FCC official predicts "messy" digital TV switch, probably a three sheeter
By Richard Lawler 
posted Oct 16th 2008 2:23PM
posted Oct 16th 2008 2:23PM
Don't let the smooth transition experienced in Wilmington and other tests fool you, FCC member Robert McDowell just returned from a tour in 
Oh, crap.
Hmmm... that probably wasn't necessary.
antennae?
Well maybe people in those regions need to watch less TV and find some work or move to where they can find work. I can never understand why people get their homes torn up by a tornado and go right back to find their new home torn up again.
As for Alaska, anyone who is doing useful work over there such as medicine, or oil drilling, pipeline building/maintenance, or catching Alaskan king crabs gets paid very very well for having to live out there. What are the rest of them doing?
As for Montana, you have natural beauty out there just look out the window. Move when you want to do something productive. At least go to Idaho and harvest potatoes. Notice how they don't have problems with this transition.
You are ignorant, period.
stop palin us bro'
It was nice to get a rise out of you guys. What are you doing in Oklahoma anyhow? Waiting for a tornado?
what the FUCK are you rambling about? Really, are you fucking 5 years old? Or just like using elementary generalizations about states? You are one of the most ignorant douches I have come across here. No, everyone in Idaho does not harvest potatoes. No everyone in Alaska that is not a fisherman or oilman does not just sit on their ass. MAYBE...idk just MAYBE the reason they think the transition is going to be messy is because in more rural areas, people DO use over the air antennae for TV for the sake of saving money or because they dont get cable/sat service where they live. Or maybe they have better things to do with their time than piss people off on gadget blogs and read about this transition...
I was going to say I didn't see you getting a rise out of anyone, but lo and behold, them simple minded folk like lowdef never fail to disappoint.
three sheeter. Is that like a double bagger?
It is referring to how many sheets of paper towel you need to clean up a mess.
That's the polite answer.
Actually, I believe it refers to something else.
When Treasury secretary, Hank Paulson, submitted a bailout proposal to congress, he turned in three pages. 812 billion dollar bailout explained in three pages.
hmmmm, im a go with the shit wipes.
Well, I believe "three sheets" (assuming paper towels) sounds far more appropriate than "three shit tickets"
It is from a Bounty commercial:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auh87qrJUg8
nope 4 sheeter
I'm not too certain that most of us actually give a sheet. Or three.
All these hillbilly states need to get with the times and get CABLE. That's all you need to avoid any problems. No stupid boxes and it just works. Oh, but you might have to upgrade your 25+ year old TV.
I take it you are volunteering to run cable to them then? Seeing as how most of the state doesn't have a cable provider?
Hillbilly states like New York, where there are still plenty of areas where cable is not an option?
Then they must have more important things to do like:
Harvest grain.
Tend the cows.
Shoot wolves from helicopters.
Most states have no cable in rural areas because cable companies see no profit in running cables to them. With that said, many of these place can't even get over the air broadcasts anyway. They have to use satellite which is already digital, unless you still use old C-Band satellite dishes.
@Ricksta:
Ah... Ignorance at its finest.
Besides there being cable service *everywhere* in Montana (along with cell phone reception... I don't know why you people seem to think that we don't have any), we have access to high-speed Internet and just about every other modern commodity out there. Cripes, there's like fifty wi-fi networks within a mile of my house -- at least ten times as many as I saw in Florida. And as far as televisions go, what the Hell are you talking about? You're obviously as unaware as the FCC guy in this article; Montanans are just as "with the times" as the rest of the country, idiot. I couldn't even tell you the last time I'd seen a TV more than ten years old up here, and yes, I've been all over the state. Kindly avoid judging somewhere before you've set foot in it next time.
No, we're not a bunch of farmers or "hillbillies", as you so eloquently put it, and no, we don't all sit out on the range all day and ride horses to school. As a matter of fact, we lead normal, productive lives (and yes, having been born in California and raised all over the country, I can say that), and probably do more good for the country than ignorant, judgemental assholes like yourself.
My God I hate people.
All they need is a digital converter box the FCC is pushing. The government is even giving out $50 vouchers so you can buy one of these boxes at BestBuy.
