Palm ranks last in satisfaction survey, no one surprised
By Joshua Topolsky 
posted Feb 13th 2008 9:41AM
posted Feb 13th 2008 9:41AM
Update: Our friends at Palm contacted us with some supplemental information which they wanted to get across concerning this research and related studies. According to them, two separate, third-party firms (Satmetrix and Russell Research) conducted studies which came to the opposite conclusion of ChangeWave's work. In their words: "The Satmetrix survey found that 65-percent of respondents rated their overall satisfaction with Palm as an 8-10 out of 10. Also, the Russell Research study found that 56-percent of respondents were either "very satisfied" or "extremely satisfied" with their Palm smartphone device."
[Via Palm Infocenter]
Apple iPhone is first! Yah!
It's worth noting that Apple has one, count it ONE, product in the space. It's a top tier, premium product purchased largely by Apple fans.
RIM products are all largely top tier as well.
It is not until LG where we see a truely fair comparison. The rest of the companies have a number of products throughout all tiers and price points.
Just because most people who purchase a Rolls Royce love it, does not mean RR is the best car company. Thier cars are top tier, aimed at a specific market. The people who buy them are already going to love them. Throw that same RR on a rally race course and you'll quickly find some flaws. That's where other manufacturers come in with a wider portfolio, but it's impossible to please everyone at that point.
Well said Gar (and Noel further down).
This survey is as much about user expectations as it is with the quality of the product.
Still, iPhone is the best. I have a BB for work and an iPhone for personal use.
Yes Apple should have a Barry Bonds sized * or not even be included.
But I assume if they weren't on this chart, we wouldn't even be seeing this posted here.
The Palm angle is just a cover, we aren't dumb, Engadget.
I can not believe LG is #3!
Gar,
I think your problem is that you're assuming that complexity/expense=satisfaction. It's possible to design a very elegant, very simple product that performs a few functions very well.
Though I guess nothing is to stop a bare-bones Nokia user from saying they're dissatisfied because their free-with-contract phone won't surf the web like a BB.
Actually, LG has always been "number one" among other competitors in the consumer satisfaction/quality surveys by J.D. Power & Associates and Consumer Reports:
http://www.appliancemagazine.com/news.php?article=5231&zone=0&first=1
I hate when people can't just admit Apple is number 1 because they have the best product. If Apple are number 1 at anything it must be because of the fanboys, great me a friggin' break. They're number 1 simply because the iPhone kicks ass! Use one for a day and just try say otherwise.
Most people would purchase a Rolls Royce if they could, and they would love it. People appreciate good design and good engineering.
Most people can afford an iPhone. It's not a Rolls Royce, it just looks and performs like one. $399 isnt that much to spend on the iPhone.
The Rolls of phones is the The Diamond Crypto Smartphone or the GoldVish phone. Not the iPhone.
Ireland: Apple is No. 1 because the people who bought it think it's the best product.
Those people have already spent £900 (£239 + 18x£35) on their phone, so have already demonstrated their strong desire for it. They will likely value its pros and not be too bothered about its cons.
They are also extremely unlikely to admit, even to themselves, that there is anything wrong with it.
The results are common sense. The more expensive a product is, the more people are going to autoconvince themselves that they like it and/or the less people are going to recognize that they aren't satisfied with it.
Of course Apple's product is first. Apple could put out a device that came packed in dog doo, exploded randomly, sending jagged, poisoned shards around a 50' radius, had a five minute battery life and no discernible function and Apple fans would STILL praise it as a new technological paradigm, believe that Apple created dog doo, and buy every version.
Oh bull. Palm is probably the least amount sold. Naturally there is way more iphones on the streets so they would get the most votes.
You do realise that this means 30% of Palm owners? It has nothing to do with units sold... The graph is still a bit misleading because it only shows how much percent are *very* satisfied with their device. It does not mean the rest absolutely hete their device. The remaining 70% could still be, erm, "somewhat" satisfied.
I think the graph is intentionally "crippled" to be more shocking.
Do you know what percentage means?
Nokia sells way more phones than Apple and the results are the same...
That's why they are using a relative scale. You don't have to wonder anymore why there was that strange % symbol in front of the numbers
'It has nothing to do with units sold'
I'd say that it has everything to do with units sold.
