CE-Oh no he didn't! Part XVII - Ballmer to Linux users: You owe us
By Josh Fruhlinger 
posted Nov 19th 2006 8:29PM
posted Nov 19th 2006 8:29PM
While Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer was taking a break from dealing with cranky users still waiting for Vista, he went ahead and told the entire Linux community that they owe him a big thank-you. Yes, yes he did. In a Q&A session at the Professional Association for SQL Server conference, Ballmer (sans sweat) said that Microsoft signed a deal with SUSE Linux distributor Novell in order to get some money back for its "intellectual property." Among other transactions, the one in question sends $40 million to Microsoft in exchange for Microsoft's promise not to sue Novell over possible patent violations. As to whether or not the SUSE Linux distribution actually infringes upon any patents, Novell's payment appears to be some sort of admission fee, and, according to Ballmer, Linux users owe him a big "thanks." After all, he was just assuring that Microsoft gets the "appropriate economic return for our shareholders from our innovation." Meanwhile, Red Hat called the whole thing an "innovation tax" and plans to protect its customers against any infringement claims by Microsoft, asking Ballmer to go ahead and show us all what part of the Linux kernel infringes upon Redmond's patents. So while Ballmer pens his report, get to it, open-source community -- start writing your thank-you notes.[Thanks, Neonez]
what is with this guy. he looks well and truly demented
MAN that picture is creepy. Oh yeah, Ballmer's a douche.
I wouldn't be suprised to see this douche bag replaced. What an ugly image.
As an Ubuntu user, please allow me...
*UCK YOU Ballmer!
Quite.
as a human... allow me to back that statment... and follow it with a "Mr Microsoft "I hate open source and everything it stands for and every hard working open source coder who gives out there free time, and doesnt ask for ANYTHING back in return" that you sir, should be hung by that which dangles between your legs, and have rotten tomatoes thrown at you!. GOOD DAY!.. Fool.
Actually... this makes them a hypocryte doesnt it? didnt they nick apples source code... back in the day?...
Hey, be polite
now let's all go buy a zone and help MS have even more power. I mean, deep down they are a very moral, likeable and reasonable company, right?
waddo
Heh, well if you approach it objectively... Linux is based upon Unix. Unix was developed a long, long time ago. As they moved to becoming the entirely modern operating system that it is today, Linux had to get its ideas from somewhere. They haven't come up with anything original, and everything they have ever done has been done somewhere else first. I know some people will react reflexivly against that idea, and I welcome you to bring to the table any sort of revolutionary innovation I've missed that originiated in Linux. Overall, Linux is very conservative and picks up the best features from other operating systems. Thanks to the current environment where ideas are considered "intellectual property" and trademarked, that's bound to cause some trouble.
"They haven't come up with anything original ... bring to the table any sort of revolutionary innovation I've missed"
It's a bit of a jump from "anything original" to "revolutionary innovation". What revolutionary innovations has Microsoft brought? Certainly not a windowed operating system. (hint: it doesn't count if they just bought a smaller company and assimilated their I.P.)
Just saying, how about offering some proof to the contrary before laying down a challenge.
otakucode;
Why don't you give us a list of the revolutionary ideas MS has brought to the table when it comes to operating system architecture and design? Heck, feel free to include computer languages too, and feel free to go up to the Vista if you need to. Please provide a list, thanks!
Since Microsoft basically took the idea from Xerox, we should all be thanking EVERYBODY for being able to devolop similar ideas their own way.
Everybody is just copying everybody else--it's all a matter of what you like the best.
Linux is NOT based on UNIX. It was and is a "unix like" OS. Developed from the ground up.
Here's my thank-you letter:
dear microsoft,
I won't be buying Vista.
Love, Alex.
O damn you really got em there! I,m sure Ballmer isn't going to get any sleep tonight now
Ballmer, go screw yourself. That's my thank-you note, and I intend to write + mail it.
Sean, I don't just want him gone from Microsoft, I want him to pay for stagnating OS technologies for one decade.
Good for you, Alex. I hope some institutional holders could wake up from their vastly overestimation on Vista sales, factoring in degrees of market saturation. Dilute those floats.
This is so typical of Linux users:
When the issue is features, Linux is some sort of super-distro that combines the features of Ubuntu, SUSE, Gentoo, and all of Sourceforge.
Whenever the issue is bugs, security or code, Linux is just a kernel.
