Dash Express beta hands-on

We recently got to take a Dash Express beta unit for a spin, and while they're still gluing all the software together behind the scenes in anticipation of launch, we did spot the makings of a few obvious and ridiculously useful features new users can expect in February. Besides the stuff we've already heard about (like sending addresses and geo-RSS feeds via WiFi and cellular, or local Zillow property values), the Dash Express has some other tricks up its sleeve, like:

• The ability to display current local gas prices in its gas station search!
  
• Local theaters show movies and showtimes (although you can't order tickets through the Dash Express -- yet).
• Yahoo Local searches show aggregate user ratings.
• Over the air updates via cellular data. (We're not yet sure what happens if you opt out of service -- we'd guess you'll just have to use the old USB cable or WiFi.)
• And, of course, there's the traffic data, which not only shows which local roads with traffic data from real time and historic Dash GPS users but also uses Inrix traffic feeds.
• And just so you know whether the system is or isn't too sure about its traffic predictions, the Dash Express also gauges its "confidence" with dashed and solid lines -- see above. (Of course, it also plots routes predicted by ETA and traffic flow, and not necessarily just by distance.)

Compared to your usual, run of the mill GPS, whole connected navigator experience was not dissimilar from the jump between going from a VCR to a TiVo -- which is why we think maybe, just maybe, people might actually want to pay for service with this thing. Of course, the downside for dash is most people won't even realize what an amazing boon these kinds of features really are until they've taken one home and discovered it first hand out in the world. (Oh, videos after the break.)

Gallery: Dash Express beta hands-on

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[Pawel @ Jan 31st 2008 9:51PM]

Mark,

Could you explain a bit more clearly how the device will integrate with third party web services? For instance, could I send points of interests to the Dash and update them at will from a site/database I create?

Thanks,
Pawel

[Derrick @ Feb 20th 2008 9:27AM]

UHH - Where are our units?? It's February 20th, and we've heard nary a word. I can feel a pushout coming on as they still have yet to release a 3D view. Could that be the holdup??

[Jesse S @ Dec 17th 2007 1:56AM]

I want one now.

[David Hamby @ Dec 17th 2007 6:45AM]

My Treo 700P does all this and more and I've been using it for ten months already.

[Andrew @ Dec 17th 2007 10:43AM]

I leave the GPS up to my simple car navigation and my iPhone takes care of the rest like gas prices, traffic, movie tickets.

Dash Express needs to either drop the upfront cost of the unit significantly (free) or do away with the ridiculously high monthly fee. You cant have both. $600 for the unit + $156 service ($13 month) comes out to $756 your first year before taxes!!

[Jesse S @ Dec 17th 2007 2:17AM]

You know these guys are smart, as in Part III, even though the guy has a Mac, he doesn't use a Cinemascreen. Why? Cinemascreens use the same panels as the comparable Dell monitors.

[pratorian @ Dec 17th 2007 3:05AM]

I got one! Its a awesome service and an even nicer device. Id pay for this!

Great review guys, however IIRC didnt i read that your not supposed to post screenshots and such of the device online? or did you guys get an exclusive or something?

[modeless @ Dec 17th 2007 3:13AM]

Devices like this and Kindle are why Verizon's and Google's open access commitments are so important. This could have happened years ago if the "soviet ministries" weren't standing in everyone's way.

[modeless @ Dec 17th 2007 3:24AM]

Also, why are the graphics in these devices always so terribly *slow* to update? They need to get some ATI or NVIDIA chips up in there.

[Griffon @ Dec 17th 2007 3:44AM]

I don't think Tom Tom or Garmin are exactly quaking in their boots... Yester year box design, all the modern units are fairly svelte 4 inch flat screens. No 3d guidance view, wtf? That screen looks very low resolution. My phone has a more pixels then that... nothing is anti aliased or smoothed yet it looks like it's updating like 1999 device (horrible under powered maybe). No voice control, it's mostly token effort on todays stuff but at least it's their. No clear view indicating lane like on navigon. Some very cool sounding features but looks like they are missing the boat on a ton of the basics. I think they are to caught up in the service side and the device will be barely usable (hope that is not the case though)

[Griffon @ Dec 17th 2007 3:49AM]

Also, there is a reason almost everyone has gone a more animated looking map view on these devices, the ultra realistic data view shown in all these shots do not work for shit when trying to actually navigate, Take the cursor for example it is scaled totally wrong to give a good accurate representation of distance on a city block but that is a problem of the maps scale not the overlay object. This is generally handled by a more animated topical or 3d view that shows a truly relative distance between you and turns but is arbitrarily distorted vs what a map would show.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 5:10AM]

Griffon - This is Mark from Dash. You can check out our technical specs on the product detail page at Dash.net if you want to see the screen resolution or other technical details. Currently all of the press screen shots we have released show our 2D mode since it does a great job of highlighting our traffic data. We do have a 3D mode that we haven't shown off yet, that is great for situations when a user needs more guidance. Hopefully you will get a chance to experience a Dash first hand to see how it matches your expectations.

