Ce-Oh no he didnt! Part XXXI - Stringer says if PS3 fails, it'll be due to the high price

The veritable genius of economic theory that he is, Sony CEO Sir Howard Stringer has finally figured out a flaw in his grand scheme of world domination via the PS3: that hefty pricetag. "If we fail, it is because we positioned PS3 sales as the Mercedes of the videogame field," said Stringer. "PS3 is a different audience and it can be whatever it wants – a home server, game device, even a computer." It seems odd that he'd say the PS3 is limited to a different audience and that it can be "whatever it wants" in the same sentence, but who are we to judge? Stringer also praised the Wii as "a wonderful device," and stated that it "has a different target audience" than that of the PS3. Nothing new there, and his statements on the format war were also unsurprising: "We are selling 3-to-1 versus to them," he said. "At some point Blu-ray will take over based on ... this support." Good to see some things just never change.

[Adam @ Mar 21st 2007 12:53PM]

Interesting interpretation of what Sony's CEO said, but ultimately wrong. When he refers to the PS3 as the Mercedes of consoles, he's not talking price. If you think the difference between a Kia and a Mercedes is strictly price, then you've got some problems. No, he intends to stress that the system is more powerful, a higher quality, and more versatile than the other consoles on the market. To this he may be right.

Now, to his second point, these points won't resonate with the entire gaming industry. Again, compare a Kia to a Mercedes, and both budget and personal ranking of what is truly important to the consumer determine which they will go with. I think it's a fair comment on his part, but if that's the case then they can't focus on shear quantity sold as they have in the past. They just need to be concerned about return on investment internally.

Finally, in regards to his comment about Blu-ray... do you think any CEO would admit to defeat until a winner has been chosen? Barring that, do you think his business leaders are really telling him the true story anyway? When you end up that high in a company as large as Sony the information you present to the world is the information presented to you. It's second hand account of third hand accounts. Take it with a grain of salt.

[Ray-- @ Mar 21st 2007 1:08PM]

"When you end up that high in a company as large as Sony the information you present to the world is the information presented to you. It's second hand account of third hand accounts."

you sound like Jeff Skilling's defense attorney.... and we all know how well the ignorant CEO argument went over....

also, I dont think mercendes loses money on each car they sell.. and if ps3 is a mercedes then xBox360 is a lexus... and that is marketed to exactly the same people as the PS3 and yet happens to be selling quite well....

[Long @ Mar 22nd 2007 3:06AM]

Comparing a PS3 to a Mercedes and its competitors as a KIA makes no sense from a business point of view. Each Mercedes sold out the door makes a large amount of profit for the manufacturer and thus they can sell hundred of thousands of their cars and be fine with it. KIA makes a very small profit on their cars, thus they need to sell millions of cars to make a sizable profit.

A PS3 looses money like crazy when it is sold so they need to make money on the games, downloads and such. Sony cannot afford to sell small amounts of units thus they made a mistake by designing a PS3 like a Mercedes and charging prices like a Mercedes when a normal Toyota or Honda could have done the same job.

[franzbonus @ Mar 21st 2007 1:02PM]

Ehh... he didn't really said that "if PS3 fails, it'll be due to the high price"; concluding that is kind of a far stretch of understanding. As far as what Stringer said, I think Engadget just morphed his words to slap a title that's catchy.

Just my 2 cents.

[K @ Mar 21st 2007 1:28PM]

What would Al Gore say???

[Aaron @ Mar 21st 2007 4:58PM]

K @ Mar 21st 2007 1:28PM
What would Al Gore say???


"How is this PlayStation thing going to help us kill Manbearpig?? Come on guys, I'm serial!"

[mathew @ Mar 21st 2007 1:32PM]

I think the PS3 is more the Hummer of consoles.

[BatteryAcid @ Mar 21st 2007 4:30PM]

No the Xbox 360 is the Hummer; large, somewhat powerful, and rugged.

