Zune vs. iPod specification smackdown
By Thomas Ricker 
posted October 3rd 2007 7:22AM
posted October 3rd 2007 7:22AM
The new Zunes are official so let's get to it: a spec-by-spec scrap between Redmond's new Zunes and Cupertino's formidable iPod foe. Unfortunately, Microsoft failed to mention the all important battery performance of their new gear in addition to a few other minor details. Microsoft fans will tell you that's due to an iPhone-like surprise close to the November launch while haters will jump to the conclusion that this is a definite sign of trouble. Still even without that morsel, there's plenty of data to masticate for comparison.
The Zune 80GB certainly holds its own when pitted against the 80GB iPod classic on a specification table. That's not the case, however, with the iPod touch as long as you're willing to sacrifice the bytes for the touch's bigger display and heftier price tag. It's a tougher call on the flash-based Zune vs. the iPod nano -- just how important is WiFi to you on a 1.8-inch display? None of this, of course, accounts for the oh so important user experience or the ecosystems supporting their respective players. As such, we'll reserve final judgment until we have the new Zunes in-hand. Until then you'd best dig in fanboys, that November release is a long way off. The tables that follow will provide the fuel to fight the flame wars in the weeks to come.
Update: Battery data updated with information found on Amazon.com.
The Zune 80GB certainly holds its own when pitted against the 80GB iPod classic on a specification table. That's not the case, however, with the iPod touch as long as you're willing to sacrifice the bytes for the touch's bigger display and heftier price tag. It's a tougher call on the flash-based Zune vs. the iPod nano -- just how important is WiFi to you on a 1.8-inch display? None of this, of course, accounts for the oh so important user experience or the ecosystems supporting their respective players. As such, we'll reserve final judgment until we have the new Zunes in-hand. Until then you'd best dig in fanboys, that November release is a long way off. The tables that follow will provide the fuel to fight the flame wars in the weeks to come.
Update: Battery data updated with information found on Amazon.com.
The Zune 80 with its big 3.2-inch display fits right in between Apple's iPod classic and iPod touch models. As such, we'll give you all three in a side-by-side comparison. Since Microsoft is a bit light on the specs, we've plugged in the information we reasonably expect to carry over from the 1st generation Zune -- otherwise, it's To Be Determined:
| Feature | Zune 80GB |
iPod classic 80GB
| iPod touch 8GB |
|---|---|---|---|
| Price |
$249.99 |
$249.00 |
$299.00 |
| Size (inches) | 4.3 x 2.4 x 0.51 | 4.1 x 2.4 x 0.41 | 4.3 x 2.4 x 0.31 |
| Weight (ounces) |
4.5 | 4.9 | 4.2 |
| Display (inches) | 3.2 | 2.5 |
3.5 |
| Display Type |
LCD | LCD (LED backlight) |
Touch-sensitive LCD |
| Resolution | 320 x 240 (expected) |
320 x 240 |
480 x 320 |
| Navigation | Zune Pad | Click Wheel | Multi-touch |
| WiFi | Yes (802.11b/g expected) | No | 802.11b/g |
| Wireless Sync | Yes | No | No |
| Wireless Share | Yes | No | No |
| Wireless Store | No | No | Yes |
| Web Browser | No | No | Yes |
| Battery | 20 hours music (WiFi off) / 5 hours video |
30 hours music / 5 hours video |
22 hours music / 5 hours video |
| Battery Charge Time |
2.25 hours / 1.25 hour to 90% via USB |
4 hours / 2 hours to 80% |
3 hours / 1.5 hours to 80% |
| Audio Support |
WMA, protected WMA, WMA Lossless, MP3, MP3 VBR, AAC (expected) |
AAC, protected AAC, MP3, MP3 VBR, Audible, Apple lossless, WAV, and AIFF |
AAC, protected AAC, MP3, MP3 VBR, Audible, Apple lossless, WAV, and AIFF |
| Video Support |
WMV, H.264, MPEG-4 |
H.264, MPEG-4 | H.264, MPEG-4 |
| FM Tuner |
Yes | No |
No |
| Headphones | "Premium" earbuds |
Apple earbuds | Apple earbuds |
| PC / Mac compatible |
Yes / No |
Yes / Yes |
Yes / Yes |
| Client Software |
Zune Software |
iTunes |
iTunes |
| Colors | Black | Silver, Black | Black |
Now on to the flash-based Zunes which like Apple's best selling iPod nano, will likely be Microsoft's top sellers:
