CE-Oh no he didn't! Part XLVIII: Mandriva CEO slams Ballmer in blog rant
By Donald Melanson 
posted Nov 1st 2007 11:31AM
posted Nov 1st 2007 11:31AM
Microsoft's Steve Ballmer is certainly no stranger to our CE-Oh no he didn't! series, but Mandriva's CEO François Bancilhon now looks to have turned the tables, with him targeting Ballmer in an open letter on his blog. Causing all his ire is a recent deal Mandriva made to install its Linux distribution onto 17,000 Classmate PCs sold to the Nigerian Government, which Nigeria says they will follow through on, only to replace the OS with Windows afterwards. Bancilhon, as you might have guessed, is laying the blame for the sudden change of heart squarely on Microsoft, and Ballmer specifically, saying "Wow! I'm impressed, Steve! What have you done for these guys to change their mind like this? It's pretty clear to me, and it will be clear to everyone." Bancilhon went on to ask, "How do you call what you just did Steve, in the place where you live?," adding that, "In my place, they give it various names, I'm sure you know them." Bancilhon then busted out the ever-reliable "how do you feel looking at yourself in the mirror in the morning?" line, before closing things off by saying, "You have the money, the power, and maybe we have a different sense of ethics you and I, but I believe that hard work, good technology and ethics can win too."[Via Yahoo News/PC Magazine]
Engadget, please rename the column of this type to, 'CE-Doh!'
It seems to me that we could just... you know... not care who uses what OS?
I don't know about the rest of you, but i don't walk down the street and get all tingly in the giblets if I see somebody using OSX of Windows or Linux or whatever else.
I get that Engadget does this to push pageloads for their advertisers, but come on guys... does this really matter? Isn't your OS of choice kind of like your team of choice or your color of choice?
Boxers or briefs; advantages to both but I go boxers, and I'm not pissed at those of you rockin whitey tighties right now...
Yeah, but with underwear, colors and sports teams, you have a choice and you can freely switch to boxers or briefs on a daily basis.
With the operating systems, you can't just load in Linux tomorrow and continue your daily routine. This isn't the fault of Linux mind you. It's the fault of allowing a company to maintain it's hold on market share. If Microsoft were forced to follow a standard model and allow other people to mimic that model, then it would be like your underwear comparison. As it is, you cannot run Microsoft Office on Linux without going through patched in libraries. You also cannot load up your favorite game in either Windows, Linux, or OSX because it happens to use a proprietary 3D acceleration library only available on Windows. If Microsoft were forced to open all their "defacto" standards so that other companies can create an operating system that will run programs written on those standards, then, and only then, can Microsoft finally play on even ground.
It should be renamed CE-Oh yes he did.
I wouldn't worry - they'll get through a dozen Windows installs, realize they still have 16,988 left to do, come to their senses, and say, "fuck it
...and yet with all of his unscrupulous endeavors, Microsoft's stock is *still* flat. LOL@STEVE what a joke!
Actually, Microsoft's stock has gone up about 25% in the past month. But if you knew that, then you would actually be informed instead of just pretending, eh?
compare and contrast...
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=MSFT&t=5y
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=AAPL&t=5y
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=GOOG&t=5y
This is easier:
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?t=5y&s=AAPL&l=on&z=m&q=l&c=msft
What the f@#$ does apple stock performance have to do with an incorrect statement that MSFT has been flat? You see that makes you stupid twice:
1) not know what you are saying
2) not understanding the rebuttal
Why exactly would you compare MS to Apple's stock when the story had absolutely NOTHING to do with Apple? Are you that much of a douche Cupertino fanboy?
Although stock prices weren't even mentioned or implied in the story (nor does quoting them support any relevant position), you should have at least used some Linux stock quotes. But that wouldn't make sense to you, would it?
Google's and Apple's are ridiculously overvalued. They're both in Bubble 2.0 territory.
Also, comparisons are pointless because GOOG, AAPL, and MSFT are all in completely different industries. Microsoft is a software company. Google is in advertising. Apple is a consumer electronics company.
Google and Apple stock are both ridiculously overvalued. Definitely in Bubble 2.0 territory.
Also, comparisons are pointless because GOOG, AAPL, and MSFT are all in completely different industries. Microsoft is a software company. Google is in advertising. Apple is a consumer electronics company.
Speaking as an African linux user, I don’t think MS won anything though it may look like a great victory. The number of pirated copies of their OS in Nigeria effectively makes this victory worthless. Yes they shall get a few government contracts and many students wont be given the freedom to choose a decent OS and would end up being shoddy techs. The only loss here is to the students and workers who would carry on not knowing that there are indeed better alternatives.
Victory eh? They just handed the first few hundred Cd’s to their demise. Wait till the real Nigerian racketeers looking to make a fast buck get hold of a few of those disks. Burn and spread shall begin and there goes their target market for ordinary consumers.
If they are indeed smart they would leave the African market to the open source guys. The open source sells support and basically charges next to nothing for the OS itself (the cost of the optical disk and manuals). Their business model suits Africa just fine… “OS free and support for sale”. But come in with MS's restrictive licensing and you are beckoning to pirates to make a fast buck off you.
