Nissan, Renault and Better Place team for electric cars, charging points in Israel

While there are many rational and irrational reasons for the delays we've seen in production of a mass-market and massively adopted electric car, most of the major issues seem to be addressed by this new initiative going down in Israel. One of the primary problems with electric cars is refilling, and that's going to be nicely addressed by entrepreneur Shai Agassi's Project Better Place, which will build a charging network of 500,000 plug-in points across the country. Other issues were a bit more easily addressed: since Israel is a small country, the limited range of electric cars isn't as much of an issue, and the government subsidies should make prices competitive -- with the eventual cost of ownership significantly less than gas cars to sweeten the deal even further. Nissan and Renault plan to built the cars, naturally, and hope to port the concepts into other vehicles in other countries in the near future. The plan is to launch the first cars in Israel around 2011.

[SHoe @ Jan 22nd 2008 11:55AM]

Israel is the richest country in the world to receive foreign aid. It gets several billion $ a year from the U.S., but ranks with the worlds top industrial countries in terms of per capita income.
So the funny thing is that the U.S. is providing this aid and yet this is a country that can subsidize a large scale project like this. I think it is great - but I wonder what the average American would think if they knew that they were helping to buy electric cars for Israeli citizens?
America will always cough up machos cash out of fear (coming up on 1 trillions in Iraq~!) - too bad we have to basically be duped into indirectly subsiding something useful. With all that Iraq money, we could go a long way towards subsidizing renewable energy and cleaner cars. But we are always told that it costs too much and that it isn't 'cost effective' to get energy from wind turbines, solar, etc. Been to countries like Germany with fields of hundreds of wind turbines? Why they must be crazy paying all that money! I wonder how many wind turbines a trillion $ would buy?

[luis otero @ Jan 22nd 2008 11:59AM]

Its not like Bush and the actual Government dont have some money inverted in oil,the NOW super powerfull oil companys have something to say, and high ups are all ears for them.

[Erwos @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:04PM]

That money was guaranteed to both the Egyptians and the Israelis as part of the Egypt-Israel Peace Agreement in 1979. Be happy that the Israelis are doing something useful with it.

You do realize they're a client state of ours, right?

[Nadav @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:42PM]

its really amazing how so freaking fast this turned into a political argument!!!

i live in israel btw, and i dont dont know where u got those "facts" from, but israel is NOT the richest country in the world. yeah, theres deffinetly upper-class and middle-class here but LOTS of people here are lower middle class and lower class. israel's poor so dont go posting stuff you know nothing about.

[quandmeme @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:17PM]

Note he said richest country to receive our aid dollars. Yes, many are richer in terms of GNP and per capita revenue.

[Benhur @ Jan 22nd 2008 6:56PM]

Just to clarify this subject,
The financial aid israel is receiving from the U.S. can actually only be spent on buying american made product (ranging srom food rations to missiles etc.), meaning that the money is being spent in the USA, and that the US goverment is actually helping buisness in some weird, twisted way. I'm an Israeli, BTW, and believe me, that money is not aid, we're guarding the gates of Mordor here.

[bob sakamano @ Jan 22nd 2008 11:54AM]

seems about right for israel to do this... if the US can do it too we can stop depending on arab oil ourselves.

[kof @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:13PM]

this is kinda getting off topic, but the aid that israel is getting is in military supplies, and most of it has to be spent in america to buy american military products and support the american economy. so this type of investment in electric cars is in no way subsidized by american aid

[Sam @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:17PM]

Shouldn't it be "build" instead of "built" in the second to last sentence of the article?

[osX @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:21PM]

Project Better Place?
Maybe Israel should try giving the Palestinian people the most basic of human rights, instead of cutting off their power and fuel supplies.
That would make it a Better Place, not electric car charging points.
And where is this electricity coming from? Maybe from their undeclared Nuclear power plants which then dump the nuclear waste on Arab land.

[kof @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:36PM]

maybe the Palestinians should spend the little money they have to buy food and fuel and what not, instead of spending it on guns, explosives, and home made rockets to fire on israel?