| Feature | Zune 4 / 8GB | iPod nano 4 / 8GB |
|---|---|---|
| Price |
$149.99 / $199.99 |
$149.00 / $199.00 |
| Size (inches) | 1.6 x 3.6 x 0.33 |
2.8 x 2.1 x 0.26 |
| Weight (ounces) |
1.7 | 1.7 |
| Display (inches) | 1.8 | 2.0 |
| Display Type |
LCD | LCD (LED backlight) |
| Resolution | 320 x 240 |
320 x 240 |
| Navigation |
Zune Pad |
Click Wheel |
| WiFi | Yes (802.11b/g expected) |
No |
| Wireless Sync | Yes | No |
| Wireless Share | Yes | No |
| Wireless Store | No | No |
| Web Browser | No | No |
| Battery | 20 hours music (WiFi off) / 4 hours video |
24 hours music / 5 hours video |
| Battery Charge Time |
2.5 hours / 1.5 hours to 90% via USB |
3 hours / 1.5 hours to 80% |
| Audio Support |
WMA, protected WMA, WMA Lossless, MP3, MP3 VBR, AAC (expected) |
AAC, protected AAC, MP3, MP3 VBR, Audible, Apple lossless, WAV, and AIFF |
| Video Support |
WMV, H.264, MPEG-4 |
H.264, MPEG-4 |
| FM Tuner |
Yes | No |
| Headphones | Microsoft earbuds |
Apple earbuds |
| PC / Mac compatible |
Yes / No |
Yes / Yes |
| Client Software |
Zune Software |
iTunes |
| Colors | Pink, Green, Black, Red | Silver, Black, Blue, Green, (PRODUCT) RED |
Oh, here's what Zune "premium" headphones look like. Sorry, no useful data but that cable has a certain rugged, mountaineering look to it dontchathink?
The new Zune looks pretty good, that cannot be denied.
But could you PLEASE stop declaring it the greatest thing since sliced bread until you USE IT. As good as something looks in the pictures and video they put out, just WAIT and see for yourselves.
As for the current flame war, its hilarious to be honest. Some people like Zunes, some people like iPods, BIG DEAL.
Choice is what people want, choice is what people have, this whole 'Zune sucks cause of x,y and z' and 'iPod sucks cause of 1, 2 and 3' is so pathetic its laughable.
Its like watching 5 year olds argue who has the best Action Man! Grow up!
I do have a question though, how slow is WiFi syncing? I know its not always convenient to use a USB cable, but won't syncing over 'G' be kind of slow?
Now, Fanboys, return to your collective camps, regroup and get ready to hurl more shit at each other as more Zune news shows up.
For the (seemingly few) rational people your wars are always good entertainment.
Finally, somebody with some sense. Couldn't have said it any better.
Wireless syncing isn't going to be any problem. The only thing that needs to happen is that playcounts get updated, new podcasts get added to the Zune, and files removed from the library are removed from the Zune. Assuming you don't have a dozen new video podcasts, it should be over in a matter of minutes.
Your initial sync where you add all the new content would probably be done connected.
To those people who say Apple was the first: No, they were not. According to wikipedia, the first hard drive MP3 player was created in 1997. A Korean company by the name of SaeHan Information Systems created the "MPMan", which reached the markets in Asia in 1998. SaeHan liscenced the design to Eiger Labs, who produced and sold the first flash memory player, the 32mb MPMan F10. It took two lawsuits, two MORE MP3 players (another flash, and the first HD player, a 6gb product Compaq invented and liscenced back to Korea), and three years before Apple even introduced the 5gb iPod.
I'm waiting for them to win a "Best in Show" at CES. Then, maybe I'll buy one. Maybe. But for now, I'm comfortable with my Zen Vision:M, which HAS a "Best in Show".
Sold.... I am pre-ordering on Amazon (or Costco)!!!!
Damn that is a nice player.
I understand the logic of your argument based on market share, But I don't think it would take Microsoft that much time to make it happen. Microsoft buying the latest Macintosh hardware to develop on?, surly they must have it already for the Mac Office developers. As for Apple users not being potential customers, Microsoft will never know unless they give it a go. Can the Zune be used as a mass storage device on a Macintosh or Linux?, If not then that's one way to deal with part of the problem, I am sure users of both those platforms would be happy to drag and drop music, movies and other files on to it.
