Zune 2 bits and pieces, plus an in-depth interface video
By Joshua Topolsky 
posted October 3rd 2007 6:02PM
posted October 3rd 2007 6:02PM
- The new players will support lossless audio of the Windows Media variety (don't go screaming FLAC just yet)
- The WiFi is just b/g, so no n, a or x (the sexiest form of WiFi)
- Microsoft is still in the testing phase for battery life and will have numbers "later"
- You can manually sync up the player wirelessly on battery power, but you can't do auto-sync -- you'll need the dock for that action
- All your old accessories are said to work with the new models
- The screens are glass, not plastic
- Green is the new brown... but brown is sticking around on the 30GB models
- You can connect the Zune to an Xbox 360 to create "your own soundtrack"
I was thinking of buying this until I heard that it wasn't Mac compatible. I know most Mac owners won't be buying this, but still MS should've made the software for Mac.
It never ceases to frustrate me when folks who buy Macs put the onerous of incompatibility of products on everyone else but Apple. It is Apple that has created a very tightly closed ecosystem that discourages 3rd party developers of software and hardware. You have no one to blame but Apple and yourself for buying into an extremely closed ecosystem.
No matter how much better Apple software or hardware may or may not be...I believe this is the number one reason why Macs are not more widely adopted beyond the 3 or 4% overall computer market share. Do you really think Apple wants anyone else to make their music player and software compatible with Apple? And even if so do you think Apple Zealots would give it a fare shake? It would be a collosal waste of time for MS or any other company to even think about doing such a thing.
Welcome to the "Walled Garden"
@ bobo:
That's why I'll be using Parallels for my new Zune!
What are you talking about Bobo? Apple has provide free developer tools for Mac OS X since its inception. How is that discouraging development of software? I also don't see how they are discouraging hardware development either.
Wait A Minute? You're telling me Zune's dont have gapless playback?! Thats the deal breaker here!!!
I hope us old Zune owners get an update for the new WiFi features when this is released. I don't doubt that we will, but it would totally suck if we don't...
wow i find it funny how *fanboys* rank high all the pro comments and low ball all the apple/negative/opinionated comments.
Pathetic
What are you guys in High School? Oh wait, my bad. You are.
The Zune might be good- ugly "touch wheel" IMHO, but then I will never know because I do use macs and, well, it is not comaptabile with my machines. lame.
I think it has more to do with the tone of the comments than the content of them. Most of the low ranking comments seem to be written by people who apparently are unable to communicate and hold discourse in anything resembling a reasonable manner. Rather, they make posts that contain little meaningful content, often aren't horribly in touch with reality, and do so in an intentionally inflammatory way.
I will leave drawing a conclusion as to why those very same posts also seem to be fervently pro-Apple, anti-MS up to each reader. At the same time, I don't think you are going to see any post along the lines of "Steve Jobs is teh suck, Apple products have been utter crap since the first Macintrash, everyone who uses those products is going to get aids, and Zune is going to utterly destroy apple" rated any higher than the multitude of immature anti-Zune comments.
There are several comments highly rated that don't have a great deal of substance, but are conveyed in a reasonable tone. I think they have been rated as such because the majority of the engadget readership have become so tired of the utter crap comments that they now just rate everything conveyed politely high, in the hopes that rewarding such comments will encourage them. That is just a hypothesis on my part, and in an ideal world such comments would be the norm rather then the exception, leaving the comment grading to solely reward comments that are above and beyond the norm in terms of useful content.
As an aside, if you look at any thread, whether they be for products by the big names or the small, those posting criticism largely can't do so politely. It doesn't really matter what people are posting negatively about, most just can't post a critical comment without being inflammatory and I think that reflects porely on our demographic. It is, in fact, possible to be critical of something without being a complete ass, and I think more of the engadget readership as a whole should try it. It isn't hard to reread a comment prior to posting and ask whether a similar comment directed at a product you happen to like would piss you off, and make changes to your tone if you feel it would.