Mandriva there is nothing to bother about. Anyday now those MS OS disks would surface in the black market prepackaged and cracked for the convenience of the customer and there is nothing MS can do to enforce proper use out there.
I grew up using windows. Did all my cisco tests and work on Xp in fact. But a few blue screens and the need to explore nudged me to try linux and i have never looked back. 7 distros and and 3 years later here I am still strong with a 275 day record uptime on one of my machines.
You give the pirates too much credit. MS believes it can handle them. Linux is the only real threat to the monopoly. Even if MS never gets a dime out of Nigeria, strangling another OS is worth the effort. What MS wants is Nigerian users who know no other OS. Pirates are just their helpers in that struggle, part of the cost of doing business.
"and would end up being shoddy techs"
Smh @ that. There's a reason why more PC users know more about computers than the average Mac user. Macs make it easy, that's Apple's goal. Which is good ... but with PCs, when things fuck up ... you're pretty much forced to learn your way around it trying to fix things.
Though I understand this isn't about Apple versus MS. I'm doing this to frame the point. Though it may be less bug prone, an open-source OS has a significantly larger learning curve to fix. Thus making Windows, the perfect training wheels for future techs ... ironically giving them more frequent real-world examples of shit to fix, lol.
Your entire rant failed miserably.
Smh @ emotional IT guys.
"Did all my cisco tests and work on Xp in fact."
Ironic, no?
An excessively emotional IT guy seems like an oxymoron. Shouldn't you have some form of good logic? Blame the shoddy techs on their poor thinking, and as far as I'm concerned ... with thinking like that, you're one of them.
For years Microsoft has allowed pirated copies of Windows to float. It has little to do with the profit of initial licensing. Microsoft is banking on familiarity. They have already done this in many Asian markets. They let the pirated OSes float for years, wait a while then try to slam the infringement hammer down. It's just bait and trap.
the nice thing about linux is, because it's open source, Nigerians could actually modify it to suit their specific needs. instead, they can have the : this is the way we roll in america" approach. now shut up and by coke or you don't get your vaccines.
All's fair in love and war, and OSs have always been at war. Bancilhon needs to chill or fight back.
It concerns me that I increasingly find myself agreeing with someone who signs himself "nutbastard."
Having the original install is very important. Although Ballmer is working overtime to exterminate Linux on EEE PC, OLPC, and Classmate, the presence of machines with a non-Windows original install allows for Linux tech support, the absence of which has been a cornerstone of the Microsoft monopoly.
Having someone with the *responsibility* to update Linux drivers when the firmware changes is an important hole in the dike. Eventually, even the third richest corporate entity in the world will be hard-pressed to plug all the holes.
Now, if only there were a way to make Exxon and GE (the two richer corps) want to eat Microsoft. Then Linux might be free to grow.
GE is too busy fighting iTunes with its new "Hulu" site to go after Microsoft. Not having been to Hulu yet, I wouldn't be surprised if it only supported Microsoft itself. (like Netflix and the BBC)
Fear not Bancilhon, hard work, good technology and ethics will win out in time, and that is Linux.
As long as Apple’s stays in third place I will be happy; there legs have been kept too tightly close for far too long and should stay that way.
I wonder how long this will go until someone defends MS?
Your apparently new to the internet. Let me explain how this happens.
1. Bad Microsoft news is posted.
2. Internal MS email sent out. Immediate break declared to allow internet browsing. Monkey boy himself makes announcement on the PA in loud annoying way.
3. Rampant fans declare, "Business is business!"
4. Anti-Microsoft folks (of which I'm a part of, I guess) spout of on how Microsoft is evil.
5. Internal MS folks finally figure out how to open IE.
6. Fans declare, "Microsoft is a good company, Bill gates gives money away"
7. Someone addresses Bill Gates as though he still works for Microsoft.
8. Internal MSers fail to find article on MSN, switch over to Firefox, search Google.
8. The same fans that declared MS a good company because of Bill berate these people for saying Bill has anything to do with MS.
9. Internal MSers finally post how Linux/OSX sucks (even if it has nothing to do with the article) and how MS is the only OS that can run ____.
10. ... bah, I think you get the idea by now. Every article it's the same thing over and over.
This is the internet. If you're going to make a list, it has to involve:
3. ???
4. Profit
FYI, if you're going to try and bash any company, try and do so with at least a modicum of wit and style.
You have an extremely vivid imagination, Andir. As if it weren't enough from your posts in the Armadillo article, telling me essentially that I lick John Carmack's balls for fun, now you suppose that everyone who doesn't like Linux and OS X and says so is on Microsoft's payroll.
I like Linux for my own personal use, but I think it would suck as it stands now as a widespread OS. The typical user just wouldn't be able to handle it. As for OS X, it's Linux without the teeth, as I understand, so that makes it better for the typical user, but not for me. Also, I like games and Windows + Ubuntu already do what I want while OS X just doesn't seem to bother either with software support *or* hardware support for anything remotely new re: video cards, so what's the point?
I'm really trying hard not to be insulting, but seriously, I just don't want to stoop to your level.