It's about customer satisfaction, not about popularity!
self-satisfaction
where's htc on this?
apple at the top reminds me of how sanyo routinely ends up at the top of other satisfaction surveys - typically the day-to-day user that knows nothing about the technology that is out there and is perfectly happy w a phone that does only one thing - make and take phone calls
Considering HTC's phones are rarely sold as an HTC product by the carriers (Cingular 8525, for example), I would imagine the majority of the people in this survey wouldnt even know who HTC is...
still...
you would think that if someone mentioned the Cingular HTC's or the Verizon/Sprint 6700's that the survey-taker would put those under an HTC category.
This survey is pretty crap - the quality of the image serves as an indicator.
I think the HTC Touch ALONE has sold about half as many iPhones -- certainly with much less publicity.
Oh well, I want to see follow up on this survey in a few months when all of those people actually using their iPhones as PMP's start having their batteries die on them half-way through the day.
Let's see how satisfied they are THEN of having to pay for parts, labor and shipping to switch out the battery.
"Let's see how satisfied they are THEN of having to pay for parts, labor and shipping to switch out the battery."
The current iPhone (1G) will be hopelessly outdated by the time its battery needs to be replaced. The battery on my 3G iPod is still decent and it's certainly outdated.
@Chris
True - Apple fanboys are a classic example of "sheeple". Certainly they will be convinced to buy a new iPhone every year.
Why no HTC, they have more smart phones than Apple?
I love my HTC Touch!
Yea WTF, why no HTC, one of the largest smartphone suppliers. And yea Palm sucks. When i had verizon i had a Tre 650w, what a total piece of junk. Constantly locked up, lost settings after a soft reset, etc. Took it back and got a Q instead.
And why do i have to enter my god damned password everytime i post here? Thats what the "remember me" box should be for.
I agree HTC should be in there - I really like my Touch as well but I also hate HTC for -
Not improving battery life
Not using VGA - still stuck in QVGA
Not coming out with reliable firmware updates or even regular one - have to depend on other sources to make firmware updates - e.g. ppcgeeks
Not working with MS to fix the crappy BT - not sure why free phones have better BT than $500 phones
Not listening to the customers when you tell them there is a problem - I had to start a campaign of terror by posting on ever website possible including their wiki to get them to recognize the issue with the mogul BT - took 6 months to get a "fix".
Survey says that most people don't believe surveys.
But honestly without HTC this 'research' is flawed considering how many HTC phones exist including the AT&T Tilt which does say HTC on the battery cover. Call me cynical but I wouldn't be suprised if apple 'paid' for this 'research'
HTC (largely) isn't a consumer brand. That's an AT&T Tilt you're carrying, not a HTC Tilt.
4 thou people, c'mon, I did better on my masters thesis
We all did, but most people are far too ignorant and/or stupid to know anything about statistics.
This chart is obviously off...
I have never once been very satasfied with a cell phone... ever... and i think that most people here can say the same.
All phones needs tweaks, and content, and good service. Palm phones just happen to weigh as much as a brick, are about the size of a brick, and come in the same colors as bricks... infact, if i didn't own a treo, i'd be suspect that it is little more than a brick.
Either way, this is clearly from a consumer level, and consumers don't need smartphones... and thats all that palm makes... plus 66% of those phones are Palm OS.... therefore they are not phones at all (they are turds...) so really, when you look at it, it's skewed...
:\
Palm should buy Moto
I can honestly say I am 100% satisfied with my iPhone. Im not a mac fan boi, I use windows. But I seriously like and appreciate my iPhone. It changed my life and made it easier.
haha...
true - to be satisfied means to be complacent.
then again Apple owners are the most complacent - in my book. Who else would pay such a premium for a product that doesn't really perform but just looks pretty?
I need my EVDO - i could not handle obsessively checking my email, facebook, etc with 2G.
I agree--the iPhone really is a quality product that makes it hard to use any other device after becoming used to one. I'm not overly enthused about other Apple products, but the iPhone is extrordinary. Before getting one I used to get a new phone every couple of months because I would get fed up with the abysmal user experience of my current phone.
I think once more multi-touch phones make it to market with a UX that is built around that functionality (I'm talking to you, Nokia S60) I'd be willing to revisit my iPhone only stance, though. For now, it's just too awkward to go back to using a non-touch interface.
@Mario
Doesn't really perform? Nice anti-Apple troll. The iPhone interface is smooth and fluid. It's the other devices out there that don't "perform." You can talk about feature lists until your face turns blue, but that doesn't make your phone stop lagging on every key press.
Palm hasn't been relevant in years. If it wasn't for all the hoopla on this site about their pathetic laptop add-on, I would have thought them out of business.
