China takes the leap: Emdrive aka Infinite Improbability Drive now in development
By Stephanie Patterson 
posted September 25th 2008 5:03AM
posted September 25th 2008 5:03AM
[Via Wired]
posted September 25th 2008 5:03AM
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Hopefully they're better at this than they are making KIDS TOYS and BABY MILK!!!
And M&Ms for the people in Indonesia apparently. Fucking assholes. I can't eat my M&Ms anymore.
Huh? Its a plasma drive, these are already mounted on real satilites for slight orbit corrections as far as I know.
As for terrestrial uses think again these things produce so very little thrust that any sort of atmosphere would keep them stationary. The trick is in space they can be left on to slowly build inertia over time. Unlike traditional boosters which have a run time limited to minutes not years.
I like how they went for the steampunk look when designing it. :o)
Well written article Stephanie.
Wow But will it RUN CRYSIS is the REAL question...if china keeps this tech advances up i think i ll have to move there,,,in a strange geek sense of chasing high tech hardware and the do la lay.
This could prove to be very interesting in the future.
Oh god China please don't screw this up by increasing the amount of microwaves to an unsafe level just to go faster... (hasn't this happened before?)
Looks like a fancy bongo drum.
http://74.52.12.98/~webovato/faold/images/bongo_drum.gif
If this is true, which it very well may be, then everyone out at Area-51 needs to be FIRED !
Judging by waistlines, we're nearing completion of the M&M drive.
EmDrive is Relativity Drive while Infinite Improbability Drive is Quantum Drive. Those are not unified yet.
has anyone ever seen Gundam 00. well with the news of orbital elevators and this new EmDrive, the world is looking to go in the direction of Gundam00. If you have the time, read up on the premise of the show or wait till november and watch the SciFi channel hahaha. but yea....if it really turns out like Gundam00 im gonna be happy =P
a
Sad is the day when you kiddies thing these ideas came from a lame ass cartoon.
and i shall say
there is no spoon
I guess we'll see if it's bunk or not pretty soon.
According to wired the Chinese professor working on this seems to know his physics...and Shawyer's resume isn't too bad either.
ie the heart of gold?
Cool. I've always wanted to meet Zaphod Breeblebox.
Its a generation one Impulse Drive.
Or a snow cone maker.
In evaluating an engine, the only thing one needs to ask is whether or not any momentum is carried away, which is a basic requirement if the engine itself is to consequently acquire momentum in the opposite direction. In a chemical engine, the ejected hot gases carry the momentum. In a plasma engine, the ejected charged particles. In a light-based engine, the photons (which have momentum equal to their energy divided by the speed of light, c). Even a rock falling to the earth is involved in a transfer of momentum, in the form of the earth being pulled toward it as well (acquiring an equal change in momentum to the falling rock).
If this engine is completely closed and emits nothing, not even microwave photons, then no thrust is possible. You don't have to look any further in understanding its principles of operation to know this, since a violation of conservation of momentum has never been observed.
David
Good! Now I can scoot off to China and steal this thing to power my backyard proyect: the Heart of Gold.
Assuming the even works......how fast will it propel an object and how large can that object get? Also, something has to be consumed in the process. How long does that "something" last before it has to be replaced/replenished?
I'll stick with Bistromathics Drive.
where the hell is Archer Quinn when you need him?
Waiting for the world to be worthy of his mighty intellect, of course. Also avoiding Nazis reading his emails.
I read through the theory paper on the website, and the big assumption that is made (and I guess proven, if physical test rigs have legitimately verified calculated values of thrust) is that the microwave radiation and the waveguide through which it passes are treated as two independent systems:
"However as the velocities at each end of the waveguide are significant
fractions of the speed of light, a derivation of the force difference equation invokes
the difference in velocities and therefore must take account of the special theory of
relativity.
Relativity theory implies that the electromagnetic wave and the waveguide
assembly form an open system. Thus the force difference results in a thrust which
acts on the waveguide assembly."
Basically, unlike say a swirling fluid in a chamber like that (which would all be part of the same physical system, and wouldn't have any impact on the overall engine) the microwave radiation behaves as an external driving force. The physical layout of the chamber results in a net positive force against one end of the chamber, which causes thrust. Think of this as kind of like an air foil - the pressure differential causes lift. Except in this case, there is no fluid involved. Another example might be something like how a solar sail works, except you're providing your own radiation.
Pretty damned wild. I'm not saying it works, but if their assumptions are valid it could be very intriguing indeed. If their assumptions are valid, it becomes a matter of being able to generate enough energy to provide worthwhile thrust.
Bugger that, I want a Bistromathic Drive.
I also read through the theory paper back when it was initially publicly announced. The implications of this were very exciting and I wanted so badly for it to be true, but I could not reconcile to myself a glaring error in the theory. As I see it now, all there is to decide is if this is simple stupidity, or is there a deliberate intent to deceive.
The error is that he holds on to an assumption long after the condition that merits that assumption is no longer true. He starts out with a strait cylinder shaped chamber, and notes that the force exerted on sides of the cylinder cancel out. This is true, and entire premise of his device is based on that, that the forces on the sides of the chamber cancel out and can be disregarded. He then changes the shape of the chamber, but retains the assumption that the forces on the sides of the chamber can be disregarded, an assumption that is not only no longer valid, but hides a force that (shocker!) cancels out the disparity in force created on the ends of the chamber.
There's a reason you can here the crickets in the US, because they are all smothering their giggles and laughter at yet another sap who buys into a crackpot scheme.
I'm surprised China or Russia don't attempt to do an Orion Drive system (wiki 'orion drive').
It wouldn't pass the ecological standards for NASA to keep working on it, but ecological concerns have never stopped China or Russia.
"Ford, you're turning into a penguin. Stop it!"
In the wired article:
"Such extravagant claims are usually associated with self-taught, backyard inventors claiming Einstein got it all wrong."
Gee - I WONDER who they could be talking about? (*cough* Archer Quinn *cough*).. Ahem. sorry, I just had to clear my throat.
I find it kind of funny that engadget claims America has done nothing over the last year in the field of space propulsion, when in fact the JPL is currently working on proven technologies like plasma drives and ion drives that dont actually claim to violate the laws of momentum (which are unchanged by relativity btw). It would be ridiculous for NASA to buy into that crap. Crickets be damned i don't see China sending probes to mars, or creating probes that are on the edge of the solar system. Besides if you read the wired article they claim that the current ion drives used by NASA provide more thrust than this microwave drive...so how the hell could a ship get to mars in only 45 days.
I'm going to tear apart my microwave and build this now.
Ha ha if you really believe that the U.S. doesn't already have this and more than your an idiot. The gov't learned a long time ago to just keep stuff classified b/c then it doesn't create huge debates between wacko environmentalists and greedy company executives. Keeping things under wraps saves money and keeps potential enemies out of the loop. We have no idea what the U.S. government has been doing the last 20 years, they probably have things that are beyond anything we could possibly think of, and it will probably remain that way until WWIII breaks out. Never underestimate America regardless of who is the president.