Apple's Steve Jobs calls Blu-ray "a bag of hurt"

Straight from El Jobso's mouth at today's notebook keynote: "Blu-ray is just a bag of hurt. It's great to watch the movies, but the licensing of the tech is so complex, we're waiting till things settle down and Blu-ray takes off in the marketplace." Phil chimed in with "We have the best HD movie and TV options in iTunes." Damn. As if that weren't enough to make Mac-lovin' home theater junkies cringe, Steve also commented (when asked about the dearth of HDMI in his introductions) that HDMI was "limited in resolution," and Philip Schiller elaborated by saying that "for typical computer use, DisplayPort is the connector of the future." So, does that mean we can't count on Blu-ray support in OS X 10.5.6?

[holycow @ Oct 14th 2008 2:00PM]

HOW is this 'BREAKING NEWS'?

[Patriks7 @ Oct 14th 2008 2:01PM]

It came from the mouth of god.. uh Steve Jobs I meant..

[Pip @ Oct 14th 2008 2:06PM]

That resolution comment is downright wrong. They both share the same maximum resolution.

[JAmerican @ Oct 14th 2008 2:08PM]

The only thing that's breaking is Blu-ray Disk Association's heart.

[zenstylejunglist @ Oct 14th 2008 2:11PM]

Anyway OSX kinda supports bluray. You just need to bring your own hardware & software to the table.

[Frankenstein Black @ Oct 14th 2008 2:13PM]

"but the licensing of the tech is so complex"
LOL, that's funny coming from the head of the Job-O the Hut Syndicate!

[EatingPie @ Oct 14th 2008 2:13PM]

"Blu-ray is a bag of hurt, but AppleTV so pwns!!!!!!!"

:p

-Pie

[nerdtalker @ Oct 14th 2008 2:14PM]

Maybe because he's:
1. Wrong about HDMI (limited resolution? What the hell is he talking about? It's DVI with audio, and some HDCP tossed in. Are you serious?)
2. Deluding himself about Blu-Ray

Honestly, I'm pretty sure the difficulty lies in securing the entire OS to meet HDCP compliance. Admittedly, that's got to be a headache, if not darned near impossible without an entire OS refresh, and what we've got now is brand spanking new. I'd expect that getting that all licensed and working on code which has such firm open source origins is going to be tedious. From his perspective, "a bag of hurt."

[prateeko @ Oct 14th 2008 2:14PM]

How the hell does is casually refer to HDMI as being limited in resolution?!

I mean, yes, it has a limit but not one that'll pose a problem for computers right now. Seems like Stevie is really against shelling out anything in terms of licensing for blu-ray/HDMI...

[Testies, Testies, 1, 2... 3? @ Oct 14th 2008 2:17PM]

Notice how the display Port on the Macbook Air can now run the 30" Cinema Display

[Hold McGroin @ Oct 14th 2008 2:21PM]

If you weren't sure, here the Apple design process:

1. Think of idea
2. Ask Lord Steve if he wants that feature for his personal use
3. If yes, put idea into new product. If no, scrap idea and say that no one really wants it at the next Apple Ego Stroking Convention.

So far casualties have been: iPhone copy/paste, iPhone removable batteries, Blu Ray, enough USB ports on any Mac laptop ever, any useful features on the Air.

[Andrew @ Oct 14th 2008 2:27PM]

The mini display port can connect to a dual-DVI adapter to power 2 external displays.

Not sure that you can do that with HDMI.

Whats the point of HDMI when the mini display port can connect to DVI via an adapter? is it just that people want the audio as well?

[Chris C @ Oct 14th 2008 2:34PM]

Maximum bandwidth of HDMI is 165 million pixels per second. As an example, 1920x1080x60Hz = 144.4 million pixels per second, so the maximum resolution - without going to dual-link - is not far above that.

To compare, display port has a maximum rate of 8.64 gigabits per second, which is enough for 2560 x 1600 x 60HZ x 30bpp.

So, yes, HDMI *is* limited in resolution.

[CraigJ @ Oct 14th 2008 2:33PM]

From DELLs website:

HDMI is intended as an external consumer electronics connection for HDTVs. It is rapidly replacing S-Video and component video as the primary connection to TV sets. HDMI appears on consumer monitors so that they can be connected to Blu-ray Disc players, game consoles, and other consumer electronics. This allows the monitor to be used as an entertainment display. HDMI is also found on PCs to enable connectivity to HDTVs.

In contrast, DisplayPort is the digital interface for connecting flat-panel displays to computer systems. It will eventually replace VGA, DVI, and LVDS in IT equipment such as home and office PCs, projectors, monitors, and data center consoles. HDMI is not designed to meet these internal and external IT connectivity requirements...it is an external consumer electronics interface.

HDMI is based on legacy CRT raster-scan architecture. DisplayPort is designed for modern flat-panel displays and PC chipsets. DisplayPort has a micro-packet architecture with low voltage signaling that more easily enables networked displays. In the future, DisplayPort will also allow daisy chaining displays at full graphics performance, including 3D. and content protection. Today's USB-based daisy-chaining solutions do not support high performance 3D graphics or protected content.

