Xbox 360 = Xbox 1.5? Kutaragi trashtalkin'!
posted May 25th 2005 9:57AM
Meeeeeeow, Ken — it's a game
console catfight, and in the near corner we've got Sony CEO Ken Kutaragi serious dissin' on the
Xbox 360, which is "more like an Xbox
1.5" because it seems like an extension of the original console instead of something radically new. He also lays in on
the use of multiple general purpose CPUs that will "only benefit general applications" as opposed to beefing up
entertainment functions. So guess what the PS3 is all
sorts of about? That's right — entertainment, entertainment, entertainment. Those Media Centre PCs, says Ken? Nice
distractions that emulate home electronics. But the PS3, man, the PS3 — created from the ground up for home
entertainment. Beyond all the hyperbole and verbal fisticuffing, Kutaragi mentioned something very interesting about a
sort of online storage system called Cell Storage that would act as central respository for media. Also curious, the
concept that you'll be able to use idle time from the Cell chip to perform processor-intensive functions such as
scaling up standard video to high definition, for example. Smells like "distributed computing" to us and frankly, we'll
be excited to see it coming to the living room. Let's just hope it's not more hyperbole.
[Thanks, tk for the size comparison image]
Wow, is the weebox 360 that much bigger??
The plugs seem to be the same size(the power plugs) so it seems possible. and don't believe james
That picture of the 360 is fake. If you look at the AC input, it is the same size as that of the PS3, which we use as a point of comparison. However, if the AC plug for the 360, scaled down, is that size, then the console would not be that large. An AC plug is about 1 inch wide, and we've seen real videos and pictures of an Xbox 360 that is about 12 inches tall. Therefore, the plug on this system cannot be real; it is likely that it is a scaled-down, photoshopped version.
Yeah, but remember, PS3 is the one that looks like a fridge. Not the "chill" colored Xbox.
*sigh*
Heh. I'm tired of all this stupid "trashtalking" and fanboyism thats everywhere now. Just buy a console that you want and shut up. It's just a gaming console, It's no big deal. Grow up people, especially you MS and Sony!
james is a liar
mattybizle must be retarded.... of course james knows wats up.... mattybizle u stink
Thanks for scaling down the refridg..er..ps3... my 15-inch monitor wouldn't fit the whole thing.
james is a nazi girlscout with a raging hormonla mean streak for lying.
Well as an ex-game developer I can tell you that developing for the Playstation is a painful joke compared to the luxury of developing for the Xbox. I expect developing for the PS3 will be even more of a nightmare - if its anything like the PS2 all you will get is a 5 foot high stack of manuals full of op-codes bottle of saki. Microsoft deserve to win this round as they actually have a *clue* how to create development tools and platforms. Sony dont. Lets just hope that influences the developers and the development of the games significantly enough to alter the outcome.
On Cell Storage... I'm not sure this will work for video content, not with the slooow upload link that most ISPs provide. Even my NTL cable account (which isn't limited by ADSL technology) has a dire upload speed.
nothing better then billionaires duking it out and everyone following behind a side like drones...
Just to clarify on the picture and size of both:
PS3- About 13.5" x 3.25"
Xbox 360- About 10.25" x 2.5"
I don't think the pictures were supposed to be on the same scale because the numbers say the opposite.
#5: Are you talking about, like... Being reasonable? Avoiding sensationalism? Dude, that's not what the "Oughts" are about! Reason shmeason, I wanna see some meaningless prickwaving!
Off/2-topic. Few quite interesting things:
http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS3988467635.html
My favorite part is the significance of PowerPC in new XBox.
blah blah blah blah blah
http://www.majornelson.com/2005/05/20/xbox-360-vs-ps3-part-1-of-4/
Does anyone else think the pic of the 360's "ethernet" jack looks like a phone jack instead? Thing looks tiny. Its either fake, my perception is off due to pics being different scale ratios, or maybe we will be able to use the 360 as a voip telephone adapter (in addition to making toast with the official MS toaster add on).