Thanks,

Mark

[offthegrid @ Dec 17th 2007 5:50AM]

I emailed Dash about the lack of 3D display and was told that there is a 3D that has been disabled for now but that will be on any shipped units. The lack of 3D would kill this for me so I hope that's true.

Other than that the open interface and connectivity aren't even available anywhere else. It sounds as though you could keep this unit for a long time and not lose out feature wise to the next gen units. Whenever Garmin comes out with a new feature you have to buy a new unit. TomTom seems to be bucking that trend but they are way behind this conceptually.

Of course when it comes down to it routing and ease of use are the main needs in a GPS. If they get that right this will be a winner.

[drunkenoaf @ Dec 17th 2007 5:48AM]

Wonderful. I hope Dash do well, as it's fantastically well thought out and looks to work brilliantly.

But, TomTom are working on real-time traffic data gathered anonymously from mobile phone handsets. They have a better interface-- and the 3D view is better (imho) than what Dash provide. Their Satnav boxes are sexier; their screens better; they do bluetooth hands-free for your phone, etc etc.

Dash are charging alot for an ugly device. Perhaps they need to learn from nearby Apple (whose products they love) about premium pricing, snazzy user interfaces and product design.

[Brian @ Dec 17th 2007 10:13AM]

I'm definitely looking forward to seeing a production unit. I've been on the mailing list for these guys since the product was announced but unfortunately, was not included in the beta test. I've held out on buying a GPS to see how this product develops. When the product was announced nearly a year ago, many of the features were revolutionary, but several of them are now available on the high-end TomTom and Garmin units.

I'm looking at either a Dash Express or a Garmin Nuvi 760 around tax return time in 2008. I'm not thrilled about Dash's form factor, and the Nuvi is far better in that regard. I'd prefer not to have a bracket on my windshield screaming, "Break into this car! There might be a GPS in here!" The true two-way nature of the Dash is a serious advantage, but with CES in January and the typical post-Christmas price reductions on electronics, it's going to be a tough battle for my cash.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:11AM]

Brian - This is Mark from Dash. I am glad to hear that you will be considering purchasing a Dash. Hopefully you will find that the features enabled by true internet connectivity (the Dash Driver Network, Yahoo! Local Search, 3rd Part Web Services, Automatic Software Updates, Send 2 Car) will overcome some of the drawbacks you see in the unit. Our first product isn't perfect, but we think it has some really differentiated features for those that want more than just directions from point A to point B from their GPS.

Mark

[Brian @ Dec 17th 2007 12:29PM]

Thanks for the reply, Mark. The form factor really is a big deal to me. Does the Dash Express fold up on a hinge, or is it molded in that L-Shape? I think the greatest thing about the Nuvi is the slim form factor. I can take it out of the car, from a bracket that clips onto my vent, and toss it in my laptop bag (or man-bag!) or even a cargo pocket in my pants. With an L-shaped device, it essentially takes up the volume of a cube, or close to it. If I can't easily take it with me when I leave my vehicle then it has to stay in it. I don't know how common car break-ins are in southern California, I'm in the Detroit metro area. Simply having a bracket on your windshield is plenty reason to get your window smashed. Whether the device is in there or not, I still have a smashed window.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 10:34PM]

Brian - The shape doesn't fold, so what you see is what you get with the form factor. We recognize that the industry has gone slim, but we decided to put in a high gain wi-fi antenna that would help ensure wireless software updates to the device while it is left in car. Again, Dash won't have *every* bell and whistle the competition does... for example we don't have a MP3 player and photo viewer. Rather than focusing exclusively on "feature parity" we wanted to really differentiate our offering by creating some compelling features only available with a two-way internet connection. We certainly won't be for everyone, but hopefully many people will find crowd sourced traffic, Yahoo! Local Search, 3rd party web services, automatic updates, and Send2Car compelling enough to give us a try.

Mark

[Nicholas @ Dec 17th 2007 12:18PM]

I was all-in on the Dash, but after seeing that last video-- what gives with the terribly slow redraw (especially after dragging the map?) Ugh. Count me out. Sorry, guys. You really need to fix that. Unless that's just a "bug" in the beta version? Or I'm misunderstanding the map view.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:08PM]

Nicholas -The video you are viewing is of beta software. I know we have seen performance improvements over the last course of the development cycle, and I expect them to continue. One of the good things about a Dash unit is that it will automatically get software updates via wi-fi and GPRS, so you will constantly have our latest software.

Mark

[Griffon @ Dec 17th 2007 12:43PM]

I see mark is doing a nice job of the spin dance, sortta.

