Sony Centre UK celebrates Blu-ray's victory
By Richard Lawler 
posted Feb 27th 2008 9:59AM
posted Feb 27th 2008 9:59AM
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So grown up...
There's nothing wrong with celebrating a victory.
So English... (and this is an English person saying this)
This is exactly the kind of thing that makes people despise Sony with a passion. Its just so cheap and unprofessional.
They have forgotten to mention that the "War" is not over by any means, in fact it has only just started. Now Blu-Ray has DVD to contend with and it will be a FAR greater hurdle to overcome than HD-DVD. The greatest challenge or threat to either of the formats was and still is DVD.
There are a lot of people (probably 299+ million in the US alone) that don't have much of a clue about what Blu-Ray & HD even were other than something everyone said not to buy. Sometimes you have to bonk people on the head with information before they know.
I think Best Buy, Wal-Mart & equivalents the world over should run full page ads declaring the war over to boost sales of players & discs.
Like HDTV's war against SDTV's? It's a progression of technology dude. If physical formats continue than it is only a matter of time before DVD's are phased out. And this would not mean that Blu-ray won against DVD either.
...and I can brag too: see my comment of 2 1/2 years ago: http://www.videobusiness.com/index.asp?layout=talkBackCommentsFull&articleid=CA634677&talk_back_header_id=1684
@ Philippe
You had a 50% chance of making the right choice you douche! Should we start referring to you as Nostradamus for your brilliant future telling powers?
Way to call it!
@Khris
You missed the point, troll.
1. The Sony poster is cheesy, wouldn't pass the marketing department. There are much more better way to brag winner's rights.
2. The "war" was unnecessary to start with, as HD disc don't bring noticeable improvement over DVD.
3. My 2 1/2 year old comment didn't predict anything, just pointing out that Sony choose the push their format down consumers' throat by bundling it into their PS3. Had Microsoft done the same with HD DVD, you'd still have a stale mate for which we wouldn't really care (see #2 above.)
@Philippe
2) HD-Media looks superior to DVD, you only have to look at the specs to work that out. I have Transformers on both DVD and HD-DVD and there is simply no contest between them. The HD version blows the DVD version clean out of the water where picture quality goes. People and objects almost have a 3D quality to them, so to say that HD has no noticeable improvement over DVD is frankly wrong.
I also thought HD was far better than normal DVDs. That was until I saw an upscaled DVD on my PS3. A difference is still noticeable but not really by much.
One Sony Centre doing something does not make Sony Cheap and Childish. Sony had nothing to do with this, in fact the stores are a Franchise like McDonalds.
If this was an official Sony Poster then it would be a bit twaty, but it isn't.
"HD blows DVD out of the water" blah blah blah
Yeh it looks great but so does good upscaled DVD. And the issue is will the consumer really care enough to invest in the difference. I know I don't at present and I'm a freaky nerd.
Upscaled DVD doesn't hold a candle to Blu-ray or HD DVD.
Everyone loses because HDTV market penetration is still shitty.
High-def games or movies don't look different if you're using a SD CRT TV, and CRT sets happen the be the majority of sets on the market today (and by far, plus people still purchase CRTs).
The only thing HD's good for is maxing out your credit to enjoy the little HD content available right now (yes, I know most channels are offered in HD, but most of the time it's not even true HD being broadcasted).
This is coming from a guy with two HD-ready TV sets but only an HD TV topset and no HD player (but an Xbox 360 - aside from the fancy effects Guitar Hero 3 looks the same on a PS2 as it does on the 360 with a standard def set).
Point is, as long as it doesn't look like shit, nobody cares (Youtube proves it).
VHS >>> DVD (huge difference)
DVD ON CRT >>>> DVD UPSCALED ON HDTV (sweeeet, I'm happy)
UPSCALED ON HDTV >>>>> FULL ON BLU-RAY (nice but there's a credit crunch on and the kids needs shoes)
richard knights, I'm sure you meant to use the 'greater than' sign in the opposite direction (Ex: VHS > DVD); but, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.
I think the arrows are indicating "to", so VHS to DVD.
What did you expected? Now that Blu-ray has outlasted HD-DVD, it now has to focus all it can to get enough people to actually buy the discs to justify making them.
