Ask Engadget: Best HTPC under $3,000?
By Darren Murph 
posted November 13th 2008 11:15PM
posted November 13th 2008 11:15PM
This week's episode of Ask Engadget takes things back into the living room -- or the bedroom, or wherever you have a TV -- and looks at the selection of HTPCs below the $3,000 range. And c'mon, who's not into getting a bargain this day and age? "My query is related to a what is commonly referred to as a Home Media PC. Recently I have gone through the wringer searching online for an HTPC which has the possibility of being upgraded when the time comes. I need it to do all the usual PC things (but on a 46-inch HDTV) and would also like to play RTS games, edit music / video and not go broke in the process. Looking online, most pre-fab vendors are charging upwards of $4,000 to $6,000 for potent media PCs -- what are my options for getting one between $2,000 and $3,000 (or less)?"
We know, the bulk of you are just moments away from blurting out "DIY!one1!," and while that's obviously a perfectly reasonable response, feel free to share of pre-built machines that just might fit the bill here. Later, you can beam in a question of your own to ask at engadget dawt com, but only if you feel led. No pressure.
DIY!one1!
build one yourself. that way your not paying for labor and any unnecessary custom features, and it'll be a lot cheaper.
Amen to that. The one you build yourself is definitely the best bet under $3K! For example, 6 months ago I built one that included everything needed (except a Blu-ray drive) for $420 including shipping. Today I can slip a Blu-ray drive in there for cheap as heck, but who needs that when you have streaming video and *ahem* other HD options.
and as for pre-built machines, i don't bother, but that's just me, so i can't really suggest any companies to turn to.
Check out the newegg homepage... there's an ad that shows an HTPC building contest between two dudes and they seem pretty decent.
If you're not comfortable building your own, you might know a friend or relative who would help. Also, you could try joining HTPC forums to read more on what others recommend.
Oh wow playing RTS on build-in graphics...
Did you even read it? The requirement I mean.
Under $3.000 you can build a great PC for yourself. If you want it to be HTPC, then you have to explain in detail what exactly you mean under "HTPC".
If its "to do all the usual PC things (but on a 46-inch HDTV) and would also like to play RTS games, edit music / video and not go broke in the process" then its pretty easy. We just need to build a... PC. A quiet one and one that has HDMI to connect it to a TV instead of a monitor.
This really simplifies the task.
1. Find a friend who knows a lot about PCs. I could help a bit but I can't contact you (the one who asked for help) or anyone else. Find someone you know personally or a friend of a friend. Its better that way. And forget about already-built PCs, I have yet to find a company that makes decent PCs and sells them with little % for "labor".
2. Ask for the following:
- how to build a quiet PC
- what CPU you can afford (core 2 quad Q9450 or Q9550 is a great thing, Q8200 is cheaper alternative)
- what motherboard to choose for a quiet PC (I recommend ASUS mobos, been using them for years and happy about it, I recommend P35 or P45 chipset, its not super-expensive but pretty good for both gaming, OCing, doing what you usually do ect and its not as expensive as X48/X38)
- I recommend installing water cooling (will set you back another $600 for pump, reservoir, triple radiator, CPU block and GPU full-cover block, all great components, but will make the PC quiet, because the most noisy "stock" things are CPU and GPU coolers)
- use an expensive case and expensive power supply (not 1000W, some 500-600W will be enough from a decent company like Zalman, Hiper, Cooler Master, Thermaltake... read some reviews to find out which one is quiet enough, I use Zalman 850W and its SUPER quiet, $160, my case is Lian Li P80, $400, and its worth every cent - pump and reservoir are inside, lots of free space too)
- use super-overpriced coolers - Noctua NF-P12 or something like that, the last model they made - its absolutely amazing piece of work, $15 each, you need 3 for water cooling (optional) and 5 more for the case (3 on the front door if you take P80 case I mentioned, one to cool motherboard if you use water cooling for CPU and one for exhaust cooler on the case, its always noisy no matter what case it is)
- as for video card - I have GTX 280 and pretty happy about it, but ATI 4870 HD is a great thing too, but for Full-HD you need 4870 with 1gb memory onboard, any more powerful card than these two will be complete overkill, I used them both with 30-inch monitor and eXtraHD resolution (2560x1600)
- some sound-proofing material (around $30) for the case really makes it quieter
- Scythe Quiet Drive. this small thing will make you forget what sound an HDD makes. I forgot mine year ago and don't want to remember.
