Battery pack upgrade for Prius claims 150MPG
By Conrad Quilty-Harper 
posted October 20th 2007 6:53PM
posted October 20th 2007 6:53PM
[Thanks, I LOVE THE CAPS LOCK KEY]
posted October 20th 2007 6:53PM
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what caps lock?
hes a dude that it is very informative that comments here sometime
THIS CAPS LOCK.
"Prius that can hit up to 150MPG in city areas. .. [by] charging overnight using a regular power plug, owners will be able to drive for up to 50 miles on battery power alone"
Am I the only one who finds it odd to measure battery performance in "miles per gallon" = MPG ...?
I love Prius, but come on. Is Toyota going to pay my power bill by any chance? No. How come this isn't figured in the calculations?
suv4x4 said:
Is Toyota going to pay my power bill by any chance? No. How come this isn't figured in the calculations?
It is - that is why they use a MPG equivalent.
Imagine it cost £5 to buy a gallon of petrol, or £5 to charge the battery. The price is the same, but the number of miles I can get is different.
These figures are easily found. Less than one dollar per "gallon".
http://calcars.org/vehicles.html
There are some places in California where this entire conversion could be offset by local initiatives & state funded rebates.
I own a Civic Hybrid, but will certainly consider other options that allow for a sizable chunk of my driving to be gasoline free when I next purchase.
Even electric cars like the Tesla Roadster have government MPG ratings.
suv4x4 - Thanks for confirming how dorky the Prius looks.
It would be so much easier if they just said miles per dollar...
All of these "Why is it listed in MPG?" comments are seriously uninformed. The car is a hybrid, so it uses gasoline. Yes, it's for charging the battery, but you can drive this car for 150 miles and only consume 1 gallon of gas.
Why is that so hard for people to understand? It's not rocket science.
That's OK for someone who parks in a garage where they have an AC outlet, but for those of us who park outdoors, it's useless.
It's not about the money, it's about the O-ZONE!!! but really, the world is more important than the gas money. . . really it is.
Mike Cohen
- Extension cord... unless you live in an urban place where you can't do that without it being stolen. Still, get enough of these out on the roads, and I'll bet the parking garages here in the city will start offering battery charging. No you say, of course they will, it's another thing they can over-charge (pun intended) for.
The 150 MPG number is bullshit. If it was truly 150 MPG - then you could go 1500 miles on 10 gallons of gas WITHOUT STOPPING!
I love the technology, but I hate the liars pushing it.
I agree...I think a MPG estimate for a hybrid is not particularly helpful. In any case, hasn't it already been proven that owning a hybrid is still way more expensive than a regular car unless gas prices hit $10/gallon or something? I remember seeing a website about a year ago that does the calculations and determined that aside from a smaller carbon footprint you are wasting your money on a hybrid. Until a hybrid is both environmentally responsible and fiscally feasible, I will pass.
These "MPG" complainers are either oil-company trolls or seriously misinformed idiots.
The car is a HYBRID. You get the equivalent of 150miles-per-gallon when you have at least 1 gallon and a full battery charge. How is this difficult to understand? The batteries simply extend your gasoline mileage (or you can run batteries alone and get a lower equivalent mileage).
Again, 1 gallon + full batteries = 150MPG. How is this hard to figure out?
Because no one likes to talk about electric cars in a realistic manner, they just fantasize about the marketable aspects.
You love the caps lock key? LOL!
...j/k, I know you're talking about the "I LOVE THE CAPS LOCK KEY" who comments here some times.
i have a prius, and i actualy bought it for this reason, people have been doing this to the prius for a while. How ever the 10,000 price point is too high.. I wish i had waited and got an ELECTRIC car. This Car requires GAS. The best thing about these cars is not the 50 MPG i get average but the EMISSIONS. This car has one of the lowest emissions in the world, meaning less pollution. If you getting a car strictly for MPG your missing the point entirely. Sometimes i think "damn i could have gotten "(some bad ass car like a nissan Z)" instead, but thats just my ego talking, and i quickly quiet him up. I know why i got the prius, and im happy because the emissions are so low, but i CRAVE for all electric.
p.s.