[Jason @ Mar 21st 2007 1:40PM]

The big problem with the development of the PS3 was that they started off the design process by saying "here are some really cool new technologies... what can we build with them"... instead of doing what MS has done with the 360... they said "Lets build a great GAMING CONSOLE... what do we need to put in here to do that" and after the fact have added/upgraded it to allow for other things that the users want... Sony is trying to sell something that people don't understand yet... sure the tech heads know the advantages of the stuff but the normal consumer doesn't. They just see the 360 at $400 and the PS3 at $600 and see all the games out for the 360 and see the fact that the games that are on both systems look at least as good on the 360 as they do on the PS3 and sometimes better and opt for the cheaper of the 2 systems... the guy at BestBuy isn't going to be able to explain to the average console buyer why that PS3 is really worth the $200 more AS A GAME CONSOLE... and lets face it... thats what people are buying the Wii and 360 for.

[Veritas II @ Mar 21st 2007 3:07PM]

Do cite a source that even begins to verify your nonsense. Please. MS wants revenue from accessories and Live, which is why they won't integrate wifi, or give Guitar Hero fans a wireless guitar, or allow for single-player only games (with no Live component - hence the lack of decent RPG's). Sony is still working off of the old model - sell the console at a loss and make money back on games. Has everything to do with business, and nothing to do with pithy cliches.

Stringer's upset at Kutaragi. That's what this quote is all about. It's a backhanded insult aimed at Kutaragi for going over budget without permission. If the PS3 fails, then Stringer has made comments to distance himself from the problem. He's just hedging his bets.

[Ray @ Mar 21st 2007 1:41PM]

Or to be more accurate... "We can get people to take 3 free blueray discs for every HD-DVD disc they buy."

[Kev50027 @ Mar 21st 2007 4:12PM]

You're wrong here, the HD-DVD camp has been giving out free movies too. Also, I don't believe these free giveaways were considered when the tallied results were drawn up. Maybe they were in this case, but in any case, Blu-Ray is far more popular than HD-DVD, that's an obvious fact.

[bl0nde @ Mar 21st 2007 1:53PM]

In Europe at least, it's almost a certainty that Blu-ray will win, and purely because of the Playstation 3. Why? HD disc players here are extortionately expensive (the cheapest HDDVD player from Toshiba is selling for £450 and Samsungs first Blu ray machine was ~£700 when it came out), and thus form a miniscule fraction of all players sold. Once the PS3 is out, it'll put about a million Blu ray players out there almost overnight, which will be almost a million more than the number of HD DVD units that have been purchased. I'm not entirely for or against either format, this is just my own opinion...

[andy @ Mar 21st 2007 2:33PM]

@blonde

Don't be too shocked when TOshiba drops the price on their HDDVD players to below the PS3 just before the PS3 launch. They haven't had a reason to drop prices there yet, so why would they?

[John Branca @ Mar 21st 2007 1:58PM]

Honestly Engadget, I know you're affiliated with Jostiq but do you really have to share their complete anti-PS3 bias as well? It's getting really old.

[Jason @ Mar 21st 2007 2:07PM]

Yeah but we are not talking about a "Blu-Ray" player with the PS3... just because there are a million devices out there that will play a Blu-Ray disc doesn't mean that people are going to run out and spend $30 per movie for the discs... It actually makes it that much harder to determine the strength of the Blu-Ray market. You can't just count the PS3 as a normal player... people buy normal players to watch movies on and you can pretty much bet that anyone who buys an actual player will be buying a few Blu-Ray movies... the same can't be said for the PS3... the people who will be in line to get one most likely are hardcore games who may never buy a Blu-Ray movie.

The HD-DVD drive for the 360 gives you a better picture of the number of HD-DVD players out there... since it is an addon that only plays movies you can bet that if someone buys one they are going to buy some movies too. The PS3 is just clouding the issue...

