Palm's super, mega top secret other business

He's all super duper extrasecretive about what they've got cooking, but Palm founder and CTO Jeff Hawkins reveals in an interview with the San Jose Business Journal that Palm has a third business (after PDAs and smartphones) that they haven't yet revealed to the public. He does mention that it has something to do with mobile computing, but that'd be like McDonalds revealing that they've got a top secret project related to food:

There is a third business that I've been working on but I'm not going to tell you what it is. It's in mobile computing. It's something different and it's in its early stage. We have three businesses at PalmOne. One you don't even know about, which is just a child. Another is the teenager and the other one is the mature 45-year-old.

Q: Can you give me a better idea about what this "child" technology is?

A: Not really. I�ll give you a couple clues. I always think of mobile computing as personal computing. This long-term vision has led us through everything � first the organizers and now through the smart phone space. It�s like everything a personal computer is. Continue down that path. What are the implications of a world where everyone has a super high-speed Internet connection in their pocket and many gigabytes of storage, super-fast processors, audio, visual and multimedia? What are the consequences of that? How will that change computing when you have all that stuff available to you all the time? I try to think into the future. That�s how we come up with new products. So I�m not going to tell you what it is, but it�s following the consequences of mobile computing.

Anyone heard anything about this?

[Via PalmInfocenter]

[Brian S. @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

It sounds like he's trying to make a mix between the pepperpad and the danger sidekick.

[Jake T @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Hm... I think t's just gonna be a smartphone with a HDD.

[nick @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I think its going to be more then that. a Real good 4in1 a PDA, Mp3 player, Video player, and a phone. I wonder if this device would have support for 3G and bluetooth.

Well only time will tell...

[Jordan @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I think It will be a mobile phone running Windows Mobile 5.0 ( Now that we know Palm is into that sort of thing), have a HDD and will be running multiple wireless high speed interfaces such as HSDPA or EV-DO, Wi-Max, 802.11g, and GPS for the fun of it.

[stingraze @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Or... a Portable Media Center sort of thing?

[Dull @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

"We have three businesses at PalmOne"

How many businesses do you have at Palm Inc?

[Stevie @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Wearable PDA with embedded RFID

[Aaron @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

What a dork. I bet that guy thinks he's generating all kinds of "buzz" by acting secret. But basically unless Palm is woring on some kind of water balloon that explodes and soakes your enemy's eyes in acid I am not going to be impressed. I just hope it is some stupid development that would sink them, like a new Palm portable game system. That would be rad.

[brian @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Geez, this story kind of reminds me of these posts at Tapland and PalmAddicts that were posted before the PIC story...

http://tapland.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6074

http://palmaddict.typepad.com/palmaddicts/2005/08/what_is_jeff_ha.html

A very important part of the interview is where he discusses the operating system he's working at Numenta based on this artificial intelligence research at the Redmond Neuroscience Institute:

"..." we can now build this memory system in software or in hardware. Our products are a set of tools that allow you to configure these memory systems, which we call HTM, hierarchical temporal memory. You can interface them with a thing like a camera or a microphone or sonar and it learns about its environment in the same way you learned about your environment when you were a child. It can model the environment, recognize things in it and make predictions about the future.

What we're building is actually a platform. It's like a new type of operating system. It's a platform on which people can use our tools to create new applications for solving different types of problems."

AI + handheld computing? After seeing Jeff Hawkins speak at MIT about his book "On Intelligence" and knowing his passion for handheld computing/PDAs and artificial intelligence based on the way the human brains works, it wouldn't surprise me if he's working on the early stages of building AI into a wirelessly networked handheld computer.

[Andy L @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Well, he gives us clues of where to start thinking. So, I have everything I've got with me in my pocket. What do I wanna do more? Share the data? Show the data? I probably don't have a computer at home, so I guess I want to hook up my palm-thingy to a bigger screen, most likely my TV-set? I guess I need a better way for input data and navigate, if I'm supposed to drop my home computer in favour to work with my handheld?