Makes sense. Linux is a kernel, but it is also /an idea/
When people talk about what Linux can give us, they are talking about Linux in terms of the effect that it has had on free software and the number of Linux distributions there are which use the kernel to build amazing things.
When people are talking about Linux in a more logical manner such as to find bugs or debate the law, they will use the more logical dictionary and refer to Linux as a kernel which runs software that has nothing to do with it.
I think Ballmer got it wrong, though. I will laugh if he doesn't realize.
@ eM
What are you smoking? You do realise that Ubuntu, SUSE, Gentoo are all linux distros that all have their own unique features? Linux isn't a specific program you can download and use, it is the kernel that you can install all of the (probably) millions of programs that people have written on, but since that takes a lot of effort/skill people (or usually groups of people) have written 'distros' that have a bunch of software installed.
To summarise:
linux kernel = dos
ubuntu, fedora, suse, etc = windows, os X, etc bundled with all most of the software you would ever buy
sourceforge = freedownloads.com (minus the viruses, pr0n, and crap)
How Balmer can go and say that a particular distro violates microsoft's patents is beyond me... It is just a collection of software... Maybe he is saying anything with an automated installer or anything that allows you to run >1 program at a time is microsofts intellectual property?
The problem isin't with Linux users: It's with you.
Linux is a Kernel. all the pretty stuff is a Window Manager--of which there are hundreds. GNOME and KDE are the major ones.
Do not confuse the Kernel with the WM. It makes you look silly.
He really is a disgusting looking fellow. Like the Penguin from Batman. It's just hard to imagine any kind of integrity in him, especially with his disgusting tongue hanging out.
Now, I despise Microshit as much as the rest of us (and as such, I'll pirate Vista rather than buy it), but way to not actually answer his question except with a counterquestion. He never said that Microsoft was an innovator; he simply questioned whether or not Linux was. I'd actually like to see a core technology that's in Vista or Leopard that originated in GNU/Linux, if you've got one to show me.
That said, I am rather uninformed, and I don't doubt that there are such technologies, but I'd love it if you'd give some examples.
otakucode is right, if Microsoft has investors who expect to get benefits from Microsoft's huge and great R&D and they do own propietary rights and patents, then I see nothing wrong. America is all about who owns what, and it only applies more to Microsoft, and I find that to be great. Linux developers should start coming up with their own ideas or start writing checks to Microsoft for their intentional idea "borrowing"
i thought Apple ripped off Xerox, then MS ripped off Apple...
----
Now, I despise Microshit as much as the rest of us (and as such, I'll pirate Vista rather than buy it), but way to not actually answer his question except with a counterquestion. He never said that Microsoft was an innovator; he simply questioned whether or not Linux was. I'd actually like to see a core technology that's in Vista or Leopard that originated in GNU/Linux, if you've got one to show me.
That said, I am rather uninformed, and I don't doubt that there are such technologies, but I'd love it if you'd give some examples.
-----
You miss the point. Why do we have to come up with a list of "innovations" for Linux, when one can't really even come up with an easy one for Microsoft. It's not the Linux community using threats of lawsuits to restrain innovation, it's MS.
And Microsoft needs to be clear here, what are the patents in question? They're going to be as vague as possible to scare people away from Linux, instead of competing feature by feature. Yeah, that'll help consumers.
And thanks Miguel de Icaza for your Mono project, people warned you this was going to be a disaster, and you didn't listen. Now look what a mess you've helped create.
Maybe you should look up what Leopards kernel is based on.
Sure, I'd be glad to say thanks to Microsoft, thanks for making my decision on whether or not to get Vista alot easier you *ucking *ss holes.
Give me a freaking break. Microsoft great R&D? They stole practically everything. Linux is just a kernel that mirrors Unix, which predates everything Archaic Windows by decades. Name some of these great ideas if you want to accuse Linux of theft. Name one.
The only thing MS has been creative is how to effortlessly become the software industry bully. And the term Linux is commonly ued for the kernel (original meaning) as well as the OS (including the different distros that use that kernel), is hard to know about which one was he talking.
BTW (@Alexander): Actually Apple made a deal with Xerox so they can use their research, MS copied the Os in the original Macintosh (things developed by Xerox and by Apple) from some prototypes intended for software development.