Isn't it as simple as hooking a digital converter box between whatever antenna they are using now and their old tv?
By the way cable doesn't mean you need a new TV, people have had cable since the 80s hooked up to TVs dating back to the 60s/70s. I'm sure its the same deal with these new digital converter boxes no matter how much BestBuy wants you to drop cash on a new LCD TV.
Maybe some people don't want to or cannot pay for cable.
You do know why they shoot wolves correct? It's called predator control. Freakin idiot. Why is this even an issue in this campaign? It's normal practice and accepted.
@Goatee Man
I live in rural Virginia, and I assure you where I live, there is no high-speed internet unless you're lucky enough to live close enough to town to get unreliable 900 MHz wireless internet (1 Mbps symmetric, when it works, and it's usually slower than promised) and there's no cable. No DSL, phone lines won't support anything over 28.8k dialup. Exactly one cell phone company has service, and they don't provide any data services beyond things bound directly to their phone (games on the phone, apps on the phone, etc, no tethering).
I'm glad to hear Montana is doing well, but in places closer to DC than that, there are still people lost behind the times.
I agree with the rest of your sentiment, though, with regard to Ricksta's comment. In non-tech ways, where I live is much like other areas, and all the same things you said apply.
@goatee man
i like how you worded that comment. bravo. well there ya go, you learn something new every day.
people from montana are called montanans. who knew?!
Rovfan, with such a slow connection why would you waste precious time and bandwith on Engadget?
A Ham Sandwich, I believe the correct term is Montananites....
-Anchorman
Apparently, I only have one ball. At least I'm still twice the man as any woman here, which is a rare phenomenon.
Doesn't matter where you live. I live in CA, and TV isn't worth enough to me to pay money for it every month. Saying people are somehow backwards or behind the times for not wanting to shell out cash for a service that just isn't worth it to them is stupid. So your argument of "just get cable" doesn't work. I might watch an hour or two of TV per week. So let's see, 4-8 hours a month for $40, or free... hmm, what to choose? Seems like you're the one who's backwards to me.
I neither have nor desire to pay for cable nor satellite TV, despite the fact that I have more than enough resources to pay for it. The vast majority of TV I watch, which isn't much to begin with, I can get either over the internet, Netflix, or broadcast TV. Sure, there are a few good shows I miss out on (such as "Mad Men", which I will put on my Netflix queue ASAP), but not nearly enough to justify it.
I'm a bit nervous about this transition because a couple of stations in my local area (Houston, TX) have DT signals that aren't quite strong enough to get consistently at my home in the suburbs, although the analogue signal is fine.
Either way, I'm not getting cable of satellite because I don't watch enough TV to justify it.
In any even remotely rural area in the US your likely to only be able to get 1 maybe 2 over the air channels and cable is rairly available. Being disabled now and on a fixed income I have to live were the cost of living is lower so I know first hand about this. I live in mid sized city (4,000) in Idaho and because I live in town I can get cable if I can afford the $50 a month. That gives a total of 22 channels. No options only one provider and one plan. Only one over the air channel. The same is true for highspeed internet. Only one provider here at $65 a month for DSL no options (plus $58 for the phone line) and until 2 years ago only one cell phone company with no coverage outside of town. Why would anyone coose to live somewhere like this? Well having a fixed income of $8k a year I can afford to own a house here ($230 a month house payment), If I moved where I had coices of 2 or 3 cable providers and DSL providers I'd probably have to live in a 1 bedroom apartment owned by someone else and pay $400+ a month for it. And my $60 a month budget for food wouldn't be workable. Yes before I was injured I lived in a big city and made $50k+ a year, paid $1k a month for a one bedroom apartment (Seattle) etc. Been there done that. What you must realize is that most people that live in rural areas do not have a choice. They live there because it is the only place they can afford. Living here I have a 4 bedroom 2 bath house for less than $40k that was remodeled less than 5 years ago. Being confined to a wheelchair it's nice to live in a place that has more then one room. For that I give up some connectivity. No I don't have cable. My only access to TV is via DVD's or my DSL connection to the web sites of TV channels. But I realy don't feel that left out. BTW before I became a disabled 'hillbilly' I programmed manufacturing robots.