[CyberTrucker @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:37PM]

It's amazing to me that, no matter the original subject, just mentioning Israel seems to create a comment thread that will, eventually, degenerate into angry and often ill-informed anti-semitic criticism. Amazing.

[Yos @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:42PM]

osX:
If the Palestinians/Hamas would stop sending missles against the civilian population of Israel, there would be no need to take various measures. In fact, if they would accept Israel's right to exist, there would be a much more peaceful and cooperative climate.

[Nadav @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:51PM]

osx: do u wanna guess how many rockets get shot at israel every day? guess, seriously guess

yesterday it was 16.

oh , and get your facts straight, we're (im israeli) not denying them fuel and food, we'ere even giving them our fuel and food. israel is the only thing preventing palastine from getting into a serious humanitarian crisis

[Adam @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:55PM]

You need to look up the definition of Anti-Semitism because you're obviously confused.

And as far as the Palestinians are concerned you forget that Israel is occupying their land and has put them under economic and physical siege over the last few years. The Palestinians are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

If Israel stopped expanding the illegal Jewish settlements on Palestinian land and building new settlements and giving settlers financial incentives (often thanks to money from tax payers like myself here in the U.S.) to live on land stolen and taken by force from Palestinian, the Palestinians wouldn't be so upset. Just some food for thought to all you propagandists who get off on promulgating disinformation and revising history.

[Zach @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:13PM]

let me guess... the holocaust didn't happen either (to some of you.)?

look, theres a shitload of missiles fired at Israel right?
theres a shitload of Israeli bullets flying back right?

an eye for an eye makes the world go blind
heres the problem: (most) Arab countries don't acknowledge the EXSISTANCE of Israel as a country k? therefore, any LAWS made by the U.N. don't seem to apply do they?
why do you think no one outside of Israel is trying to do any help/peace talks? --> we get our oil to drive our cars and light our houses from...where again?

might i remind you all (this was before my time, so i didn't witness it first hand but i know a bit about it..) that the 6 day war.. lasted 6 days.. so if the Israelis want to do something, they're going to..

[Ari @ Jan 22nd 2008 7:13PM]

Adam -

I know you probably get your history from the mainstream media, but in fact the land was not taken by force. In fact the Palestinians fled after the War of Independence fearing for their lives, because they openly pronounced they would slaughter Israeli men women and children when they won the war, and when the opposite happened they assumed it would happen to them. In fact Israel has given all Arabs the right for full Israeli citizenship and rights. Rights you say? But Arabs don't give themselves rights? True, only Israel would give their sworn enemies rights. When you start a campaign to give back Manhattan, the Dakotas and thousands of other cities to the Native Americans, and Texas to the Mexicans then we'll talk about occupied territories.

And there is no such things as a Palestinian. It was made up by the British and hijacked by Arafat. That is history, not opinion.

[Ari @ Jan 22nd 2008 7:13PM]

Adam -

I know you probably get your history from the mainstream media, but in fact the land was not taken by force. In fact the Palestinians fled after the War of Independence fearing for their lives, because they openly pronounced they would slaughter Israeli men women and children when they won the war, and when the opposite happened they assumed it would happen to them. In fact Israel has given all Arabs the right for full Israeli citizenship and rights. Rights you say? But Arabs don't give themselves rights? True, only Israel would give their sworn enemies rights. When you start a campaign to give back Manhattan, the Dakotas and thousands of other cities to the Native Americans, and Texas to the Mexicans then we'll talk about occupied territories.

And there is no such things as a Palestinian. It was made up by the British and hijacked by Arafat. That is history, not opinion.

[aleks @ Jan 26th 2008 11:47PM]

sure....give more rights to Palestinians, that they can blow up more inocent people

[Maorsa @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:56PM]

I'm from Israel, and I can unfortunatly say that even if this project does come to life, this will not be IN ISRAEL.
The Israeli Goverment's lowest priority is the enviorment, especially when we have over 10 missiles fired to our country daily....