You smell that? Do you smell that? Fanbois, son. Nothing else in the world smells like that. I love the smell of fanbois in the morning.
I agree with chriss, this article was useful, too bad no one else is contributing, yeah that includes me
I love my XBox 360, and my Microsoft Wireless Mouse, and I really prefer using MS Word to any other word processor, but I also love my Mac, and my iPod.
My Mac and my iPod both play nice with my XBox 360 and Microsoft Wireless Mouse... So why won't the Zune play nice with my Mac?
I'm not a fanboy. I'm not dedicated to any one company. I prefer using OS X for my needs, but I still use WinXP for gaming and a few small apps. I love gaming on my XBox 360 (I think MS really made the best console this time around) and yet I have absolutely no love for Windows Media Player or any of the Windows Media formats. Add to that the fact that the Zune never supports Mac, and you have a solid reason why I'll never even consider buying a Zune.
I'd *like* to consider it. It seems like a nice piece of hardware. Unfortunately, MS took the choice away from me and they're marketing it to Windows users only... And no doubt they'll be pushing for it to be Windows Vista, and not XP.
Look, guys-- I know you hate Best Buy, but like it or not they're the number one electronics retailer in the country, and guess what? They're selling Macs now, and according to the Apple rep at my local Best Buy, people are snatching them up faster than they can stock them. People ARE switching. Apple's share is growing steadily, and for Microsoft to cut out an entire section of the market is just plain stupid. We're out here. We're not zombies who only want to buy Apple-branded products. We buy the *best* product for the money, and if the Zune is a better media player than the current generation of iPod, we see that as a GOOD thing because it will stimulate the market.
All we want is the option to use the damned thing in the first place.
If you use Windows, you have a choice. You can use iPod or Zune. If you use OS X, you're locked out of the Microsoft offering. To me, as an equal-opportunity gadget freak, that makes Microsoft look petty, and indicates to me that they simply Do Not Want my business when it comes to the Zune.
Fine. I won't buy a Zune, but it's not because I'm not open to it. It's because Microsoft stupidly made the choice for me before even going to market.
They're going to find that they will never have an "iPod killer" as long as they limit use to one operating system. Apple figured that out, and that's part of why they're on top.
Get with the program, Microsoft. You either want to sell me a Zune, or you want it to sit on the shelf. Your decision to lock out an entire group of computer users shows me you're not really very serious about this product... So neither is my interest in it.
Enjoy mediocrity in the media player arena.
I really wish they'd add bluetooth to this thing. I'm not an MS or Apple fan boy, I'm just saying no one got it right so far. They're both corporate monsters that keep holding things back for their own, greedy interests. As long as Microsoft or Apple don't adopt bluetooth A2DP to stream audio to stereos, players, and alarm clocks, we'll keep getting stuck with stupid proprietary docks. I'll buy another DAP when I can hear it through my car or home stereo without wires or docks. I'm happy with my smarthphone's 8GB micro SD card (INTERCHANGABLE card. Bite me, Apple) and beaming my re-ripped, unprotected content to whomever I please (bite me Microsoft with your 3-day WiFi sharing bullshit), and I honestly never felt the need to carry 80GB worth of anything in my player. Well, at least until they manage to make converting videos to a PMP format less excrutiating (under 5 minutes would be nice :)
I see a lot of Creative bashing going on here. not to mention some unnecessary language and rude comments. all of us are entitled to opinions, which means anyone who likes microsoft more than apple and vise versa should not be snapped at for it. get over yourselves. everyone has preferences. And just so everyone knows, I own a Zen Vision: M. After me and my friend (who has an ipod 5G) switched players for a few minutes and listened to the same song, we both agreed that the Creative's sound quality was better. Know why? Oh yeah, cause creative specializes in sound equipment. Apple specializes in computers, not bad ones though. So does microsoft. and i don't know bout anyone else but i'd rather buy from the sound guys than the computer guys when buying an MP3 Player, which i learned after buying a Sansa e200.
Did the FM tuner get RDS again?
@ joseph
WHAAAAT???
It's funny to see these Apple fanboys ripping into the Microsoft fanboys...