But either way... forget the cost of the players... there just isn't a big enough difference right now to the average viewer to run out and spend twice as much on the discs... the discs prices are whats killing the market for the HD media right now.

And if they want either format to stick they better get moving... e-distribution is getting more and more popular everyday and if they are not careful the whole exercise of and HD movie disc format is going to fall by the way side.

[Stan @ Mar 21st 2007 2:48PM]

Actually PS3 is considered one of the best Blu-ray players out there, just check out the AVS forums. PS3 is the major factor that has been driving blu-ray sales. So your statement: "You can't just count the PS3 as a normal player" is really not accurate as a lot of people use PS3 as a normal blu-ray player for now because of its price and quality.

[apeguero @ Mar 21st 2007 2:09PM]

The question I have about all of this is why are Blueray players so expensive if PS3s are $600.00 and offer much more? This is why I really see a PS3 as -- I can't believe I'm actually saying this Engadget so please don't let Sony see this -- a good deal.

[kaztm @ Mar 21st 2007 2:26PM]

apeguero
"The question I have about all of this is why are Blueray players so expensive if PS3s are $600.00 and offer much more?"

Because Sony is taking loss on the PS3 hardware it sells.

In that sense, all hardcore Sony haters should go buy PS3...

[Jr. @ Mar 21st 2007 2:16PM]

It's not "if we lose" it's "we've pretty much resigned to having lost."

Game over, unless Sony cuts $200 off the price very soon.

[dagamer34 @ Mar 21st 2007 2:19PM]

Only one problem: Mercedes and Lexus don't sell a lot of cars. And in this business, if you're console doesn't sell, I don't care how good it is, it will eventually go down the toilet from lack of exclusive games.

Say... what this news about Devil May Cry on the Xbox 360.... :P

[kingofwale @ Mar 21st 2007 2:29PM]

I think the PS3 is doing poorly is because... people don't get it.

consumer don't get it because of the price.
gaming communities don't get it because there's no game yet
game developers JUST PLAIN DON'T GET IT.

with tons of game delays, I'm not going to blame Sony for it, I bet they are more worried about it than anybody here. but it does show that developers are taking A LOT more time figuring out this console.

now, Let's say they finally figure it out, we will see the potential in say... 1 year from now. Let's hope Sony lowers its price by 100 dollars. Then it will make it very hard to beat.


Also, I worry for Wii.. lack of third party support and the 'undefine' demographics... now, I know a few people who got Wii are just not gamer... are they going to go out and get the latest Wii games when they come out???

Well, let's hope they do, for Wii's sake

[Kev50027 @ Mar 21st 2007 4:16PM]

Who would want to spend still more than 300 for just a damn DVD player when they could get a PS3 that plays games AND high def. content?

It's just stupid to throw down 500 for something that only plays videos and nothing else, that's a total waste of money. The PS3 can do so much more that it's well worth it's price, and infact worth more.

[andy @ Mar 21st 2007 2:36PM]

"what would Al Gore say?"

It's Bush's fault.

[tleblanc4 @ Mar 21st 2007 2:40PM]

The PS3 has already failed!

[Rick Lyon @ Mar 21st 2007 5:30PM]

Sure it is. The Samsung sucks, the Sony was delayed and is over $1000 like the Panasonic and the Pioneer require a second home mortgage to purchase. Whereas the PS3 is $600. Easy to see why it's so popular among the early adapters at AVS. BUT, now they we've all bought our PS3s, NO ONE is buying anymore PS3s, and no one is buying the stand alone BRD players. So, for Sony to claim victory is not only ludicrous, it's downright insulting to think we would blindly believe it just because they claim it. Toshiba is dropping their prices, game shortly to be decided.

[Dantexfactorhall @ Mar 21st 2007 6:04PM]

Well If its one of the best blueray players out there its pretty sad!! It doesnt up convert anything on a regular dvd. and when you buy a blu ray movie its like buying a disc thats half full or half empty?? Because they are only using about 25 gigs any way there is no use right now for all 50 gigs its a wast so when hd snaggs the rest of the market then they can release their 51 gb disc.