I never said "everyone" I included fans on the list. Your reading skills are getting worse. First you didn't read the Lander articles, not you skim my post and pick out only what you want to read...
is it me or is engadget very anti-microsoft???
Or maybe they just call it as it is and your opinion is out of whack?
It's better than being pro-monopoly. ;)
They're not just anti-Microsoft, Olu, they're anti-everything that isn't Apple. At least lately it seems they're bashing them equally, though, so I'll take what I can get.
I see where you're confused. This is not an "anti-Microsoft" site. This is a "consumer" site. We consume. We consume gadgets. Whatever gets in the way of our consumption gets bashed. Microsoft more than anybody gets bashed because it's the original anti-consumer company. But Apple and even the "do no evil" Google have their days of bashing here. Just wait until iPhone or Gphone has a bad day.
@Jerry
I'll do it. Maybe the Nigerian Government felt that getting the most commonly used OS in the world on their Classmate PCs will do the most benefit for the underpriviledged children they're trying to help. If they're trying to get them relevant in a digital world, tying them to a niche OS, no matter how much "better" it may be, doesn't seem to be the way to do it. It's a bit like English being the language of business...Windows is the language of technology and if you want to be successful you should probably speak it. While that may change in the future, it's true now, and maybe THAT'S why Nigeria chose Windows. I suppose that's not as fun the Microsoft bashing though.
yup. Nothing beats bashing MS. Especially when folks finally test an alternative and find out that their product is for the most part a rip off.
Very true,
"A survey of 1,400 CIO's by Robert Half in August 2007 asked the
question: "Which technical skills are most in demand within your
organization?" Leading the pack was Windows administration (73%),
followed by Network administration (70%), Database management (60%),
Firewall administration (55%), Wireless network management (52%),
Business intelligence (34%), ERP implementation (22%), Microsoft .NET
development (22%), CRM implementation (18%), Linux administration
(18%), Unix administration (18%), and XML development (18%)."
http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/career/article.php/3708361
The guy's "Open Letter" was a joke that stopped just short of "You
did something bad! We know you did it! Don't deny it! We won't say it
though... it is that bad!"
Instead of whining, maybe he could back it up with... oh I dunno...
FACT instead of baseless accusations.
Windows (while being buggy, slower, more expensive) is still the
dominant OS. Give the kids the best opportunity to succeed.
And yes, I use Linux (Arch) and XP.
I dont doubt that, but thats just the point I would rather see things change across the board. At the desktop level windows is dominant and no once is denying that fact, but at a server level linux is competative. It can be used by any user at this point and the open architecture would actaully allow these students to develop and not just use there operating system ( I realize we are talking grade school kids but you have to start somewhere) and more to the point why would they do this in a backhanded way instead of just ooooo i dont ORDERING THEM WITH XP?
Andir3.0- If your gonna post a reply to my comment dont you think you should open up your comments to response as well? NOT MY FIRST TIME ON THE INTERNET, my point was that every time some accuses MS of doing something shady agaisnt the little guy a MS fanboy will be here to defend them.
YES winders will run programs that do not run under Linux BUT there is always a linux program that will accomplish the same thing
Yeah, that's the way to improve your country...follow what everyone else is doing. Has anyone ever considered that trying to be like everyone else might be the problem? Wouldn't it be cool if all of these people needing tech skills to "be relevant" developed their own tech and used it to leapfrog everyone else instead of letting some huge corporation tell them what they should be doing?
@Mort:
I think is quite funny when people do not see the irony in the high demand for Windows administration skills. There is such high demand for those skills because Windows servers and clients need to be fixed all the time, not because Windows is so popular. The corporate staff that manage our Windows servers is 3 times as large as the group that manage our Linux servers, yet we have double the number of Linux servers. Hmmmm.....
@Jerry: It was a joke, and the art of debate is having the last word that has no retort. Although this isn't a debate, not all conversations have to be open ended.
@Jerry: It was a joke, and the art of debate is having the last word that has no retort. Although this isn't a debate, not all conversations have to be open ended.
@Mort: that's obviously a bogus report when you consider that .NET is used for less than half of development, the remainder being Java and other systems.
OOOOOHHHH you guys want to play the stock game. Well... Ok...
Goog @ $717 per share Is valued at 222 billion with a float of 312 million shares
AAPL @ 188 per share is valued at 165.25 with a float of 872 million shares
MSFT @ 37 per share is valued at 350 billion with 9.36 BILLION share float
You idiots are comparing ants to elephants. It takes much more money to move microsoft stock. Does that make it an inferior company? No. In fact, MSFT is the cheapest stock of the bunch right now, and if it weren't for morons like you crying about Microsofts dominance the stock would be much much higher. Quit hating Microsoft because it's popular; I can tell by your posts you have not one good logical reason to dislike Microsoft other than that's what everyone else is doing. LAME
MSFT @
...And not at all because Microsoft as a company sucks? Right. Good call, buddy.
point of correction.Most folks don't bash MS out of hate for their popularity. But shelling out cash and not getting adequate support when time comes makes people angry in most cases. Most people have legitimate reasons for gettin pissed and ranting, So stop hurling irrelevant insults around. Getting a product from a tech savvy sales rep is great. but being put on hold by some thick-accented Indian tech-support guy half way around the world while losing money by the minute sucks big time. Its the day to day fuckups that they are raving about. Give the same task to a small band of linux firms and you can get a good nights sleep. Catch my drift?