Sony is still full of douche bags.
Rich, full of win douchebags!
Fortunatly, a HD-DVD doesn't have a head to put on a spike.
Every time I hear "The War is Over" it reminds me of that guy from the Matrix: Revolutions that states:
"The War is Over....Neo Saved us!"
Just wanted to put that out there.
we don't speak of Matrix 3
The Matrix is on HD DVD... which I have.
What are you going to do with your HD-DVD (I hate writing that, I'm glad it's dead. They should have chosen a better name) player now?
Yeah, LiqwidZero, what are you going to do with your HD DVD player now? Because, you know, your HD DVD player won't play your existing HD DVDs any more. Wait ... yes, it will ...
Okay, well it won't upscale regular DVDs any more. Wait ... yes, it will ...
Fine, your HD DVD player won't work any time soon, just like those old DIVX players. Wait ... yes, it will as long as you take care of it ...
Well, then I guess you're going to keep your HD DVD player and continue to enjoy it as long you feel you're getting value out of it. It's amazing how that works.
I'm famous.
So how many Engadget writers just set this as their desktop background?
I knew Blu Ray would win the first time I heard its specs compared to HDDVD.
When your maximum capacity is more than twice that of your opponent, there really is nowhere else this can go.
I insist as I did before that HDDVD FAILED BECAUSE MICROSOFT DIDN'T OFFER AN HDDVD DRIVE as a STANDARD DRIVE.
SONY took a gamble with the Blu Ray as a standard drive and that is what increased Blu Ray's market penetration - 100% per PS3 sold. The same thing can be said about DVD's relation to PS2. PS2 put the first DVD player in millions of homes and therefore had tremendous trade value.
The PS2 needed DVD, DVD didn't need the PS2.
oh ! really ? thanks for those information . nobody on engadget knew those.
by the way , where were you when HD-DVD player got below $99 & everybody rushed to buy HD-DVDs , why didn't you saved our millions of $$$, why didn't you warned us ?
also , can you tell me what you're gonna do with all the remaining capacity of your blu-ray ? i'm afraid most HD movies wont be able to utilize a single layer of content , let alone the 50 gb.
More Capacity don't always mean Better Quality.
just like Better product don't always win.
- 50 GB is NOT double 30 GB.
- Also, almost 50% of current Blu-ray releases are on 25 GB, single-layer discs. 90% of HD DVD releases are on 30 GB dual layer discs. The Average HD DVD has greater capacity at this point than the average BD disc.
Thank you for summing up the general stupidity of the average Blu-ray supporter (no offense to those Blu-ray supporters who actually make legit arguments).
When you first heard the specifications? You mean the specifications that are SO similar that made the cost/value ratio of HD-DVD superior?
When it comes down to movies, the slight bitrate difference causes almost no visible difference in quality, and the audio compression is 95% the quality of the lossless of Blu-Ray, which is not even discernible to the majority of consumers.
If you're talking about storage, a single layer HD-DVD is 15GB, while Blu-Ray is 25. You can easily add more and more layers to get the capacity you want, and once you get to or near 50GB, you have reached your limit in usefulness. A 200GB optical disc is not only pointless, but inefficient due to the reading and writing speeds of current and future Blu-Ray players and disc drives. HD-DVD had sufficient storage space and near equal quality, at a cheaper price.
The icing on the cake is the fact that ALL HD-DVDs were guaranteed to work on ALL future players, and also had more features than Blu-Ray from the start, and still does currently.
HD-DVD was easily the better format, and much more consumer friendly.
-Please predict the winning lotto numbers for this weekend if your so good, I'd really appreciate it.
-The capacity has nothing to do with blu-ray winning, the average consumer will not see a difference between a blu-ray film and a HD-DVD film despite blu-ray having a higher bit-rate.
-The xbox 360 is a GAMES CONSOLE, that is how it is marketed, that is how it is mainly used. Why should Microsoft waste time putting a HD-DVD drive in it which would also have brought it much closer in price to a much more widely used and recognized brand i.e playstation? Microsoft wanted an early march on the PS3 and so far it has worked out for them, despite them cutting corners during the 360's development. Another reason why there is no HD drive in the 360 is because of XBL where people can download HD content.
