Toshiba's triple-layer HD DVD / DVD discs

You know we likey our Blu-ray and HD DVD tech 'round here, but we heart hybrid capabilities even more. So today's announcement from Toshiba and Memory Tech of a triple-layer twin format HD DVD / DVD disc has certainly caught our attention. The new disc is capable of either a dual-layer 30GB HD DVD and single-layer 4.7GB configuration, or single-layer 15GB HD DVD and dual-layer 8.5GB DVD. The resulting disc can be manufactured on the same HD DVD production lines with little modification and conceivably play either HD or DVD films (without flipping the disc) when fed into a regular ol' DVD or new fangled HD DVD player. As our hi-def bros over at HD Beat rightly point out, the DVD TWIN standard is already in use by our Japanese overlords, albeit, in its lessor dual-layer format. The next step is for Tosh to present the new format to the DVD forum who, with any luck, will slap Toshiba up side the head and get 'em focused on the HD DVD / Blu-ray hybrid we're all waiting for.

[Via Impress]

[stopgeek @ Sep 11th 2006 9:38AM]

This is all good and dandy, but how much will it cost?
Its usually a years wait before average consumers can afford stuff like this.

[Wonderboy @ Sep 11th 2006 9:38AM]

This could be golden for HD-DVD... which is a shame cause I'm still rooting for Blu-Ray. But you start manufacturing DVD/HD-DVD hybrids, take the plain DVDs and plain HD-DVDs off the market, and suddenly you've got DVD owners stocking up their movie library with HD-DVD discs. Makes it that much simpler for a transition.

But like I said, I'm still rooting for the superior tech/capacity of Blu-Ray.

[Wonderboy @ Sep 11th 2006 9:41AM]

Stopgeek... it's not a hybrid player (since all HD-DVD players are "hybrid" with standard DVD). These are discs... the same ones that are out on shelves right now, with a minor tweek on the production line you're looking at a minimal cost increase over HD-DVD (non-hybrid) discs. If the studios are smart, they'll price these the same as normal HD-DVDs that are out for maximum market penetration.

[cameras @ Sep 11th 2006 10:00AM]

it is wonderful to think this HD-DVD players:)

[Hmmm @ Sep 11th 2006 10:22AM]

There has been a BD-25 / DVD9 disc in the works for a while now. Needless to say consumers and publishers should prefer to have and release content in DVD9 and BD25 quality rather than in DVD5 (obsolete for movies) and HD-DVD30.

http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/english/press/2004/bd-dvd.html

HD-DVD will have no advantages over Blu-ray in the end, not even price.

[Rasesh @ Sep 11th 2006 10:42AM]

Looks extremely good, but i fear that it will be priced way to high :(

[Pete @ Sep 11th 2006 10:49AM]

And just how much more vulnerable to scratches will this be? It's already a *big* problem with normal DVD's...

[shmengie @ Sep 11th 2006 11:39AM]

yawn...let me know when they get to 4 layers...

[MuDoggy @ Sep 11th 2006 1:29PM]

And yet another reason why the 15/30 isn't enough to hold ALL the good stuff.

Blu-ray was the first to demonstrate the Blu-laser/DVD Hybrid in test, in fact, they can do a full 8.5GB DVD plus a full 50GB BD on ONE disc, unlike the limited either-or situation of HD-DVD.

HD-DVD shares at least one layer with DVD. Its dead center, and that is why it can't have both HD DVD and DVD double layer. Meaning if you're into quality (seeing as you have high def setup) then you'd want a superbit DVD plus high def disc hybrid. You can't do that with HD-DVD, because you'll either have a low quality DVD version(4.7GB for DVD, leaving 30GB for HD movie), or a low quality HD version (only allowing 15GB for a movie is NOT enough for any kind of quality video, but you get the full 8.5GB DVD movie).

So sad to see them try this when it just doesn't have the room to have the best of both worlds.

[EatingPie @ Sep 11th 2006 2:36PM]

Some commentors missed the real problem here. It's not a "true" 3-layer disc. The maximum capacity of HD-DVD remains 30GB even with 3 layers. The maximum capacity for DVD remains 8GB even for 3 layers. But you can't max them both at the same time.

This just gives the ability to market one disc to both HD-DVD and DVD adopters. But even that's problematic, since you sacrifice cpacity at one end or the other: either 8GB DVD / 15GB HD-DVD or 4GB DVD / 30GB HD-DVD. Someone gets short-changed with these. Either the guy who wants it for DVD (4GB is tight) or the guy who wants it for HD (15GB is VERY tight).

Given that issue, I'm not sure there's a market for these -- until they allow 8GB/30GB anyway.

-Pie

[James @ Sep 11th 2006 2:41PM]

Pete,

"And just how much more vulnerable to scratches will this be? It's already a *big* problem with normal DVD's..."

I guess when you toss your movies around like frizbees, you'll have big problems. DVD/HD-DVD spec puts the data layer much deeper than BD thus not requiring a hard coating to prevent scratches. Personally, I would still prefer a scratch resistant coating on DVD/HD-DVD like the Verbatim Videoguard line of DVD+-R blanks. But I also don't handle the discs by holding on the flat surfaces. Edge/center only for me.

[Karl Viklund @ Sep 11th 2006 3:06PM]

Dual layer HD DVD = 30 GB
Single layer Blu-Ray = 25 GB

The fight is over, may HD DVD rest in peace. HD DVD was doomed from the begining. Without Microsoft support HD DVD would be even less the nothing.

[Robomania @ Sep 11th 2006 6:46PM]

Slap them upside the head? Who are you guys kidding? This is an awesome development, just think: buy the DVD now and watch normal-def, then when the players get cheaper, watch the same movie in HD! Sounds good to me.

[Oddmanout @ Sep 12th 2006 1:44AM]

Interesting. I know MS has stated that the HD-DVD sttachment for the 360 is not intended for gaming, but down the road a ways, this might change things. I mean it's not like MS has never broken their word...it probably wouldn't even be the first time they did so concerning the 360, but this way, if they do no one should have any reason to complain.

With discs like these MS could create standard and high def versions of games and sell them as ONE sku# for one price. People could play the game whether or not they have the HD-DVD attachment (albeit at lower res and probably with less features). And if they ever pick up the HD-DVD add on, they don't have to re-buy any software to start reaping the benefits.

Again, no specific reason to think MS will do this, but it's an interesting possibility...

[GhostDoggy @ Sep 11th 2006 6:58PM]

LOL, their player can't show me 1080P off of the HD DVD disk. Why should we care about n-layers for greater storage? Maybe they should build a player that can natively output 1080P so people can get what they are already paying for.

[Reg @ Sep 11th 2006 11:39PM]

First I was rooting for WMV-HD, then DivX HD, then the new HD-DVD. Boy, I can sure pick em'.

After realising the limitation of

4.7/30 or 8.5/15 GB, I think HD-DVD has sealed its fate.

All hail the new king of HD video, blah, blah, blah, his royal heineyness Blue-Ray HD. [sigh] Yea.

Guess I gotta go spec out a Blue Ray ROM for my HTPC now.

:-(

[Fredus @ Sep 13th 2006 6:38AM]

"Dual layer HD DVD = 30 GB
Single layer Blu-Ray = 25 GB

The fight is over, may HD DVD rest in peace. HD DVD was doomed from the begining. Without Microsoft support HD DVD would be even less the nothing."

This has nothing to do with the article. Stop trolling please.