Yeah, sorry, that picture's more than a wee bit off on the scale. Here's a better size comparison of the XBOX360 and PS3 with the PS2 and PSTwo.
http://www.playnow.com.au/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=011210;p=1#000012
I've heard several people complaining about how hard the PS2 was to develop for (which I fully agree with), and then expanding that to the PS3. If a very large chunk of the UT2k7 engine was ported in 2 months (Yes, I know porting is different from straight-out coding, but it's still no walk in the park) then the PS3 can't be THAT hard to develop for, and certainly not as hard as some are imagining it to bee. Remember, very few people have even got a look at the CURRENT devkit, so we'll have to wait a while for any concrete indication of what the FINAL devkit is like.
As for the 360 pic being 'doctored', look here:
http://home.btconnect.com/hgi/xbox2/xbox-360-picture.html
And see that the power connector IS that size (for those who can't see it, the pic is rotated).
Sony income depends on 40% - 60% of profits from the playstation. If they go under they will lose a lot of stocks. This is why the trash talking.
Bill Gates is shutting him down and he Kuteragi doesnt like it.
This information is found in page 53 of TIME magazines May issue!!!
Another FACT: Bill Gates has the same IQ as Albert Einstien ( 160 )
You Idiots...the Photo is not doctored, it's just not to scale with the PS3 Photo. The Xbox 360 is smaller ...haven't you seen any of the E3 press stuff or read any of the specs on either system. The 360 is SMALLER than the PS3.
THAT PICTURE IS A FAKE!!! Look at how they shrunk the AC input on the XBOX its not in proportion to the outline
Come on engadget, Don't post this stupid stuff!
#16 This is the only place on the NET that has a comparison in the Xbox 360 favor(bias perhaps). It looks like everybody else is wrong :-O
PS: I've read all magazines and watched all TV shows related to E3 (especially G4 TV) and all gave hands down victory to PS3. Dont get me wrong I have all systems and I'll buy them all again *-)But right now PS3 is the best nextgen console.
THAT PICTURE IS A FAKE!!! Look at how they shrunk the AC input on the XBOX its not in proportion to the outline
Actually Tony, if you look at the official Xbox 360 images you'll see the one you linked to is doctored not the other way around. Maybe you should have guessed that by all the anti-Sony signatures on the thread.
http://www.xbox360.com/
They'll both look nicely sitting next to my TV.
Ken Kutaragi is not CEO of Sony Corp. or any division or subsidiary thereof.
Only plebians fight over consoles.
Buy both. Worry not.
Granted Brian, but they used actual dimensions given by IGN who took physical measurements at E3, not just photo scaling techniques comparing power connectors, USB ports or CD tray sizes.
Tony, then why did they feel the need to edit the photo and change the size of the AC adapter? I think comparing USB ports is probably the best way to go, they're universally the same size.
God, Ken, shut up. Please, just shut up. You're not helping Sony out at all. Remember the PS2? The "Emotion Engine?" The billions of polygons, particles, and effects that would make the PS2 look so amazingly good that you'd crap yourself?
The PS2 is a good system for its generation, but really, it's not as good as the hype indicated. Here we go again, of course, with the same crap, but this time, we've added wireless controllers and an Ethernet jack as standard equipment.
You can all go argue over which is better, which is uglier, and which is going to revolutionize this or that. *I* will wait for the games to come out, and buy the first system to come out with a must-have exclusive title. Kutaragi and Gates can maintain their pissing contest for as long as they'd like, but it's the games that drive the console, and they haven't shown us anything indicative of a must-have system on that front.
I was wondering if the actual specs of the PS3 outdo the 360.
A friend at work was blowing smoke up my rear telling me that it was said the 360 could run 4 games at once with no slow down (the proccessing power it had)
sounds like B.S. to me.
The Killzone game shots, were they just trailers of the game, or are they of the game IN ACTION?!
G4TV was clearly biased towards the PS3.
engadget is bais toward 360
Sony said that the kill zone shots were Cgi prerendered not real time
G4tv sucked in showing E3
Was xbox360.com just designed to piss people off? Yeah, that barely usable flash menu will keep people coming back. Function? who needs function?
hey, Justthefacts, what's the third dimention on both of thoes units?
yeah, engadget is biased towards the 360, I would like to get a neutral persons opinion and reaction on the consoles.