These results couldn't possibly be because:
a. the kind of people who buy a palm device are the kind of people that are hard to satisfy
b. the kind of people who buy an iphone are satisfied with anything that has a fruit logo on it
I've never own a single Apple product in my life, yet I love my iPhone. See how generalization fails all?
I meant prior to buying an iPhone of course...
And how many different phones does Apple produce? Oh yes one. And how many different models do people like Nokia, Samsung and LG produce each year?
The only accurate way of doing this is the number of phones sold and how many complaints the company received/have been reported.
I think the only fair way to do this is by individual models, not brands. Then show us a graph for "somewhat satisfied," "somewhat dissatisfied," and "I hate it."
That would be fair and accurate.
Yup. Either / Or
Wait, you mean to tell me I'm supposed to trust a site that says a "3-point change" is something to worry about when I have no clue HOW he sampled to arrive at these numbers? They don't even tell me how many respondents actually had each brand in question...am I missing the original report somewhere?
Maybe more importantly to all of you, the graph only represents people who were "very satisfied", but does not tell me anything at all about who might just be "satisfied", a distinction that could change a lot.
Exactly, I am glad that someone brought up the fallacious nature of this report. I never trust reports where the methodologies used to perform the study are not disclosed. This is just crap marketing from a Stock Market firm designed to disinform people for the purposes of moving a stock price.
Apple just has not been the same since MacWorld, their stock has been diving and their does not seem to be an end to it.
When reading statistics such as this you need to realize the psychology of each brand and what goes into their users saying "very satisfied". Apple users tend to accept what they're given and change their habits to match the product, so they are by nature very likely to satisfied. Palm users are generally the type who are seeking out the device of their dreams, the exact specs they want. Thus, Palm users are likely to not be "very satisfied" with anything. If they bought an iPhone, they would find it lacking in some way.
I'm an Apple fanboy and I approve of this comment.
It's going to be interesting to see how happy those IPod owners are next year when their batteries start to age.
"Yeah, I'm not so satisfied with my Palm and it's only eleven years old!"
Let's put this in a little perspective. People love bashing on Palm, and as a former Palm owner (and current iPhone user), I definitely agree that they seem to have stagnated, to put it mildly.
BUT, I disagree with the statement above that we should assume that Palm has the smallest number of owners. I know more people with Treo's than people with iPhones. While this is just my own personal observation and has no bearing on the population as a whole, my point is just that Palm was huge until not TOO long ago, and lots of people are still fans, despite the fact that they really haven't changed anything in a coon's age (that, by the way, might also say something about how good their designs were). And Sanyo? Really? When was the last time you met anyone who had a Sanyo phone?
I would also like to point out that for all the sh*t that Palm gets here on the tech blogs, notice that Samsung, Sony/Ericsson, and Motorola are all at 34%, and Nokia is at 36%. Given the size of the sample and all that, +-4% could be statistical variance. And even if it's not, 34% isn't THAT much better than 30% satisfaction.
So let's not put too much spin on this chart, m'kay?
HTC should be in there. Also, correct me if i am wrong, but I have never seen a Sanyo Smartphone!
I am just curious to see the numbers...
Find me an Apple owner who is willing to admit that Apple Suck, and I will give you $1 billion.
It was obvious that Apple would come first, and not because they are the best, but because people that own them believe they are the best.
Disclaimer:
Any impression that you will receive money is purely accidental. No money will be given to you even if you manage to find an Apple owner who says that they hate Apple products.
> Find me an Apple owner who is willing to admit that Apple Suck, and I will give you $1 billion.
> It was obvious that Apple would come first, and not because they are the best, but because
> people that own them believe they are the best.
That's widely believed to be called "customer satisfaction", only when talking about Apple it must be a conspiracy.
Are you fucking kiddin' me? Apple sold more smartphones than most players in the last 6 months. They didn't sell it only to hardcore Apple fans. They sold them to the average joe and jane.
You Apple bashers are the ones always talking about iPhone buyers being the gullible people who buy into its looks only.
Well, you know what? Those are precisely the same people that would complain about the iPhone if it didn't live up to their expectations. Those are precisely the same people who aren't going to go onto internet forums and discussion boards to figure out what's wrong with their phones (and usually finding out that it's their fault, not the phone's) but rather start bitching about how the phone is a piece of junk. *They're the ones that are hardest to please when it comes to multi-function convergence phones like the iPhone.*
When the iPhone sells like crazy, you say they're being snatched up stupid iPod users who don't know anything about tech and smart phones. Then when you hear that iPhone satisfaction rate is through the roof, you say that's because the phones all belong to hardcore Apple fanatics who'll eat Steve Jobs poop out of his ass. You can't have it both ways, pal.
