Hands-on with the TiVo Series3!
Design
Functionality
Toggling between tuners can be performed via the programming info menu or by pressing the LiveTV button on the remote. Any two incoming signals can be recorded simultaneously with the option of watching a third signal of recorded content.
The Series3 is designed to replace a cable box, not control it. The S3 supports OTA broadcasts (both ATSC and NTSC) in addition to analog cable, but to fully appreciate the unit a pair of CableCARDs are needed. If our experience is representative, getting them installed will test your patience. The S3 supports CableCARD 1.0, and it's our understanding a single M-Card (CC 1.0+) will replace 2 CableCARDs once they become available.
HD details
Specifications
Disappointments and concerns
TiVo continues to develop and evaluate Multi-Room Viewing, TiVoToGo, and external hard drive support in relation to CableLabs certification. While we recognize certain aspects of this issue are largely out of TiVo's control, the absence of these value-added features makes the MSRP more difficult to swallow. And while we were pleasantly surprised that the Series3 allows you to scan and tune unencrypted QAM programming, we were disappointed in the inability to manually map those channels to their respective networks. TiVo tells us this functionality is being evaluated for a future software update. Lastly, the cable industry appears to be in flux and it's not clear when/if technologies such as OCAP and SDV might impact Series3 functionality.
Cost and Availability
Being an early adopter is gonna cost you. Those leaks and our own forecast were spot-on: $799 will be the price of admission. Unfortunately for potential S3 consumers, TiVo is at a disadvantage compared to the deep-pocketed cable companies and satellite providers who operate under a different business model and underwrite hardware costs. If it's any consolation, the 30-hour Series1 and the HD DirecTiVo both retailed for $1k at launch (and then proceeded to drop in price).
Service fees remain $12.95 a month, or $6.95/month for those who currently have a non-bundled pricing unit subscription. TiVo also offers pre-paid pricing at the rate of $155.40 for one year or $299 for two years. TiVo is offering two promotions in conjunction with the release of the S3. First, you can prepay three years of service for the price of two ($299). Second, as we revealed last week, $199 lets you move Lifetime Service from a S1 or S2 unit to the new S3.
Units go on sale today at TiVo.com and should be showing up within the next week or so at Best Buy, Circuit City, Fry's, and Ultimate Electronics. Good luck on that decision!
first comment!
Sweet!
Too bad i dont live in the states
Number 2!
Today???? ZOMG! I'm going to have to wake up early to buy one. I've seriously been chomping at the bit for one of these.
I'm ready to buy, but i need to know about the esata external drive connection. is that ready to implement right out of the box? i can't handle 30 hours. i need to upgrade right away. if people already have the unit, why have they not tested this out yet? is there any information about this? does the software in the series 3 support external storage out of the box?
I'm tempted...
Finally... I can drop-kick that @#$%^ing CableBox out on it's ass.
Is the interface updated to hires HD or is still low res with funky scaling on a HD channel (like the direct tv HD tivo or moto boxes)? How is the performance? Can you make a change to the season passes without needing to then go for coffee, 3 miles away, while it recalculates?
the series 2 direct-tv hd tivo's hdmi was an early, limited spec that did not support 'handshaking'... you couldnt connect hdmi to a sound processor and the sound processor to the tv and receive copyright protected content.
does anyone know the hdmi version that is output by this new tivo?
Okay, but can I connect a slingbox to it and have it
work correctly - so I can watch my DVR "remotely".
I still don't like how you can only record one digital and one analog channel. I'm sticking with my TW HD DVR in the meantime.
Awesome but I don't see too many people paying that price for them. Very sweet but they need to get the price down.
For your slingbox you will probably have wait a bit until Sling adds it to there system. I can't wait to get rid of that Cable Box, but i hope they drop the price by a couple hundred dollars. I could care less about Cable On Demand i never use it.
I also want to know the speed of operating (e.g. configuring the season pass list) and the noise of operation. Is the cooling fan noticably loud?
I see it's up on Best Buy's web site for $800. No mention of rebate, etc. But apparently it's available for store pick-up in my area.
$799 for the unit + $12.95/month for service = I won't be buying one.
If they got rid of the monthly fee or slashed the price of the unit, I may consider it, but that is just TOO much money for the improvements over my current HD DVR. At least for the cost of a Vista media center, you will be able to do all of this in addition to all the other things you can do with a PC. I just can't justify this pricing in any way.
Hesh: You can record two HDTV programs at once. There are a total of six tuners in the box. Two QAM, Two ATSC, and two analog.
Have there been any interface tweaks? I'm thinking MCE type stuff like 30 second skip, automatically recording an extra 5 mintues on each end of programs if nothing else is recording, etc....