For those of you with not too much grey stuff in your brains:
Israel is the main exporter of technology for the world. a few of the inventions which came from Israel are:
* Mobile phones
* Disk on Key (Flash Drives)
* Intel Pentium Processor
and SOOOO much more....

[Exeter @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:03PM]

10 missiles fired to our country daily....


You clowns are hilarious. You're comparing a homemade rocket the size of a lawnmower to the squadrons of F16 and the 500 pound bombs Israel is using to shell the Palestinians and you have the audacity to whine.

Well, the occupation is an inconvenience, isn't it? What did you expect? Did you think you could steal other people's land and then sit comfortably sipping margaritas every day, while people are being killed because of your fanatical government and the fanatical right wingers in Israel? Get a clue.

[Nadav @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:25PM]

exeter: imagine if canada started attacking new jersey (nj is about the size of israel) with 15 rockets (as small as they may be) every day that destroy buildings and sometimes even hurt and kill people. what do you think america would do?!!?!?!?!?!? i can assure you they would do A LOT more than just target the shooters.

[Eric @ Jan 22nd 2008 5:02PM]

Canadian Bacon anyone?

[Adam @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:58PM]

Nadav, you need to stop lying. It's disgusting.

ISRAEL is the only reason they're not having a humanitarian crisis? What have you been smoking?
Is this a joke?

[Nadav @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:20PM]

yes, palastiniens were in israel first but so the hell what???? we didnt forcefully take israel, it was just a natural proccess -jews started imagrating to israel and little by little, there were way more jews than arabs in israel. so when it came time to give the jews a country, israel was a great choice. when israel became official, we gave all palastinians a choice to stay if they wanted, and many still live in israel.

ok that was to your first comment-this is to your second:
israel is supplying food and fuel to gaza all the time. when people say israel cut fuel and fuel supplies to gaza, they dont mean we take their food it means we give them a little less of ours (israel is in enugh of a bad shape and we dont need to give away the little that we have to other people.) without israel, gaza would be completely controled by hammas and than no food or fuel would go to cavillians-so yes, israel is preventing a humanitarian crisis.

[kof @ Jan 22nd 2008 12:59PM]

adam, but the serious problems are with gaza, which israel pulled out of and handed over completely to the Palestinians, and in return the palestinians are firing rockets at israeli civilians. while the west bank which is under partial israeli control is much more peaceful.

[Adam @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:09PM]

Yes, and why is that. Do you know? It's because you've got 1.5 MILLION Gazans crammed into an area smaller than Washington DC, with sewage running in the streets, economic and financial siege, no imports, no aid, thousands if not all living under the poverty line, children starving, no food, no heating oil, no clean drinking water and no electricity and one begins to wonder how the Palestinians have put up with all this crap for so long.

The West Bank is much better off, because they get some imports from nearby Jordan and have farm land they can use to grow crops instead of starving to death. That's the difference between Gaza and the West Bank.

[kof @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:22PM]

so instead of trying to improve their living conditions and try to establish a productive government,they spend all their time and money in trying to smuggle in explosives in order to fight the non existing occupation, which then forces israel to impose a "siege" and will eventually force israel to go back into gaza and renew the "occupation"

[Nadav @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:30PM]

all their time and money?????? believe me that the govermants funds in this thing is tiny compared to the whole project. im sure 99% of this thing is funded by individual people

[paps @ Jan 22nd 2008 2:18PM]

I don't think Adam really understand the situation over there. He gets his knowledge from muslim propaganda and conservative opinions.

Israel is an amazing country but unfortunately it has to deal with some deluded arabs that want to steal the jewish homeland (as they have for many years).

[quandmeme @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:22PM]

In the future sociologists studying the convergence of technology and social issues will laugh at these comments. Gadget geeks have geo-political opinions but they shared them on gadget blogs because they weren't savvy enough to find a political blog on which to post.

[Nadav @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:27PM]

LET THE POLITICAL ARGUMENTS BEGIIIINNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!

[David @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:31PM]

No wonder theirs massive power outages in Palestine...