Lets sum it up:
Case - $200 minimum, Lian Li makes good ones
CPU - $200 minimum, C2Q for video editing is preferred over C2D, more cores - faster encoding
Video card - if you use a build-in video, you'll hurt yourself, a lot. it can NOT decode a blu-ray video as well as discrete graphics - tomshardware had some articles about it, and they said even a $100 card does a better job than any build-in solution. Far better. I recommend a $300 4870 to play games. Please note: should have HDMI out or HDMI to DVI connector (my GTX280 from MSI has one, and 4870 had one, HDMI cable sold separately)
Motherboard - P35 or P45, $150 approx.
Sound card - X-Fi Xtreme Gamer Fatality series. Non-fatality series Gamer is a piece of crap, same level as a build-in sound - its a piece of software on a chip, which makes CPU do all the job, unlike the "fatality" series card, which has its own sound CPU. makes things sound better and work faster. yes I have one. $200 approx.
Memory - DDR2 (make sure mobo works with DDR2, NOT DDR3) 4gb 800mhz will be more than you'll ever (probably) need. $80.
HDD - you choose. I got 1TB and its more than enough for me. I took WD AECS 1TB drive, happy with it. $300 for me, $200 or less for you.
PSU - make sure it has at least 2x8 PCI-E connectors, you'll need them in the future. Module connections are recommended. $150 or so.
So far its $1480. Toss in $600 for a great water cooling set and its still well under $3000. It will be powerful enough to play practically any game (Crysis not included, Crysis Warhead not included) on maxed out settings in Full-HD resolution. And with water-cooling you'll be able to squeeze some more juice from it to rival those Core i7 CPUs at a much smaller price.
I'd look at newegg.com for parts, never bought there anything but heard its a good place for PC components shopping.
This is gonna be one crazy pc
I'm using an AMD duron 1800 with 128mb ram for an HTPC (my neighbor was recycling it. The system is fanless, except for the psu, boots in approx 25 seconds, and plays 720p blu-ray rips (of course, I didnt actually rip them on that pc)
Anyway, what im tryingto say is that before you build this thing, make sure you really want to do all this stuff ON YOUR TV
I basicly just use mine for watching, well, TV and movies, so i spend my money on other hardware. And BTW, if you dont have a nice setup, like a desk in front of your tv, pc gamining can get really annoying. Again, I would say do that elsewhere, and get anxbox for the TV (but of course im sure you already have one)
I know I'm just adding to the chorus, but pretty much any decent PC will make a decent HTPC with some adjustments.
I was running a nice 3.6ghz dual core, 3gb ram system with a last-gen nvidia card. I just recently added a $99 Hauppage tuner that will tune HD-OTA, analog cable/tv, and FM. I ran a $15 HDMI cable to my TV and I was good to go. The tuner came with a remote for Vista Media Center and I already had a wireless kb/mouse. Now I can use the guide to tune my cable and OTA, record like a Tivo, watch all the "instant" netflix I want, and browse all other local and online media all from my couch and with a remote. The great part was that it just took a couple hundred bucks to do this with my existing computer. You can do this from scratch for under $1000 if you already have an HDTV. There are some nice cases (Antec comes to mind) that look more like home theater components so you don't need to have a tower sitting beside/behind your home theater if you don't want. A decent dual core cpu, a few gigs of RAM, a decent vid card and tuner card, and a nice big hard drive (newegg had a 1TB today for $114) and you are good to go. Throw in a wireless kb/mouse and remote for easy couch-potato mode.
@pcmike how did you make a htpc for $420? I find that hard to believe. with what parts? Do tell. Can it run anything worth while or record HD?
I built a 3 HD, 2 analog gaming / htpc for about $1400 with:
Intel Q6600 cpu
ASUS P5QL-E mobo
Evga 9800 GTX+
4 GB ram
1 Hauppauge 2250 tuner
1 Dvico Fusion HDTV5 RT Gold tuner
1 Hauppauge MCE 500 tuner
2 x 500GB seagate HDD (in raid 0)
Origenae S16V case
Antec 650 watt PSU
It even has a recording light. :)
@ Shinigami:
Thanks for the info dude, that helped and cleared up a lot of things. My roommates and I were just talking about we really needed to invest in putting together a decent HTPC setup.
HTPCs are the most fun to build, mainly because these cases are the newest of new.
Antec Veris Fusion
ASUS P5Q-VM
CORSAIR 4GB (2 x 2GB)
EVGA GeForce 9800 GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready
WD 640GB
Pioneer Sata 20X DVD±R DVD Burner Black
This totals $611 before shipping (Newegg). I do not see where anyone gets $3000!
ya! thats the way to go, build your own! but i personally would go with and ATI over Nvidia any day, the new 4850's and 4870's are cheap and kick butt.
You're forgetting the HDTV tuner(s). Don't waste money on that Antec case. looks cool, who cares. you can get nice looking htpc cases for
with the $2389 left, you can buy a nice 52 inch 1080p LCD!
