If you've been counting on being able to run Windows on those
new Intel-based Macs, Apple's not about to
make it easy for you -- at least not if you're attached to Windows XP. According to Apple SVP Phil Schiller, the new
Macs announced yesterday (those being the
Intel iMac and
MacBook Pro) may not
be able to run current versions of Windows due to the fact that the computers will boot using the Extensible Firmware
Interface (EFI), rather than a traditional BIOS (current Power PC Macs use Open Firmware). EFI was developed by Intel
and allows a number of advanced features, including the ability to connect to the Internet from a command shell before
the OS is loaded. Since EFI was developed after the rollout of Windows XP, it's not supported by the current or earlier
version of Windows (it is, however, supported by 64-bit versions, but the new Macs are 32-bit, so it's back to square
one). However, all is not lost: Windows Vista will support EFI, and Apple has said it has no plans to directly block
Windows from working on the new boxes. So, if you're a Vista beta tester and have ordered a new iMac or MacBookPro, get
those install CDs out; the rest of you will have to wait for the official Vista release, or find a way to hack XP to
boot using EFI (which we're sure is about to become a major priority of some of you at this very moment).
posted January 11th 2006 5:45PM
I want to run both Windows and Mac OSX on a Macbook Pro because current I have two machines, one of each operating system. I am an e-Learning developer, and use Apple products like FinalCut Pro, and Motion for editing video, and use Windows products like Lectora Publisher and Macromedia Captivate to publish. Also, since our users connect using both programs we have to test the final product on both platforms. Bottom line, a Macbook Pro running both operating system natively would save me from carrying two laptops!
As to those people who complain about the lack of two button mice (touchpad), here's something to think about. In Windows, the average user is almost REQUIRED to use the two button mouse, and ends up preferring it. In Mac OSX, the average user does not have to use the two button mouse, and tends to either prefer a two button mouse, OR prefer key combos with mouse. Bottom line here, Apple has simply designed the operating system to be as easy to use as possible, striving to keep it usable with a single button. The laptop design reflects that philosophy.
Personally, I must be in the minority for laptops as I would KILL for a speed demon, with top of the line video cards, sound cards, and connectivity, but I don't care if it even has a battery or trackpad (even built-in keyboard could be sacrified as I always plug in keyboard and mouse). What I'm really looking for is a powerful portable workstation that gives me two monitors (built-in and large flat panel external, full keyboard and mouse, and lets me take my machine (with large memory, my applications, and large hard drive) with me where I want. As it is, the small hard drives in most laptops (
Windows for gaming, OS X for everything else.
'nuff said
I ran Mac OS X on my P.C. not to long ago, then it all crash and died so I sticked with windows vista. I have a AMD 1.8 GHz with 512mb ram. Any questions?
I know this story originated in January upon the Intel Macs' release, but it's now almost 6 months later. Apple has devised a method to install WinXP on the Intels using a program called Boot Camp. It allows the safe reparitioning of your hard drive so you can install WinXP onto it. Go to http://apple.com/macosx/bootcamp to learn more. I think it's the right step in the right direction.
hell i dont really care i just want to have a peg leg
if it hasnt been mentioned already i will mention it now. os x has a mouse option to allow you to "right-click" by clicking the mouse button with 2 fingers on the trackpad. plus there are some other options you can fiddle with. its not that difficult people, just do a little bit of digging before you dismiss a macbook over a mouse button
I agree, Abomb. Apple mouses have left AND right buttons, 360 degree scrollong, AND side buttons. What windows compatible mouse could be better in ANY way? I ask you... And we'll see if Apple will allow Vista on mac when it comes out in Jan (well, in my country (Australia) anyway).
You can already run Windows XP on intel Macs...I have a intel gen5 imac core2duo 2.16ghz and all i use is Windows XP SP2...the people at this site must be idiots. i've been running Windows XP on it solid, no problems or hardware issued for 5 months now. what is engadget smokin?
People, Listen up.
For you Mac freaks, Apple paired up with intel because Apple is failing poorly in the market. Michael Dell (Owner of Dell Computers Inc.) Said that apple should be put out of buisiness. As for the Intel Macs, THEY SUCK!
Apple wants to pust Windows out of the market. You can run windows on an Intel Mac but you cannot run Mac on any normal PC. Apple and intel are now bringing out their new EFI. That is just going to send mac users into a spiraling slide to hell.
Intel's processors plain out suck, AMD only makes 64 bit processors and support 32 and 64 bit software.