Tell me MIKEY, have you ever worked at Microsoft? Have you been to Washington and seen what Microsoft has done for the economy there? Are you aware that Microsoft employees (excluding Bill G) give more money to charity than any other for profit company in the world? Did you know that Microsoft gives its employees that most comprehensive (and expensive) health insurance available?
So I ask you again genius, have you EVER worked there? Or better yet, give me 10 facts that as you say makes "Microsoft suck as a company."
Sorry. I don't argue with Believers, but I like how you capitalized MIKEY, insinuating an ultra-condescending tone. It was pretty clever, that you took my name, added a 'Y' and capitalized the whole of it. I felt the angst. No.. really. It was impressive.
you don't argue because you don't have an argument. You call me a believer when you are a follower. The difference between my belief and and your faith (which is what you're doing when you follow something without any information) is that me belief is based on facts and experience and your faith is based on.... Well, you let me know when you figure it out.
By the way, were do you work that is so much better than Microsoft?
:)
STEVEY WARSHAWY
"me belief"
*priceless*
Microsoft may not be a bad place to work for, but you have to question _your_ ethics when you walk into a company that abuses it's market share to crush competition and squelch any innovation. Sure, your living in the lap of luxury, but your strangling your entire family in order to do so. And if you can't see that (or you view my last sentence at a personal perspective [not your direct family, I'm talking about the global family]) then you really need to take a step back and try to see the bigger picture here.
Andir,
The worlds biggest philanthropist is a Microsoft employee, and he's managed to convince the second richest man in the world to join in. I don't see where ethics
are in question. We are a capitalist society aren't we? It's not like Microsoft sits in front of retail stores and prevents you from buying other peoples products. People have a choice, and they COULD use products other than Windows and Office, but they don't.
Microsoft does not squelch innovation; they try to beat the competition and usually win, but sometimes they don't. Take a look at nintendo for instance; they were dead in the water and Microsoft let them be. Then nintendo created DS and now the create Wii, which has revived Nintendo. Do you see Microsoft stopping Nintendo? No. Will you see Microsoft learn from the great ideas Nintendo had and try to improve upon them. Absolutely.
Don,
IF you have a group of linux guys to support you then perhaps support is great, but of the millions of PC owners, how many of them are able to get that support? If you turned the tables and installed linux on hundreds of millions of machines, do you really think that everyone would have access to these linux gurus for support? Also, Linux doesn't have to be concerned with any legacy code, or backwards compatibility; which is the same advantage Apple has. Microsoft has literally thousands of employees working on sustained engineering and supporting old legacy software. Why you may ask? Well because people don't want to give up their 16 bit DOS based word processors. You have no idea how backwards compatibility complicates software. Microsoft literally has to simulate bugs that were in old code in their new code so that they don't break older software. You try managing that scenario sometime. I will give it to you that tier 1 support at Microsoft is substandard, and I do hate that the support center for tier 1 support is not located in the US. That's clearly a money saving business decision for Microsoft. However, if you are any good at describing your issue to the tier 1 support guy, it's VERY easy to get escalated and talk with someone who knows what they're talking about. Not to mention most of the support calls from end users could be avoided if people would just some time to search the internet for their particular problem. A good percentage of the IT related call at the corporate level skip tier 1 support because they have a service contract. So in reality, complaining about support is usually more about being too lazy to do some research.
---"The worlds biggest philanthropist is a Microsoft employee"
Bill Gates retired from Microsoft. Besides that fact, giving money to a charity has never and will never make you a good person. He obtained that money through shady deeds.
---"We are a capitalist society aren't we?"
"We" (assuming your an America) live in a Capitalist society under a free market economy. There is a fine balance that must be maintained as the ultimate goal in a capitalist company is supreme control, or Monopoly. For capitalism to work, you must have competition. This is why Monopoly laws were set in place. Without competition you have no control over the company producing the goods and no control over the prices they charge.
---"It's not like Microsoft sits in front of retail stores and prevents you from buying other peoples products. People have a choice, and they COULD use products other than Windows and Office, but they don't."
People don't have choice. With the market share of Microsoft, all business documents, emails (for the most part), entertainment software, business software, and services all rely on Windows technology. Unless Microsoft releases control of that technology to it's competitors, the world has no choice in service providers. Period. You cannot succeed in today's world without paying something to Microsoft. You don't see a problem with that?
---"Microsoft does not squelch innovation; they try to beat the competition and usually win, but sometimes they don't. Take a look at nintendo for instance; they were dead in the water and Microsoft let them be. Then nintendo created DS and now the create Wii, which has revived Nintendo. Do you see Microsoft stopping Nintendo? No. Will you see Microsoft learn from the great ideas Nintendo had and try to improve upon them. Absolutely."