Novell develops the Mono project, which is basically an implementation of .NET. .NET is a Microsoft property and Mono is a free implementation of a standard the Microsoft published. For years people have warned that Microsoft would collect on that and just because they made it an open standard doesn't mean they won't turn around and sue. Many called this FUD. I call it reality. Now with this latest fiasco I think those who were cautious are right. BTW, Mono is being used in Gnome right now for Beagle and some apps outside that project. It is easily removed. I say remove it and replace it with GPL Java. That is free for real.
,,|,, /waves at Microsoft.
/Ubuntu user
I think there are a few considerations.
Novell is one of the few software companies that have survived the Microsoft typhoon.
Novell continues to have many best of breed technologies
Novell was almost destroyed by Microsoft in the past, many times.
By all accounts Microsoft tying the knot with Novell shows some signs of weakness with Microsoft and Novell tying the know with Microsoft does not seem to make much sense. So on both accounts it is not very clear why they really climbed in bed together. The Linux train has already left the station and law suites are not going to stop it.
Novell has been deemed pretty much irrelevant however since this agreement Novell has been getting more press in terms of its relevancy than in many years. Why is this?
Everything that is said about this deal is pure speculation on both the pro and con side. Only time will tell what this, on the surface, irrational "desparate" play will turn into.
Confusing to say the least !
Your XBox dollars hard at work!
GET ON YOUR FEET
GET UP AND MAKE IT HAPPEN
I plan on pirating Vista anyways... So screw you MS... Man thats why those geeks at MS need Wifi on Zune to be social. Ugly!
@...
You might want to work on your reading comprehension.
...and also on your understanding of patent law, but you'll need to work on the former before the latter.
When did engadget become slashdot?? Get back to cameras, cellphones and keyboards. I agree that Ballmer is being a big jerk, but thats what he gets paid for. As long as he is in the headlines keeping discussion sites talking about M$, than he is succeeding.
I agree that Ballmer looks like a piece of crap.
The key question in the article, however, is why did Novell pay Microsoft to not sue them? If there is in fact no violation of Microsoft's patents, why pay at all?
It will be interesting if Red Hat stands up to Microsoft, so any alleged violations can come to light.
Didn't SCO try this a few years ago?!?! Once again Microsoft is late to the market and playing copy cat.
Not to mention MS PAID NOVELL $440 Million and then Novell gave MS a token $40 Mil. for some sort of IP rights.
IANAL but I have dealt with patent laws and other laws enough to know that this is about laws and patents and not about justice. Two very different things.
Of curse everyone developing Linux was very careful not to use any proprietary code - because it's open source, this issue is probably more important than any non-open-source projects. Linux definitely didn't steal anything from MS.
But its not about that. It's about a patent system that has gone out of control, and about big corporations like MS patenting everything and anything. That works because the PTO allows pretty much any patent, so the more $ you spend the more patents you get.
Patent infringement suits are extremely difficult to defend against in courts. Especially when there's an expensive army of lawyers behind it.
I do still believe that justice will win out in the end, but you are talking years and years of court action, uncertainty, and business-threatening penalties. Just look at SCO, they had absolutely nothing and made a big stink. MS can do the same thing if they want to. Luckily, Red Hat is big enough to withstand such an onslaught. Smaller distributions would possibly just be forced to close down.
Microsoft has a right to defend its rights as an patent holder. Obviously Novell agreed with them or they wouldn't have parted with cash... Linux is just the kernel, yes. But today Linux is considered to be a distro and if any part of that distro is patented then that distro must either drop the use of the portion of its distro or they must pay. It has been said because of these ease of adding code to open source, there is beleive to be alot of patent infringements.
I obviously will be getting Vista, as I have it now. 100% Free, thanx to MS (Big Thank You). Being a part of their Beta Test team throught the whole developement of Longhorn, and previously with XP and XP SP2, I was generously given a copy free or charge :)
To those of you who think you can pirate Vista... you are dead wrong. Vista is NOT XP and had much more security including the security of its activation and piracy control.
"Microsoft has a right to defend its rights as an patent holder. Obviously Novell agreed with them or they wouldn't have parted with cash... Linux is just the kernel, yes. But today Linux is considered to be a distro and if any part of that distro is patented then that distro must either drop the use of the portion of its distro or they must pay. It has been said because of these ease of adding code to open source, there is beleive to be alot of patent infringements."
Then MS needs to enumerate those patents, instead of trying to scare the community at large with these deals. And it's very sad that MS has to depend on software patents to fight competition from the Linux world. However, as far as we know, there are no patent violations, and it's MS burden to prove there are any. Without them even delineating a single violation, there's just talking BS.