@Lowest Ranked
I'm one of the lucky few on the 900MHz local service, but also I'm currently at college where the Internet is much, much faster.
Excuse me? Hillbilly states? So people who enjoy and recreate in the natural world, understand what a deciduous versus evergreen is, know how to deal with large wild animals and enjoy peaceful, productive lives are hillbillies if we live in northwest states? Quite frankly, I've found ample number of people that enjoy malls, retail-heavy highways, commercial buildings that block the view of the world, freeways, polluted air, need to lock their homes and cars always, and who need to compete with the Joneses, the one's who are closer to hillbillies because of their superficial foci. Seems to me that someone needs to let you jump from a crop harverster into a field where you can spend the summer contemplating the real meaning of your existence on this planet. I doubt that it's intended for shopping. Alternatively, you can hide in the woods near one of my outfitter friends (atop a mountain far from urban life) and listen to them chuckle each night about the city folks who have come to the woods to pretend to be big hunters for a weekend, accompanied by wives who feel it necessary to protect their nails in the middle of the woods. Darn dumb people. But, we tolerate them. They pay. For something that's free. And they pay handsomely. Seems like the last laugh is on...
I was like "three sheeter.." wtf? and then I got it. The government should either a) force dish companies to offer discounted packages or free service of your basic 5 or so channels to those that can verify that they can't get cable and get rid of the over the air broadcasts. Then they could use the $50 voucher from the government to purchase the required hardware for satelite and not upgraded bunny ears.
what about option B? you only gave on option. LoL
b) let the whole system die with no compensation. TV is not a right.
It's up to the cities to force cable providers to give any channel out for free.
The problem with the program is that everyone and their brother is going out any buying these boxes that they don't need, just because they can or because they don't understand that the digital transition wont effect them. That's why money is running low in the budget for this program. They need to make it clear in the signage and commericals that unless you have rabbit ears to get your tv...don't waste your time or our money.
Or either spend their money on a flat screen(large or small) w/ a digital tuner built in. I bought a 26" last yr (black friday) and had cable at the place I lived in. moved and didnt have cable or dish(didnt like the prices). Went to Best Buy, bought a $9 rabbit ear "HDTV" antennae, and get ALLLLLL of my HD OTA channels.
So the "black box" is more or less an alternative, but of course the FCC wont tell ppl that...they're part of the Gov't, why would they? That make tooo much sense..And Dubya doesnt like sense...
You know what it is? It's really greedy assholes who have digital TVs but they need like 5 TVs in the house and they won't throw away their POS analog TV because today it is a right to be able to have more TVs than number of people living in a household. The only people who should qualify are people with ONE TV that is analog. If you have 2 TVs buy your own damn box.
That's Commissioner Robert McDowell. Don't know where you came up with Kelly.
Me either, thanks though, fixed
LOVE the headline.
If it is like in Italy.... They had a law that analog over the air service was going to be switched off at the end of 2006. This obviously did not happen and the date has been pushed out repeatedly and is now set for 2012.
My mother-in-law lives in Italy and I pretty much decided to play the wait and see game. It is quite possible that the date gets moved again, and even if it does not, perhaps by then her TV needs to be replaced so she can get a new one with DVB-T decoder integrated and avoid the hassles of an external decoder box.
have you not been paying attention for the last 8 years? It was set for 2002... 2004, 2005, etc we have been through this cycle. It's going to happen in 4 months. at the very most 10... I don't get the big deal, if you have missed all the signage/advertising/anouncements about DTV you obviousl don't watch enough TV to care that you may have to go out and get a box after Feb 09....
The one thing this is hurting is people who have satellite but were using bunny ears on auxiliary TV's. Most of them have to get a box or pay more expensive subscription/maintenance fees. I don't get why the communications companies don't treat it like Power/water/telephone.... let me worry about the distribution inside the house... if I want to watch 34 TV's in my 4 person house what do you care? People don't feel like moving a box from room to room if they want to watch TV in the livingroom or bedroom - they shouldn't have to pay for a second fee for the 'convenience' of being able to watch TV in their home without having to move a box every time they change rooms. Condo's, Appt's, and Commercial outlets are different and are already charged on a different rate structure.
