Kutaragi says Blu-ray/HD-DVD compromise isn't happening
By Peter Rojas 
posted June 10th 2005 1:31PM
posted June 10th 2005 1:31PM
Not sure if this is the end of the line or just more posturing, but now Sony Computer Entertainment prez Ken Kutaragi says that the chances of a single unified next-gen DVD standard emerging are "almost none" and that they're moving forward with plans to put a Blu-ray drive in the PlayStation 3. And given that the PS3 is less than a year away (at least officially), they're probably getting close to the point (if they haven't passed it already) where they have to start finalizing the console's specs.
Doesn't exactly sound like they're bending over backwards to make this happen. All we've had is a half-assed sit-down conference with no real deals. Not that we can expect much, Sony has possibly the worst track record for media formats across the industry.
In Sony we trust.
*takes cover with flame suit on
Screw the Blu-ray/HD-DVD camps.
This dual format BS is total crap.
I will not be buying anything until:
1) there are players that can run both formats.
2) there is only one format.
Blu-Ray for studios and professionals(behind the scenes...like beta).
HD-DVD for the general public.
Well, HD-DVD at least has a name that the general public will like since they probably don't know what is meant by Blu-ray having an actual blue laser. However I'm planning on getting a PS3 and hope Blu-Ray wins, but only because I'm getting a PS3.
I wish there was a third option... somthing to make these greedy sobs stop crying shooting off at the arse.
I want to like Sony... they seem to make decent stuff, but as a corporation they really piss me off.
Maybe someday we will see people stand up and stop taking it from these pigs.
Sony and phillips did develope the CD, and beta max was a good format, just didnt catch on. Digital8 is cheap(in price), so, I wouldnt say they are the worse. At least someone is pushing the boundries of technologie, HD-DVD's capacity is a joke.
I am getting unbelieveable tired of this vs. thing. I like sony alot but everytime they try to make something dominate they tend to charge an arm and a leg for it. look at the minidisc for example and even with the Memory stick. its doing good but still cost alot more then Secure digital. Btw did I mention once they go a certain direction they never give up? minidisc are so dead and yet they still sell that shit. You can look at it both way though, that once you buy something of sony you will always have support from them. I just hope there is a compromise soon, or this can get ugly.
Minidisc is really popular is Asia for some reason. That is why they still sell them, people are still buying them.
Long live HVD! hahah if only.
all seems pretty clear, dunno whats all the fuss. judging by the partners involved:
Blu-Ray = computer/game data (and sony studio movies for ps3)
HD-DVD = consumer movies for consumer players
sony just doesnt have the mass market luck goin proprietary. else we'd all have UniversalSuperAudioMemoryMiniBeta players by brands other than sony.
And so the war begins (or continues... whatever).
Content is king. Whichever format provides the most movies wins. The average consumer is not going to measure the specs on the formats and decide which one to get. They are going to measure the amount of movies available for each format and then decide.
These things are only interesting if you own a HDTV. So far not too many people own HDTV. I'm guessing we won't be able to declare a winner for a few more years. Unless Toshiba drops out of the race. Sony can't drop out now.
about Sony keeping things proprietary (like they have with MD and memory sticks and stuff).
Are other manufactures allowed to make blu-ray drives? If we don't get flooded with cheap Chinese and Korean players I don't see how Sony stands a chance. I have to assume Sony does not plan to prohibit other manufacturers from making BR drives.
I just think the most capacity possible is the best way to go.. I remember when I upgraded my pc from a 486 to a Pentium I and got a 2 gig HD.. Man 2 gigs is way more than you'll ever need. It's actually a waste of money to go that big.. Oh and the 2 MB videocard.. Wow 2MB thats soo much games will just fly... err aren't they now coming out with 500GB Hard drives and 512MB videocards? Imagine if I haddn't had to upgrade from my pentium I..
Let us never make reference to Memory stick again. That is the worst/most overpriced product to ever come from Sony since Cliffhanger for SNES.