As for Microsoft, the reason why Windows can get so many viruses is because Windows is used WORLDWIDE!
about 87% of buisiness worldwide depend on Windows.
MAC IS ONLY VIRUS FREE AS LONG AS WINDOWS DOMINATES THE MARKET.
Linux, on the other hand is on of the most crappiest OS I have ever used, or seen at that.
Linux boots from the damn command prompt.
99.9% of software used today is designed for windows, and 63.4% of the internet depends on windows machines. (though most sites are developed from windows notepad)
Don't even talk about damn Sony. You can't write crap for PSP or PS3.
Microsoft encourages you to write software & games for 360, Windows, and Xbox.
EFI will be the new USB (as in "cool new Intel technology popularized by Apple").
It says here that Gateway used EFI in a media center PC not so long ago. That's XP isn't it?
http://news.com.com/2100-1008-5131787.html
It says here that Gateway used EFI in a media center PC not so long ago. That's XP isn't it?
http://news.com.com/2100-1008-5131787.html
I don't suppose these nifty EFI thingers are going to sport hardware DRM?
*starts searching about the matter*
I actually see a VMWare / Virtual PC solution as far more interesting.
With dual-booting, you have to split your operations between two OSes, whereas with 100% virtualization you can run programs from the two systems more or less alongside each other.
Eg, playing Windows Solitaire while editing in OS X iMovie.
Also, the Virtual PC approach partitions the Windows OS away from critical OS directories, so if a virus / worm / spyware hits Windows, it's less likely to take out your data.
i'd rather have a peg leg than use a one button mouse for windows.
The new mouses do have right click, scrool ball, and side buttons that work better than any 2 click mouses
I thought vendors (Apple) had the option to enable some sort of legacy portion of EFI that would allow it to emulate a BIOS so legacy OSes could boot (Windows pre Vista).
yeah, but how crappy would windows be with only one button... I really wish the new Mac Notebooks had two damn buttons.
I am still MUCH more interested in someone getting OSX (real OSX, like the whole kit and kaboodle, not just the underlying OS sans the interface) to run easily on a PC.
Unless I'm late to the party and someone has allready done so, in which case....link please! :)
Awesome! Vista and Mac Dual Boot? nice...
Suprising they changed them that much. I'm typing this on an Apple Intel Developer box (not the ones released yesterday, the first Intel one that went to developers only) and I've run XP on it from day one (running XP now). Suprising the big change...
Then again that's OS level boot stuff, not stuff we need for dev work... I'm guessing someone will make it work...
"It says here that Gateway used EFI in a media center PC not so long ago. That's XP isn't it?"
It's probably XP MCE, which I believe is based on XP Pro. If XP MCE supports EFI, expect sales to increase...
Can someone at Macworld go to Microsoft's booth and ask if/when Virtual PC for Macs with Intel is coming out? Are they developing it? Are we looking at 1 year? More? Less? Thanks!
Does Linux have EFI support?
Also, "EFI was developed by Intel and allows a number of advanced features, including the ability to connect to the Internet from a command shell before the OS is loaded"
..huh?
#8, I agree. Who in their right mind would cripple something like this with Windows? It looks like a nice machine and the BSD-based O/S only makes it more attractive as far as I'm concerned.
Gooman is right, EFI can emulate BIOS and legacy OSs should boot. None of this is known for the new intel Macs until someone tries and all the stories being posted LIKE FACT, ie. "it CAN use Windows XP" or "it CAN'T use Windows XP" are misguided and below the editoral level of sites like Engadget.
I agree with number 8.
I think that people should try to get OSX on the PC. That way I can have all of the Mac goodness on a home-built computer, and not pay alot for only the Mac OS.
There is a BIOS backwards compatibility layer for EFI, but I guess Apple didn't include it.
Virtual PC may protect your Mac data from getting wiped out by spyware, but anything inside the Windows environment is still screwed. Thatt's why I don't see virtualization as a big help for desktop security.
People got the full OS X to run on generic PCs months ago; it shouldn't be too hard to Google it.
Come on VMware, at least give us an announcement...
I think a dual-boot option would be great. I mean, a good percentage of Mac users already use Virtual PC to get by with software missing on their platform. I think virtualization continues to make sense if you need it for solitaire. If you need want a MacBook that runs the latest 3D games (and like pretty much everything else, they come out on PC first), virtualization isn't a solution. I like the idea of a machine that does well for work, games and fun.
"Who in their right mind would cripple something like this with Windows?"
So I can play Half-Life 2 on my Mac. =) I'd be fine with dual-boot if it meant being able to rock some HL2 or CS...