Did i mention that 10,000 is a little to much? how many prius owners do you know are willing to plop down 10G's? betch please.
Well, Prius is half electric and there are dozens of conversion kits and modifications out there to allow you to run your car on full electric most of the time. One of the more interesting ideas is the solar roof that puts 30 mile charge per day on your Prius; so any short distance driving will not involve non-renewable resources. Since the infrastructure for electrically powered cars has not matured enough, it's still a good thing you can still fall back on your Atkinson Cycle Engine (ACE) to get you home.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reB7KTQkbjk
http://www.nextenergynews.com/electriccars/electriccars74.html
What about the emissions generated by the production of electricity? What about the ozone produced in the motor?
The current crop of electric cars are just a marketing game and many studies are beginning to show that the TOTAL COST of ownership is harder on the environment than a gasoline driven automobile in the same class.
I will stick with my SAAB, thank you.
Touchsky, if you can't get electricity from clean energy sources in your area, you can offset any emissions used by your hybrid by purchasing carbon offsets:
http://www.terrapass.com/
https://www.buycarbon.org/EmissionsCalculators/Order_Form.aspx
If you were half as bright as dim bulb you could have figured this out on your own. But of course you never gave a shit about emissions in the first place, so shove it.
Really, it's the emissions? Where do you think the electricity comes from to charge your car moron......COAL FIRED ELECTIC PLANTS! It's a zero sum gain. Until electricity is produced exclusively from wind and solar it's a loss to use electricity as the Coal Fired plants give off more relative emissions than the cars that have emissions standards.
$9500 would be a better spend on buying a 4 stroke EFI scooter that passes EURO4 emission test. Not upgrading the Prius....
This prius is a much better idea because it fits more of an average person's needs.
To go further, there's a reason why people drive so many SUVs and pickup trucks in the US. It is because if you have a house with a yard 1/4 an acre and up especially, you pretty much need one to take care of a house and children. That's the unfortunate side effect of suburbia. Since we can't convert suburbia, then we simply need to use technology to come up with better solutions to meet our environmental and personal needs. I believe that humanity is smart enough to do that, and that we find solutions when the need is there. The need is here, and this prius is a great step in the right direction. You're comment is giving up. Don't give up. Believe in people. We, as humanity, will figure this out.
Too bad nobody wants a Prius because it looks DORKY.
"Too bad nobody wants a Prius because it looks DORKY."
Ever seen a Toyota Prius at all? Here: http://www.supanet.com/media/00/08/29/toyota_prius_430.jpg
In fact, ever bought a car?
Drove a car?
Been more than 14 year old?
Is that why I see at least two Prius' on a single trip to the store? Not including the trip back.
Then please explain why Toyota cannot make the Prius fast enough to meet the demand and why there is an occasional waiting list to buy one... I've got questions, you'd better have answers.
I love the looks of the Prius.
as great as the prius is, i still think that it's looks don't live up to its name. even my dad who has worked for toyota for over 20 years thinks that the prius designers could have done a better job....
http://www.concurringopinions.com/archives/images/south%20park.jpg
He's right. It's a stupid looking car. I'm 30, btw and have owned several cars, to preemptively defend against attacks on my car knowledge/age.
When you consider that the electricity may have come from a coal-fired plant that bought pollution credits and passed on the cost to its consumers, claiming fantasy mileage is completely irresponsible. Or maybe the plan is for drivers to plug in at work
That is a known factor. On the west coast, especially in California, the emissions from going electric are indeed lower. On the east coast they either balance out or are worse.
The best gasoline engine can only be about 40% efficient. Large power plants, coal or otherwise are over 90% efficient, so you are getting at least twice the energy per unit consumed. To me, that's cleaner. Not perfect, but cleaner. Couple that with much better mileage per joule (which I believe is the correct way to measure it) and we are looking at about a 3 fold increase in fuel savings, which is significant IMO.
you're forgetting transmission losses among other things.