I don't like how everyone assumes that Sony are the ones trying to fpoist something on us when the whole point of HD-DVD is to save money for the movie studios by foisting inferior technology on the general public so they don't have to pay for new injection-molders.
I don't care how good lossy compression has become, a 50 gig HD movie is going to look and sound a lot better than a 30 gig movie.
If the transition from VHS to DVD was any indicator, it's going to be a while before either of the HD formats fully take off. With the jump to DVD, at least the average consumer could immediately appreciate the additional clarity DVDs provided over VHS on their existing sets. And, yet, average consumers were still somewhat slow to warm up to the format. Here, most consumers don't yet have TVs that can even take advantage of the higher resolutions the new formats offer so I imagine adoption rates will be somewhat slower. Given that fact, Blu-ray will clearly have an early advantage in the home video format wars since it is guaranteed to make it into at least a few million homes via the PS3 within the next year (assuming the system is released within the next year with a good supply and it's priced reasonably). And since, I'm guessing, there's probably significant overlap between the markets for PS3s and blockbuster movie releases, it'd be silly for studios to completely shun the format.
"I wish there was a third option"
I keep sayin' it. ** VMD *** is the way to go (and my support for it is likely a death sentence if history is any indication)
http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Details.aspx?NewsId=11493
http://www.engadget.com/entry/2476252172659240/
http://news.designtechnica.com/article7294.html
In Response to comment #11:
If you own an HDTV, you can get a DVD player that upconverts 480p to 1080i for less than $200. And you won't have to rebuy everything in your DVD collection to watch them in HD.
Blu-ray and HD-DVD are going the way of DVD-A and SACD. This is a format war that NOBODY is going to win.
The only way this would work is if the two formats were closer so as to be able to build one device for both formats. XD, SD, MMS, blah blah.. and so on Media format disks for all the digital cameras. How irritating is that! But luckily computer manufacturers have created a drive to accept multiple formats which has made using different media easier but i still think it sucks. I don't know what the solution is other than working on some type of compromise in either the media itself or the devices that will read the media.
The studios should force both camps to sign a contract - before they will make films available - that they will pay for all media to be replaced by that of the opposing camp if they loose the format war...
...then see how quickly they get round the table.
#18, that up-conversion is nowhere NEAR what you could actually call "High Definition." OK, so it brings up the resolution, but as they say, you can't polish a turd. Up-conversion is in no way, shape, or form a worthy substitute to actual HD material.
Blu-ray will win hands-down. Capacity always wins, look at BetaMax vs. VHS.
Why would I want a crappy over-compressed HD picture on a measly 30GB, when I can have it spread out over 50GB?
I think the compression will be exactly the same on both formats. Didn't they both add wmv9 to be the standard comprssion scheme? It will be the same PQ for both formats. BR will be able to store more data though.
Andy (#21):
If up-converted DVD looks like a turd to you, you've got better eyes than Brian Roberts. Most people are not going to see turds. They're going to see a way to make their big DVD collections look even better. Some people have HUNDREDS of movies in their DVD collections. They're not going to re-buy them all in unfamiliar, unproven formats.
DVD-A and SACD didn't come close to replacing the CD. Likewise, HD-DVD and Blu-ray won't come close to replacing the DVD. Just watch.
Blu-ray wont win hands down at all, Paramount Pictures, Warner Brothers and Universal are only making films for HD-DVDs the only one any where nearly as popular as these that Blu-ray have is Disney studios, HD-DVD had better support and will be cheaper, only a moron cannot see how it will win the "format war" that is why Sony began these negotiations for one format it can forsee its doom. The PS3 involvment is irrelavent more movies will be bought than games for it and so the DVD buying consumer group will decide the fate. Thank You and goodnight
I think BR will win, just bacause of PS3.
Blu-Ray versus the HD-Dvd,It will be one heck of a fight But Blu-ray will flourish only on Ps3 But I think HD-DVD will win in the overall arens.Since,its power packed and there are reports Saying the Capacities of Blu-ray may be till 50GB but the HD-DVD may be 500-850 GB that's a heck lot of space.