For fucks sake if you need a two button mouse on your laptop buy a USB mouse.
Whether you like it or not, OS X uses one button, that's why the laptop has one button.
actually OSX can make use of a 2+ button mouse very nicely. i use scroll wheel mice on all my macs. i dont know why there is so much of an obsession with the one-button mouse in the windows fanboy camp...
#8, I agree. Who in their right mind would cripple something like this with Windows? It looks like a nice machine and the BSD-based O/S only makes it more attractive as far as I'm concerned.
...its the same goddamn thing as any pc now so its not crippling it.. nice try
and its still a shame they dont put two buttons on the macbookpro who wants to plug in a mouse when your using it on your lap
OSX has very intuitive 2 button functionality. I wish more people would realize that.
That being said I prefer 1 button on a notebook.
Urr, me not like single button mouse idea, me never use one with OS X & me not want think about one button + ctrl key.
yeah, that's a pretty stupid thing to say, you can plug about any multibutton mouse into a mac, the iMac ships by default with a wired multi as well.
I get by just fine with my one button bluetooth mouse, ctrl click is the same as right click for those who don't know, my hand is on the keyboard for key commands anyway.
For the complainers about one button mice...please get over yourself. You must have never used a mac or you would know that you can use a modifier key to bring up the contextual menu OR you can use the SAME two button mouse you use on your PC. Most people have no idea what the other button is for anyway! Its just so lame to hear that complaint over and over...
then how come the Mighty Mouse has two buttons ?!?
For the record, EFI did come out before Windows XP, it was on a few IBM eServer xSeries 380 Itanium servers I worked on back in '99 I think it was. Windows 2000 on IA64 and Windows 2003 on IA64 use it and work just fine. I think Windows XP Chose not to support it on the IA32 and EM64T/AMD64 revisions
Because it's Mighty.
As a Mac lover, yet gamer, this is my dream, especially since my brother somehow got a beta test copy of vista. I can't wait to get my hands on an iMac, since it's specs seem to be great as per gaming, but...where am I going to get over $1,300 dollars(for the one i would want)?? I guess I'll try even harder to find a job...Until then, I'll have to make more fun desktops ---> http://home.comcast.net/~xmaskitty/Intel_iMac.jpg
Vista beta 2 is rumored to come out late this month or next month which I cannot wait for!
Apple / Mac has been taking their sweet time improving on some things and even though OS X is the greatest OS right now on the market, they will ultimately lose against linux and vista.
Sorry Apple, but the fact is Microsoft is getting off their butt and doing something and just because you got Intel to work with your new machines it probobly wont save you.
I really want to get a macbook to replace my currant laptop, but won't do so until they make one with 2 buttons. It is a breaking point with me. All new macs come with the mighty mouse making it the new mac standard anyway; why have differant configurations for portable and desktop models? It just makes it harder going from your desktop to your laptop because you can't use them in the same way.
And the saying that ctrl key is cood enough is like saying virus and spyware are not problems on PCs because there are programs to prevent them. It may be true but it is still a problem and a major paain in the ass!
Hell just wait for the Merom Intel chips that are 64 bits and support virtualization. You'll be able to run both XP and Os X at the same time and switch between the two. There would be NO speed delay like a Virtual PC solution.
I find two-buttons on a trackpad to be annoying. I use a two button mouse when my AI Book is docked and I am using a large screen, but don't miss the two buttons when only using the track pad.
So Apple has resorted to making it easy for Windows to be ran on their machines to try and bauild their measly 4% market share.
Hmmmm Dual core processors, Intel chips, two button mice standard (maybe). It's beging to show more and more the only big difference between mac and pc is software.
It's a good thing they've got the iPod or they would barely even exist today.
this dumbed down TravelMate 8200(read macbook pro) is PC notebook with one mouse button. If it had two, what would there be to differentiate it? besides price higher. we're talking hardware folks.
when will the full version of vista be out anyway!? approx!?
I hear that vista only works with one button.
Seriously... Who cares about getting the blue screen of death an a brand new MacBook Pro?! The reason Apple isn't blocking Windows on their new computers is because barely anyone would want some nice viruses, poor memory management, and constant End Process dialogs on their new Macs...
Forget this, lets hear about running OS X on the PC!
wtf?! why the f&*k would you buy a an Intel iMac or MacBook Pro to put windows on it?! sad sad ppl......
#30, funny that you think that Vista is going to be the death of all other OS's, why is it funny? because many of the features in Vista have been in OS X for YEARS, sorry, but nice try MS.