-Amen

[Storm9 @ Mar 21st 2007 2:52PM]

I'd say 360 is the Acura of consoles. Wii is the Mini Cooper.

Why Acura? They arent as good as BMW, Lexus, Benz. But Acura still sells a lot of cars.
And they use FWD, not RWD.
(FWD vs RWD) Samething as (HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray).
Soon the industry will like Blu-Ray due the better specs and better movie titles.

Just like RWD is better because of handling.

[Jr. @ Mar 21st 2007 9:29PM]

Not every Lexus is RWD...Not every Mercedes is RWD. Not every Acura is FWD.

As for RWD being better for "handling"? Uh...no. Drifting, sure. Sliding, sure. But "handling" is not dependent upon simply the wheels that spin.

And regular old DVDs aren't going away anytime soon.

[Jason @ Mar 21st 2007 3:00PM]

The problem is that SONY doesn't get it... without a decent attach rate the PS3 will fail... PERIOD... they have already lost a couple of the big exclusives and with the 360 having more than 10 million users already who in the world is going to be jumping up and down to write games exclusivly for the PS3???? the game companies would go out of business if they did that... Why does everything think that God of War II is the biggest thing in the Sony world right now? I am surprised game companies are not making more games for the older consoles.

[andy @ Mar 21st 2007 3:13PM]

@Jason

"not making games for older consoles"


And on that note, I'm still waiting for the online multiplayer version of Goldeneye for xbox and 360. I think they'd sell more than a couple copies of that.

I don't understand why we don't see more ports of the most popular games to the newer consoles, like with Conker's Bad Fur Day (also a Rareware game).

[Sam @ Mar 21st 2007 3:06PM]

I like how he also said that they could have beaten the iPod but they couldn't get the software up to snuff. Hasn't this always been Sony's problem - craptastic software? What does it take? Fire everyone and hire a new team who doesn't suck so bad.

[jason @ Mar 21st 2007 3:29PM]

different audience or not everyone still groups them all together in the console wars

[Thomas @ Mar 21st 2007 3:29PM]

DROP THE PRICE!!!!!!!

[apeguero @ Mar 21st 2007 3:48PM]

Stan and Kaztm:

So Sony is losing in both ends then. They're losing money for each PS3 sold (I knew this already but thanks anyways Kaztm). They're also losing money on regular Blue Ray players since the PS3 is taking market share from regular Blue Ray players? This I didn't know. Looks like Sony's got a pretty rough ride going then. Maybe their plan was the Gillette Razor plan which was to make money from the games, $59.99 per, ouch! That apparently isn't helping either on that end due to the lack of games. Oh well Sony. I'm sure you'll figure something out.

[Jr. @ Mar 21st 2007 9:29PM]

Hate to break it to you, but your comment that "Blu-Ray is far more popular than HD-DVD, that's an obvious fact" is nothing more than opinion. DVD is far more popular than either of the two new HD formats.

Even if Sony manages to sell 10 million PS3s as Blu-Ray players (main use), it does nothing for them but cost them money. Most folks aren't jumping on the HD disc bandwagon, because upscaled, progressive scan DVDs look good enough to them - just as VHS was "good enough" for many years.

The PS3 is supposed to be a home entertainment system, with video games as it's primary use. There are no games...woohoo...PS3 has lost, even before the next-gen war gets started.

Sony is selling more PS2s than PS3s...why? Because even with the HD disc capability, no one really cares. It's about gaming...and PS2, Wii and Xbox 360 do that quite well.

[Kev50027 @ Mar 21st 2007 11:08PM]

It's a fact. More Blu-Ray discs have been sold (for money, not including the free ones) than HD-DVD. Thare are more Blu-Ray players out there, and there are more studios supporting Blu-Ray than HD-DVD. In fact, every studio except one supports Blu-Ray.