It's exactly the kind of product you would expect from Microsoft.
classic. apple fanboys go boof your ipods
All the accessories I have work with the new one? Hell ya!
The software on the zune1 can be upgraded to zune2? Hell ya! Zune1 has RESALE VALUE, baby!
Glass screen? Wifi sync? Smaller size with increased screen real estate? Sign me up.
I'm going to be ebaying my brownie for that green zune2... it looks great.
zomg, like, yea, totally.
M$ posers!
I'm quite interested in the usability, not of the GUI but the layout of the buttons... I don't know if this is true as I've not used a Zune, but it looks like you have two use two hands to operate it safely and comfortably (one to hold)?
The navigation pad doesn't seem to be in helpful position for one handed use, obviously to allow for the huge screen?
It's great to see Microsoft improving their products, and the Zune 2 is looking like a real player in the market now (excuse the pun).
However, I can't understand why people are raving about the interface....to me it looks like it still needs a lot of refining, it just doesn't look elegant at all. Those large letters in the main menu? Awful, ugly (to me). The submenus look dull and uninteresting....function over style, very Microsoft. And did you notice how the user in the video tried to select Pictures twice, but accidently selected the option above and below it, as the cursor over shot the mark? Hmmm....
And perhaps it is just the video, but the screen looks like it has a slight blue cast to it and poor contrast...colours don't appear to be that well defined.
I am not saying the iPod is totally superior, but it's interface is certainly more elegant and attractive.
I would reserve judgement until I used one myself, but as I am a European based Mac user, the Zune is not an option for me.
I do hope the Zune is a success, for if nothing else it will mean that Apple will keep improving the iPod more and more, and that can only be a good thing!
Microsoft isn't letting 3rd parties develop software for the Zune.
Uh, it is a media player... it's job isn't to run applications. MS doesn't seem to be writing any non-media related software for the device either, so it isn't like they are taking advantage of the platform while locking others out. Toshiba doesn't let me write software for their HD DVD players and I am not overly pissed about that; why should I be that MS isn't letting third party applications on their non-general purpose media device?
If they had games available for it, that I could buy off of the Zune store, and they were locking out others, then I would think they were behaving too controlling, but they seem pretty insistant that this is a media device only.
@Josh:
Wait....writing apps and locking out any attempt at 3rd party development? That sounds like Apple!!!
(Note: I've been a six-color-bleeding Mac Cultist for a long time, but Apple's recent Microsoft-like customer relations have prompted me to question my loyalty. I have an iPhone, still running 1.0.2, chock full of my 3rd party apps and mods, but my next PMP may well be a Zune.)
I'm holding out for Zune v3.0. I have a feeling thats when things will really, really get interesting.
Why the Zune will remain a distant second for the near term:
Simple, 100 million iPods and 3 billion songs downloaded. The simple fact is millions of people now have a library of DRM protected content that doesn't port (easily) to other platforms. I own an iPod and I would consider buying a Zune except that I would have to sacrifice my library to switch devices. I have about 250 iTune DRM protected songs so purchasing a Zune costa me the price of a Zune + $250 (if I want to play my songs on Zune).
That's the dilemma faced by many consumers - DRM limits your product choice. You have to get rid of Zune or any other MP3 play to seize substantial marketshare from Apple. Incremental tweaks and features to the player won't be enough to make a large number of people switch. It is simple economics.
That should read 'Get rid of DRM... instead of 'Get rid of Zune....
Strip the DRM. There are numerous programs available to do that. You're not losing anything that way, and it's (probably) not even illegal.
Stripping DRM is possible but doing so has questionable legality. I think the current court opinion is that removing DRM is illegal.
Even ignoring the legal aspect, many people simply wouldn't bother to go through that process to gain incremental improvements from the device. To gain traction Zune must offer a compelling reason to motivate user to switch. So far, I don't see any of the features offered capable to compelling a massive adoption of Zune.