G4TV is awful, I can't stand that new Kevin guy, he's a huge tool.
G4TV are morons. They said PS3 games looked better... Yeah right, they compare pre-rendered movies with actual games running realtime engine on alpha dev kit. Seriously, I'm wondering if they know what they talk about.
I'm sure in the end the PS3 is more powerfull than 360 but now we're comparing apples and oranges. Let's wait to see real games on PS3 and 360 before taking premature conclusions.
And I'm sure that you'll enjoy your next-gen console, either you choose a PS3 or 360. Best is chooose both if you can. As for me, that's a 360 and Revolution.
#32: Your friend is wrong. The 360 got problem running games at constant frame rate at e3, but they were on alpha kit (pre-developpement machines based on mac G5). Developpers said they were using only 30% of the capacity of what will be final hardware. Killzone was pre-rendered.
For All Those Who Are Still In The Dark Come Into The LIGHT!!!
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/617/617951p1.html
Heh, I don't trust those sites. Seems like a scam.
Brian, I specifically linked Mxlegend99's post, which *does not* use the doctored power port photo, but instead uses the front, which gives a very good relative size of the optical tray when compared to the PS2. If you'll notice, the same poster somewhat verified the relative sizes using the USB ports on the PS2 and PS3. Unfortunately USB is hidden behind a vanity panel on the XBOX360, so no direct comparision is available there.
Official specs from Sony's website list their consoles at:
PS2 - 301mm x 78mm x 182mm (12" x 3-1/8" x 7-1/4")
http://www.us.playstation.com/consoles.aspx?id=2/info/PlayStation2/415007657.html
PSTwo - 230mm ?28mm ?152mm
http://www.us.playstation.com/consoles.aspx?id=3/info/specs_70000.html
Fifty bucks says neither is faster than my P4 3ghz/GeForce 6800GT. Sony lied about performance when they launched the PS2, emotion engine my ass. I own every current game console and the PS2 is the worst performing, and yet at its launch was hyped as the best. Barely outperforms the dreamcast.
I think it's funny Sony can rattle on about trashing the XBox's performance when the Xbox is about 5x faster than the PS2, all the while using "general purpose" PC components.
I'm sure the PS3 will be faster than the PS2, but I somehow doubt it's going to be what they claim. Even Nintendo, which has similar specs, has said the Revolution will only be 3x faster than the GameCube, and Nintendo is at least honest about that kind of thing.
So yeah, for all you fanbois... just think back to the PS2 launch... and remember the lies. And no, I'm not a Microsoft fanboi... my favorite console right now is my PSP.
Blaze, all they are is SPAM from John trying get you to use his referral link to freeCrap.com so he can be on the top of the pyramid scheme. Avoid links at all cost or he'll be encouraged to spam even more.
Tony, your first link actually takes me to the PS3 Spiderman joke. Mxlegend99's comparisons are much better than the first guy's. If the PS3 is only slightly larger than the PS2 than it's not that big at all. Maybe still smaller than a conventional DVD player's size. As long as they're not larger than that and they fit in typical A/V stand or entertainment center it really doesn't matter how big they are.
"Posted May 25, 2005, 10:58 AM ET by sandro
PS: I've read all magazines and watched all TV shows related
to E3 (especially G4 TV) and all gave hands down victory to
PS3. Dont get me wrong I have all systems and I'll buy them
all again *-)But right now PS3 is the best nextgen console."
It's funny you mention G4TV, the most idiotic group of wanna
be geeks out there... Out of all of them only one seems to
know his stuff and that's (Kevin:DarkTips one). Aside from
everyone one else that has reviewed both systems only a few
has really given unbiased and good reviews.
The more surprising of all is many people that reviewed both
systems were stupid enough to give PS3 the hands up just by
viewing the cgi trailers. IF THAT'S WHAT they base their reviews
on then they deserve no honor. I know both systems are going
to have great games but don't tell me the PS3 will render cgi
like games like that in this coming generation cause that's
straight up bullSHIT***.