- The PS3 helped but there are more factors to Blu-Ray winning than simply sticking a drive in a PS3. I also have to ask the question... How many PS3 owners use their blu-ray drive for watching films on a regular basis? None of my mates seem that fussed about it and it is very hard to get accurate information about such a thing for a global market when a format is FORCED upon them. At least with the 360 HD-DVD drive you could be pretty sure that people were buying it to watch HD.
-You could be right about the PS2 making the uptake of DVD quicker, but DVD had no competition; moving from VHS to DVD was an obvious and logical move to make because DVD had so many more plus points than VHS ever had. As pointed out above the PS2 needed DVD not the other way around. Moving the market over to Blu-Ray will take years because DVD is firmly planted in peoples lives and in my experience many people who aren't techies simply don't care for HD, many still haven't heard of it or understand it let alone understand was blu-ray is.
My choice was always blu ray for the same reason, superior capacity (HDDVD theoretical limit: 60GB, Blu-ray: 200GB but only because I was thinking of it as a data storage standpoint. Also think about more episodes on a single disc when it comes to TV shows, saving shelf real estate.
There is also the matter of that special coating that boasts more scratch resistance than HDDVD, which lets face it, is one of the biggest threats to physical media.
But all matters aside, blu ray just sounds better, and in the widespread consumer market, marketing is a big contender. Thats just one of the reasons why apple products are popular. An average customer wanting an mp3 player looking at the iPod Classic against a Sony Walkman NWZ-A818, hmm what they gonna choose?
I do however give Toshiba credit for having a complete standard, Sony were shaky on that front.
As far as the poster goes, i can see the funny side, I do think its a little tack, but i doubt they had the authority of the big bosses for it anyway so don't base your opinion of the values of an entire corporation on the actions of some perhaps over passionate employees.
@collide007 - http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/16/blu-ray-disc-coatings-starting-to-rot/
The PS2 did not need DVD.
Still saying Digital Downloads FTW!
Yeah, the US doesn't even have the bandwith to support mass digital downloads, even taking to effect that the shit you can stream off of netflix, apple Tv and the likes even in the HD content can't even come close to physical media (DH or SD). Digital download may take over, but not for years and years and years and well decades. Also don't forget about the millions of people in the US and other countries that even if they wanted to still couldn't get a broadband connection and are left with crappy dialup. Yeah, digital downloads is going to take right off!
I was pulling for analog downloads...
Do your research please before blabbing senseless crap! Professional comparisons were already made of AppleTV and physical media and On Demand HD Cable and guess what, the differences were slim to none. So I would not say decades away, maybe years or even less then that, thanks to services like FIOS. People that live in farms or rural areas, that are on dial up are highly unlikely to be buying HD content, and are definitely not the majority of the market. There was a recent study and a majority of the US more then 50%, are in fact on highspeed internet (DSL+). I have an Apple TV on 5Mbps cable connection, and I rented a HD movie and it buffered up for watching in less then 2 minutes and it never again stopped and the quality was pretty damn close to that of my PS3. So to say that it will take "decades" is just plain ignorant.
I totally agree. I have yet to understand the BluRay/HD DVD debate. It's the same source on two different storage mediums. Who cares? I don't care if it's via HD DVD, BluRay, or a USB thumb drive...digital is digital. Give me downloads straight to a hard drive any day over a 1990's delivery method. By the time I run to Best Buy to purchase, or blockbuster to rent, I could have it downloaded via Xbox Live or Apple TV.
That arrogance is exactly why I no longer purchase any Sony products.
As far as HD goes, I'm more than content to stick with regular DVDs until downloadable HD content becomes mainstream.
Do we really call this "arrogance"? Blu-ray won the war with HD-DVD so declaring this isn't really arrogance - just simply stating a fact. That most people had never heard of either format is neither here nor there...
Yes, complete and utter arrogance. There are gracious ways to win, and then there's the arrogant "Told you so" way to win. If you think Sony is in any way gracious, look at their proprietary format habits over the last decade or two and you'll see that they're only concerned with themselves.
Doesn't really look 'expensive' enough to qualify as a Sony job. Looks like someone else stuck this on. The store is closed, after all.
The poster was on the inside, someone else on Flickr has uploaded a pic too, I noticed. I asked my mate if I should take a picture with my hand on the glass to show it was on the inside, but we decided I was being overly cautious.