Can you save HD video at a lower resolution?
Definitely getting one of these. Some thoughts on the monthly fees:
1. I have an S1 & an S2 with lifetime. I can add an S3 for 6.95 a month. I get to lose a cable box and remote which saves me 5.50 a month. Net 1.45 a month difference. (hmm...there are two card slots so maybe that doesn't add up?)
2. Assume I pay $199 to transfer minus 1 free year on the old unit then pay again for the old unit after 12 months. I'm back to the same 1.45 a month difference but have given them $115 extra dollars.
3. The only thing that makes any sense to me is if, sometime in the future, my S1 and S2 are gone. And I no longer have a lifetime unit then the S3 would cost me 12.95 a month. So transferring might make sense in the long term. (or I suppose if i am going to chuck the S1 after transferring)
The bottom line is it's not worth thinking about this much. We're talking $50 to $100 a year difference? If you do have to think about it maybe you shouldn't drop $800 on a DVR?!
just called tivo and the sales guy said that you won't be able to do the 6.95 extra box if u already have tivo??? not sure if that's correct or hes just misinformed... not going to get it through tivo.com at least...
"Can you save HD video at a lower resolution?"
Sure, if you record the non-HD alternative! There's always a non-HD version of the broadcast channels.
Also called, wanted to transfer my lifetime from my S1, sale rep says I need to use the URL from the message Tivo sends out to the Tivo boxen. I have not received this email - does anybody know the URL, anybody received the message???
Hi there,
In answer to your question, for a limited time you can get lifetime if you have it now transferred to your hdtv box for $199 and they will let you use tivo on your old box for a whole year, but the original box has to have lifetime already. There should be something on the now showing menu letting you know where to get this deal, but try phoning the 866-921-tivo cust. svc. again, and ask them how to do this. I know its for a limited time.
Hope this helped!
Looks great but $800 beans is a lot of cash!
When factoring cost I'm still not clear on what, if any, the costs will be of getting two cablecards from the cable company. Are there monthly fees on those?
WHAT?!?
Only a 250GB HD, no multi-room or TiVO-to-Go? For $800?!!? Wow, what a joke!! What am I supposed to do, keep my old TiVo units around for that functionality? Oh wait... they'll "allow" me to transfer my lifetime for another $200, but then I'll need to pay monthly on my current boxes just to retain multi-room, etc.
What a mess! TiVo - Please upgrade the HD to a reasonable size, add back multi-room and TTG (at least on the non-cablecard shows). And how about giving loyal customers a break instead of charging $800?
Think I'll keep my crappy $5/mo Comcast/Moto HD box for now.
Wardude - Here is the URL:
http://www.tivo.com/vip
Ok, I ordered one. Should have it in two days. :-)
I've heard that comcast will be offering Tivo service through the Comcast HD DVR soon (already in pilot in Chicago). Does anyone know more about this? Could this mean we wont't need a Tivo HD box or does the Tivo box have some advantage of its own?
Not being able to stream from my series 2 is the deal-breaker for me. I had two ReplayTV's downstairs and one upstairs. That gave me the ability to record three channels. In preparation for the series 3 and a deep desire to get back to Tivo, I replaced the upstairs Replay with a series 2 dual-tuner and move one of the two remaining upstairs. I was planning to obsolete them with a series 3 and move the series 2 downstairs... So I guess I will wait to see if they implement streaming before I buy..
I won't be buying one, especially at that price. What advantages does it have over Dish Network's VIP622? Everyone says the interface is better, but $800 better? The 622 had a slick interface and is faster than most previous TIVO's.
Wish lists? I have Dish Pass which is just slightly less functional, bit in some ways better. Wish Lists are not worth $800.
Search and Guide data? Have them.
250 GB HD? Have it.
HD DVR? Yes.
Multiple tuners? Well I know TIVO has 2 OTA and 2 HD and 2 regular tuners? This does kick the 622's butt, but not in a $800 way. The VIP622 has 2 Sat tuners (both HD) and an OTA tuner. Rarely if ever am I trying to record more than 3 things at exactly the same time.
TIVO to GO? Well it doesn't exist, but you can currently buy a Portable PocketDish for the VIP622.
Multi Room functionality? Not yet on TIVO, but the VIP622 can output to two TV's in different locations independently of each other, both with access to all DVR recordings independently.
External Hard Drive support? Not yet on TIVO, but not yet on Dish, although this is one of the features that is coming on Dish as it is on TIVO.
So what exactly am I getting with a TIVO? It may be nicer and have a few small items of additional functionality, but come on!! Through Dish you can get the VIP622 for $100 after $100 rebate!! TIVO? $800. It is just not worth the price if you are a Dish Network subscriber.