$30 Billion in military aid, what a bloody joke. American media is the propaganda in this problem, it's shockingly pro-Israeli to the point of disbelief on certain channels, especially to a Brit.

But like many people on here have said, anything Israeli related ends up as a war of opinions. And for the record, drop the Anti-semitism thing, I don't care whether you're jewish or Christian, keep religion out of politics...I'm looking at you America...

[Meldon @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:36PM]

Umm, I think its great that there will be refueiling points, but I wonder how people would feel about taking 30 minutes to get a decent charge into the batteries?

(I thought I would try and bring it back to the original topic, my views on Palestine and Israel do not belong on a technology blog, although I could fill a large comment to do so.)

[Noah @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:36PM]

Kinda ridiculous how millions typo BILLIONS of our dollars goes to Israel in general.Why sooo much to israel we have enough problems at home.People are loosing their homes ,people without health care ,failing education system.This money could be better spent then helping israel dumping 500lb bombs on Palestinians.And you expect no resistance? Those people are in unbearable conditions everyday they have no where else to voice their opinions besides terrorism.Imagine if Canada came into new york n started building houses everywhere over your property .Imagine if your home was taken from you and you became a refugee?What do you do ?People have to switch shoes once in a while to realize reality.

[kof @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:42PM]

Nadav, i was talking about the palestinians...

[Nadav @ Jan 22nd 2008 5:24PM]

lol i was so hyped up to say something pro-israel i didnt really read your comment.....sorry.....

[Amir @ Jan 23rd 2008 5:01PM]

Guy, seriously!

This well written article describes what could be the start of a world wide revolution. Electric cars could very well BE the future and an Israeli company (e.g NOT the state) are trying to lead this innovation.

Shai Agassi is a brilliant man, by the time he was 19 he had a physics degree and around the age of 25 he became one of the directors of the world GAINT chip manufacturer - SAP.

Now, only 30 years old, he is trying to develop this new technology by himself. His talks with the Israeli government lead to nothing but the general approval of the ministers to his plans, yet he was clearly informed that no money will be directed his way.

So plz, put the politics aside, aspecially if you are not sure of what you are saying. The Israeli-Palestine situation is complex and no side is right or wrong (well, actually the Hammas is definitely wrong, because it's a terrorist organisation, but the Palestine people surely suffer from all this.)

[Jables @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:52PM]

So, by some of the same arguments that I'm reading here, everyone would be totally cool with giving California and Texas back to the Mexicans and Puerto Rico back to Spain? I mean, we did take that territory over by force, and the Mexican's were there first.

Love the total lack of knowledge explained by people 6000 miles away from the actual situation sipping latte's in their Saabs.

[GSS @ Jan 22nd 2008 1:58PM]

Hamas and the rocket attacks are a response to Israel's illegal occupation. The real issue is about land. Israel's annexing Palestinian land and diverting water to serve it's illegal settlements. So, why doesn't Israel stop stealing land and water from the Palestinians and then ask why the rocket attacks. The Palestinians are doomed both ways. If they attack, it's b/c they're crazy and lunatics, if they don't attack, they get to watch Israel steal their resources right in front of their eyes.

[paps @ Jan 22nd 2008 2:26PM]

GSS, Hamas is not a response to Israel's alleged illegal occupation, but the outcome of years of frustration and lack of progress on the part of the PLO.

How many people here really understand the situation in the middle east?

It seems you all exclude mentioning how every Arab country turned their back on the palestinians (a.k.a Jordanian refuges) and even slaughtered THOUSANDS of them (yes, their own brothers in arms).

Or that you may not realize they stole land and money from the Jews that live in communities in their country. Oh yes, and they killed and murdered the Jewish inhabitants of their country without provocation. I think while the fighting and death going on now is unfortunate, at least you link one cause with one action. Not so for the innocent families that lost everything many years ago.

Or maybe you'll forget that little surprise attack war that Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, and the refuges launched on poor little Israel and (get this) LOST. Since when do losers get their land back in an offensive war?