HDMI has rules for how to implement and use the technology. Business and enterprise customers may not want to implement all of the consumer electronics features that are required in HDMI products. In contrast, DisplayPort is the display equivalent of Ethernet....anyone can implement it in any type of application. A VESA compliance program ensures interoperability for products featuring the "DisplayPort Certified" logo.

DisplayPort supports higher performance as a standard feature-every 6-foot cable supports 10.8 Gbps. With HDMI, high performance is optional and comes at a significant cost premium. DisplayPort has better support for projectors and enables cool ultra-thin monitors. It supports native fiber optic cable and offers latching connectors, features that are missing from HDMI. Down the road, DisplayPort will allow multi-function monitors with a single cable delivering display, audio, and USB connectivity. It will also support multiple monitors on a single connector.

[Poom @ Oct 14th 2008 3:13PM]

lol at Frankenstein, spot on!!

[owen @ Oct 14th 2008 3:16PM]

Because Job's said it I guess. This page looks like he took it over. WTF. Job's saying anything negative about a product other than his has no validity to me. I really hope he gets taken to the cleaners in Europe because finally someone stood up to his "mp3" incompatible crap format. don't even get started on I-tunes. Crapware part 2.

[Patriks7 @ Oct 14th 2008 3:22PM]

@ nerdtalker
I guess you are correct about the OS thing.. after all they will be releasing Snow Leopard sometime next year..

[loosely_coupled @ Oct 15th 2008 3:15AM]

Phil Schiller is a complete moron. I'm really getting sick of Apple blowing off the professional crowd, e.g. the ONES WHO KEPT THEM IN BUSINESS DURING THE 90's! There is much more to Blu-ray than consumers watching 1080P movies. For god sakes, has Apple forgotten about the entire video production industry? Even beyond using Blu-ray to distribute HD video to clients or indie film making, I'm sure there are many home users with new AVCHD camcorders that would like to playback HD home video on their blu-ray players. Secondly, There are a lot of home, professional and business users who would like to use 50GB optical discs for backups and archival purposes, especially for video, audio, and large scientific datasets. It's bad enough the Macbook "Pro" doesn't have an actual professional Quadro/FireGL graphics card or eSATA....

Oh and another thing. HDMI is certainly not bandwidth limited, and it's type-B connector actually supports TWICE the bandwidith of DisplayPort, enabling Quad-HD displays...

[eiki @ Oct 15th 2008 10:48AM]

replace 'mp3' with 'm4a', and that's about right

[KennyC @ Oct 15th 2008 12:16PM]

@Chris C

I'm not sure where your getting this information, and I don't think you're comparing apples with apples. According to wikipedia's HDMI page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI), the maximum resolution at 30bpp of HDMI 1.3 is 2560×1600p60. Seems like that's the same as DisplayPort's maximum resolution of 2560x1600xp60x30bpp.

Also, according to wikipedia, the maximum bandwidth of HDMI 1.3 is 10.2 Gbit/s.

Maybe you're basing your figures on HDMI 1.0–1.2a, but seems more accurate to compare the latest specs of both technologies.

[Rick C @ Oct 16th 2008 6:11AM]

"A bag of hurt"? Oh poooooor baby! I guess Jobs doesn't like it when Himself is forced to deal with the greed based DRM world he helped create. Imagine Himself having to endure the discomfort of Digital Rights that are owned by someone else and withheld or delayed out of greed.

[j h @ Oct 18th 2008 12:59PM]

This is EXACTLY why you should not buy MAC. If they don't want to support it, are too lazy/cheap, you will not get access to it. They will make up some stupid excuse to try and explain why, while the PC people are using it regularly and having loads of fun with it.

[Gabagool @ Oct 14th 2008 2:00PM]

My god, Jobs looks like death. He is so skinny, and not in a good way.

[Fatima @ Oct 14th 2008 2:04PM]

the SEC is going to be paying you a visit!

[iKurt @ Oct 14th 2008 2:03PM]

Introducing the all-new Steve Nano. More compact than ever before.

[JAmerican @ Oct 14th 2008 2:05PM]

I think they started his mummification process so he can be a statue at the company headquarters or brought on stage during press conferences.

[Anton @ Oct 14th 2008 2:06PM]

I wonder who will replace him.

[WickedEast @ Oct 14th 2008 2:07PM]

You're witnessing God turning into Jesus.

[UnixSystemsEngineer @ Oct 14th 2008 2:22PM]

I don't think he looks particularly bad, but I *do* think they're intentionally having him do less and less of the keynotes. I think Steve and Apple are trying to put the focus more and more on other high-ups in the company so that his health doesn't appear to be as big an issue in the company's future. That way if he is sick, or becomes sick, or gets hit by a bus, the stock doesn't completely nosedive. They're trying to prove that the management structure is in place, even if a specific successor hasn't been named.