Well, transmission loss is only about 7%, so it's still way more efficient than an internal combustion engine...
The thing that you're missing is that even the worst coal-burning electric plant is far more efficient that the best gasoline engine. It's simply a matter of scale.
The two pollute differently. You're working under the assumption that they produce the same pollution, and the same type of pollution, per whatever unit burned. They do not. You're also not working in nonpoint source pollution. Mileage numbers are pretty meaningless if you're just looking at what pollutes more or less per unit burned.
Gasoline efficiency is lower than you state. On average, worldwide, it costs half a barrel of oil to get the next barrel out of the ground. By looking at that energy usage, coal is also lower than you state. You have to actively feed a coal plant and that takes..dun dun dun.. gasoline or diesel or worse yet, heavy fuel oil. That stuff is worse than crude oil. You don't have to actively feed a dam, but you do have to rebuild it every 20-50 years. An on-site garbage incinerator requires little input because the garbage is already on hand even if the incinerator wasn't there. Wind farms get built once. Solar gets built once and the very first solar cell EVER is still producing about half its maximum wattage. They don't dip under 75% of their maximum for almost 30 years and the glass is endlessly recyclable. Geothermal is good until your source cools off; no nonrenewable sources needed.
Once you work out all those things, electricity will push a car the same distance as gasoline but with less pollution if you're on the west coast.
Perhaps you noticed it was shown at a canadian carshow, and canada is very heavily electrically powered by water power, which means 0 pollution.
And over here in europe consumers can actually select if they want green electric power or 'classical' from their powercompany.
besides, I thought california was full of nuclear power plants? and that americans for some reason think that's 'green' and 'safe'.
last time i checked your precious EU has france in it, which, last time i checked, receives 70% of its power from NUCLEAR PLANTS. With that in mind, considering a major nation gathers the majority of its power from nuclear, it would be reasonable to conclude that it is relatively safe or france would be a radiation zone and all of europe would look like prypriat, and since you are living smugly in your european home writing nonfactual comments on engadget to look 'cool' because bashing america is in right now, i am going to assume that europe is not a giant prypiat.
A fully electric car sounds great, but having an engine to assist would be nice when you are dead out of power and don't have time to stop and charge. I would love to see a fully electric power train like that of the Tesla that can perform on par with modern luxury sedans (lexus, bmw, acura, etc.) as the people with enough money to afford a fully electric car for sometime in the future will probably be used to having a fair bit of power behind the wheel.
this is Ontario, CALIFORNIA (to the guy in europe who thinks it's in Canada).
Even though power plants may be 90% efficient, the transmission of the electricity to the home makes it less efficient, and perhaps most importantly the charging of the battery and then discharging makes it less efficient.
They've done studies before comparing pure electric vehicles against hybrids, and IIRC, the hybrids actually had better efficiency overall after you accounted for all the losses.
That said, if your electricity comes from hydropower or wind power, even if it's less efficient it's also way cleaner.
Using these same type of exaggerated calculations, I could fill my car with 1 teaspoon of gasoline and roll it down a 1 mile long hill, and conclude that I got 768MPG (1 mile divided by 0.00130208333 gallons) Just make sure you ignore all the gas required to get UP the hill.
I just wish Toyota or Honda would build a plug-in hybrid to begin with. The Prius is already expensive for the savings you get, compared to a comparable gas powered car. Another $9500 is just too much money. The Chevy volt is looking promising. I hope they pull it off.
A plugin hybrid won't work for me since I park outdoors and don't have an AC outlet nearby.
So install one.
Or get an extension cord....
I wouldn't be comfortable with an open electrical outlet from my house being so accessible to anyone who walks by. That and the chance of the neighborhood pranksters unplugging my electric car and leaving me stranded...