Judge rules against Pioneer's TiVos in nation-wide suit

Well now, we'd have thought the ruling handed down June 1st by Judge Person in LA might have caught more attention, but according to our layman's reading, a class-action law suit filed against Pioneer ended sharply—owners of Pioneer TiVos (models DVR-810H-S and DVR-57H) nationwide are entitled to some big rebates due to:

providing unsatisfactory picture quality… not [recording] as much programming to the hard drive or to a DVD disc as advertised and [taking] longer to record to a DVD disc than advertised

Ouch. So how much scrilla we talking about here? Well, if you dropped $200, $400, $800, or $2500 or more on some DVR-810H-Ss, you'll get back $25, $50, $100, or $250, respectively; if you dropped $200, $400, $800, or $2,500 or more on DVR-57Hs, you're entitled to $50, $75, $150, and $350, respectively.

P.S. PDF warning on that read link.

Update: Upon further investigation, it would appear that Pioneer has not yet actually been judged liable, and that the pending approval of settlement hearing is August 5th.

[Thanks, Chris]

[Conrad Quilty-Harper @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

Typo: cought should be caught. :)

[Jase @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

I've got one of those TiVos (and don't really have any problems). As I read it, the settlement vouchers are redeemable for cash on purchases of Pioneer stuff AFTER June 1, 2005. So you don't get money back for the DVR you already bought long ago -- you can only get some money back if you want to buy new Pioneer stuff.

[spsmyk @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

Not cash back --- only a rebate off of a future Pioneer purchase.

But the law firms that filed it collect about $500K.

[James @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

I bought a 810H in Dec 03, and it did suffer from some video quality problems. I printed out the form and I am going to submit it!
Then wait to see if I get some money back!

[Mike - Raleigh, NC @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

I have an 810H. I've had severe quality issues until my unit was eventually replaced and they never fixed the pixelation issue that exists for any recording quality except for the top. Still it's a good unit and for the most part i'm happy with it.

I have a BIG problem with the settlement. Who needs another cupon settlement where the lawfirm gets big bucks for sueing and the company pays practically nothing in damages or compensation. I would have prefered the option for a free repacement HDD/DVD burner to be sent to me vs. a cupon that very very few people will use.

[billthecat @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

That's the problem with class action lawsuits -- the settlement terms are set by the lawyers. If you're a consumer that bought one of these units, it looks like you have three options: accept the settlement, object to the settlement, or opt-out of the "class" and pursue the case yourself. Check the actual document for details, but to object to the settlement:

"You may, if you desire, appear at the Settlement Hearing described below to object to the proposed settlement or to the application for attorneys� fees and reimbursement of expenses, if you do not request to opt out of the class. To do so, you must file a written notice of objection, together with a
statement of your reasons for objecting, with the Court,

Judge Victor Person
California Superior Court, LA County
111 North Hill Street, Department 39
Los Angeles, California 90012

To be considered by the Court, all objections must be received on or before July 15, 2005, and copies must also be sent to:

Lawyers for the Class
Paul R. Fine, Esq.
Scott A. Brooks, Esq.
Craig S. Momita, Esq.
Daniels, Fine, Israel
& Schonbuch, LLP
1801 Century Park East
Ninth Floor
Los Angeles, California 90067

Ian Herzog, Esq.
Law Offices of Ian Herzog
233 Wilshire Boulevard
Suite 550
Santa Monica, California
90401

Fred J. Kumetz, Esq.
Law Offices of Fred Jack
Kumetz, Inc.
433 North Camden Drive
Suite 400
Beverly Hills, California
90210

Lawyer for Pioneer:
William T. Bisset, Esq.
Hughes Hubbard & Reed LLP
350 South Grand Avenue
36th Floor
Los Angeles, California 90071

And a note about the original post: "held liable" is when a defendant is held legally responsible for damages. This is a settlement which means that there is no judgment, it is just an arrangement between the parties (or in this case, the lawyers) and the case goes away. In class action lawsuits judges must approve settlments because the lawyers are negotiating for a large class of plaintifs, but they are not always looking out for the little guy.

[MegaZone @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

I think I may object to this settlement, since I think the lawsuit is bogus. I've had a Pioneer 810H since they first shipped, and while that had some, IMHO, minor issues they always performed as advertised, and they have done nothing but improve over time as the software has been updated. This is another stupid lawsuit to make shyster lawyers money, and in my dreams 5% of the class object and this settlement is squashed.

[Gordon @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

Court granted final approval on August 17, 2005

[R Grace @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

Form is at end of PDF file, can be downloaded from Pioneer site - click on "Important Notice to Owners of a Pioneer DVR-810H-S" on the 810H product page: http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/product/detail/0,,2076_4139_22912926,00.html
This will get you a voucher that can then be mailed in for a rebate off a purchase of another "home electronics" product from Pioneer between June 1 2005 and March 31 2006. Hope this applies to car stereos too...

[aimee bancroft @ Dec 19th 2005 12:54AM]

I got my "settlement voucher"....I can get up to $250 off my next purchase of a Pioneer Product IF I spent $2500 on a product made after 6/1/05. Gee, I really want to go spend that much money.

For some silly reason, I thought I'd get some money back. My tivo 810h-s has never recorded near the many hours that it was advertised, and we have some major pixilation issues. I don't have the money to buy something new, and their minimum qualifying purchase prices to the rebate amounts suck.

While I love my tivo, I really hate this class action law suit--it does nothing for those of us who got screwed with a crappy product.