"I obviously will be getting Vista, as I have it now. 100% Free, thanx to MS (Big Thank You). Being a part of their Beta Test team throught the whole developement of Longhorn, and previously with XP and XP SP2, I was generously given a copy free or charge :)"
Good for you, watch how slow Vista is adopted in corporate America though. Even very large companies are still trying to move to XP (running 2000) so it'll be interesting to see how long it takes them to move to Vista.
"To those of you who think you can pirate Vista... you are dead wrong. Vista is NOT XP and had much more security including the security of its activation and piracy control."
A Beta tester you might be, but you are not highly technical. Vista will be cracked in no time when it's released, you can count on that.
Since using Firefox's Ad-Block extension for the past year or more, I have blacklisted many a ad-site using the all-encompassing asterix.
Until today I have never had to Ad-Block a single image.
Your comments: Does Micro$0ft expect us to believe they have not stolen ideas and code from the Linux community? The Linux community need to file a class action lawsuit against MS for theft as well! We should demand the code for Vista to allow us to see the code that they have stolen.
What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
Linux being free and open source, gives Micro$oft full access to the base code to compare to their closed source software. This gives Micro$oft an unfair advantage in claiming IP theft. As a software developer in the open source community for the past 30 years, I wonder how much of my code [if any] has made its way into Microsoft's code base. I have reported bugs to MS in the past, and once or twice an actual patch. Would not the code I supplied to MS [if they used my patch] be mine?
Also, if MicroSoft uses any open source code in their OS or other products that was taken from the open source community, make the OS or application an open source produce?
I program at home because I enjoy it, and being paid to program at work is that much better. But I keep the code separate. I never use code developed on the job with code in my independent programming efforts and vise versa. For obvious reasons. My contract with my employer also specifies this.
"if MicroSoft uses any open source code in their OS or other products that was taken from the open source community, make the OS or application an open source produce?"
not nessicarily. for instance, the TCP stack in Win95 was based on the BSD tcp stack (and has copyright atributions to BSD as well) but the BSD license allows for commercial dirivitives so no foul there.
Steve Ballmer is ugly because he epitomizes the ugliness of the company (microsoft) and it's take no prisoners approach to market domination. And the fact that he has money doesn't make him better than anyone. It just makes him uglier. I am not a technically astute guy but, I have become passionate about computing and especially internet connectivity. To me, microsoft is what keeps us all back from a better computing experience. Because of their monopoly on the Op. Sys. in the world of PC they hold back the free markets ability to continue delivering innovation.
It is microsoft's intimidation tactics that are anti-free market: the fact that Steve Ballmer and microsoft have a lot of money and can scare people with the army of lawyers their money can buy. But, I think, that. just like the break up of Ma Bell into baby bells, other forces that seek fairness and equity in the markets will force a change that will mean a freer market and the monster that Microsoft is will be chained. And it is the Googles and Yahoos and other forces that are uniting to fight the battle for more innovation and a freer market who will show the way. Personally (it's a Psychological thing=I know microsoft has planned it) everytime I have a problem with my computer (XP operating system) I curse Microsoft. I have quit using Internet explorer (I like mozilla and not because it is better(it probably is better but I could can't articulate technologically speaking why it is) but because it isn't microsoft) except that Microsoft forces me to in order to get updates from it's web site. The list goes on. And, I think there are many other users of Microsofts products that feel the same way. And, someday the big bully that microsoft is will get knocked down. There seems to be some universal rules about getting what you deserve in the end. I would really like it if Linux was available in a open the box and use kind of a way and was supported by all the software that I can get so easily to make my computing enjoyable, effortless for the most part. And, that said, I do credit Microsoft for some of this ease of use. But, I hate monopolies and I know that it could be better. Anyway, just some random thoughts from non-techy me.
Okay, that's a pretty valid example, except that Leopard is built on Darwin, which is based on BSD, not on Linux. According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Unix.svg , Leopard and Linux are related, but neither is descended from the other. Anything more direct? And keep in mind what I'd really like to hear is something that's in Windows that started in Linux, because I don't know of any, while I can probably think of several that are in OSX.
what a whiney bunch of wankers you lot are. You whinge about Microsoft stifling OS development, how they protect their IP, how they make money even how Balmer looks. And it seems only as justification to use pirate copies of their software or should I say steal their software. If any of you had any backbone rather than sitting there pulling on your 2 inch dicks you would not even bother installing Windows or write your own OS (highly unlikely since the only thing you are capable of is whining).