But whatever floats your boat, I guess.
@rawhead
"eat Steve Jobs's poop out of his ass" My god, that's funny. :-)
Honestly, I get pretty sick of people bashing Apple. I chalk it up to jealousy. I see posts here and there of people claiming to own Apple products they hate, but I have yet to meet someone in person, who owns a Mac or an iPhone and doesn't love it.
People who don't use Apple products and think Steve Jobs is the spawn of Satan tend to hate anything and everything they don't already own. It's just a big "mine's better than yours" pissing match.
Gian
I could buy an i-Pod, or a Mac, but I don't want to because I want an MP3 that isn't junk, and a laptop that isn't style over substance.
My iPhone sucks. Where's my million?
Well, Pantech isn't even on there... I loves my C300 though!
Yea WTF, why no Pantech, one of the largest cellphone suppliers in the world. Some Pantech phones (rebadged as AU brand) are particularly popular in Japan.
Add HTC to the bottom of that list for their latest screw up with the Touch.
I own a Palm TX, which I really enjoyed when I first got it ... until I started using OneNote and discovered there was not any support for it. I've since been somewhat annoyed with Palm and will probably not purchase another palm product. Of course, I'm one of the few people who refuse to get a cellphone and will not purchase an Apple device out of simple principle to not desiring a 'status' symbol, but something that works.
I'm likely to purchase a Cloudbook to replace my palm.
You're annoyed at Palm because a *third party product* can't be bothered to write a compatible program?
I think you've got that a bit mixed up.
Nope. I'm annoyed with palm because they're not a primary player and won't get with the program and run windows mobile.
I know that Microsoft is just trying to make them even more obsolete, but 'eh, don't care. I bought it for productivity and it is no longer useful to me for that purpose.
You're an idiot for using the POS known as Microsoft One Note. That was your first mistake.
Won't run Windows Mobile? Have you heard of the Treo 700W?
Nothing to do with the fact that the iPhone has been released relatively recently, does comparatively little in terms of functionality and is a sealed up tight system with no chance of customers screwing up their phones, while the Palm OS offers tens of thousands of free/shareware programs with an infinitely greater chance of screwing up the phone then?
Oh, OK then.
(looks for resigned smiley)
And yet, people love the iPhone. They must all be idiots, right? All 4 million of them?
Right, but then, that's exactly what Apple was going for, and iPhone buyers know it going into the purchase.
4 million iPhone users? Argumentum ad populum.
There are 200 million Internet Explorer users. Billions believe there is a god. These people aren't stupid, they just don't know any better.
How many of those surveyed know how to change the clock in a VCR?
How many of those surveyed are over 30?
I'll give you an amen on that one.
I have a hard time believing Nokia is that far down on the totem pole. Nokia and Sanyo have made some of the most reliable phones out.
But the iPhone looks good, despite the lack of software.
I'm very happy with my 7 or so palm devices. I rely on at least one every day.
LG and Sanyo rank higher than Nokia and Sony Ericsson... seriously ?
Yeah that's just messed up... man you guys are backwards when it comes to cellphones.
This studie is done in NA? No really asking i dont know.
lol, since when does Nokia rank up there with LG in the customer quality/satisfaction surveys?
http://www.appliancemagazine.com/news.php?article=5231&zone=0&first=1
When it comes to the handset quality/satisfaction, LG rules, period.
Engadget posts a story with no surprises? Why am I not surprised?
I would like to survey BB owners after the outage. I bet you that graph would be a little different
I bought a Palm 650 over 2 yrs ago, had two replacements for the bad one; both replacements mailed to me were bad. In disgust the manager @ local verizon gave me a new 750. Guess what? Love it!
well, I have treo 700p and I'm somewhere satisfactory. Looking forward to get iPhone when it double the memory in end of summer.
There are alot of things that go into "very satisfied." When someone makes a big purchase (iPhone at the beginning..and even now, really) they tend to be really proud of themselves for it. My boss bought a luxury car, a Benz E500, and the brakes completely failed on him one day. But he still thinks its the greatest thing since the invention of the internal combustion engine. The iPhone hasn't been out long enough to see where it has problems. Like Syke said, he used his palm for awhile until he wanted to use OneNote, and then it was a problem. What won't work with the iPhone later on? Also, it's the biggest fad right now. Ripped jeans were awesome two years ago. What will happen with the iphone? And of course, let's not get started on the sample space here. 4000 people? Paltry numbers.