I've been reading reviews across the net about these things, and aside from the comments section of sites like Engadget, where MS & Zune fan sites can sent their minions to to heap praise upon the device, and give it positive ratings & reviews, and making up nightmare iPod stories. All while low ranking anyone who dares say negative things, or pro Apple things (most desperate market stratergy by Microsoft) But the Zune reviews in the tech world aren't faring so well.
A few actual headlines (Google them) to low rank me for:
"Microsoft's Revamped Zune Still No Match For Apple iPod"
"Zune throws weak punch at iPod"
"Sorry, Mr Gates, but they still won't be playing your Zune"
PC Magazine: "Analysis: Zune Improvements Aren't Quite Enough"
"New Zunes better but still not iPod killers"
"...
Microsoft (MSFT) to launch new Zune -- is anyone listening?"
"Are You Going To The Zune Social? Me Neither."
"Zune 2 shivers in iPod's shadow"
"Touch-sensitive Zune 2 Debuts, but Is No Match for the iPod"
"Zunes not likely to get iPod fans to change their tunes"
"Too little, too late for Zune in '07"
Wow! Some of those are harsh! I would have never guessed it by what the sampling of people here are saying. Hmmm, I wonder why?
Realize people, this device you are trying so hard love & promote has the Microsoft taint all over it, and that is something that just doesn't wash off.
I'm waiting for bigass files to transfer here at work, so I have some time.
Your first article says that the Zune hasn't caught up all while mentioning all the features the Zune has added. It fails to say why this isn't enough to compete aside from the iPod's already huge installed base. I might mention here that installed base is not and cannot be a feature of a standalone PMP. Basically, it's an appeal to popularity, which is also a logical fallacy. Popularity is irrelevant to quality.
The second one was written by David Zeller, who, and I quote from the byline, "follows all developments related to Apple, Inc. Having spent his early computing years on the Apple II platform, he moved to the Mac in 1993. At the Sun he designs pages, compelled against his will to work on a Windows-based PC." Need I say more?
The third one says that the Zune isn't innovative, but Apple's iPods are. Because at least the premise itself that iPods are innovative isn't true (and this is demonstrable, aside from maybe the deal with Starbucks), this argument falls apart. Plus they printed the article twice on the same page. I mean, WTF?
The next article (Zune improvements aren't quite enough) also doesn't say why. In fact, the only place that you can read such a negative remark in the entire article is the headline. The conclusion they draw is rather different. In fact, it's not even a review!
"New Zunes better but still not iPod killers" doesn't say that Zunes are worse, but that MS will have to blow everyone away in order to get people to notice what they're doing, and in that respect they're right. That's just the reality of dealing with the iPod market share. And what's with their auto-linking Apple every time someone types the word? But nothing for Microsoft?
"Microsoft (MSFT) to launch new Zune -- is anyone listening?" comes to no conclusion whatsoever.
You know what, I said I had time, but this is stupid. Did you actually read the articles or just glance at headlines and think you knew the whole story? Jesus H. Christ!
I'm not even going to bother with your post. I don't trust anyone who creates a name to comment under just to post something like this.
"I'm not even going to bother with your post."
the word for today is;
Contradiction
Not reading it thoroughly, not looking up his review quotes and checking the accuracy like he suggested, and then not responding with any sort of thought out reply is what I consider not bothering with someones post. Sorry to make you have to type, make a fake name, and come up with a word of the day to bother with mine.
How's that 'not bothering with my post' working out for ya?
I have the original Zune, but if they make a brown version of 2.0 I guess I will have to own both. Im a sucker, and if I see a lonely brown Zune2 on a shelf somewhere, Im going to buy it. Its that simple.
Competition is good.
You can't tell how thick/thin this device is from the video or any of the pics. Hopefully it's a lot thinner than the old zune.
Let me preface this comment by saying that I'm one of the many currently disgruntled Mac Cultists.
That said:
I own an iPhone, and I'm pretty pissed about 1.1.1.
I own and iPod that's now 3 versions out of date.
If Apple continues to take the Microsoft-like approach to customer service that they seem to be trending towards, I might as well buy a device directly from the evil empire, huh? Every PMP on the market seems to be an iPod ripoff; this is just a really good one. Not to mention that now it has all of the features that the iPod does, and some it doesn't.