[Bjarke @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I think he's thinking of the OQO?

[ccrook @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

AI + wearable computing + highspeed data service + storage

[Tomas @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Until he clarifies his comments, I'm going to say that they're developing a mobile porn platform with electric stimulation.

[Victor Agreda, Jr. @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

No no no folks. He's referring to the technology revealed in a Forbes article (and making the rounds elsewhere):
http://www.forbes.com/technology/2005/08/04/technology-remote-control-humans_cx_lh_0804remotehuman.html

That's right! Remote-controlled humans courtesy of Palm Inc/One/Etc. It'll be running Cobalt v.1.4.7.#.Twinkie.007.
And when you boot it up it will make you run to the store and buy any remaining Zire's in stock.

I told you Hawkins was a genius.

[Justin @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Maybe the third business is one that actually makes an interesting product - seems like right now all Palm has going for it is the Treo, and even that is getting a bit long in the tooth. So the next version will have WinMobile, so what?

What would impress me is:

- a very tiny (2.4" QVGA screen), very thin (RAZR-thin) unit, landscape-orientation, NO touch screen but with a 5-way nav pad on the right side and a small slide-out QWERTY thumbboard (... think Sidekick I guess, but make it way way thinner, make it out of magnesium or aluminum so the housing could be as absolutely small as possible).

- throw on a new, proprietary OS that runs Java so 3rd-party developers could write apps

- put it on the CDMA carriers so it would actually have decent reception (my little jab at GSM providers, at least in NYC =) and make it EV-DO. No WiFi.

- Bluetooth and SyncML so that I can sync it with almost any PIM app and not just ones that "support" this new device.

- Media player of course to play music and movies off of the MiniSD card it would have

- Here's the kicker: make it intelligent. Give it a bunch of apps that stream data from web content providers (And make these apps look damn sexy and have great UIs - because they have to be engaging to use and pretty to look at. To me, every Palm app looks the same!) Let it learn from my actions. If I check the weather every morning before leaving for work, that data would already be on the screen in the morning. If I check movie times every Friday before leaving work, let it retrieve movie times and have them waiting for me onscreen.

- hmmm. Guess I just described a Sidekick with a media player, decent wireless data connection and apps that integrate with APIs. Guess I still think the Sidekick is the best mobile device - too bad it's on GSM, which is poop in NYC. Boooo!

[The Good Kaptain @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Given the interview that makes up this article was probably carried out some time ago, he may actually be referring to the LifeDrive product line.

[brian @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

The Good Kaptain wrote:

>Given the interview that makes up this article was probably carried out
>some time ago, he may actually be referring to the LifeDrive product
>line.

Here's the original article from the 7/08/05 print edition of the Silicon Valley / San Jose Business Journal Enterprise :

http://sanjose.bizjournals.com/sanjose/stories/2005/07/11/smallb2.html?t=printable

" Last month, he spoke with Technology Editor Janet Rae-Dupree about what his earlier experiences have taught him and what he envisions for the future of computing."

The LifeDrive was officially announced back on May 18, 2005.

http://www.palm.com/us/company/pr/news_feed_story.epl?reqid=711174

[Sean Siler @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

"super high-speed Internet connection in their pocket and many gigabytes of storage, super-fast processors, audio, visual and multimedia"

Sounds like a Palm based PSP! Another entry into the gaming arena!

[daniel @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

#9, that is exactly what I was thinking.

[chris mong @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

The ultimate next product should be a mother of all - Personal Computing Service Bureau ... I bet Palm Inc. will be opening up a service platform with a global market front... with all that horsepower, connectivity and mobility... under the hook of a couple oz. device in your hand...

[Eric @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

No, think about it...all this stuff in your pocket has so far been used for basic entertainment and communications. Next is commerce: essentially the "Palm Wallet". Buy online or at the store through the same mobile account. Better than credit cards because of advanced tracking and additional security. Beam your payment via infrared or Bluetooth to the register or Coke machine...