And btw, before commenting on someones looks (which has nothing to do with any argument) take a good long look in the mirror at yourselves, are you the prettiest face around or do you look like a dogs arse with a turd stuck in it ?
Engadget is winding us up. Mr Ugly is an easy pull for chatter and this blog has lately been throwing out transparent invites to fill its pages with squawk.
So add mine, for what it's worth.
Ballmer go back to your tree you chair throwing retard of an ape. Ballmer..the missing link between man and ape. Seriously have you seen this man walk? I swear he would prbably do better swinging threw the trees. For you see he mistook that chair as a tree branch to beat this competition with.
Oh and as an FYI for all of you looking for stock tips. By Microsoft. Ballmer will be introducing fire to the masses next week. If you get close enough to him you can hear him grunt about it right now.
Idiot. I wish he would shut his grunt hole, resign, and let someone with a clue run the company. Or at least someone who doesn't make a complete fool out of himself.
"Now, I despise Microshit as much as the rest of us (and as such, I'll pirate Vista rather than buy it)"
If you really despise them go use another option. I don't think it is so easy to rationalize stealing their product- often they don't originate but they do collect cool technologies and make them ubiquitous...
So go use Linux or a Mac but if you use Vista, pay for it!
They will do their best to make sure you don't get updates if your COA is not legit- can you blame them?
I think whether intellectual rights have been infringed on or not, that tub of lard dosn't need to shout to the world how great he is. That's very tacky, Ballmer - although I'm not sure what else I was expecting...
Yeah, he thinks he's like the singer of 'Bad Manners'. Difference is the latter is cool, Ballmer's not
You guys really don't see what's going on here?
Sun/Java was a turn off for MS (yes, there's a whole ordeal over it and Microsoft basically washed their hands of it, probably because they had no control.)
Microsoft comes out with their own JIT compiler and front end to compete. We call this (dot)NET.
They openly say that .NET is an open standard and reach out for companies to use it. They want you to use it so they can pull the leash in later.
The leverage gaming as their "in". Gamers to them are idiots. Simpletons that will follow them because they have pretty lights.
Thus XNA is born. Windows and XBox only (of course). They continue to tell everyone that DirectX is the ONLY way to go.
Vista ships with a modified OpenGL. Performance of this is under their control now. Competition will soon be crushed.
Linux picks up users on a daily basis, competition get's an "in". Imagine if Mono got to the PS3...wouldn't you think that those "games for windows" could easily be ported to the Playstation? Microsoft would lose their push for total home dominance. I think they saw that and that's why they pulled the string now instead of 3 years from now.
For every XBox360 you buy, you support Microsoft's monopoly and it's dominance in the market. They are leveraging the development community, giving them candy to keep them in the MS team, and your all falling party to it. When Microsoft finally crushes everyone else, your in for a rude awakening.
Call me a conspiratist or what have you, but you CAN NOT trust Microsoft. I seriously hope the 360 fails and the Wii/PS3 prevail again. It will make MS either spend more money trying to take this sector or bail out and cut their losses. I don't see them bailing out. Not until they run everyone else dry.
No, I don't own a 360, and I never will. Don't play Micirosft's game. Literally.
Jesus, ignore my spelling, it's late.
The fact is that the reason Linus distros are becoming more and more popular is because the window managers become more and more like windows/os x, if it wasn't for this then it would just be for the geeks and the paranoid so i'm sure those part infringe on intellectual property.
I do not know how the xbox360 got brought into this by some idiotic logic but if anyone was close to having dominance in video games it is Sony and, while i do own many of their products, they are as unscrupulous as a company can get, forcing out innovative companies like Sega with their marketing force. Nintendo should win this generation for daring to try something different, then xbox for focusing on what gamers need.
Mark said: are you the prettiest face around or do you look like a dogs arse with a turd stuck in it ?
Is that you Ballmer, you disgusting sack of shit? Haven't you heard? Only beautiful people read Engadget. That's why we're making fun of your repulsive, Elephant Man visage.
sounds like microsoft is hungry for money....maybe it has to do with appple taking all their business. thank you apple. microsoft needs to learn business ethics from apple and maybe then they would get the business back...
but microsoft is a bunch of old farts that are losing their way so screw em...and screw em for not coming up with a better OS because windows SUCKS
my2cents:
That guy looks like a typical alpha manager who spews and spews and nothing else ...