:-D
it is ludicrous how cheap LCDs are now.
You can get 52" Samsung 1080P LCD's for just around $2k. With the left over $350 dollars you can buy a PS3/X360/Wii and hook that up too. A PS3 would let you watch BluRay as well as being a nice gaming console.
I second the recommendation of the Fusion. It's this case I bought for my own system, and it works great!
Looks awesome but since that's way under his budget I'd say a 1TB hard drive. I agree with magnum870 this looks to be the best I also compared to Nvidia
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121276
ATi cards are more commonly found in HTPC builds from OEMs and knowledgeable HTPC DiY-ers. "ATi 3650 All in Wonder" is an excellent (the only) choice for this application.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=ati+wonder&x=0&y=0
I totally forgot the CPU!!! Nobody caught that too, and we call ourselves DIYers ;)
Add another ~200 for a Q6600 (we want to be encoding video don't we?).
hey I WANT THE CAPS LOCK KEY http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121276 is a better choice since he said he wants to game on the computer, but i totaly agree he should get some sort of a TV tuner card.
and as i said earlier would killermojo tell me why he recommended a 640GB instead of 1TB hard drive.
What everyone seems to be forgetting here is the ideal HTPC is supposed to be QUIET. Sticking in powerful Quad core CPUs and GPUs is fine n' all but generally defeats the whole point of an HTPC. It's no good watching a film if you have a noisy fan/hard drive running in the background. It's the reason why HTPC's are so expensive as the cooling and case components are generally of much higher quality in order to keep them quiet. Silent fans, heatsinks, and PSUs aren't as cheap as noisy ones. You need to take into account airflow as a lot of silent components are passive as well. This generally restricts the actual components as they can not as powerful due too much hear or noise such as the case with GPUs and PSUs.
Finally most people also seem to be ignoring TV tuners as well. If you don't follow this, you might as well just build a standard desktop.
Mac Mini + XBMC
http://xbmc.org/
Lowish cost + minimal messing around. Has everything you need to view HD content. Just add external storage over the network.
Can also swap the hard disk with a flash based drive to make it even quieter.
Its not great for games but get a PS3/Xbox360/Wii to sort that out
That's not even remotely helpful.
"all the usual PC things ... also like to play RTS games, edit music / video"
What good would a Mac Mini do for any of those? Are you going to honestly try and convince this person that a mac mini has the ram and horsepower to be a video editing box?
It's okay, most people don't read beyond the headline.
"...which has the possibility of being upgraded when the time comes."
That pretty much rules out any Mac.
Classic Mac response.
Get a Mac Mini +
1. Load custom software
2. Add external storage
3. Add external capture card
4. Add TV capture software (Myth/Beyond, etc)
Oh yeah - and it won't solve your underlying issue about wanting to play games. Brilliant!
Believe it or not, Macs are not the best solution for every single problem.
@ Bjsguess
[Insert indignant Apple fanboy response here]
@ bjsguess
Dude,just use Windows.
Much easier than what you just listed.
I don't know about building one, haven't spec'd out a computer in more than a year :P
I was recently looking at some PVR software though, LinuxMCE looked REALLY awesome, but getting it installed was a huge hassle cause of some display issues and then getting the Internet working proved too much trouble for me and I tried Ubuntu with MythTV, but again I was having too much trouble with getting Linux working at 100%
I don't want to use Windows Media Center, but right now I'm gonna try SageTV for Windows, it's a little pricey compared to free, but being able to use an OS I'm more comfortable with is worth the moniez. I used it before way back in the day and it's made a lot of progress in 2 or 3 years since I gave it a shot so I'm looking forward to it. From what I've read, I think it's the best PVR software for Windows, but other options are BeyondTV and of course Windows Media Center.
If you're comfortable with Linux you could try LinuxMCE, Myhbuntu, or just install MythTV on top of what ever distro you're comfortable with.
I'm also wondering about these $3000 to $6000 HPTCs being mentioned above, what sort of specs do they have?
As the others said, if you build one at least, you'll have one at a large fraction of the cost, not even close to $3000, that is absolutely ridiculous!!!!
Tell that to companies that successfully sell $7000+ PCs during world economy crisis...
Not really, I used to be fanatic regarding trying to get stuff to work. Like 10 years ago play with Slackware and see how to build partition tables and get your cron jobs done. Nowadays if something doesn´t work (I´m not an ICTer) I dont start fiddling with the buttons I pickup the phone or mail the ICT department and ask them to get it fixed and not to forget, how long does it take.