They were dead in the water because of Sony (PS2) and they got pig headed with the Nintendo 64 and pricing. It didn't work for them because they had competition. You've just proven why competition is good, but for all the wrong reasons. Microsoft however tried to stifle competition and innovation by using closed "defacto" standards such as .NET, DirectX, Exchange, Active Directory, etc. and by creating these internal standards and being he market dominator, they maintain a stranglehold on the market. Microsoft excels in the console business because it's a business model they are good at. Exclusivity and Proprietary devices. The only way to compete in the console business is to create the entire gamut from controller to TV and Microsoft loves this. A fight for dominance. You cannot create software without first asking Microsoft for permission. The same applies for controllers, attachments and whatnot. Does this help the consumer? Have you checked the amount of cash your dishing out in licenses? Add-ons? I sincerely hope Nintendo does keep pushing the competition. If Microsoft gains dominance in the living room as well, you can kiss that Nintendo innovation good-bye.
hey STEVEY WARSHAWY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atTcylfV4lg
Furthermore, tell me what Linux has done in comparison to Microsoft in standardizing technology and making it available and easy to use for the masses. Answer, JACK SH*T
Don't bother answering him. He's a believer: he's already been lost.
haha
For the record, I'm also a believer, but I hold different beliefs than yours.
And I don't chastise people for thinking.... otherwise.
:)
Monoculture is bad. The evidence is all around you, and it has been proven throughout history for tens of thousands of years.
You want to talk about "standardizing technology"? You're a fool if you think it was Microsoft. The very standards you're using to post your comments on this site were created decades ago by people running UNIX, not Windows. You wouldn't be able to send mail, surf the Internet (with IE or anything else), transfer files, chat, whatever if it hadn't been for UNIX.
I'd put UNIX up against Windows in an argument for "standardizing technology for the masses" any day.
It was UNIX that created the standards; it was Microsoft that made those standards accessible to the world at large. Yes, Microsoft uses its proprietary technology base to make sure that its market share remains untouched, but I ask you how this is a bad thing for them to do. A classic example is DirectX vs openGL; if Microsoft had just used openGL and not developed DirectX, then where is the 'competition' for openGL? If competition makes things better, how is having one open solution better than multiple closed solutions?
In any non-commodity based business (i.e., oil), I find the idea that a company in a global economy can be a 'monopoly' to be laughable. Companies that aren't built on a specific good are built on ideas, and those cannot be monopolized.
John, thanks for putting to words the problem I had with these arguments against MS.
François, if you're going to rant, either be coherent or crazy (better yet; both!)
As much as I love reading this site, everything has to go down the road of Apple doesn't it!
@Golferal - completely agree there!
I fear the whispers of sense will soon be drowned out by all the noise in this conversation.
PLEASE ADJUST YOUR NOISE FILTERS NOW
NOISE FILTER ADJUSTMENT IS WARRANTED AT THIS TIME
Of all the people I think have the right to criticize Microsoft, I don't think the OLPC guys are one of them. Last I checked it was over budget and still sucked for everything except watching porn.
Hard work, good tech, ethics : that is definitely Microsoft.
Hard work: There is no such thing as "free" software. Microsoft is entitled to the profits from the massive amounts of work they have put into their OS and other software.
Good tech: If you are an elitist geek or can afford to pay one or two to be at your beck and call, sure you can use Linux. For most of the world, this is not an option. Linux on the OLPC will be a disaster. Kudos to Nigeria for being smart enough to realize that.
Ethics: To whom is the Linux community accountable? No one. But if MSoft so much as farts in the wrong place, the hordes will be all over them.
The way most posters here assume stupidity and cupidity to be at the heart of this borders on racism.
Wow, I have to give you credit. My sarcasm meter was through the roof reading that... until I realized you were being serious.
Racism? Are you kidding me?
And FYI:
Hard work: The hard work of hundred (or thousands) of coders all over the world to try to make a stable core system that will run a multitude of hardware and software fast and efficiently. (Unfortunately, the only thing keeping this task difficult is Microsoft with their proprietary systems stranglehold. .NET/DirectX/Active Directory/etc.)
Good Tech: You mean like the latest hardware, that automatically creates drivers for the most market penetrated OS in the world? Your giving Microsoft credit for creating drivers for all that hardware? Sorry bro, that's the hardware vendor. Or perhaps your talking about the "good tech" that's been the source of hundreds upon thousands of security vulnerabilities (some of which are still denied by MS.) Maybe your talking about .NET, the direct proprietary ripoff of Java? Good tech?
Ethics: ... and Microsoft do not go hand in hand. Ever. As far as accountability; Whoever sold you the OS. If you downloaded it and installed it yourself, that's your own damn fault. Just as if you had downloaded that trojan in windows. There are plenty of distributions out there that offer service and support for Linux builds that they sell you. In fact, that's the business model they're in. Service.
Linux teaches you to fish and does not give you fish... Know and have a basic understanding of what is in your box. Don't just be a pushover for big business. Stripe the jargon and KNOW what they are advertising.
Don, Christian allusions aside, the 'teach a man to fish' thing is only semirelevent because you first have to decide what task the person needs to do.
For most computer users, it's not 'rebuild the kernel' or 'figure out how to change resolutions by editing an obscure config file with minimalist documentation' - it's 'read and reply to email' and 'write a document in a word processor'.