Microsoft owns 25% of Apple... so everytime you buy music on iTunes, or buy an iPod, or buy a Mac, you're giving money to your "sworn enemy"
So keep buying your iPods, Apple TVs, and iTunes media... please keep funding the development of the Zune. :)
I think the typical Apple/iPod user is too dumb to get the fact that MS owns a huge stake in Apple!
Weeeeell, time to stroll in with my comments.
Why do people buy these things? i ask sincerely in hope of an intelligent answer.
Video players have been around for god knows how long now and they still don't get used.
I live in london and commute everyday, not once have i seen anybody catching up on a movie (on a 3" screen) on the way to work. I have seen peeps with those potable DVD players (7" plus) and using laptops for movies but never ( I shall repeat) NEVER has anyone used these tiny little things.
When do you watch a movie with these things?
Do you pull them out when your in the pub and go "Hey dude check out my new toy" and then play some porn/cartoons/eastenders to impress your pretty much uninteresting mates.
I can bet that that (for most) is 90% of the video useage that this machine will ever see.
Mainly they're MP3 players with the ability to play small unexciting videos.
I like the idea of the iphone though as you at least can use tinternet for google maps, youtube and what not.
But "C'mon!"
If you want to listen to music ** BUY AN MP3 PLAYER **
If you want to watch movies ** BUY A LAPTOP **
DO NOT converge the two! theres no point.
(As a side point i'd probably buy an Archos over these two! i am currently sporting a zen stone with Sennheiser cx300 soon to be upgraded to the cx500's No need for screen as i only commute for just shy of an hour and have no need to pull it out of my pockets)
Bring the Flame!
Can i get a whoop whoop!
Whoop whoop!
I agree, people who will never use video on their iPod/Zunes will rest their decision on a function they will never use. I think manufacturers include the function just because if they don't, people will wave the product off.
I personally have only recently put video on my Zune (I got it when it released) and only have a few TV shows, yet I hardly ever watch video more than once, while I will listen to music a countless number of times.
Once flash based players are able to have enough storage for my music library (nearly 30GB), I will purchase one for music, an Archos 705 or 605 for video. And of course, I wouldn't really carry one of those in my pocket, just for a break in my college courses or during travel.
I REALLY hope the screen rez is NOT 320x240. I don't see a point of having a large screen when it looks like crap during video play back.
I the zune does WiFi and doesn't come with a browser how is that supposed to work for browsing internet?
I am a very satisfied Apple consumer. Own a Mac mini, an 80GB 5.5G iPod and a 2G Shuffle, and absolutely hate Windows....
But I got to admit that the new Zunes look quite fine... The flash ones, in my opinion, still don't catch up with the nanos, but the 80GB sure looks way better than the iPod Classic!! (I'm not gonna talk about the software... anyone who has ever used Mac OS or other Apple software is never gonna aprove MS softs, as I don't...)
The touch, though, is in a whole different level, and I don't think MS can get there in the next years... :-)
Anyway, just by looking at the diversity of opinions in these comments, you can already tell that the iPod is gonna face some competition... Probably gonna keep its #1 place for a long time, but maybe losing 1 or 2% market share....
the touch is worthless as a pmp. It doesn't have enough storage to be a video player, but its too big and expensive to be an mp3 only player. It simply doesn't fit anywhere. Sure, it's a neat gadget to say you have, but as a primary pmp, it doesn't keep up with the competition. Given the choice between the touch and the zune, or even the classic, i'd take the dedicated pmp over the touch any day.
As an iPod/iTunes user, I think the new Zune design is a fabulous improvement. Much better than the brick-style thing they had going on before.
I'd definitely be interested in playing with one a bit with an open mind to purchasing it.
Call me crazy but I like the look of the new Zunes and I have ALWAYS liked WMP11. I have never been a fan of itunes. It works (usually) but it is one ugly piece of software. I have an ipod (have had one for years) and have never seen a reason to dump it for anything else. When the HDD Zune hits the stores I will go check it out. It will take a lot to make me dump my ipod, but the Zunes look promising.
My biggest ipod complaint other than itunes is the sound quality. How will the Zune compare?
Steve is hoping that many people are not willing to dump/convert their DRM library. If people will hang onto their tunes as is, then they will hang onto ipod.
What I really like about Zune2 is the ability to sync wirelessly and synce to Media Center. I have so much Media Center content that this is very exciting for me.