@KJ
You can run TV from one cable box you know... most people just don't know how. Granted you can watch only one channel at a time, but that's about right.
I work for a broadcast television station. We have been pumping the hell out of the DTV transition for more than a year now and you won't believe how many calls we field pertaining to it. Most of them are retired folks (read: old) living out in the middle of nowhere picking us up on a 20 year old aerial with a TV that is just as old. They cant (or won't) navigate the government's DTV hotline so we field the calls. I shudder to think of the phone calls the morning of 2/17 when these folks can't get their "Price is Right." That's to say nothing of the mentally and physically handicapped who watch our station like it is the gospel, which is taken pretty seriously here...
"...who watch our station like it is the gospel, which is taken pretty seriously here..."
now that, is the funniest thing I've read today.
Glad I could brighten your day but I am for real. We get calls if a anchor goes on vacation because they are worried we sacked them. Hell, we have a stray cat that we adopted as sort of a mascot, and we get calls about it if we go more than a day with out showing him on the 6 p.m. news...
Ok, Nuemann. I'll have the ball to ask what everyone else is thinking.
Where the fuck do you live and which station is this? Please do live webcasts for those of us too far away to pick up your signal!
Also, the GAO was renamed the Government Accountability Office several years ago. Not that I'm crazy about that name.
Oh, and Ewwwww!
thanks for the heads up!
Just roll it out in each state/area over a period of a year. Spread out the transition times so that gov't resources can handle the influx of calls.
For example, switch Massachusetts over to digital first. On the analog signal, just broadcast a message like "Your head has been up your ass for the last 4 years and you now cannot watch Wheel of Fortune. Please call the government for help at 1-800-GET-SNOW."
Next month we move on the North Carolina, etc.
We don't need to do California. Ever.
This is genius. It would at least prevent the first wave of retards.
No, fuck that. I'm tried of having to wait for technology to advance because people don't pay attention or are too lazy to read.
I don't need a converter and I see ads for the switchover every single day on numerous channels. If people like watching TV enough to care when it goes away they should have seen these PSAs more than enough times. Especially since the ones who are confused are probably the same people who sit in front of daytime soaps for 8 hours a day.
1 in 5 households are not yet ready. They've got four months to get their act together. If that's not enough time then they deserve to lose the TV.
They can spend their free time reading.
This has been coming for years. The government & sales people have been warning them that this is coming for years. I'm sure all of them could save $20 or less to prepare themselves for this. And if they have been receiving the analog signals, they should be able to receive the digital signal ok. They may need to get some help pointing their directional antenna though.
I hope that this will push TV stations to switch to HD faster. I have completed my transition to all 1080p in my house for computers, DVR, and 3 HDTVs. My parents, sister and Grandpa are all setup for digital TV/HDTV now as well.
Another commentor hit the point exactly. A whole bunch of people who have cable and satt TV but still use old TVs think they need a coverter box. The stupid blue shirts aren't any help either since they just sell a box to anyone dumb enough to buy one.
In fact Best Buy and other retailers carry boxes for that reason. They get to sell a product to people who don't even need it. Easy sales.
My grandmother asked me if she needed to spend $50 on a box just so she can watch TV since her freinds told her that they needed to buy a box to get their cable to work next year. I said no grandma you have basic cable so you are fine. You only need a box if you use rabbit ears. She said, who uses those anymore.
The converter box is the biggest consumer electronics scam in history. I bet only 1 in 10 boxes is actually sold to a person that really needs it. Most people that buy one get one for a garage TV so they can watch football games.
And even then it's not like its showing in FULL HD, you're just getting a cleaner signal w/ no snow..just digital "scrambled eggs" when it starts to rail or someone at the stadium, in the truck jacks w/ the output signal.
PPl seem to bust a nut when they see the letters HD in the corner on tv..
"oooh HDDDDD...ahh skeet skeet!!"
:o) Sorry havent had my lunch yet..can I do over haha
Why is this so complicated? If you have cable you are fine, if you have an HDTV you are fine, bought in the last few years anyway, if you have none of those and want none of those, get a coupon and buy a converter box. If you have no idea what any of what I typed means, then you probably better off not watching TV anymore or one of your friends or relatives can help you.