What? Someone managed to stick it on the inside of the pane of glass whilst the store was closed. If it was done by someone else surely they would have noticed it when they locked up.
This is just a shop that sells Sony products, hardly an official Sony voice. They're just trying to do what every other shop on Tottenham Court Road (major tech shopping road in London) is trying to do and that's sell more products. Indeed, what any shop the world over is trying to do. Most people walking past probably have no idea what BlueRay or HD-DVD is, so this is just a cheap attempt to get some attention.
I can go back and quiz them about it, if you like?
I dont know why everyone hates sony so much! They didn't do anything wrong! But everyone seems to hate someone!....
I hate Microsoft...
I hate Sony...
I hate Apple...
come on now we are not in the 3rd grade!
Google Sony and look around - the rootkit fiasco, opressive levels of DRM, always creating its own format (MiniDisc, SACD, and MemoryStick, to name three)...
I hate all three of those...do I win something?
Actually, nuts to you, you can see the reflection of the glass over the poster, proving it's inside :P
Well, you can't fail with every proprietary format, 1 out of nearly a dozen isn't bad.
remind me how atrac PMPs and mini discs are selling these days?
They're selling like hotcakes. Very cold, possibly frozen hotcakes.
Nothing wrong with celebrating a victory. People, all of you complaining, you might want to go outside of your cave and do something that's an accomplishment. You'll find that celebrating a victory is quite a joyous feeling.
By the way, Beta didn't make it in the consumer world, but it sure made it in the professional video world. Minidiscs may not be made any longer, but they're still being used in the professional world. Just because it's not popular with Joe-sixpack doesn't mean that it failed. The real people that depend on the item for their livelihood is where it really matters. Do you think a professional photographer uses a Canon Elph on an assignment to Iraq for an important photo shoot? Heck no. Do you think they'll rely on a Sony 13MP P/S for that important model shoot that will be on the cover of all those magazines? No. They'll probably use a Hasselblad 39MP camera. Is a Hasselblad 39MP camera popular with the consumer? At $33,000 without a lens, I don't think so. So is it a failure? I don't think so.
He is right about the Beta comment. I've got a stack of them sitting next to me. We send these things out on a daily basis to be used for broadcast. It did catch on there.
Of course, Sony does still have their fair share of failures, so you've got to be fair. :)
@ whatsdamattau
Hasselblads are NOT made for average consumers.
but the mini discs , atrac & betamax were made for average consumers , so thery are fail.
and yes, proprietary formats are the reason i HATE sony so much.
"No. They'll probably use a Hasselblad 39MP camera"
what does a professional quality camera have to do with bluray or any other proprietary formats?
thats like people complaining about how every ford retail vehicle sucks but then mentioning that the ford formula 1 racecar is awesome and it's the shiznit. Enjoy your one race car, everything else is fail.
It's great if the company has great professional products, but Sony's business is mostly consumer electronics, and in that field they are notorious for crappy proprietaries formats.
Cool, Formula One. That's awesome. Much better than the Corvette I saw on the street.
Proprietary formats, that everyone seem to be getting on Sony's case about, doesn't seem to be isolated to just Sony. Last time I looked the AAC format is proprietary to Apple. I'll try to put Mac OS-X onto my computer...oh wait, once again that's proprietary to Apple. Garmin has a proprietary format for their maps. Try to put a commercially available non-Garmin format Topo map on one of their GPS units. Magellan has their own formats. I'm not following everyone's logic that Sony is bad because they have their own format for things. Everyone seems to have their own format for something. That's how companies try to keep people loyal to their products. Next time you try to put that part that's made for a Dodge Charger into your Porsche 911, you may find it's a proprietary part and won't fit.
As for the reference to the Hasselblad, it's a point that just because the consumer and Joe-sixpack didn't embrace a format, maybe a professional will. A Hasselblad may not be a consumer item (well it is really since you can go to any high end camera store and buy one. You just may not be able to pick one up at Wal-Mart or Target.), but it's a professional item.
OH MY! Look at Sony Gloat. Sony is now like 1-5 on standards wins. This is kinda like the Miami Dolphins gettin all excited 'in your face' and 'we're #1" after that one victory over the lowly Ravens. They still blow.