Whatever; I just want a way to get MP3s from my Treo 650 to my car stereo without fiddling with FM transmitters or paying for $500 car kit.

[Kelvin @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

PalmOne always refers to the lifedrive as a 3rd product segment that doesn't belong in either the smartphone or the handheld computing category. So either Hawkin's is referring to the LifeDrive as his "revolutionary" vision, or he's not towing the company line.

[mardoen @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I think it's a device that makes use of high speed communication and remote storage. A mobile client for information services and media consumption. Where the display and UI is more important than the storage, and where applications are just lightweight clients, both to commercial and public services and to your home computers (media desktop, tivo, etc).

Which makes sense; except that this is a market that won't be very huge for the next couple of years. Which still gives them a lot of time to experiment.

[jay vaughan @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

better not be a musical instrument...

[NickT @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I'm betting on a huge understatement from Palm. I bet it's just the Treo 670 with a hdd. Which would be cool but not top secret material.

[John Brandon @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

My guess: a tablet running Palm OS. It makes sense, all the software is basically there. They compete with MS in the smartphone and PDA space. It's not OQO because they already think of high-end Palm devices as computers. It's not a video player because they have the LifeDrive already. It's not a laptop, they'd need Windows XP for that. It's not a cell phone, they're too dumbed-down. So, large form factor PDA, and I think it could actually work if they were much cheaper than MS Tablet PCs.

[Evan Evans @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

WEARABLE COMPUTING

It's the obvious choice and I knew it before he even answerred. This would be something that has a screen inside sunglasses or glasses, with a "in the palm" mouse/keyboard(already some patents out on this), or a tongue/tooth based pointer.

You'll never be without your personal computer again. It goes where you go. It will likely be voice controlled as well, and there is research in thought control going on these days too, for perhaps basic clicking. ;)

Evan Evans

[Kelvin @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

PalmOne always refers to the lifedrive as a 3rd product segment that doesn't belong in either the smartphone or the handheld computing category. So either Hawkin's is referring to the LifeDrive as his "revolutionary" vision, or he's not towing the company line.

[cap @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Its like a location free TV for you PC. Your link is a Palm. Access everything, everywhere, anytime. Internet, your data, tv etc etc. Probably runs on EVDO network. Either that or he is putting chips in peoples heads. Me first.

[Yackp @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

AI + "wearable" = mobile that is a combination secretary, life coach, publicist, decision maker, agent, psychiatrist, lawyer etc. I look forward to never have to think again.

[morgan @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

sounds nice ...

[Charles @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Sounds to me like it's going to be a mobile computer (wearable perhaps, but highly unlikely), pretty much like a laptop but with a mini HDD that has built in wireless capabilities as well as a built in router that makes mesh networking more realistic. If not, that'd still be a good idea.

[Sam @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Security, commerce, connectivity, and communication - secure wireless authentication for PCs, doors, ATMs, cars, etc.; wireless point-of-sale transactions; control of data and information anywhere, on your PC, at your bank, on servers; output of information and media such as music, video or databases to other devices such as screens, speakers, or computers; all types of communication, including phone, video, IM, email, PTT over various channels.

A lot of old ideas - but we're still waiting...

[Jack O'Bob @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Jeff is working on a new OS based on AI techniques combined with a trust maintenance system to improve relevancy of lists. Many issues to work on yet, mainly involving privacy and legality etc. But as he says himself, it is still a baby.

[Matt @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Please god don't let it be an Mp3 player!

[scott @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

A palm-sized WiFi tablet running Firefox Minimo on top of a micro portal OS that includes a personal media server.

[Sam @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Security, commerce, connectivity, and communication - secure wireless authentication for PCs, doors, ATMs, cars, etc.; wireless point-of-sale transactions; control of data and information anywhere, on your PC, at your bank, on servers; output of information and media such as music, video or databases to other devices such as screens, speakers, or computers; all types of communication, including phone, video, IM, email, PTT over various channels.

A lot of old ideas - but we're still waiting...