From these statistics (which are all facts) alone, Blu-Ray is the clear, and obvious winner.

Also, your idiotic comment about the lack of games for the PS3 is so blind sighted that it makes me sick. THE PS3 IS NEW! There were even fewer games at this time for the Xbox 360 last year, so as far as I'm concerned, the PS3 is winning in these concerns. Also, there are many games planned for the PS3 that haven't been released yet.

How the hell are you going to predict the future of a console after just a couple months of being out? You can't.

The PS3 is a great console, the 360 is old, and it has a couple games that are well rated, but I have high hopes for the PS3.

[Andir3.0 @ Mar 21st 2007 5:25PM]

"No the Xbox 360 is the Hummer; large, somewhat powerful, and rugged."

Don't forget mechanically not ready for off road, loud, and always has red lights cause it's stuck in traffic. Are you thinking of the Humvee? Empty on the inside, but you can whack it a good on to get it going again.

[everrette powell @ Mar 21st 2007 5:05PM]

how comes when sony is getting wooped, there products all of a sudden becomes something for a different audience? i think the psp is now in that catagory and both are losing for teh same reason "price tag"

[yoni @ Mar 21st 2007 6:46PM]

sony haters/360 fanboys -your home resides in this thread.

[parrotthead111 @ Mar 21st 2007 8:47PM]

right now my ps3 is just a big paper weight, but there isnt that much difference in price when you factor in the price of the wireless adapter and 12 months on xbox live ... as far as blue ray I cant tell the difference, my regular dvds look so good on my tv no way am I upgrading my dvd collection to blue ray or dh dvd

[Jon @ Mar 21st 2007 11:36PM]

You keep on hoping on that PS3. Cracks me up to see you post this information again as more and more studios are leaving their exclusive contracts with Sony and it seems that the 360 doesn't have that problem. And from the consumer's point-of-view, they only stay with PS for those exclusive games. More and more consumers say they would rather have the 360 instead of the PS3.

The Wii is a better game console that the PS3 and the numbers prove it. All Sony has going for it is the PS2 which is sad the only thing holding them afloat is old game system albeit that it is a great game console. Drop the big ball on the PS3.

As another comment poster on here stated, "Sony looked at this console the wrong way. They said, 'Look at all this brand new and high end technology. Let's put it all in a box. Now how can we make this a game console?' Where Microsoft was, 'Let's make a badass game console. Now how can we add the new technology or make it accessible in the near future and STILL KEEP THE PRICE REASONABLE!'"

[Kev50027 @ Mar 22nd 2007 12:54AM]

Once again, you're just telling my your opinion, while I'm giving you facts that Blu-Ray is winning, and the PS3 is selling well. You can keep making judgements based on false/skewed information, but don't post it online, it makes you look really, really stupid and fanboyish.

[Jon @ Mar 22nd 2007 7:29AM]

It's 'fanboyish' if I stick to one console. I already stated that I like the PS2 and the Wii but that must be the lack of knowledge provided by your country (and apparently English as well.) Let's take a look at some of the facts you choose to avoid:
1. The major game production companies (Capcom, ID, Activision, etc.) are having problems programming for the Blu-Ray format. That comes straight from the companies.
2. Having hands of a 10 year old pre-pubescent girl will cause you to perceive the Xbox 360 controller larger than it seems.
3. Blu-Ray got it's count up so high by giving away free Blu-Ray. Not necessarily counting the free ones but as a marketing plow to produce false results, the have to give away disks just to get more movement.
4. Sony doesn't see any improvement on the PS3 until 2008 while Microsoft saw improvement well within a year and were able to bring costs down.

This could go on and on. The facts are there but you seem to be ignoring the other facts that pertain to some of the stats you are trying to throw out.

[Jr. @ Mar 22nd 2007 8:39AM]

No, the numbers don't indicate either format as a "winner".