This is the core problem with Linux users - they forget who the actual end user is. It's not Linux coders - it's regular people who have no particular love of computer but use them as a tool to get their work done.
Nothing about Linux makes it a better choice in terms of teaching someone how to use a computer for an actual end-user task. That's why it's still not making much of a dent against Windows.
To use your analogy a bit more clearly:
You want to catch some fish...
Microsoft gives you a rod & reel, shows you the lake, and offers several different-sized boats with varying levels of leak protection. The reel usually works, but does get tangled if you don't know what you're doing, requiring you to ask someone to untangle the line in the reel so you can get back to fishing. Microsoft does offer some information on how to fish, but it involves a paperclip popping up and saying "It looks like you're trying to catch a fish..."
OS X gives you a rod & reel, shows you the lake, and offers a single small yacht that doesn't leak, but looks nice when you're on the lake. Optionally, you can press a button on the boat's console and you'll be taken to a nice spot in the lake where your rod and reel will automatically deploy and a pleasant chime will sound if you get a bite. If you look around the yacht, you'll find a cleverly-worded book on how to fish, but it ends with "However, you don't have to do any of this because the yacht will do it all for you, and all you have to do is pull in the line then clean and cook the fish... Which may also be done automatically in the galley with the iStove."
Linux gives you a large rowboat that could be upgraded if you're the type who likes to upgrade boats, a rod in several pieces, a roll of fishing line, and all the components for a reel (but disassembled). It offers to show you the lake, but only after you've upgraded the boat and built the reel and connected it all together. After that, you're on your way! Before you get there, though, you MUST read the included 400-page manual entitled "The varying degrees of fishing and the concise directory of bait in an enclosed environment, Volume II." which will teach you all about fishing, the biology of the fish, the biology of the bait, the weather, pH levels in various lakes, the merits of different lengths of fishing line, the need to calibrate your reel precisely, and various other fascinating subjects. Once you're done with the books, then you can dip your line into the lake and stand there for six hours because you misinterpreted chapter 18's information on good spots to find a fish.... So you move to a different spot... and so on... Until you finally get a bite, reel it in through muscle alone and find that you've gotten a pufferfish which is not compatible with your digestive system.
Yeah, but your Microsoft boat, rod and real only work in Microsoft lake and they charge a premium to fish there.
The Apple boat is like the Microsoft boat in that it will only work on their lake, but you can also use their rod and real in a Microsoft boat.
Your Linux boat, rod and real will work in any lake you want and it will usually produce the biggest fish in the least amount of time once you get started.
Yeah, but your Microsoft boat, rod and real only work in Microsoft lake and they charge a premium to fish there.
The Apple boat is like the Microsoft boat in that it will only work on their lake, but you can also use their rod and real in a Microsoft boat.
Your Linux boat, rod and real will work in any lake you want and it will usually produce the biggest fish in the least amount of time once you get started.
IIRC it's the first Linux company CEO featured on CE-Oh no he didn't.
Gasp ?!! Ballmer would do THAT ??? I'm just speechless. Not!
You know this is just an example of good business practices. The ethics don't really come into play. Ballmer saw an opening and managed to take it.
I'm sorry - precisely which 'ethics' are even relevent to it? Microsoft saw a bunch of computers going out with a competitor's OS on it. They went to Nigeria and said 'Hey - we think you should consider using our software on your systems, we'll give you a price break to encourage the deal.'
How exactly is this any different than say Wal*Mart cutting their margins to the bone to beat our K-Mart by a penny or the kind of cut-throat competition in the PC hardware biz?
This is business guys. Microsoft isn't in this as a hobby - this is what businesses do, and Microsoft does it VERY well.
If you can show that Micrsoft is selling Windows to Nigeria below cost, THEN you'd have a complaint - and that may be infact what's happening - but Bancilhon doesn't actually make that claim. He vaguely implies that something shady has happened because he knows most Linux and Mac people will eat that up without question, and because he believes his OS *must* be better and more desirable than Windows.
If Bancilhon knows of any real improprietry on Microsoft's part, then he should say so. In fact, what he actually said implies the opposite:
Then your people entered the game and the deal got more competitive. I would not say it got dirty, but someone could have said that. They fought and fought the deal, but still the customer was happy to get CMPC and Mandriva.
Wow - Microsoft competed with them. Such an unethical thing for another company in the same business to do.
Amen
way to be, Jeff. Well stated.
So two competing businesses went after the same target, and one outbid or out-negotiated the other? Yes, that is business.
Also, I think that OS fanboys have too much loyalty - maybe I'm objecting to the existence of fanboys altogether...
When reading the following keep in mind I'm a multi-OS using IT guy, and don't have any real emotional interest in any OS.
Microsoft's operating systems are the standard for general use computers. They really are the best choice in terms of an operating system for the end user. They have massive hardware and software support, have become very stable, and everyone is used to using them.
Does Windows have its faults. Of course. I'm security+, CISSP and CEH. Windows is probably the most insecure operating system... Of course, this really is a design decision and one the general public tends to agree with. The user has ultimate freedom and so much can be done in a simple and understandable way. Of course, generally with such freedom comes the threat of programs that take advantage of these freedoms.