Is the 3d interface so ugly Mark that you guys have had to keep it under total wraps and hide it from civilization as we know it? Dose it not work with the traffic routing or something?

$600 +-$10 a month makes this the most expensive device on the market to own over time. You have like 5 screen shots a couple videos but no complete feature demo or even a full break down online. Your pretty much asking for biblical type faith.

The Navigon offers free traffic for life, others offer a FM data for 6 bucks a month. Since the Dash is not a iphone I don't imagine there will be a million plus units on the road any time soon (at least not at $600, a price apple could not sustain on their flagship product release). Since the dash data sharing won't be relevant soon (but is totally cool) where is the rest of the data being built and how dose it distinguish from the FM data everyone offers for less?

Bluetooth? MP3 playback? Voice prompting? Will the wifi act as a repeater? Will the cel data act as a proxy for a laptop? Honestly I can't tell from your web site and the limited vids what the Dash can do at all. It looks like you guys have one angle and have pushed it at the expense of everything else. If you don't want to flop you have got to put out real information, this mysterious shiny object bit is old and not being done well IMO. If you guys are truly playing to compete you are not showing where the value is particularly given the steep subscription rate and high out of pocket for a decidedly old design type exterior.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:05PM]

Griffon -

As my wife will attest, I can't dance to save my life, much less spin dance. On the off chance you are claiming I am spinning the facts, not a chance. As I have stated in a number of comments on this blog post and others, some people will like what Dash has to offer, and some won't. No need for me to spin anything... we need customers who WANT what we have, because that will result in happy customers.

Ok, now onto the substance of your post. The reason you haven't seen the 3D view yet is two fold:

1 - The 2D view does a great job of showing off how we display traffic, so we like showing it
2 - The 3D view is a work in progress. It exists, it just isn't ready for prime time yet.

Now onto pricing. Yes, we will be one of the more expensive units on the market, but we will also be the most differentiated unit on the market. Not one other navigation device can do a live Yahoo Local Search from the car, wirelessly send an address to the car, have live flow based traffic data from all the other Dash drivers, wirelessly update the device without taking it out of the car, integrate with third party web services, etc. So, yes we are more expensive that most (not all) other navigation devices, but we are also unique in our capabilities.

I will wrap up by saying that it goes without saying that you are clearly a skeptic of ours, and that is fine. Every start-up has it's skeptics and the way we can win people like you over is by delivering great products, and that is what we are going to try and do. Hopefully you will get a chance to ride with a Dash someday soon and see some of the unique features I mentioned above.

Mark

[the evaluator @ Dec 17th 2007 1:29PM]

as i think one of the other posters pointed out, i believe they've priced themselves right out of the market. i was part of the national road test, loved the product, and i won't be purchasing a unit. I was extremely disappointed when i saw the pricing structure, and the lack of features like bluetooth in the 1.0 product. i just purchased a tomtom 720 for 350 with a 150 dollar discount at a major retailer. with Dash monthly service.

you're expecting people to pay 600 for the unit, and several hundred dollars for the service, when the cost of that service equates to the price of another GPS...i would have payed 5.95 a month, or as i urged during the beta, perhaps a tivo style lifetime subscription. as it stands right now, i'll simply look up addresses using google maps on my smartphone and key them into the tomtom, and suffer the inconvenience.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:18PM]

the evaluator - I am sorry to hear that it looks like our pricing is keeping you from buying the product. The Dash 0.9 product that you tested demonstrated our vision, but the new Dash Express really is our 1.0 product, and I hope you will consider checking out all the improvements before making a purchase decision.

Mark

[Leach @ Dec 17th 2007 3:48PM]

But does it play Doom? or blend? More importantly blend.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:08PM]

It doesn't blend, but I bet it could be blended:

http://www.willitblend.com/

Mark

[johnwarren @ Dec 17th 2007 7:11PM]

Mark,

I hate windshield mounts plus they are illegal in California and those mounting disks will not stick to a curved dash.

Does the part of the mount that the Dash plugs into have a standard AMPS hole patters so we can use any AMPS mount we want to use?

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:23PM]

Johnwarren - Yes, I am happy to report you can use any AMPS mount you want!

[Timon @ Dec 18th 2007 2:10AM]

That's great. Now the harder question is if I should cancel my TomTom 920T order. It would be much easier if I could check out a Dash. It's going to be a long wait until Feb.

One more questions, The TomTom x20 series with the latest maps will route using HOV lanes and really use the HOV lanes and ramps. What about the Dash, will it actively use HOV lanes when routing?

Also, who's maps does the Dash use?

[Vic @ Dec 17th 2007 7:26PM]

Please-O-please show us the route screen! Is it like a regular GPS device(TomTom)(teleAtlas done) with arrows and roads that display heading up(good)or is it like Yahoo maps on a PC witch is not so good for navigating streets while driving.

