Apple gouging Europeans on the Mac mini?

Apple's not the only company that charges more in Europe for their products than they do in the US—obviously local market conditions, taxes, and other variations in the cost of doing business mean that different countries will have different prices for the same products—but a lot of European Apple fans are peeved that they will have to pay a lot more for the world's "most affordable Mac" than their American counterparts (recall that Apple's been slammed before for charging Brits more for iTunes Music Store downloads than they charge everyone else, too). For example, when it comes out, customers in the UK will have to pay £339 ($632) for the version of the Mac mini which costs $499 in the US; in Germany the cost is even higher at €489, or $636.  So have these disgruntled consumers launched a boycott or organized a sit-in at the Apple Store in London? Nah, instead they've chosen to employ the most effective method of protest known to man—an online petition asking them to lower their prices. Best of luck with that!

[FMr Ikasu @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Just thought I would point out that once you add the 17.5% VAT to the $499 price (which I don't think includes sales tax) you end up with $586 making it only a 50 buck difference.

Probably fair if you think about the extra shipping etc.

I wouldn't mind them being cheaper though!

[Ed @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

If people would compare Apple's PRE-VAT pricing to the US pricing, there wouldn't be so much complaining.

Example: Mac mini: $499 US - �288.51 ($539.37). $40 USD difference.

France: $499 US - �417.22 ($546.81). $46 USD difference.

While pricing between the two countries is not 'on-the-dot- perfect, it's pretty darn close.

Don't blame Apple for a 19.6% VAT (France) or 17.5% (UK) charge. That's your government's doing.

[adnans @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

In Ireland the MacMini costs �519 ($675). Yay Ireland. :(

[Heiko @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Actually, Apple's prices here in Germany are generally much higher than in USA. For example, take the iPod at 329� which is around 429$. Probably that's why *many* people here have flash-based MP3 players ��iPods are not common and usually not taken into accont.

Now guess why there are so many european tourists shopping at Apple Stores in the USA.

[David @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Unfortunately, this is a mistake everyone seems to be making. The UK price includes Sales Tax which the US price obviously does not, the UK price without tax is �288 @ Ex. Rate of 1.8 = $518. Ex. Rate of 1.7 = $489, so do u really think Apple are ripping off the UK ?

[Joan @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

I'm from Spain. Why I have to pay 40$ more than USA customers for a mini mac that's made in Asia (so the shipping cost are more or lesss the same for USA and EU)???
Why i've to pays 0.99 Euros (~1.27$) for a song in itunes?
etc, etc, ...

[cyberdork @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Don't know how it's in the US, but here in Germany (maybe the entire EU?!) they are required by law to give one year of full warranty plus an additional year of limited warranty on everything they sell. Could that explain the difference in price?

[iceberg @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

"...European shoppers, who are petitioning Apple to rethink its EU pricing"

I think they're barking up the wrong tree, its the oppressive governments with heavy-handed tax policies which hurt the consumers, not Apple. I mean, don't they understand that Apple desperately wants their business, but can't go about losing money to gain customers.

And being the ignorant savages that these "enlightened" consumers are, I'm willing to bet that had Apple done exactly as they wished, they would be bringing anti-trust lawsuits against Apple; which kind of brings me to the point of why I think anti-trust regulation is a bad joke, and a very harmful one at that.

[TC @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

There certainly doesn't seem to be an education discount on the Mac Mini or iPod Shuffle in the UK - even though the US has them. Bah :(

[Oliver @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Holland and Belgium have it worse still:

Basic mac mini in Holland: 499 euro = $650

Basic mac mini in Belgium: 519 euro = $680

That's 150-180 dollars more!

[hide2all @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

If you think that you pay to much for an Apple product, please stop crying or barking ! Yes there is some VATs differences but it will never explain the gap between US or Canadian or Europe or Asia prices. The only way to fix this is to boycott Apple products which is never happend because of our stupidity !
Lets think about it and how Apple CEO is doing more margin just beause european people are paying more !?!

[Andy @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Mainly down to sales tax, it is a little more but its not extortionate.