I have a couple questions. Does the HD Ouput have to be HDMI only like the DVD HD Upconverting players? Or is it like the DirecTV HD DVR that you can view HD content via composite? I Was an early HD Big Screen adopter and am stuck without dvi, vga, or hdmi.
Also I want to see a shot of the Now Playing screens to see if it allows sorting/folder organizing of recorded content because the new DirecTV HD DVR HR10-250 seems to not have this capability out of the box.
Does anyone know if this little machine would work on european cable as well?
"Not only does the S2 handle OTA"
I think you meant:
"Not only does the S3 handle OTA"
After being an early adopter of the Series 1 (Sept. 1999), and the Pioneer 810 Tivo with DVD-RW, I'm finding myself underwhelmed and postponing my purchase.
After having had HD cable in my home for what, 4 years now, Tivo has finally made it to the batter's box and it turns out he brought his bat, but forgot his batting helmet, glove, and shoes.
It's just inexcusable for Tivo to release this thing with limited functionality. It should be able to re-map channels to deal with QAM. There should be a selection of models with larger drive options. eSATA, Tivo To Go, TivoCast, MRV, and high-def Photo viewing should all be functional. And it shouldn't be a fight with stupid cable operators to get the cablecards for it. TiVo should have a # to call to report such problems, and a legal team ready to serve papers to each cable company that plays dumb.
Thank God I have that old Series 1 with grandfathered lifetime. I'll wait until the S3 is ready for primetime (and with a lower price), and then transfer my lifetime service. Looks like I'll be waiting another 6 months to a year for these shortcomings to get ironed out!
Disappointed.
Early Adopter - NOT!
You will only be able to transfer your life time sub until Jan. 07. So unless you adopt early you will be stuck with the monthly.
Mark,
You're confusing my situation with non-grandfathered lifetime subscription Tivos. I could even hold onto my lifetime and transfer it to another model 10 years from now. From www.tivocommunity.com:
Grandfather transfer: The one-time "Grandfather transfer" (for people who purchased Product Lifetime on or before January 21, 2000 [as in, more than six years ago], and who have not already used their one-time transfer) is still allowed and will also be honored for future hardware releases from TiVo, such as the Series3. If you have any trouble when you call, please mention KDB code 09-07-04 to the agent.
I've compiled a FAQ, and taken just a few photos:
http://www.tivolovers.com/Series3-Review.html
http://www.tivolovers.com/Series3-FAQ.html
http://www.tivolovers.com/Photos/Series3-Review/
Coincidence that Apple announced its iTV service today? I think that Apple must have a mol inside TiVo and is trying to get early-adopters to hold off on the series 3 in anticipation of an iPod-esque TV-revolution. Me, I think TiVo beat Apple to the punch with th Series 1. I'm getting one of these ASAP.
FWIW it appears that the lifetime transfer option may only be available for units purchased via tivo.com (see their disclaimer on the vip page)
No worries, since mine was ordered from tivo.com and I should have it by friday!
Cable card only? Why, oh why, Tivo? No set top box menas no on demand programming - no HBO on demand, no pay-per-view movies. I can't live without the on demand stuff...so no Series 3 for me. What were they thinking????
Yeah Len, except the iTV has no TV tuners and is nothing like a TiVo. Close though.
Two questions I have:
1. What's the performance like of the S3 coupled with TiVo's wifi adapter? I realize TiVo-To-Go has not been activated on the S3 yet, but I'd still be interested to know if everything's been smooth sailing in terms of making the "daily call" over a wireless network.
2. Will TiVo honor any unused Lifetime Subscription service cards that were sold by the likes of BestBuy, or must they only be used on S2 models?
I'll never get the desire for 'On Demand'. My TiVo is my version of on demand, and in the 7 years I've had TiVo I've never been able to catch up with all the stuff it records for me.
have been waiting for tivo 3 HD for ages, and don't mind paying high price to be an early adopter - but no multiroom means no purchase. [at least for SD quality] - guess I'll wait and take a look at iTV.
SDV is the biggest concern. With TiVo saying that the S3 will never be able to overcome SDV, I feel the S3 is DOA.
I got mine last week. A friend who works for TiVo gave me his employee purchase slot. Waiting for Comcast to install the two CableCards (no monthly cost) tomorrow so the $10 a month Moto DVR can go back to Comcast where it belongs.
It is a pretty sweet with these advantages over the Comcst DVR:
250GB vs 120GB -- Greater than 2X the storage which is really a necessity for all the HD shows we watch and all the kiddie shows we keep around. The need for "OnDemand" greatly diminishes.