I find myself more and more in a position I expect my hardware to work and less intersted in what happens in the box. Now I can certainly imagine that people tend to go to a store or order online whatever they need and don´t want to think about how to put it together and get the software to work correctly. They want to get a box, open it plug it in and done. If it doesn´t work they dont start meddling themself they pickup the phone and ask Alienware or whoever when it gets fixed.
Yeah. Jesus. $3k? You don't need much in the way of expensive hardware for this task, just LOTS of disk. We're not talking a gaming machine, it's a video playing machine.
"...and would also like to play RTS games, edit music / video..."
Actually, we are talking about a gaming machine. Sometimes it helps to read the requirements before making suggestions...
Still it has to be CPU strong anyway to decode 1080p video so to make it a gaming machine only costs $300-400 more at most to put a high end card in and buff the power supply.
who the hell spends $3000 on an HTPC? You can build one for $500ish. a good one too. Anyone paying more than ~$800 (blu-ray burners are expensive) for an HTPC is a sucker. unless its got a built-in touchscreen on the display or something.
The best is the one you build yourself ;)
45nm quadcore
passive gpu
plenty of ram
huge hdd
nice looking case
Passive GPU and RTS don't really click if you ask me. But its easy (and inexpensive) to make it quiet enough not to be annoying. Just use expensive coolers, water cooling and sound-proofing materials in expensive (and large) case. More expensive, but more powerful. And quieter than what most companies offer.
I'm amazed at how good my setup is: XBMC on an old xbox and FreeNAS on an old PC (with a new 1TB HDD).
Only thing it doesnt do is record TV, but you can set that up apparently...
Cost me about $350 in new parts, including the hard drive :D
I'm with you - except right now my movies are scattered across 2 20gig drives, a 60, a 120, a 55, a 250(all on various locations throughout my netork), and about 40 backup DVDs (5 divx rips each). Time to organize....
mine cost about 300.00 mostly using used parts. it is connected via hdmi to a 47lg50 and looks amazing. all you need is a silverstone case and nobody will know the difference between your 300.00 build and their 3000.00 one.
For a total cost of $1240
I even threw in a pretty nice GPU for gaming...
Case: $160 Antec Veris Fusion
PSU: Included with case 400W
Motherboard: $120 ASUS P5Q
Processor: $190 Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 (2.4Ghz)
Memory: $55 4GB
HDD: $115 1TB 7200RPM
Optical: Pioneer Blu-Ray ROM
Networking: Onboard Gigabit LAN and Edimax 802.11a/b/g/n card
Video Card: $300 Sapphire ATi Radeon HD 4870 1GB
OS: $120 Windows MCE
All the prices came from newegg except for the case, which came from buy.com
That PSU won't cut it for overclockers... and Q6600s/4870s just BEG to be overclocked. 500W minimum for a system like that.
Yeah i guess, but who said anything about overclocking? That's a solid build you've presented.
go with 2gb so u dont need 64 bit vista if u use vista cause there r tons of incompatibilitys
You guys keep talking about DIY but that means he doesn't get a real HD tuner (OTA by itself doesn't cover it). The best experience is with a CableCARD tuner. The cheapest ones you can get are from Dell (XPS 420) or HP (m9400t). They'll run you for $1-$2k depending on options and coupons available. The problem with these is that they come in regular towers as opposed to a nicer htpc cases, for that you'd have to spend big on velocity micro, niveus or some other boutique which goes to your $3k range.
I would agree. I have built my own for many years, but for my HTPC I bought a system to get CableCards. That's really the only reason I can think of to buy pre-built over building it yourself.
As for suggestions: I'm very happy with my Velocity Micro Cinemagix Grand Theater. Dual CableCard tuners cost $600, so that put the total cost at around $2500. I haven't had too many problems with the CableCards (did have to replace one after about a year), but I did my research, and I know others have different experiences.
I agree. The true integrated experience will require a DCT. I have the HP d5000t. Considering replacing the standard PC tower case with one optimized for HTPC use.
The Cost? $1100 (single ATI DCT tuner). Take the cable tuner away and you have a price that's pretty much on par with a DIY.
Online coupons baby.
if you need cable cards, why not get the hardware that accept the cable cards (a nice graphics card that supports it would do the trick) and then get the cards from the cable company. they're gonna charge you that danged monthly fee, but it's usually cheaper than the actual cable box rental. and then you can DIY and have cable cards which is the best way to get your tv. but then again guys, what's wrong with the solid coaxial cable plugged in? i know where i live (upstate, ny time warner cable) people with standard cable can get hd channels so long as they have cable and an atsc tuner. if his card had one (mine does) he'll get hd tv on his HTPC
oh yea, you also could get the hdtv box from the company and then use firewire to link it to the htpc.
that also works...