" Posted May 25, 2005, 11:27 AM ET by andy
G4TV was clearly biased towards the PS3."
I second that comment by andy. But also I would
repeat myself to the fact that TechTV(G4TV) are a
bunch of idiots. They never even gave any reason of
why the PS3 was better other then the CGI.
Nuff Said...
I'm a senior engineer working on 360 and PS3 game development. I'll try to give some unbiased info.
The approaches of the two companies is quite different, and this reflects on the hardware design.
Sony wants to provide the most powerful hardware possible, and let developers figure out how to really take advantage of it. That's why the PS2 was more difficult to program than the XBox. I call this the "performance powerhouse" approach. As far as the PS2's actual performance is concerned, keep in mind that the XBox came out about a year after the PS2.
Microsoft wants to use more standard hardware, developer tools, and libraries, to make development easier and get good games out more quickly. I call this the "cheap PC for your TV" approach.
Now, Sony has gotten burned by some developers shunning the PlayStation because its more difficult (read: more expensive) to develop for. So they've done a *lot* to make it easier to develop for PS3.
I can't comment authoritatively on the size comparison, because I'm working with dev-kits, and I haven't seen the actual consumer boxes. But I'm pretty sure that the PS3 will be substantially smaller.
Personally, I'm leaving 360 development to focus on PS3 development. So you can guess where I'm putting my money.
Enjoy!
why is the ps3 BIGGER than the ps2, and just so all yal' stupid fanboys know if you want to buy a concole for its size, buy a spazin' revolution
>:)
knot_u
To end this size debate ..
(From ps2.ign.com website)
PS3 Dimensions
About 13.5" x 3.25"
Xbox 360 Dimensions
About 10.25" x 2.5"
I'm not on anyone's side here but I think its quite obvious that those two pictures at the top of this article arent scaled properly. If they were that switch on the ps3 (which looks like some manner of power switch) would be the size of the ethernet port on the 360.
So a couple things...
The major nelson site is biased, but he is open about that (He is pretty honest about being a manager for xbox live). The other websites that are calling the PS3 hands down more powerful are not competent to judge that. Gaming journalists know how to write about games, not how to analyze hardware. They can look at all of the pretty numbers that both sides quote, but those are all theoretical maximums, which are irrelevent. A processor that can do 100 gigaflops but has to spin clock cycles waiting for data from RAM to queue up in the cache really can't do 100 gigaflops in practice. This just reminds me of the random BS that apple used to pull when they released the "first desktop super computer".
Also, most game devs also don't know the actual performance of the systems. The dev boxes currently released only have a passing resemblence to the actual hardware. I've played with the xbox dev kits, and they are impressive (there was a demo of a dolphin swimming around, which wasn't very detailed, but was also running at 7500 frames per second, which is not a typo. Some decent lighting effects too. Sorry, the current crop of PCs are going to look weak this time.) but the glorified powermacs really don't have a whole lot in common with the 3 core 3.2 ghz beast that will actually power the 360.
and what it boils down to is that the first gen games on both consoles will use ridiculously little of the consoles's actual power. It won't be until 2 years+ that we will see a clear difference in quality, assuming that in practice there is a distinct difference in graphics power. Also, I'd sort of prefer good games over pretty ones, and that contest is still completely up in the air. That being said, I think the xbox handled itself much better in terms of lineup in the past couple of years, so I am inclined to buy the 360 when it debuts, but have a wait and see policy with Sony when they release their console.
Really though, I'm not particularly willing to hand my loyalty over to some mega-corporation and bark at anyone who speaks ill of them. That's sort of silly.
Screw all of you. The Phantom will kick the ass of the Revolution, Xbox 360 and the PS3. And the Gizmondo kicks the ass of the PSP, the DS, and the upcoming gameboy micro. So there!
one question:
whats the read speed on sonys little blueray technology?
:)
also.
is there a reason why sony is only dumping 256mb of ram into their system?