Hd-dvd will win because of movies but at the same way Blu-ray will make an impact on Ps 3
Let's see...
Blu-ray - two syllables
HD-DVD - five syllables
Blu-ray wins! :-)
25:
I have a Samsung unit that upconverts to 1080i on my Toshiba Cinema series CRT. I also have high-definition cable coming through it. There is absolutely, utterly no comparison as to which looks better. Up-conversion does not, can not, and never will magically convert a DVD with a fraction of the available pixels to look like real high def source material. Upconverted DVDs look, at best, marginally better than a progressive-scan DVD playing on a large HD capable TV.
As far as who's going to win the format war (I wasn't referring to that in my first post, just up-converted DVD vs. real high-def)... it appears we won't know for a while. One of them will catch (Eventually). My bet right now is with Blu-Ray. DVD-A and SACD aren't really good examples because the difference for your average consumer (the ones who don't care enough about sound to buy speakers that cost more than 100 bucks) between a CD and those is negligible. With high definition TV, there is no question what you're getting. HDTVs are selling quite well (and this is BEFORE the high def consoles are out!), and you can bet that consumers will be interested in playing their favorite movies on them at full resolution. The format war will make this a drawn out process, but the root desire will be there. DVDs simply won't cut it for the years ahead.
I like Iomega's idea better.
http://news.com.com/Iomega+aiming+for+800GB+DVDs/2100-1041_3-5720359.html
800GB's using the existing DVD format.
It doesn't matter who wins. When HVDs and there ENOURMOUS 1 terrabyte(1000gigs) It will crush both.
My comment is in reply to #26. Sony Pictures who owns the Columbia, Tristar, and now MGM libraries has the biggest library (approx. 8000 titles) of any rivaling studio. When paired with Disney they own almost half of the entire industry's content. So I would have to say that they have a pretty big say in this format battle.
My personal opinion is that HD-DVD is an interim cheap alternative, whereas BluRay is a marketable brand new format. The average market consumer won't be self-informed as to decipher the specs. Sony's presentation of the actual physical disk is far more appealing than the outdated look of the HD-DVD disk. Resolution aside, I think that is what swayed the average consumer from VHS to DVD.
It is not fair to compare these new formats to beta/vhs. CD and DVD-A are far better examples.
beta and vhs fought out a needed standard. While only one could win, they both provided something that the public needed.
Blue-ray and HD-DVD do not provide something that the public need or want. People bought DVD's because the quality was vastly superior, they didn't have to rewind the tape, they had instant access and VASTLY superior sound.
Yet as an owner of a 5.1 sound system that also supported DVD-A I still don't own a single one. This format would produce better sound quality, 5.1 surround which is worth buying, but due to CD's being so good for most listeners it never really took off.
The only way that either technology will take off is if the price justifies the additional content. For the average TV and average sound system neither format offers any advantages. The fact it contains more storage capacity will not convince anyone. Studios release many DVD's in collector's editions which sell better because people feel like they are getting more. Reducing this to one disc will not demand a higher price.
There are IMHO only two ways either format will take off. One is that DVD support is stopped in preference of a superior format - this is very very unlikely especially with two formats. The other is that studios create a genuinely compelling reason to buy the things.
It is possible that this format will take so long to take off that a better format comes along and replaces it before it starts.
Finally I respond to comment #8
"Btw did I mention once they go a certain direction they never give up? minidisc are so dead and yet they still sell that shit."
This shows a complete misunderstanding of Japanese corporate and technology culture. The not giving up and not loosing face is an ingrained part of Japanese culture and therefore it's not surprising that Sony will not give up on technologies. The comments about minidisc are also short sighted. The format has begun to be superceded in Japan, however, up until very very recently (maybe the last year or so) minidisc was seen everywhere in Japan for mobile music - and CD hardly existed for mobile music. It was an incredibly successful product in the domestic market.
Just because it's not successful in America or Europe, it does not mean it's not successful or "shit".
Indeed sales in Japan have been the biggest stumbling block to the X-Box success. Just as American sales will be the biggest stumbling block to the PS3's success.