But you can guarantee the good ol' British media will turn this into an Apple ripping us off story and a chance to knock them off a pedestal!

[Mark @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

My girlfriend and I recently had a new year trip from the UK to New York, to pick up some nice Mac items at $ prices. They were mainly cheaper due to the $ to pound rate, and the 8.5% sales tax verses 17.5% sales tax - although as a UK shopper I did find it a little confusing to have to add tax on to the displayed prices. We're using to seeing the "tax included" price over here! :-)

Bargain of the week was a refurb Airport Express, only $99 (ex tax) ... very handy!

[Daniel Noonan @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Paying VAT is worth it considering that we have to pay for a welfare state unlike Americans who are ripped of by there government not providing healthcare or Uni system and public transport not to mention a number of other smaller things.

[Mac112 @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

In all of the EU Apple has to give an (effective) 2 year warranty, wich of course must be covered in the price (lots of things can go wrong in that period).
And there is the sales tax (VAT), different from country to country. Here in Denmark we pay 25%� Our VAT (in part) finances free hospitals, free education, free motorways, excellent unimployment benefits (up to 4 years), pensions and a lot more�

[Tetsuo @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

If you want to talk about hideous price differences, let's talk about Grado Labs (www.gradolabs.com), makers of high-end headphones. Their RS1 model is $695.00 at www.headphone.com .. www.unbeatable.co.uk (which, I believe is one of the cheapest) has it for �634.96 ... For the record, �1 = $1.86940, meaning this thing costs 1,186.79 over here. Even taxes and whatnot can't justify that one. In my native Norway, it's even more expenisve. :(

[Tetsuo @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

If you want to talk about hideous price differences, let's talk about Grado Labs (www.gradolabs.com), makers of high-end headphones. Their RS1 model is $695.00 at www.headphone.com .. www.unbeatable.co.uk (which, I believe is one of the cheapest) has it for �634.96 ... For the record, �1 = $1.86940, meaning this thing costs 1,186.79 over here. Even taxes and whatnot can't justify that one. In my native Norway, it's even more expenisve. :(

[Mansmama @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

How about comparing apples with pears, for a change...I mean, how do any of the big PC-producers (Dell, etc, etc) compare prices for same products in different world markets? Surely, they must all face MORE OR LESS the same costs in terms of shipping, marketing, taxes, etc.

[Morten @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Denmark: $684 incl. 25% VAT which is $510 excl. VAT... I'll have one. Now.

[declan @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

VAT in Ireland is 21%. But even so price differences between here and the States do require some explaining. With price differences and the current exchange rate between the dollar and the euro people fly from Ireland to New York for shopping weekends and if they buy clothes and electronics like IPods they cover the price of the trip. The problem got so bad before Christmas customs officials had to make a press announcement telling the public they were going to crack down and charge import tax on any items they suspected were bought on the trips.

[chiudesign @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

The US dollar is really low right now, that bad exchange rate is causing the price differential.

[Ingoal @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

I guess it's a mixture of bad exchange rate, gurantees and local sales taxes. Over here in germany it's 16% so the basic price of 499� - 16% = 419,16� (546,46$ as off now)...so I guess there's not all that much to complain about...those 50$ are justified with the 2year full warranty and free shipping (remember that shops like dell charge 75� for shipping over here)...

[Mark Murray @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Please everyone, pull out your ECON-101 textbooks! There have been many good and probably true explanations for the price diff between USA and EU. Weak US dollar vs. the Euro and Value added tax probably adequately explains the price difference.

However, were that not to be the case - so what?! [edit: so f****ing what?!] If Apple can make their sales volumes at a higher price point in a different market (Europe vs. US) more power to them! If you don't like it, don't pay (I mean don't buy it - not steal it!) This is how a market economy works. Prices are set at what the marked will bear. (you should read that last puncutation mark aloud, i.e. "period")

[disc @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

1.
Apple has already reduced prices due to the dollar, they did that a week or two ago. The new Mac Mini and iPod shuffle was priced accordingly.