Shut up you stupid apple fanboys. I have owned both players and the Zune is considerably better. I mean, with the iPod, you have basically no customization, and the artwork is a lot smaller. The sound quality seemed lower too. The one redeeming fact about the iPod is that it had podcasts, and that's being added to the Zune. And the fact that Microsoft is doing firmware right with adding the new firmware to the old zune. And who could not love wireless syncing?
Apple wins... wake me up when M$ has something worth looking at. BTW - I switched to Mac OS-X just over a year ago, and I'm never going back to Windows. Ever.
Screw both of them, ill take a Creative Zen thanks
I bought a Zen last year and it was trash with a broken screen within a month. And even when it was new it kept freezing.
I don't trust Creative
So I got an Ipod, which lasted me about 8 months with frequent freezing and now it's got dead pixels on the screen and kills the battery for no reason randomly.
Now I'm looking at a Zune. Can anyone testify that they last longer than 8 months?? If so I'm yours
I like it just beacuse it not a Ipod I am so tired of Jobs the Great.
put it simply all theses products are very boring. I don't know bout anyone else but this is what i look for in a player:
1.No software needed, drag and drop transfer
2.loselsss and open source audio codec support (ogg, flac etc)
3. xvid and divx support, come on everyone knows that these are the most popular formats for dvd rip and tv series content, how can u not have support for them? f**k rencoding.
4.Good sound
5.long battery life
6. good aesthetics
none of these players provide all these options, spec wise they are unbelievably average. So what their ms and apple players. So they have nice looking interfaces? big deal, the are very limited in their capabilities. Think about what is possible in a player now and think how far away they are from achieving what they could very easily do. They're holding back the technology to get you to spend and then spend more when you buy the new ipod or zune in a years time. Use you brains, can no one see these players are so middle of the road. Just look at their specs for christ sake! Do any of you really take playing audio seriously? these are drone players for the average d***k heads, these aren't for people serious about audio and tech.
Yo!! once that Zune supports FLAC I'll be buyin' it!! Those ipods are whack like the Mac.
For my education,
1. Does the Zune s/w have a separate category for podcasts (like iTunes has)?
2. Does the Zune s/w allow the download of podcasts or must one use a separate utility (like Juice)?
3. Is there a Zune forum where these things are discussed?
Forums:
http://www.zune.net/en-US/social/forums/default.htm
I just wish MS would launch the new Zune with Apple support out the gates. I am interested in buying a Zune, but own a Mac...
Well, if you compare how many people run Mac (Apple) computers and how many people run PC's (Microsoft), then you should see that Microsoft is a true winner there. I work in the IT field and 99% of all computers we work on are PC's.
Here are my thoughts about the iPod and Zune 2nd Generation:
My stepdaughter's iPod screen is totally scratched - she got it last year for Christmas. I read that the new Zune (2nd generation) is going to have a glass screen (on a hardness scale of 10 it's going to be a 5.5 while the iPod still has a plastic - easily to scratch - plastic screen with a hardness of 1). That is something important to me, I'm definitely thinking about buying a Zune when it comes out in 2 weeks from now.
Also, I have read about the volume output on both devices. The iPod is supposedly not as loud as the Zune and the frequency range lacks as well. I'm an audio freak and sound - lots of bass - is very important to me. Another reason for me not to buy an iPod.
I also like the idea of having a FM radio in my multimedia player. Not available in the iPod. Again, the Zune wins.
Screen size matters as well! :)
The iPods are way overrated and (and used to be very) overpriced in my point of view (it's like at school - if you don't have an iPod, you're not "hip" or "in" but who really cares?). For those of you who think that Microsoft "copied" the iPod, so what? It's a free country! Competition is healthy, because us, the consumers, win. The end product (Zune) is a clear winner in my book. :)
You people are weird. It's not about which company is better: Apple or Microsoft. It's about what you get out of them. And right now, we're talking about PMP.
Now in my opinion, I like the bigger screen, the lightweight, the FOUR-WAY ZUNE TOUCH PAD AND NOT A CIRCLE. I like the fact that you don't get thumb arthritis from it...and the UI is IMPRESSIVE. It's not just a white background with letters, that's why Apple had to put album art.
As for Apple being innovative: please! They didn't create the first PMP, they didn't create the first computer, they didn't create the first touch-screen phone...actually, it was a blunt ripoff the LG Touch!