Amen,
I know this is enGadget and thus the posters here skew towards having the latest and greatest technology (tv's and connections in this case) but flat screen, HD, and cable doesn't equal better quality of living...in fact, I would argue that it increases your chances of getting fat-assed and just sitting there.
I have an aluminum antenna from the 60's (in the attic, not on the roof), a hand-me-down tv from my parents, and one of those converter boxes you can get for almost free from dtvanswers.com. I am amazed at the picture quality...no it doesn't match my friend's high-def super shiny new rigs but its good enough (and free).
But will it be as messy as MobileMe?
this thing is all a sham.
This transition is being made because it allows cable companies to control the number of t.v's that you have running in your house (since a splitter will no longer work, and you need to register every box you have). I dont know about all you US people, but here in canada, you get charged extra per month use splitters without telling them.
Don't be a conspiratorial idiot.
if you don't know why this has to be done, then you shouldn't be reading this site.
Just... wow.
Hint: cable companies have nothing to do with aerial transmissions.
this switchover is only for over the air. It does not change anything with cable box!! What have you been smoking. If you have analog cable, you can continue to use it. No difference.
I quit watching TV nearly a decade ago when I got broadband internet instead of cable TV and haven't missed it, baffles me why TV is seen as a necessity by so many rather than a luxury. Get a DVD player, or a book, pick up a newspaper, etc.
Agree totally. They don't call it the idiot box for no reason. I seriously think that amount of TV we watch serves only to dumb us down. Sure people keep watching TV, keeping importing excessively from China, and don't learn any skills that we could use to export out talent because we like to be in huge amounts of debt to 3rd world countries. Fucking embarrassment.
@sr
That may be the most pathetic oversimplification I have ever read. God help you if you actually believe all of that.
The problem I had was the $40 government coupon did not cover the $60 cost of the equipment. I let the coupon expire. Hopefully, the price of the converter comes down next year.
The prices are not going to come down and these boxes might actually go away. These boxes are severely crippled. Mainly to appeal to the coupon using crowd. Once the coupons are gone, may be better boxes with HD output will come down in price but not to the $40 level.
If you got off your ass and find a job maybe you could afford $20. Good thing the public library has computers for deadbeats.
Let's see......
Adopt a system already tested in another country to lower the transition cost - NOPE
Develop a digital broadcast that is capable of being decoded while mobile - NOPE
Provide vouchers for converter boxes and make sure manufacturers offer certified boxes for the same price of the voucher - NOPE
What could possibly go wrong?
Seriously, they couldn't screwed this up any worse. No DVB standards here? Always outside the norm with regard to established international standards.
I live in Wilmington, we made the switch about a month ago. Feels good, man. Switch here got delayed, actually, because of the tropical storm...dunno if anyone outside of here knows that, I don't watch national news...
But Wilmington isn't exactly rural, nor poor, so we probably don't accurately portray the proportion of people who will not be ready for the switch, but thats not what the test was for anyways. I'm glad we made the switch (get my news in HD now), can't wait for everyone to make the switch... yay for advancing technology!
Yay for Wilmington! And Yay for the surrounding counties which most certainly are rural. We ain't rubes!
The government should take some of the blame here. They totally f*cked up the converter coupon program.
I, like many other Americans, ordered my two coupons as soon as they were available. When they arrived, it became clear to me that NOBODY was selling converter boxes yet. Best Buy was waiting for theirs. WalMart didn't have any. Even Radio Shack was a dead end.
The coupons were good for 90 days, after which they became worthless.
Guess how long it took for Best Buy and others to start stocking the boxes? About 90 days. Sometimes way more than that. Best Buy had one near the end of my 90 days, but they wanted $60 for it, and I wasn't keen on paying an extra $10 for something that was listed as being $50 elsewhere, when they finally got them in stock. I waited. My coupons expired.
Now I can't use the coupons, even though all the retailers now have boxes in stock at the $50 price, which makes them $10 with the coupon. The government won't extend the expiration date of the coupons, which is stupid. Why 90 days? Why not extend the coupons usefulness until February, 2009 so that we all have a chance to use them?