Linux, on the other hand, doesn't offer the user such a complete ease of use. I don't care what anyone says, once you go beyond running pre-installed applications the level of difficulty in installing drivers and software off the net becomes increasingly difficult. There are systems for automating this (a la RPM), however you c an very easily run into the same security threats through some of these systems.
Linux is not easy. If anyone has to support Linux systems, they know of the very large support bill or salaries for in house linux professionals needed to deal with the problems. Every IT staff already comes with workable knowledge of Windows, and you don't pay extra for it. I personally use Ubuntu on my laptop, and I find it extremely useful. I use other variants for running things like snort, aircrack, nessus and other security tools.
Despite this, it would be insane to suggest that there exists a parallel in quality and ease of use between Ubuntu and say Windows XP. I've had far less hardware support with Linux and even stability wise I'd say my Linux machines screw up more after adding new programs and such. After my last updating of Ubuntu, I've had this problem where my mouse clicks don't register sometimes. This sort of thing has happened regularly.
Linux is just not ready for general use.
As far as OS X... Well, its nice, but Apple screwed this up all on their own. If anyone still remembers, they closed off their platform many many years ago. There are still no third party makers of Apple computers. Apple's strategy for the PC was greedy and foolish. That is why no one is adopting OS X in mass numbers. If they were smart they'd make OS X run on non-Apple computer, or let other people (like Dell) build Apple computers.
Of course they won't do that... this would mean they'd need to provide more support, make the platform more open, etc etc. Apple would quickly encounter many of the same problems that Windows faces, and that is the last thing they want.. This is why Apple will remain at a small market share. The only reason they are still making machines is because of the Ipod. If they didn't have that unlikely success, Apple would be close to dead right now...
There are some might big faults with all companies and operating systems. I really see no viable candidate other than Windows for general use at the moment. Besides, its up to the customer... The customer is free to do whatever they want. Obviously this African govt saw more of incentive to go to windows.. and that IS how business is supposed to work..
How ironic; the French lecturing on the topic of ethics.
its a damn OS not a friggin way of life. People here are too damn loyal to their special brands. Like there is a "morally" right version of an OS to use. Thats a load of crap. Just because you believe a certain method of coding software is the "morally" right way of doing things does not make it so. Its a bunch of 0 and 1s thats all it is. There is no "immoral" way of producing code. Justhow people may possibly use it. And last time I checked using Windows/Linux/OSX/BSD/Unix whatever does not constitute any wrong doing. Its a tool just like if you use a phillips head screwdrivers instead of a flathead screwdriver you do not become morally corrupted. Or swingline vs. boston stanley staplers.
It's not about producing code. It's about the morality of a company that abuses it's market power to squash competition so they can do things however they want (and charge whatever they want.)
Also, I can guarantee you that I can use any phillips screwdriver on that screw or replace it with a flat head screw if I wanted to and it would work just as well, maybe better. Also, I can probably find staples that work in either brand of stapler without special adapters.
Im sorry Francois, I hate Ballmer as much as anybody else...but what did you expect from a deal with the NIGERIAN government??? Just be happy your end of the deal went through without being told you were going to share in someone's inheritance or some other such scam.
This poor guy really thinks Microsoft stooped to a bribe for a small contract like this. Maybe that's how he does business, but the U.S. is pretty strict about bribery. It's not worth the risk (except for small companies bribing politicians). Microsoft would have to be crazy to use bribery and it has many other tools to make the sale, some af which are illegal under antitrust laws, but nothing that would be punished as harshly as outright bribery of foreign officials.
"Andir3.0 @ Nov 1st 2007 4:10PM
Yeah, but your Microsoft boat, rod and real only work in Microsoft lake and they charge a premium to fish there.
The Apple boat is like the Microsoft boat in that it will only work on their lake, but you can also use their rod and real in a Microsoft boat.
Your Linux boat, rod and real will work in any lake you want and it will usually produce the biggest fish in the least amount of time once you get started."
Um not true at all. A good example how a fanboy spreads FUD. Instead of using this magical analogies explain to me how as a window user I am being forced to use things I do not want to use given that I made the choice to use Windows because it seems to be the most versatile OS in terms of software and hardware support?
I honestly do want to know in a clear manner because your analogies are confusing me. I think the fishing example confused me. So lets try this A boat is a computer the OS is the engine.
Microsoft Engine: Microsoft's Engine works on a limited number of boats however those boats are both some of the best and most cost effective boats I can buy. Generally if I buy these boats I can get the MS engine with it for very little extra and its already installed and I can use it the moment I buy it but I may not be running my boat that efficiently if I do. Fortuantly I can change a lot of things my boat and all sorts of upgrades for my boat are available to me by using this MS engine. Also I can make something that uses the MS engine's provided framework to make my own custom things which other people can buy. The engine may not be efficent but I can buy hardware cheaply enough that will make it work nicely for me. You cannot touch the engine itself but you can change a lot about how it works with your boat.