And if it weren't for Microsoft, Apple's "innovations" wouldn't exist. Apple was falling apart until Microsoft helped it out with their OS back in the late 80s and early 90s.
In these posts there appears to be significant emotional investment between devotees of "MS" and "Apple" - get a life! Every company I've worked for uses MS products/platforms because basically that's all there is. I have two Macs (an iMac and a Powerbook both bought within the past year). I've never had to "regedit" or figure out inscrutable messages, contended with inexplicable system freezes, felt the stomach-freefall lasting an oh-no-second* when I made some terrible error in trying simply to install a new piece of software. With MS I've had all these issues. At work we have IT to fix them, upgrade, "handle issues", etc. With my Apple products I simply get to do what I want with the computer, iPhone, and iPod, which, unlike some others here, DOES NOT include making love to them! (Incidentally, *oh-no-second is that brief period of time between clicking "OK" on a button and realizing, "Oh no...!" whereupon the consequences follow.)
GODDAMN MAN!! look the zune is here to save us from the domination of the ipod! some ppl like me just cant use Macs. Its just DNA, i waste time like hell trying to use these softwares and now i am satisfied that microsoft has made the zune for windows users. Call it whatever you want, some people like me just cant use Apple.
P.S. I have tried real hard to use it if you are wondering. In my school, Macs were used throughout my entire middle school and elementary school experience. Only in highschool do you have the option to use a Windows 2000. Trust me i always use Windows 2000. I have spent several of my hours figuring out apple softwares. I used the moviemaker which took me 3 hours to figure out the functions. It took me 2 hours to figure out the itunes and load my songs properly.
I like both devices... Can't we all?
getting a zune 80 for x-mas can't wait!
an even better player is VLC player
has every codec except for the damn apple ones check it out
1) Why is everyone so hung up on colors?? I think black is the best from both ipod and zune. And if you are going for appearance, Zune has a customizable background and an engraving for the back
2) The Zune software is atrocious x_x They need something, ANYTHING that is better than what they have now. I thought I was still on a webpage when I first loaded it. Itunes still dominates software
3) Did anyone consider that Apple comes out with a new ipod style every year because we have to buy one every year since the ipods keep BREAKING?
4) You can't compare Touch/Zune.. Both the size capability and the prices are different. Stick with Classic/Zune when you bicker
5) How is anyone supposed to take you seriously if you have the grammar and spelling skills of a 5 year old? Or the maturity for that matter, for those who keep fighting over who is the biggest 'fanboi' -kills self-
6) Why doesn't anyone care about AUDIO QUALITY??? I still haven't been able to pick for sure which one I want, but I've heard Zune is better and seeing as your buying this thing to listen to music, wouldn't the quality of said music be the most important factor when deciding???
Thanks.
Personally, I'm slightly biased. But that's primarily because I've had more than one bad experience with Microsoft's software. I suppose you could chalk it up to "user error," but if a hardware/software developer is willing to take steps to prevent "user error" from freezing an entire operating system, it has my vote.
I used to despise Apple's cutesy computers. I thought I was cooler than the Apple user if I could emerge victorious after having faced-off with the "Blue Screen of Death."
Unfortunately, I lost the war with my computer. I decided to go with a Mac simply because I heard that Adobe Creative products work better. Naturally, I was surprised with the system's stability, ease of use, and aesthetic appeal.
That said, I hope I'm being as objective as possible here. The new Zune has a lot of appeal. It's a sleek device with more than enough things going for it. Sound quality is decent. The UI, while not refined, is more than efficient.
The "three plays" sharing limit is still rather bothersome. I find the wireless sharing function somewhat unnecessary. Discovering a limit on it was annoying.
My big beef is the fact that the Mac OS X user is completely left out. Still no Mac support. This irks me when Apple has been dishing out stuff like Safari, iTunes, and Quicktime to Windows users.
And the Zune software still feels unnervingly buggy. I'm sorry, but when I load an application that's supposed to house my music, I want it to at least feel stable.
And with a screen that big, I would hope that Microsoft figure out that selling video content is an opportunity worth taking advantage of. Despite the NBC debacle, iTunes is still an amazing way to download TV shows. And don't tell me you're not willing to pay for TV shows. DVD sets, anyone?
Stronger than before, but still not quite there. Keep working at it, Microsoft. I'm sure you'll get it soon.