So argue away and make your remarks. The truth is nothing will change over there and electric cars will eventually be sold in Israel:)

[GSS @ Jan 22nd 2008 3:36PM]

Israel's "alleged" illegal occupation... what a joke!

[dave @ Jan 22nd 2008 3:24PM]

The rankings of these posts is amazing, pro-Israel to the max! Didn't take long until anti-Semite was flung around ether. Both sides are at fault here, but one sides doing most of the killing.

From September 29, 2000, when the current Palestinian intifada erupted, through January 18, 2008, at least 981 Palestinian and 119 Israeli youths under the age of 18 were killed in Israel and the occupied Palestinian territories.

Source American Educational Trust

[kof @ Jan 22nd 2008 10:10PM]

whats your point dave? should the stronger side which everyone admits is israel, just lay down and die? whould that then make it the "right side" bec more of its members died? is the stronger always the wrong one and the weak always the right? if u compare what israel is doing to what ANY other army in the world is doing, and if u do it objectively, then the only logical conclusion you can reach is that the israeli army is one of the most human ones on the world.

[dave @ Jan 22nd 2008 10:43PM]

A quick search found Amnesty International wouldn't agree with you, see the 2005 annual report. The report lists "reckless shooting, shelling and air strikes in civilian areas... and excessive use of force". So I would suspect that several army's around the world are doing a more "human" job. The problem with this is its self perpetuating, more dead family members makes for more extremists.

BOTH sides are committing horrific acts, I'm sure if Palestine got $4 billion a year of military funding from the States, Israel would have their hands full.

[Mark @ Jan 22nd 2008 3:30PM]

What a heated discussion, and none of it is at all related to electric cars or batteries!

Instead of charging the battery like that, what if cars were designed to have the battery accessible from under the car... Could design a special mechanism in the ground that would reach up and pull the battery out, and insert a new one that is fully charged. The car would just have to pull up underneath it and sensors could locate the battery, pull it out and store it into an underground compartment where it would be recharged, and then slide an already fully charged battery into the car. The whole process could be designed to take less than a minute.

I know my idea doesn't have every possible situation laid out, like what would happen to batteries that reach the end of it's lifetime, etc...but something like this would need to be implemented for it to be practical.

Plugging in your car to charge it is too time consuming. Everyone will be late for work.

[Wolf @ Jan 22nd 2008 5:50PM]

To Mark:

That's about the idea of the charge-points, and what makes this whole technology viable. In the charge points, battaries will be replaced, and then charged.

Good economic thinking.

Z

[Natan @ Jan 22nd 2008 3:56PM]

"If Israel stopped expanding the illegal Jewish settlements on Palestinian land... the Palestinians wouldn't be so upset."

A common myth. In fact, the PLO was formed even before Israel occupied the West Bank and Gaza. The Arabs want to exterminate Israel, period. It's not the "occupied land" which is causing their terrorism (unless you define "occupied land" as all Israel.)

[Mark @ Jan 22nd 2008 3:57PM]

Isreal...Isreal...Why the hell isn't this coming to *NORTH AMERICA* huh? Are car companies avoiding selling electric vehicles in North America? Why? We want them, we will BUY them.

[MichaelD @ Jan 22nd 2008 4:47PM]

First, I commend Israel for this action.

Now, in response to the political discussion...

Israel is not occupying a foreign land. Even denying their 2000-year-old claim on the land, they came in peacefully and purchased land legally. The Arabs had no interest in Palestine until they realized that, through the determinedness of the Jews, the desert was blooming again.

Palestinians are not being oppressed by Israel. Israel provides food and medical care to people who swear to drive them into the sea, while other Arab nations deny the Palestinians shelter and once even placed Palestinians in concentration camps. The Palestinians are mainly an inconvenience to the surrounding Arab nations, but they use their fervor to gain their own political ends.

I realize that for those who disagree this will seem to be Israeli propaganda, while to those who agree the other posts seem to be Arab propaganda. But I hope there are some here who seek to know the truth about Israel, not just hear whatever anti-semitic lies fuel their passion.