We just got a look at some amazing touchscreen interaction, running on a humble resistive touchscreen with some
OMAP hardware backing it up. Stantum's technology is a software-based refinement to resistive touchscreens that allows for accuracy beyond the pixel density of the display, a complete lack of touchscreen "jitters" and some fairly incredible input methods. Termed "TouchPark," the multitouch framework provides gesture recognition, cursor management and physics processing for phone builders to stick on top of the phone OS (Symbian, Windows Mobile and Android are currently supported), and works with hardware such as
Texas Instruments Zoom,
Freescale i.MX and ST Nomadic. The PMatrix multitouch firmware allows for unlimited inputs, detection of any contacting object (a finger, a stylus or even a paintbrush) and pressure sensitivity. We played with the demo unit for a bit and were frankly blown away, it's far and away the best touch experience we've ever seen or felt, and the multitouch functionality is just gravy on top. Stantum is targeting resistive touchscreens because they're still considerably cheaper to build than capacitive ones, and from our perspective there seems to be zero tradeoff -- for sensitivity and accuracy this destroys everything else we've seen on the market, capacitive or not. Sadly, there's no word on when this will make it into real, shipping handsets, but we'll certainly be tracking its progress obsessively. Video is after the break.
posted February 19th 2009 10:32AM
This is some wild shit. Now I can have multitouch and wear gloves in the winter. I hope this technology goes up for market. Resistive screens FTW.
Very cool!
Sweet!
Cool
If it's laggy it might slow adoption for the "must havers", but someone somewhere will have a use for it..
See this is what im talking about.
i would LOVE to see a universal TOUCH format, where it becomes like MIDI, assignable to anything, works with anything, teachable, fluid, and stable.
I would really like to see the whole TOUCH movement to be smal enough and responsive enough to work with pretty much anything, like the film touch systems that can be used with laptops, other screens, etc.
I think all it would take is some company to do it just REALLY well, and then adopted by an open source platform.
come on already just make Touch universal and embeddable!
This is some cool stuff!
Oh boy I can only imagine what TVs will be like in 5years..
What's so unusual about this this stuff. When I had taken a tour at Cupertino the other day they were telling me this technology was already built into Snow Leopard Mobile and would be available when the next version iPhone is announced. I tried to get them to explain to me the use of such technology and they just laughed. They claimed they had found a few practical interface uses but mainly they just wanted to put it in the iPhone just so the other handset manufacturers would be scrambling to make copies of it. Of course, it was too late since Apple already had a dozen or so patents already submitted. Apple said they called this technology MultiTouch-and-Go.
Look at the size of that bulky prototype. Apple was able to get the engineers from P.A. Semi to fabricate a chip the size of a pinky nail to duplicate the same actions.
So what's next?
It doesn't look all /that/ amazing
ok, guys, I LOVE this, but there is one potentially large flaw which is mostly due to software issues that I've even noticed on my Pavilion tx2000. When you are using the tablet to write or draw with the pen you have to put your hand on the screen's surface in order to do it properly. The problem is that the computer doesn't know what u r trying to do or what is what, so it automatically detects your hand and not the pen making all sorts of irritating things happen. Sure, as long as u put the pen on the screen first and then rest your hand it should be fine, but in my experience (yesterday in biology, etc.) I find it happens eventually one way or the other. I always have to turn the finger touch option off... that's annoying. SO, I can only imagine that, as you can see in the first video, this problem would only be worse because now everything is considered an input. It's funny, I was thinking about that yesterday afternoon. lol. I guess you could make it to where you can tell the pc how many input points to respond to and/or to respond only to objects that have a certain "footprint", like a pen, and thing with certain pressures combined with their surface areas and all that. A lot of work to go through, but we are going to need it. Shizzle?