They're still basking in their first win, and there's no assurance they won't goof it up, or better become irrelevant in the bigger technology picture. This all just means higher prices for movies.
I can't wait for the price-gouging to begin.
Sorry, make that "cost/quality ratio of HD-DVD superior".
Oh no, I understand, but it will get worse.
The price gouging hasn't begun yet? IMO, $400 for a fancy DVD player is already a bit expensive.
Everyone's talking about how lame Sony are being for putting up one sign, in one store, it's most probably got nothing to do with Sony, just the maganer is (as you'd expect) a massive fanboy.
It also seems everyone is forgetting about what Microsoft did at the PS3's launch, that is thousands of times worse than this, did Sony react and take action against MS? No. So chillax.
We see what we want to see. But you're right... you're very very right. *Sulks*
It's almost like France finally winning a war and saying "Hey, look at us! We're the winners!" After that many format losses, you're bound to win one.
But honestly let's not kid ourselves - France will never win a war!
Either way, I'm still holding out for awhile on my purchase. My $5 upscaled DVDs are good enough for me. :)
But all I'm trying to say is
Pearl Harbor sucked
And I miss you
maybe, and this is a big maybe,
like if France won a war,
and they are announcing this out of utter surprise?
but i think we all know Sony and the French are too smug to be anything but to most pompous self promoting individuals.
They might have one, but i'm still not buying one.
They don't have to be smug jackasses about it.
Oh wait, they're Sony! Of COURSE they do!
I do remember when people were claiming that Blu-Ray would lose, just because the technology was developed by a consortium that include Sony.
Some victory. It was hard to tell which format would win out. Where did laser disks go? http://www.whatisgoingonblog.com
Totally Lame.
Not the sign, but Engadgets lame bottom feeding posting of anything the can dredge up to keep the fanboy war going despite the end of the actual format war.
It is over, grow up, move on.
Actually I submitted it coz I thought it was a funny sign. Not to stir any emotions. Obviously your feelings towards this subject are anything but healthy.
Not concerned with your motivation, just those of Engadgets.
Read some other comments, apparently no one got the joke and it got right back to fanboy bickering. The format war is over, there is no point to keep dredging this up again and again. Apparently more fanboy bickering = more hits for Engadget.
Remember beta-max? Nope.
We wont remember HD in a few moments.
I hate [other] nerds...
This has been said before but Sony would likely not officially have anything to do with this as the shops on Tottenham CT road are very competitive, and do practically anything to bump up sales.
"They're still basking in their first win????"
WHAT???? The hell are you bangin on about? If you do your homework then you will see that Sony introduced portable music solutions - namely the walkman brand that started off all the portable music trends.
Sony are also number one at compact cameras with the cybershot
there is an extra two wins that you can think about!
YES YES YES Apple now have the monopoly over the mp3 market (although it is not mp3 it is aac) but the sony walkmans are now open format wheras ipods are not, walkmans have beter battery life, better sound quality, but im not going to bitch about ipod because they found a niche in the market for their players and they have marketed them well.
For gods sake people, blu ray have won, why bitch about it when there is nothing you can do about it
Sony are not the only body within the Blu Ray forum, it is made up of pioneer, sharp, panasonic, philips, etc etc etc
So why bitch at sony when you could just as easily bitch at those companies too.
Sorry to anyone that is actually giving a real opinion here but it seems that some people only want to moan about sony.
Fucking gloaters! lol
Sony still fucking sucks at the end of the day. I'll never buy any more shit from them.
HD-DVD and BluRay lost.
I just keep laughing at the fact that people think that BluRay won. All that happened is that the HD-DVD/BluRay war gave the online content deliverers an opportunity to catch up on delivery. So now you have HD Rentals on iTMS, Microsoft and others will start offering the same. Amazon has Unbox, etc... So in reality, why would I bother wasting a huge amount of money on an early generation player and high cost BluRay discs when I can watch over 100 movie rentals from Apple or Unbox before I ever reach what it would have cost just to buy the BluRay player.
Oh... another thing, as internet bandwidth improves and P2P delivery improves, bitrates will go up and quality will improve on online rentals, but BluRay will be stuck at the same quality playable by the earliest BluRay players.