2.
Shipping to Europe instead of the US from China/Taiwan/wherever would not cost more.

3.
A price difference of $50 after VAT has been excluded from the price is just another way to earn some more.

4.
Apple has always overcharged for their 'design'.

[JK @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Can we all just stop this nonsense and get real for a minute:

Who CARES about europe or its people? They just a bunch of wusses anyway.

[Rick James @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Is �267 to �288 such a big difference. I can go to the high street and find shops next door to each other, selling identical electronic items with a bigger price difference

[Viviana Wong @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

The price listed for the US does not include the state sales tax which can vary from 0% (Oregon) to as high as 10% (Texas). In California it will be between 7.5% to 8% depending on the county where you buy your Mac mini. This ought to take care of the difference between the European and the US pricing difference.

[mike @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

The US dollar is really low right now, that bad exchange rate is causing the price differential

---

Ehm.. that would make the EU price go down, not up. A weak US dollar would benefit the EU customers..

A weak Euro, on the other hand..

[Sebhelyesfarku @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

JK you moronic redneck, take care about your goat.

[dave @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

see #22. I think Germans have a really hard time understanding tax is not included in displayed US prices (their 16% MwSt is added into everything).

Maybe you should petition McDonald's for paying more for your BigMac or Royal with Cheese? I'm an american living in germany and I "pay more" for everything, everyday, than I would in the US.

[deepkid @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

People have missed one basic item. Apple is based in the U.S. A manufacturer usually has more affordable prices in its home country, than abroad. Look at Japan. You're able to find electronics much cheaper there than the same models in the U.S. Some of this is due to tariffs, shipping and handling expenses and even trade agreements. When petitions like this crop up, it makes it easier for people to think that Euros either complain that they don't have access to Apple's products or complain that they are too expensive when they do.

[funnelbc @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

I'm in australia, and its like this here.

$499 USD = $661.368 AUD + we have a 10% goods and services tax $727.10 AUD. The retail of the imac mini here? $799 AUD. That's $70 aussie dollars extra to get it shipped from singapore to here instead of the states!

$599 USD = $793.924 AUD + GST 10% = $873.32 AUD. Retail of that model is $949. Extra $75 AUD for that model.

Which is pretty shameful price difference for a sub $1000AUD product. Is it apple australia gouging us on price or is it set by apple in the states? Either way I think we're getting done over.

[V. Gud @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Iceland:
Basic Mac mini 49.900 ISK including 24,5% VAT
1$ = 63 ISK
That comes to what.. 792$
636$ pre VAT.. I don't know about you.. but I think we're getting fisted over here..

[AB @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

I'm not going to complain about the price. I'm just not buying it now.

he he he
The joke's on you Apple.

[Another Thought @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Let's face it: Apple, in spite of its hip image, is out to make the maximum profit, like any other corporation. Yes, I know that comes as a shock to some, but Apple is like any other company and exists to make money, and make as much of it as possible.

If they can price it higher overseas and sell it, they will. Simple supply and demand.

Grow up, everyone: Apple is greedy like all other corporations. They aren't exactly giving away their stuff.

[funnelbc @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

#34 Yes, I can see that apple doesn't give away computers, and isn't in the industry out of the kindness in their collective little hearts - but that's not the issue here, simply that the pricing is inconsistent internationally.

[Another Thought @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

So what if the pricing is inconsistent internationally?

Gas prices are inconsistent within a few blocks of each other in my city, and in every city across the country. I know that some products are priced differently at various outlets for the same supermarket chain. Same with cars...same with a lot of things.

It's called discriminatory pricing...it means pricing is determined by the local supply and demand.

It may seem unfair or whatever, but that's only when one doesn't think in terms of economics. From an econ perspective, you price what the local market will bear.

[viveka @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

"If they can price it higher overseas and sell it, they will. Simple supply and demand."

But they can't. Apple's market share here in Oz is around half what it is in the US, and I'm sure part of it is to do with always charging just a little more here than seems reasonable.

Apple is charging $799 for the Mac Mini here; the exchange rate says it should be $659 plus 10% GST for a total of $725.