[MAL Woods @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

He has the PDA. He has the Smart Phone. Now he's working on the mobile network and applications to use it i.e. all the stuff you do with your Internet wired beast at home but on a hand held when you're anywhere.

[Galley @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

We REALLY need a laptop-style portable computer with a huge 800 x 600 screen, wireless and all that jazz. It would be perfect for students. This would replace all of their heavy textbooks. The device would not be pocketable but would weight no more than 1 lb.

[Hussain @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I think it will be something like portable stress management system & a massager.. In a high tech world now we need it daily.

[BeDammit @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

Palm bought the intellectual property from Be Inc. One of the things they were working on was video with a fingerprint. Be's last breath was the BeIA. (an Internet Appliance) The implication of everyone having a PDA is increased access to data (personal and financial) which will require increased security. Because financial transactions will be commited via these devices. Their unique IDs will require performance (for heavy encryption), dedicated internet access for transactions, undeniable datastreams send from the device) No more magazines... they will be on you IA. To make this work.. Palm not only has to create the devices... but they have to create server to link with the devices. Thus... they will enter into the Blackberry-like market. Providing securelink for personal and business data. Its not an email only thing...
Its an everything ... thing.
BeDammit
long live BeOS

[Rekutyn @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

To #40 - They tried this long ago with the old Palm.net service... remember? Blech, Palm Query Apps

[khalil amar @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

it's an AI device that would gather informations from you and predict the near future, depending on a tree of decisions and probabilities. It will analyse your daily life since it's a device that merely never quits you, and offer you advices, exchange datas with your wife's pda, and make a reservation to a restaurant.
It's like when people are writing secrets into their diary, and these e-diaries are able to think and exchange datas then decide what to do to make both of you happy.
not really decide, but would give you a couple of hints to please your wife for example.
It's better then SMS :)
It's gonna be called e-providence. Electronic devices will rule our life and guarantees us less stress.
Everybody would be happy, because it's like reading in people's mind and offer them exactly what they expected (time, valuable thing, etc)
(* what women want)

What do you think ?

[kevinc @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

The mobile device will be primary; the PC will be secondary - only used for tasks where a mobile device isn't suitable.

[Justin @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

MAL Woods, that is exactly right I bet.

I think the new Traffic application that they released last week is a sneak peak at a new subscription based software departement they will be cranking applications out of.

http://www.palm.com/us/software/traffic/

that could be the third business.

[Vishi @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

How will it change computing when you have all that stuff available to you all the time?

You will have everything in your pocket but wont be able to SEARCH it. Google rules text search, but text is a minor part of all the data that is collected. All current engines suck majorly at non text searches.

Enter Palms child: You sing a tune, it will give you the mp3, you show an abstract sketch it will give you an image. You sing a happy tune, it will return happy images. All of it done using "auto-associative networks".

In summary, palms third child will store all data as a set of patterns and will enable searches that are not imaginable currently.

[Chris @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I bet he makes a comment like this, reads the postings here and had the R&D guys working over time on all these ideas! They are smarter than you think...

[Lukino @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I know it! Palm is building an "hypebox": everytime you have to release another little variation of a long-existing tecnology, the way you change parts on a swiss army knife and claim it's a revolution (I love my victorinox), you can just press the "hype" button on the hipebox, and all the usuall geekophilia sites all over the world will recive a "we're workin on something revolutionary, still secret" notify. This will cut down big PR costs for many small and medium enterprises, without affecting sales.

[Alexander @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

The Register is also stipulating that he was actually referring to the Lifedrive.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/08/09/hawkins_lifedrive_poser/

What a bummer.

[Maikeru @ Dec 19th 2005 12:18AM]

I'm thinking it's something like the LifeDrive, but maybe the whole "storage in the sky" idea that never got worked out for TiVo taken in a different direction. Essentialy major storage isn't on the device, but elsewhere and remotely accessible at high-speeds at anyplace and anytime�at least as far as I figure. That's the only far-fetched, yet "reasonable" thing that those clues lead to.