie would finish downloading.
John Metzger @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
If the service is anything like Movielink is currently offering it will be good. With Movielink you can download to your PC, pick the format WMV or real and start watching the movie within 10-15 minutes of starting the download. You can also choose to download the entire movie and watch it up to a month later. You get unlimited viewings in the 24 hour period after you first start to watch it. Then you can choose to pay a small fee (.99) and open up anohter 24 hour block. They have also started offering enhanced quality movies, larger file size, better resolution, longer download. I watch them on a HTPC hooked up to a 42 inch plasma screen and the quality is better than DVD to my eyes (progressive scan DVD through component video). Personally I think it's going to be a big win for both TiVo and Netflix if they offer the same flexibility as movielink.
Luke @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
As several people have already noted, the number of movies that you watch from Netflix does impact how quickly and what movies you get (ie, if you watch a lot of movies, something might be long waited for you, but available to someone who only rents a few a month).
This link describes the situation pretty well:
http://dvd-rent-test.dreamhost.com/
As a long time heavy Netflix user, I'm all for this. Fantastic idea for those with a TiVo.
dfd @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
Video-on-demand is one of those technologies that eventually HAS to happen. There's no way around it. It makes it easier and more convenient for couch potatoes to get their stories.
This is a very rudimentary first step, but it's a first step nonetheless.
Peter Kimball @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
I'm using a Sony SVR-2000 that is a couple of years old. Any ideas about whether I'll be able to get digital downloads?
Scott @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
Ok, so my 140 Hour Tivo arrived today, and before i open the box a friend informs me about this NetFlix/Tivo arrangement. So, concerned that this unit will NOT be NetFlix compatible, i call Tivo for clarification. The rep at Tivo told me that she was informed "today" that is was just a rumor and there is no agreement being worked on between Tivo & NetFlix...(how convenient, she just happen to be told "today"!!). So do any of you know if their is a future being worked on between Tivo & NetFlix... and if there is a NetFlix future, what are the chances that NetFlix downloads will work with this generation of Tivo's, specifically, the 140 hour unit? Does anyone know about the next generation of Tivo's? When they are due out and what new feature/benefits such new units will have?
Thanks Everyone
Alex @ Dec 19th 2005 12:04AM
I really hope this deal goes through. This may get me to purchase the Netflix subscriptions.
Alex
http://www.tivoblog.com