The difference isn't a lot of money, but imagine if the US price was $604 (which is what Australians are paying in US dollars) instead of $499. There's a reason Apple does't just charge that extra dollar to make it a round $500.

Another part of the market share problem is the lame Mac resellers. I just walked past the largest Apple reseller in the largest city in Oz, and all the staff were out the back looking distracted, and there was no indication that Apple might possibly have a new range of stuff. Not only no new stock on display, but not even a poster showing the new Mini or the iPod Shuffle, nothing to tell you when they might get one or whether you could order one, nada. There are some resellers doing good specialist business to the film and tv industry, schools and other niches - but no reflection of the consumer-focused Apple that we've supposedly seen since the Return of Steve.

[AznFX @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

@Sebhelyesfarku #29

wut does JK stand for?

and i really dont care how much macs cost in europe b/c theyre overpriced EVERYWHERE
the hardware in macs are worth about half the cost of the unit, u pay double for the rebranding of Hitachi/IBM hardware and Apple copywrites on their "designs"

but people will pay for wut they think is cool
senile fools

[Esme Vos @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

The only reason Apple charges more in Europe is that they know they can get away with it just like other gadget manufacturers. Europeans are used to paying higher prices than Americans. It won't be like this forever because prices are becoming more transparent (witness the outrage of a lot of Europeans on this blog). Because of the Internet, it is much easier for Europeans to find out what Americans are paying for the same gear.

Similarly, when several EU member states converted to the Euro, it became easier for people in one country to compare prices paid by people in another member state for the same products. Example: gadgets and blank DVDs are generally cheaper in Germany than in the Netherlands (and this is excluding VAT) so a lot of Dutch people go to Germany to buy their gear. I am sure there are reasons for price differences beyond just being able to gouge consumers but people are becoming less tolerant.

Another drawback to selling in the EU vs the US is the absence of a true "unified" market in the EU. Everything has to be localized in different languages. You have to put different warranty clauses, hire different marketing people for each country, and so on.

[Pip @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

//QUOTE// So what if the pricing is inconsistent internationally?

Gas prices are inconsistent within a few blocks of each other in my city, and in every city across the country. I know that some products are priced differently at various outlets for the same supermarket chain. Same with cars...same with a lot of things.
//UNQUOTE//

The gas station analogy is irrelevant in this case based on the fact that if you don't want to pay the prices of the city centre gas station you can drive to the cheaper gas station 2 blocks away. No one will stop you. Try living in England you cannot order a new Mac mini from the US store in order to take advantage of cheaper pricing in the US.....see how far you get. The 'so what' part only matters when it affects you.

The issue is that despite taking taxes into consideration European consumers are still paying 50 bucks more per unit than they should for a product manufactured in Asia not the US.

You can rattle as much as you wish about exchange rates between dollars and euros but in all fairness it means little (especially when the guys who made it are probably paid in either yuan or taiwan dollars).

Don't forget Apple is a massive company and by virtue of the size of its massive corporate pie eating sumo ass will probably get near interbank rate on money transfers. So currency exchange is not quite so much of an issue for them as it is for their customers.

//QUOTE//
It's called discriminatory pricing...it means pricing is determined by the local supply and demand.
//UNQUOTE//


You are right about the name discriminatory pricing...wrong about supply and demand. Its a mini-computer, a media PC, a mass produced item not a one off Faberge egg. With an item like this if there is a supply problem its due to the incompetent producer totally underestimating the size of the market not lack of demand. Apple mini Estimated Ship: 3-4 weeks......no comment.

[charlie @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

Just get a friend to pick one up in the States. So what about the Warranty? Like you're not gonna open the thing up anyway.

[?ak Ben. @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

And in Iceland the Mac mini sets me back abut 49.900 ISK which is about $802....

[LeRoy Smith @ Dec 19th 2005 12:09AM]

If Apple must do business in your country with a physical presence the price you pay for their products will be based on the cost of doing business there rather than in the USA. For most of Europe that translates to higer costs, as well as higher taxes, hence higher prices. Certainly a no brainer....almost everything you buy in Europe costs more than here so why would you expect Apple products to be different?