Excellent scaling of 480i to 720p. I have a 2005 Panasonic Plasma and after some experimentation, I found that the 480i video scaling in the TiVo was actually superior to that in my TV. The THX certification does seem to be meaningful after all. My TV is not THX certified.
Okay, so I don't get TiVoToGo yet. I am bummed. This was a feature I was looking forward to for the 4 hour drives to the ski slopes. However, I do get network Photo viewing. I was going to build a home theater PC or buy an HD digital media viewer ($200 - $300) to view photos on my TV, but now I don't need to. My wife and the kids loved watching the slide shows of our trips to Disneyland and Disneyworld. Something you can't do with a Comcast DVR. When you think that printing photos can easily be $100 or more, the cost doesn't seem so out of wack. And far more convenient than a slide carosel.
Other great features over the Comcast DVRs - Wishlists, folders, better UI, doesn't shut off in the middle of viewing a show, ATSC tuners for OTA HD (Comcast doesn't carry all of the local DTV signals).
As for unencrypted QAM tuning. You know, I tried this on my TV for awhile when I got it a year ago. But it was really cumbersome to try and remember the mapping. Yeah, it would be good if TiVo had software to do this. However, there's a problem. Comcast occasionally reorganizes the QAM channels and maps them to different channels. Given that the CableCards are $0 per month from Comcast where I live, it's worth the $16 truck-roll to have an installer come out and get hassle free mapping.
And I just found out that my Plasma TV is now $1000 less than I paid in 2005. OUCH! I guess if I was really concerned about the price drop, I should have waited one more year and it would have paid for the TiVo Series 3. Couldn't wait any longer for the TS3. Just hated the Comcast DVR that much. But I am going to wait a year (or more) until the Blu-ray/HD-DVD thing settles out.
Anything to complain about?
Yeah, TV.yahoo.com doesn't work for the TS3 right now (it does for the TS2 however) and this seems to be glitch on TiVo's side (they forgot to configure the affiliate software to allow TS3's to do online scheduling). You can use the TiVo site for online scheduling, but the Yahoo TV thing is a bit easier to use (if it works).
I would have liked the WiFi installation to be just a little easier. I had to reboot the box to get it to work properly. (The Comcast Moto DVR has a built in Cable Modem that is provisioned by the Cable company).
Also, I think that it should have been 300GB (or more) out of the box, rather than 250GB. Just waiting for 500GB or 750GB eSATA drives to work with TiVo and I may go straight to 1TB. Weaknees is already offering upgraded TS3 which has one 750GB drive (100 hours of HD, >900 hours of SD). $600 for the upgrade is more than I want to spend right now.
@Jeremy - WiFi daily calls works just fine. I'm more concerned about PPPoE over DSL not working causing a hiccup. But I have a phone line hooked up too (from my 7-year old TS1). WiFi also worked well for photo viewing.
As for the lifetime service cards from earlier this year. I read someplace that this would work for the TS3 as well (not just TS2). It might have been a link from a seller on eBay you had linked to the TiVo page. I've been trying to find something in the TiVo knowledge base or FAQs confirming this. You need to double check.
Dear Tivo: You're high!
I understand this is a cool gadget--AND I LOVE TIVO!--but who in their right mind would pay $800 dollars, plus taxes, plus a monthly service fee for this product--which is inferior?
I canceled Tivo in August and got my Comcast Motorola box with a dual-tuner and HD. I don't love it, but its functional and only $5/month and I don't have to cough up $800 plus $12.95/month for the same functionality. I mean, what I can I say, "You can't use TivoToGo with my Motorola box", well guess what, you can't do it with their $800 box either! Nor can you use multi-room sharing.
Sorry Tivo, you're moving in the wrong direction. Give me the box for $99 like it used to be, and maybe I'll pay the $12.95/month.
mmmm oled mmmmmmm
can someone explain to this novice how to use the series 3 to tune in unencrypted QAM channels with my basic cable service so I dont have to keep dealing with the poor reception I get from over the air bunny ears antenna brad@ka.net is my email If I can't figure this out I'm thinking of returning the Series 3 I just bought....Tivo Tech Support is no help and state that it can't be done.
Informed by TiVo and confirmed on Costco's website, Costco is offering the Series 3 for $399!!! Deal ends 1/1/08. Definately getting one!
http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11179878&search=tivo&Mo=6&cm_re=1_en-_-Top_Left_Nav-_-Top_search&lang=en-US&Nr=P_CatalogName:BC&Sp=S&N=0&whse=BC&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntk=Text_Search&Dr=P_CatalogName:BC&Ne=4000000&D=tivo&Ntt=tivo&No=2&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Nty=1&topnav=&s=1