I asked about this, and they told me there's no way they're extending it. So I tossed my worthless coupons.
I DO have an HDTV, so I'm not out of luck, but my perfectly good older (2003) TV secondary TV is going to be useless in February unless I want to pay full price for a converter box, which I don't.
No, I don't use cable. I'm not keen on paying Comcast $60 a month for standard cable. I was on Dish, but they kept jacking prices despite my being under contract, so I ditched them. Over-the-air ATSC broadcasts look better than cable or satellite anyway. If I want to watch a cable show, I grab it on DVD, or on my Roku Netflix Player, or from Hulu, or from the show's own website (Daily Show, All of Adult Swim, CNBC, etc. are online for free). Hell, if I want to watch Starz, I get it as part of my Netflix account now.
Cable is for suckers, these days. You're better off getting 6 Mbps DSL and downloading. It's a better value, and then you don't have to deal with the cable jerks.
Anyway, I digress. The point here was that the government could avoid having any problems if they just allowed people to get coupons if theirs were never used, or if they extended the expiration on the existing coupons. There's no logical reason to give people only 90 days from ordering the coupons to pick up their converter box. In this economy, with the limited availability of the boxes, some people can't or won't manage it in 90 days.
I just got back from Mongolia where herdsmen who live in TENTS (actually, something like yurts) watch digital satellite TV that's powered with a few miserable solar panels. If Americans can't get their junk TV fix without government help, then God help us . . .
It's going to be messy because most people don't understand what is happening or what they need to do. Everybody has heard about mysterious coupons and lots of people think they need to buy an HDTV to use the box with.
The problem is the way it has been advertised on TV (at least around here) with the most dumbed down message imaginable. They're just telling old ladies that their TV "might not work anymore", but doing it in such laymen's terms that even knowledgable people who see the ads don't understand what they were trying to say.
I was listening to a morning show on the radio the other day and they were talking about the digital switch, and all three of the hosts were totally confused and misinformed about what they need to do. They started taking calls and they got at least 20 calls in a row from people who thought they knew what was going on, but were spouting inaccurate information. The most common misconception was that EVERY tv in the country is going to need some kind of box attached to it no matter what. So people who have cable but not a cable box were thinking that they needed to get a bunch of boxes for all their TVs.
From what I gather, only an extremely tiny percentage of the US population accurately understands what is happening and what they need to do to prepare for it. The FCC has done an incredibly terrible job getting the word out in a way that people will understand.
Wow, what a pathetic statement about the technical literacy of the talking-heads that populate the Vast Wasteland. And the poor citizenry . . . well, they are more to be pitied than censured. And you can't blame the FCC for sheer inability to do the most fundamental research before going on the air to spew fear, uncertainty, and doubt! Whassamatter, is Google broken where they live?!?
Nope. One sheeter.
What do I win?
Are you all forgetting that if you have cable you might still need them CABLE GOES OUT and what would happen when its out and no converter no TV at all if you had a converter you could atleast get local channels.
I have cable and im still buying some just because when our cable goes out which seems to happen atleast once every couple of months and Comcast takes forever and a day to fix it.
In reading these posts it is apparent that there are going to be problems in February. Some seem to believe that most of the people that will have problems are perceived to be old, stupid, or lazy.
I am not old, stupid, or lazy, nor do I live in Alaska or the midwestern plains. I DO live in Northen Michigan and have been aggressively tweaking every component of my television reception system to ensure that I can receive all the local digital versions of the analog stations that I have been receiving for years (even decades) with my amplified dual antenna array. So far, I have discovered that the unforgiving digital signal in conjunction with the distances and geographical terrain interference will reduce my full-time reception to one CBS affiliate and the local PBS station. The NBC and ABC affiliates are about 70% stable, and the FOX affiliates are about 15% reliable. There is no cable available at my location, even though I am only 2 miles from town, and satellite is out of my budget. My only hope is that the stations will boost their signal strength when the February deadline arrives.
IMHO, if the reason for the change to digital was to open bandwidth for government agencies, and if digital is so superior, the government should have adopted the digital channels and left the analog alone.