The PS3 is selling well...mmmkay! It's currently in what, fourth place, behind the Xbox360, Wii, and the PS2. Wow, I'm sure that's exactly what Sony had in mind...when the PS3 can't even sell more units than the PS2.

The PS3's niche was that it offered exclusive titles...now, unless they're Sony-developed, it's likely to have no exclusives.

The Xbox 360 did have a year head start...and demand remained high. The PS3...most of the early adopters were simply hoping for a large profit via eBay. Something that didn't hold up. PS3s were available for purchase in the days leading up to Christmas...sitting on store shelves. So not only was the initial demand for the PS3 less than high...it hasn't managed to give anyone any reason to purchase it...no games, no nothing.

When a PS2 title (God of War 2) is seen as the "must have" game for PS3 owners...you know it's bad.

If Sony can't get some serious games out...and gut $200 from the PS3 price...it's over. No one cares about Blu-Ray...no one cares about the PS3's "8-core cell processor" you realize the Cell is just a modified IBM Power chip, just like the one in the Xbox 360, don't you?

And at the end of the day, no one cares about the PS3.

[Kev50027 @ Mar 22nd 2007 1:28PM]

You people are all idiots. You are so ignorant of plain facts and lacking of any debating skills whatsoever. Jon makes fun of me because I typed "my" instead of "me", and Jr. obviously has his facts all effed up.

The PS2 is still selling well because it has the best games of any console out there. Look at game reviews for the PS2 on Gamespot.com, there are so many games rated 9 or above that they can't even fit them all on one page, and it's the only console to ever get a game rated 10.0 on that site.

You simply can't compare a nearly 10 year old console to one that is 4 months old. You must be so confused and out of touch with reality to do so. I suggest thinking before posting on here, Jon and Jr.

[Jon @ Mar 21st 2007 11:40PM]

Sony just goes into everything without a second, intelligent, thought. Such as a console priced at $600 USD going against $400 and thinking that it will do well. The advertisement for the PSP with the white model chocking the black model. Someone in their department of advertisement must have known that was a bad idea and just had a laugh. Beta anybody?

Sony, I'll admit that you do have some good ideas but the bad ideas are hard to ignore.

[jason @ Mar 21st 2007 11:45PM]

The PS3 is a great console, the 360 is old, and it has a couple games that are well rated, but I have high hopes for the PS3.

I find this all very, very amusing. The PS2 had a head start on the Xbox and went on to kick it's ass along with having a slew of exclusive titles. We are currently seeing an opposite trend happning this generation. The 360 beat Sony to market, has already put out a console selling exclusive title (Gears of War), is about to put out another hugely popular console selling title (Halo 3) and rather than sony getting exclusive titles (GTA4, Devil May Cry, etc.) they are sharing time with the 360. Nothing is certain, but MS has a huge headstart, is making money on it's console already, and is piling up the titles.

[DMAN @ Mar 22nd 2007 12:35AM]

Didn't it fail because it's friggin hard for developers to program?

When you got 4 of the most powerful game developing companies such as ID and Capcom complaining about writing games for the PS3, you think it's still because PS3 cost is too high and that's the major issue? Sure, cost is problem, but it's not as big as a problem as developers making quality games for the system. So far, the only good game on the PS3 is like Madden, and that's for all 3 consoles, and the Xbox 360 version offers superior graphics and Wii has the more fun control. With Wii winning the motion sensitive arena, and Xbox 360 winning on the graphics, who needs a PS3.

Go to Gamespot and 1up for the Madden comparison between the consoles. It's hilarious if you own a PS3 for the games. Sure it's the cheapest blu-ray player, that's about it.

[darkstar @ Mar 22nd 2007 10:00AM]

i agree. the ps3 is too new. when xbox 360 came out, the games were scant. xbox 360 got a 1 year headstart, thats all.
for 500 bux, the ps3 is so worth it with that 8 cores processor!!! quad core is like 1000 bux already! but too bad, i dont know how to take advantage of linux with that 8 cores chip :(