I was planning on getting a new iPod Classic for my deployment in iRaq (sorry, couldn't help the spelling pun) but I may just get an 80GB Zune.
All of this said, I still don't think I'm willing to forsake my Mac just yet.
If iSaw a zune user in public, i'D point and laff my ass off. have yet to see one, tho. oh, and great comments redmond employees! your product blows chunks (and comes in colors to match the chunks), but your paid viral comment planting abilities are unparalleled!
Can we start requiring an IQ test to post here? Seriously?
I would love to run across you in public while sporting my wifes Zune. Right now its white, but I would really prefer it to be a more natural color like brown. I think I could find a way you could help me out in this regard. There would definitely be some pointing and laughing, just not sure it would be for the reason you expected.
Obviously I'm playing with you here, but unless by "public" you me your school playground, you should really join us back in the real world where publicly pointing and laughing at someone doesn't go as smoothly as you seem to think.
By the way, if you speak anything like you type I suppose you are used to a little pointing and laughing and are just the angry sort.
Would anyone happen to know if it would loose and functionality in the uk and how well the radio (RDS)would function? Cheers
lmw - supposedly the measurements are: 4.3x2.4x0.51, nice and thin.
I just hope they support other languages this time around. I am sick of the little boxes where the chinese characters are supposed to be!!!
What? The screen orientation doesn't change when you tilt it? That is SO 2005!
Everyone who's comparing this to the iPod touch and iPhone should realize Microsoft is still working on a new version of Windows Mobile which is supposed to compete. According to some hints on Engadet its supposed to be interesting.
I would rather get one of these...
http://hideapod.com/
Awesome player!
I am getting one ASAP.
Great job MS.
fucking Divx and Xvid? If it plays that i'll get the new zune right away
Im loving the fact that when Microsoft's Surface computer comes out (www.surface.com), its going to pair up with the zune and will allow transfer of Pictures, Movies, Videos, and now pad casts, on and OFF the zune to ANY other compatible device such as a PDA or a Notebook... this is some great shit here... cant wait! :D Check out the Zune pairing up with the Surface Computer, its the third video on www.surface.com.
The only thing that throws me is that the screen is GLASS and not plastic. One drop and there goes the screen :S .... I'll probably pick one of these bad boys up during X-MAS maybe a bundle deal will be available.
"Introducing... the new
WinPod!
4gb, 8gb, and 80gb
there sooo creative!"
Hehe said the apple fanboy, Apple design is dead, Always the same? How creative is that? I thing the Zune is cute and ctualy a new design pmp from MS, Apple iPhone/iPod touch = The same? And look at the other ipods, always thesame :) And how nice are apple to theris customers whit uppgrading the firmware? noo Older apples at history fo them! :) No, im not a MS fanboy, I actualy like creative the most!
/Sluggis
well... sure looks kinda like an ipod... but seriously, who really cares who copied who? as long as we get a helluva good music/video player, who cares?
though, it does kinda minic the ipod cuz it does have a touch screen... microsoft should just start coming up with more innovative products, completely different from apple.
apple has been doing great these last few years, but microsoft has lotta pontential, but insists on trying to keep up with apple instead of planning ahead for the long run, and making a huge leap, like apple kinda did...
micrisoft doesnt have to play catch up. they noticed that mp3/mp4 players were big and made one and made it better than the ipod. they had wifi in the zune way before apple did in ipod or iphone. all they did is write firmware to use it to sync. anyone that talks bad a bout zune is a dumb ass and i bet if you held one for a minute you would love it i did and i just wanted to wait for a bigger harddrive and wireless sync because i knew they would make it so im getting the 80gb. and i have 4 ipods and i hate em really all have crapped on me and dont have many features and itunes sucks.
"iTunes started life as an app called SoundJam, which Apple bought. And the iPod hardware was designed by PortalPlayer, before Apple adopted it and put their UI on it."
Comment by Michael Portuesi