And if anyone is listening include a map screen of search results, 10 miles is OK if it is ahead of you on the interstate, but not so good if it is 10 miles behind you! And, not to mention, stopping at a post office...on the way.

No beta testing for me...oh well, but it's not to late, send me one.

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:11PM]

Vic - While I can't accommodate screen shot requests I can say that I am happy to report we have both a "heading up" and "north up" view for our 2D mode... so users have a choice! I can also recommend that you check out the youtube videos we posted that demo the product. Here is the link:

http://www.youtube.com/dashnavigation

[Bill Hungate @ Dec 17th 2007 9:28PM]

Mark, my heart was racing when I watched the videos of the searches. That's exciting stuff. Then, I saw the on-screen maps. Tiny detail, tiny lettering, thin roads, no name of the street you are on....I don't know how you can read it.

I have to agree with another poster, wondering if you forgot the basics. After I pick my route, I want to see clearly where I'm going...at a glance. I want to see how far yet to go and the time remaining. But mainly I want to see big bold streets, names of streets, and map details, as in my Garmin and Navigon.

Maybe this will come? At this price, I want bold, detailed, easy to see maps with time/distance information. The other great features will then be icing on the cake...not the other way around.

I have been waiting for months. I'm a little disappointed, but have faith you guys will be able to adjust.

Sincerely,

Bill Hungate

[mwilliamson @ Dec 17th 2007 11:16PM]

Bill - I am assuming you are referring to the youtube videos we posted. Without complete context it will be tough to address you concerns but let me try anyway. As you would expect the amount of detailed information shown on the 2D map varies based on zoom level, so how large the text is, how many roads are shown, etc. all vary based on zoom level. I don't know if our current design would work for you, only you trying the product would know, but I will say that I am able to get all the information I personally want in just a glance at the screen.

While we have focused on differentiation, we are aware that certain functionality is core to the product and we know we need to nail these basics. We are working hard to get there and hope you will want to try the product!

Mark

[Timon @ Dec 18th 2007 2:29AM]

A question about power. Is the 12v to what ever the dash needs done in the cig plug adapter or is it done in the mount base? reason for asking is about hard wiring rather than using the cig plug.

[Bill Hungate @ Dec 18th 2007 2:15PM]

McWilliamson, thanks for your reply. I agree that I'll need hands-on to see if Dash is the one I've been hoping for. I'll wait to see it.

That said, so far I see only screen shots that resemble the dumbed-down look of Garmin. (Like most everyone else, I have high regard for Garmin, generally). It seems to me that such a sophisticated unit as Dash should offer user-selectable main map information, such as total distance and distance remaining, time to destination, time remaining, clock, etc. And where does it show what street you are on?

I will wait to see if the zoomed-in maps improve the readability. Also, you say you will have 3D maps, so that might get over my concerns about ability to confirm at a glance where you are headed.

Don't want you to think I'm dismissing the other great features, truly revolutionary and desireable...but first I want a great, easy to read navigator. If I have to squint to see details, or pull over, forget it. I'll go the route of another poster who uses his cell phone for searches.

Next year, if not you, someone will get this right. I'm hoping it will be you because you innovated. However, Navigon and TomTom are jumping up fast.

CES in January may tell the future.

I do wish you success...I want your unit!

Bill Hungate

[engadget @ Dec 19th 2007 1:34AM]

The shape of the unit is a deal-killer for me. The biggest benefit to a portable GPS unit, for me, is the ability to take it on trips -- and an L-shaped unit like this won't fit in my briefcase. Big thumbs down on that.

[Steve Cary @ Dec 21st 2007 2:04PM]

Is it fair to ask what the difficulties are with using a WVGA screen with nearly 3 times the number of pixels of the typical WQVGA screen? (that the Dash and most others use).

My Nokia N810 and a HP 310 that I had briefly both used the WVGA screens and the difference in resolution or Pixels Per Inch is astounding. You can do so much more with more detail. Are they just too much more expensive, or use too much graphics horsepower to redraw?

[Harry Janish @ Dec 26th 2007 9:06AM]

Mark, I drive 550 miles one way every other weekend to go home from Detroit MI to Knoxville TN. Will your unit keep me posted on weather conditions as they happen? Traveling thru Ohio in Jan/Feb can be a nightmare. Do you expect to release a bluetooth interface? I really like the ability to get the latest POIs I am looking for off the net, 9 hrs of traveling time makes me sometimes crave a Starbucks and my Garmin c550 does't always know the nearest or newest..

[JGC @ Jan 16th 2008 10:19PM]

I want one BUT it has to meet my expectations. I'm looking for a signal strength indicator for the Dash Network and a break on the monthly pricing (lifetime would be OK). The Dash Network reaches our rural area (wow!!) making it much more useful here than the Nuvi 680 is. If Dash is avoiding brick & mortars, I'll give them points for that.