Actually, usually the more you spend on something, the more disappointed you are when it doesn't live up to expectations. Read the Paradox of Choice.
All you need to do is glance at the "Apple Product Lifecycle" humor bit to be reminded that Apple fans have the highest expectations and are the first to whine loudly when the tiniest flaw appears in their new toy.
And Benzes are for status-seekers who care nothing about cars, but didn't want the reliability of Lexus's sensory deprivation tanks. :)
As a former treo user I'll tell you that Palm has horrible Q&A for their devices and thats not even mentioning their archaic OS.
The legions of apple fans out there are perfectly fine with their locked down device which cant do nearly as much as other smart phones but because they dont have I at the front of it they dont sell
If they would add full support for Vista for my LifeDrive than I would be happy! I hate having to sync via BlueTooth, or WiFi! I want DRIVEMODE to work in VISTA!!!
Lazy Palm! They really have no excuse. I mean there is not newer large capacity PalmOS device to replace the LifeDrive!
I also was frustraited that both the Treo600 & the Trek650 had crashing issues, the SAME crashing issues... I got tired of my phone crashing, so I gave up and got a Razr! Now when my phone rings, I can ACTUALLY ANSWER IT!
Proof that Apple people are brainwashed lemmings, seriously how can people be that happy with a cell phone that can't do simple and standard on even free cell phones things, you know stuff like texting a pic to your friend, or using a set of bluetooth stereo headphones.
"you know stuff like texting a pic to your friend, or using a set of bluetooth stereo headphones."
So it must mean I'm brainwashed if those are features I care nothing about? Nice logic.
fail
The day my SEVENTH Treo broke and had to be replaced, I used the wasted hour while they verified that it was indeed broken to walk into the ATT store and buy an iPhone. My new replacement 755p will be on ebay any day now. Palm deserves this last place ranking.
I'm a happy Treo 700p user. It has not given me any major problem. It works even better after the recent 755p firmware update. Lots of great apps. What else can you ask for?
So it must mean I'm brainwashed if those are features I care nothing about? Nice logic.
yeah especially since it cost $100 for a bluetooth headset
At the end of the day, the poll would seem to suggest that Apple and RIM are doing the right things, and Palm is not. A certain degree of post-purchase justification is going to be present for all the brands.
The most interesting finding here is not Apple's high number, but Palm's very low number. What happened to the 'zen of Palm'? That's the big question, not whether Apple fanboi's artifically prop up the Apple number.
finally, the first objective and insightful comment. (ok ok, there's maybe 4 others)
Seriously, why do we take some market research firm's results as 'evidence'?
Sure, it seems fashionable to hate on Palm (I wouldn't know either way since I don't own any 'smart' devices, I prefer dumb), but shouldn't we be asking:
1) Who paid for this research?
2) What questions were asked.
3) How were they asked?
...before we get all frothed up with agreement/disagreement?
Here's a market research firm with vested interests in selling its 'research' and getting free PR over the interwebs at releasing the 'results', with no real details for Joe to ascertain how things were done, and for who they were done (probably the ones paying them the most)...and nobody really questioning the results.
The only satisfaction that matters is YOURS, not supposedly 'independent' market research firms which are anything but. Who butters their bread? Probably the companies who came highest in the results suvey.
Next up, CompetitorX Market Research firm showing differing results. At the end of the day what does it mean? Don't be a sheep and get pressured into buying something not for you, either way. Marketing is often about preying on insecurities and lack of product knowledge and "going with the crowd" or the "safe bet" at the end of the day...do not be swayed (or scared off a purchase) by these market research firms; make your own decisions.
These guys have more vested interests than you can poke a stick at.
just my luck...i have a palm phone (worse according to this survey) on sprints network (worse according to jd power)
I have loved my Treo 750. I get a new device every couple of months and of all the brands I keep coming back to Palm devices.
It's too bad Palm's slowly (or maybe not so slowly) becoming irrelevant and obsolete. I've loved every Palm device I've owned, and right now I'm still using my Treo 650. The best thing about it is that they LET you hack it. It has a built-in bootloader, and creating a custom ROM is as easy as deleting databases you don't want. Palm OS was such a fantastic platform and it's depressing to see it fail.