C'mon, show us the IP infringement, where is it?
Thank you, Mr. Ballmer, for not getting too much dribble everywhere, you slobbering gargoyle.
@nikster
That's a popular view of the Slashdot crowd, but ask anyone who's actually been involved in filing patents and they'd call you insane for believing that it's easy to get a patent approved. Rather, they'd tell you that the PTO rejects patents for the flimsiest of reasons and you have to go back and forth for months or even years for the faintest glimmer of hope.
If you bother to look into the issue at all, you'll quickly see just how difficult it is to get anything patented.
That man is grotesque.
Wow... a whole bunch of MS haters here. I'll bet everyone who posted those comments posted using Windows, too.
Anyhow, Novell wouldn't have paid up if they hadn't infringed on Microsofts patents.
I don't understand why that is such a big deal. I don't care if you're Microsoft or if your Big Bob's Carpet Outlet... if you infringe on another companies copyright you have to pay up.
@Alexander, MS did not get the idea from Xerox. That would be Apple, which didn't steal the idea but had permission to use it from Xerox. I believe it was some sort of a stock deal but regardless, Apple did not steal the basis of the modern GUI from Xerox. MS copied the basis of their OS from Apple. Don't get me wrong, over the years, MS has added some features that were more evolutionary than revolutionary but has added to the usability of it's OS which Apple has copied. But when it gets down to the nitty gritty, MS copied their OS from Apple.
MS is not a company based on innovation. While I've seen this argument that Apple is a better marketer than a innovator, this is very true in the case of MS. MSDOS was arguably not better than DR DOS and Windows 3.1 and Windows 95 were not better than the Mac OS at the time. Windows XP was largely when things were very equalized as Windows caught up the Mac OS in terms of general functionality and ease of use. There were differences but they're negligeable as is the case now with the current Mac OS and Vista.
As for Novell's payoff to MS, it likely has more to do with other Novell software than Linux. Yes, it's a conspiracy theory but it furthers MS's agenda, which is to crush all other OS's, especially Linux which can easily rise in the next few years to be it's largest competitor. We've seen this with MS's "licensing" of technology from SCO. It wouldn't surprise me if MS could have gotten more from Novell but decided to forgo that pleasure by Novell "licensing" technology from MS that covers it's Linux products. I would really really like them to try the same on Red Hat which is basically a support and service provider in that you can get their product free, but if you want support and help, you need to pay up. They really don't own much in the way of private software like Novell does.
Make no mistake, MS is afraid of Linux and it's actions point to this. One only has to read between the lines. Is Linux there yet? Not by a long shot. It's still aimed at more technically minded folks but I really can see it being "idiot proof" enough in a few years with a popular distro that has most major apps already installed or easily installed in an easy manner that wouldn't confuse Joe Consumer. And that scares MS because they will lose control of the PC OS monopoly they now hold.
To the beta tester who said Vista can't be cracked. BS. You're living in a fairy tale land. Vista _will_ be cracked. The question is the difficulty and practicality. From what I know, Vista has already been cracked before it was officially released but it was some trick using a beta serial number. It will only be a matter of time before they crack Vista.
I'm no bleeding heart MS hater, I own an Xbox and will own an Xbox 360 after the 65nm process shrink (reduced heat). I use Windows XP, at work and at home. I prefer Firefox though to IE though. I actually like WMP, though I do use other media players as well.
Ballmer fucking rules!
The one inovation that has been in Linux(the os as a whole not the kernel) that other os's are copying now? Try multiple desktops.
Stuff that MS will get around to? Try software repositories that you download programs from...except you will have to pay...
I can do the same things with openoffice that people can with ms office. And mine
came from just such a repository. Same thing with Gimp vs Photoshop(not ms).
I don't owe Microsoft crap. They owe me money. I bought a computer and it came with XP.
I wiped the hard drive and used Linux.
I propose a plan. Buy the Xbox360. Buy lots of games. But don't buy(or steal) Vista.
Microsoft is better off as a entertainment company. Because let's face it...Ballmer looks
funny. Funny like a clown...
He's definatly not on Bill's "top 10 best hires" list, or atleast shouldn't be :P
FUKK YOO ballmer
The box said vista OR BETTER, so I installed LINUX!