Whether or not any of those things are actually true, however, is another story.

[Brak @ Oct 14th 2008 2:30PM]

uhh didnt he just have cancer not too long ago? or HAS it? i forget... macfans please correct me

[esoterica @ Oct 14th 2008 3:33PM]

FWIW, Jobs is a vegan. Now, maybe I don't get out much, but I've never met a vegan who was anything but rail thin.

[MadMike @ Oct 14th 2008 4:04PM]

@Esoterica: Steve is no longer a Vegan. He used to be. But with his health issues he quit that a while ago. Especially after the whole "holistic healing" backfired on him big time and almost cost him his life. He does enjoy Sushi and other raw and organic foods but he doesn't base his entire diet around it.

[Josh @ Oct 14th 2008 4:07PM]

i've met a few overweight vegans...it's tricky, you have to eat a lot of carbs

[Valicore @ Oct 15th 2008 4:14AM]

Fat vegans? Jesus, what do they do, drink soybean oil and eat bowls of sugar for breakfast?

[Amerist @ Oct 17th 2008 12:36PM]

I was a vegetarian until I found out soy is toxic in certain quanities (but what isn't really) and nobody seems to be sure just how much of it is considered "safe". Since you end up eating quite a bit of it to replace animal protein-based foods, I decided the lifestyle was not for me and started eating meat again. I like to save the animals and all that but if it comes down to me or the animal, I'm looking out for numero uno.

[Lucas @ Oct 31st 2008 11:51AM]

good, maybe he'll die soon and his successor will get on that Blu-ray support stat.

as for the DRM cracks, that was not Jobs. that was the studios and record companies demanding it from him. just like they did to Netflix, Hulu etc. they will NOT allow downloading of (especially movies and tv shows) without copy protection. or at least a decent effort at it.

as for the whole download v disc issue. downloads are on the rise cause they are often cheaper, you can get them from home without burning gas to go to a store or wait for them to come in the mail. they take up a lot less clutter and for many folks they don't care about the snazzy embedded features. so it's not a shock that Apple, which is trying to reposition as a green company, is all about less energy, gas etc use.

there are 3rd parties that have made the burners and the software for those that just gotta have it, which is probably not that many folks in comparison to those that are fine with the disc player they got for Christmas last year and hooked up to the big screen tv.

[Jeremy K. @ Oct 14th 2008 2:00PM]

Licensing of the tech? What? This just sounds like Apple doesn't want to make blu-ray software.

[THJ @ Oct 14th 2008 2:09PM]

Yes. Apple can redo their entire notebook manufacturing process, but blu-ray player software is too complex?

I think they, like a majority of their customers (minus the 10% that hang out at tech blogs all day), realize that BD is not that compelling yet.

[Paul @ Oct 14th 2008 2:09PM]

lol, they complain about other company's licensing techniques and stick us with horrible iTunes DRM for most of the songs.

[Chris Are @ Oct 14th 2008 2:13PM]

I don't know if that's TOTALLY the case. I've heard a good amount of criticism about Bluray, how it won't have the staying power DVD did/ does. Apple has always been about the future, so maybe they just don't want to jump on the bandwagon because they think digital distribution will take the lead in 5 or so years.

Or maybe he just doesn't want to develop software. :-)

[Cody @ Oct 14th 2008 8:31PM]

actually @ Paul.

Learn a thing or two about the music distribution industry before complaining about it. Apple has no choice other than to put DRM on some the content they sell, it's in their distribution contracts. If you want to complain about DRM on your songs, complain to the copyright holder, not the retailer. Dope.

[thedesolate1 @ Oct 14th 2008 9:23PM]

Apple knows what we all know. Physical media is dead. Now if they could only put the last nail on the DRM coffin we can all be happy, considering the iPod's popularity. Unless I'm missing something......

[fanman @ Oct 14th 2008 2:00PM]

Any news on the licensing issues with removable batteries?

[Benson @ Oct 14th 2008 2:04PM]

Well, apparently a deal has been struck behind closed doors to license it for the new Macbooks, anyway.

[TVGenius @ Oct 14th 2008 2:20PM]

They'll get on that after they license cut-n-paste for the iPhone/iPod Touch.

ZING!

[diode3diode @ Oct 14th 2008 2:01PM]

Wow, Steve looks realyl skinny sandwich between those two people. Get more healthy Steve!

[smak @ Oct 14th 2008 2:02PM]

cancer does that do you...

[CraigJ @ Oct 14th 2008 4:46PM]

No, it doesn't. (well, it might, but not in this case). Having your Pancreas, part of your stomach and your gall bladder removed does. His weight is a result of the procedure he had done to remove the cancer.

[smak @ Oct 14th 2008 2:01PM]

Gotta love Sony... That's what happens when you develop and spec a technology yourself and not with a consortium i guess.

[y3k.nik @ Oct 14th 2008 2:04PM]

Sony doesn't own Bluray, the Bluray association does..

Get your facts straight!