Apple Engine: I need to buy the boat and the engine from apple together bundled. But I get a pretty boats if not expensive. It comes with a lot of nice stuff already attached to it and I can certainly buy more but there are not as many things available to me for that. But it is a lot more reliable since it is all tied together right from the start. The only bad thing is if I want more speed from my boat I generally need to buy a whole new boat and most hardware will not easily work with an apple boat. But its pretty. Can't really touch the engine and there is not a lot it will let me change about how my boats works with it.
Linux Engine: Well its not so much a whole engine as its the main important parts of the engine. I need to put the rest together but then thats a ton of work. I can get it from some other people who made a nice engine too which are nice but often includes things I don't want or even know what it does. If I try and remove them though I may break something important. I can find out though easily but I gotta read these huge techno geek manuals. Also each of these engines have their own way of trying to make it easy for me to customize how it works with my boat but each one does it differently. I can also tinker with the engine all I want but anything I change to the fundamental part of the engine I have to tell everyone how I did so. Also apparently if use any part of the engine in my own customized mods I need to let everyone know my mod too freely. But I can still make my own stuff and sell it too....The linux engine will work with any boat almost which is cool. However as an end user I can find it hard to work with sometimes and is all very confusing and isjointed at times though there are some very cool engines based on the Linux framework which works but not always easily. Mods are numorous but not as much as with my MS engine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Id_kGL3M5Cg
Computers suck.
Paul wrote: "Seriously people actually own Zunes more then a million people own them thats a significant amount. So go buzz off. We would like to hear some news about our player too its only one day not like we didn't have to sit through monhs of stupid iPhone gushing and iPod gushing."
Seriously people actually use Linux more then a million people use Linux thats a significant amount. So go buzz off. We would like to hear some news about our OS too its only one day not like we didn't have to sit through months of stupid Vista gushing and XP gushing.
Linux Engine: I can look under the hood.
love the old argument:
"macs are for babies" -you dumb
"wins are for smart guys" -me smart
"lins are for geeks" -you geek
First off when you quote me do it in the right context. I was upset that as a Zune owner we were getting a meaningful (and much needed) update to the hardware and software of our players and 90% of the comments were iPod fanboys saying how the Zune needs to die. Especially after the 100+ topics and news posts made about the iPhone. I felt it was unreasonable and not needed. And whatever the hell a Zune has to do with Linux is beyond me and I think most people would agree is totally irrelevant to the whole discussion.
I like linux I use linux and I love gentoo. Its what I like to use. If I saw a post about a brand spanking new interface overhaul to Gnome I would be happy. I may not say anything but I would not say buzz off to the commenter's in that who are gushing the greatness of linux. Or say how linux oughta die.
My comments come down to simply this: An Operating System is a tool and as such I see no reason for people nor companies to sit there and bas each other simply because of a business deal gone sour. its business that all it is. Yes the open source movement is great I think its wonderful people can modify the code on their machine as they see fit and they can then share that knowledge with the world. That being said I see nothing wrong with the closed source license system either as it is the perogative of the content creator as to how they want to distribute their software. There is nothing evil about it. I think its ridiculous to see comments from a CEO no less like this. MS's goal is the same as Mandriva's - to get as many people as possible to use their platform. MS simply gave nigeria a great incentive to using windows. Mandriva probably started out the whole deal the same way by undercutting a Windows machine cost.
I see no reason why it should be treated like a religious war
which frankly is how it seems like it is sometimes.
Windows / Linux... In the end it is going to be used for one purpose... Writing those stupid spam mails about millions of dollars waiting for me in some f$%ked up ex-dictators bank account...
Not impressed!
Slamming Ballmer is not hard to do - and most of the time he does it to himself anyway_
So this dude is upset at Ballmer [and Micro$oft] for selling their stuff to the Nigerian Government after he already closed a deal [made a sale]?
Frankie made money on the deal?
And he's upset that Ballmer made money on a second deal with the same folks after he did?
Maybe this is cutting into future earnings and circling the barn a little too much by buying machine w/ one OS and then turning around and re-installing them with a different OS after - but Frankie just made a big chunk of money and he's upset?
Hmmm....
Aside from Ballmer being a moron anyway....they are probably going to push Vista [over XP] and in 6-10 months we'll hear about this again - except the headline will read more like "Nigerian Government declares ware on the US because Ballmer is a Moron and Vista sucks!"
since i'm an anti-ballmer kind of guy, and i love it when people criticize him, i'm saying this is more of a "CE-Oh thanks for finally sticking it to the man!" article.
1. How does MS "squelch any innovation"? Surface computer. Tablet. That stuff doesn't matter to you?
2. MS already announced they would give XP to developing countries for a dollar or two.
3. No matter what MS does, they will always get hammered by jackasses on blogs.
In a way, I can understand this fellow's frustrations. But in the end, a customer has to choose what they feel is best for them. His blog rant will accomplish nothing except for letting him vent.
OK, a bit OT here - I have nothing against François personally, and granted, English may not be his native language, but that blog entry was painful to read. How could he ever expect to be taken seriously by anyone (especially Ballmer) if he doesn't utilize proper English grammar? He desperately needs a native English speaker to proofread and edit his writings, because his writing makes him come across as simple-minded.