Spacegravity, the TX2500z doesn't have this problem in tablet mode, it switched automagically to prevent that from happening. That being said, this is still crap resistive. Ya, use any object you want people, when you scratch that delicate screen I'll be laughing. Resistive = garbage seriously. The paintbrush didn't paint like a brush did it, no it didn't so just grab a stick people. Anything you have to flex to register a touch is BAD. Again, just look at how often supermarkets and stores using resistive have to replace those items..bahh
At least you're not bitter.
hmm, I've yet to scratch any of my resistive screens. Even my old ass PDA screen is fine.
And why would I care about how a screen holds up in a supermarket? How does that affect how a personal product will hold up for me? The controllers on the video game displays at Wal-Mart are normally broken. Does that mean I should stay away from buying them?
And know patent this and start screwing apple for not letting GODle using Multitouch.
Trade in my glass screen for a plastic one that will scratch? No thanks.
"Hooterman @ Feb 19th 2009 4:44PM
hmm, I've yet to scratch any of my resistive screens. Even my old ass PDA screen is fine.
And why would I care about how a screen holds up in a supermarket? How does that affect how a personal product will hold up for me? The controllers on the video game displays at Wal-Mart are normally broken. Does that mean I should stay away from buying them?"
Wow hooterman, you're special. I seem to remember a huge deal with plenty of news stories discussing how scratchable the iphone screen is, and you have no scratches at all? Suuure...which totally ignores the fact that it's still WAY easier to scratch a resistive screen.
You might care how it holds up because it's the same tech, in high usuage with an adult present to prevent adolescent teens from breaking it. So your analogy holds absolutely zero water. One is in an area normally not supervised by anyone that gives a shite and one is in an area that is always supervised and within 2 feet of the cashier. Nice try though.
You seem to be arguing that a resistive screen is just as tough as a capacitive and that's just not true and you know it.
"Wow hooterman, you're special."
Thanks buddy.
And when did I ever say that a resistive screen is just as tough as a capacitive? Obviously that isn't true. What I did say is that I've never had a problem with scratching on my resistive screens.
And I really don't care how much water my analogy holds. It's basic idea works fine. Neither my phone or my game controllers will be used by random people all day long, so why would I care about how well a similar product holds up in an enviroment that is used by random people all day long?
Oh, and "One is in an area normally not supervised by anyone that gives a shite and one is in an area that is always supervised and within 2 feet of the cashier" means nothing. Kids aside, have you seen some old people try to use touch screen devices? They believe that you have to push the screen as hard as possible with either their finger or whatever pen instrument they have handy for anything to register. Nice try though.
Hoosier, you DIDN'T outright say they were tougher but tried to use two examples to support that theory.
Sorry I didn't clarify my argument as for the general public and not your sigularly exceptional careful use of those devices. YOU used the analogy of game controllers, not me.
And thanks for basically proving my point. I've been right next to the kids, and old users and I've had the unpleasurable experience myself. The reason most of them including myself are pressing SO HARD is because the device has been worn out to THAT POINT.
Now maybe you don't use YOUR devices that much based on how you currently use them or whatever but you can be damn sure that a multi touch will get THAT MUCH MORE use for simply BEING multitouch. I get it, you like your tech old, cheap and crappy. Others might want some refinement. Get on with your big stylus brotha.
Ok, well my original point was, why does a personal use item HAVE to have a capacitive screen for it not to be immediately considered "garbage" as you called it. Just because a supermarket should have something that can withstand abuse doesn't mean that my phone HAS to have this tech too. Do you only buy Toughbook laptops too?
hmm, I've yet to scratch any of my resistive screens. Even my old ass PDA screen is fine.
And why would I care about how a screen holds up in a supermarket?
And why would I care about how a screen holds up for you?
...you know, I really like visiting engadget....but I'm starting to dislike watching their videos....I mean, why should I have to click the close advertisement button twice in 2.483 minutes....huh?..once is bad enough, but twice...seriously...(shakes head)...I know you have to pay bills...but c'mon...
asdfasdf
Viva la Resistive!
"Hooterman-Ok, well my original point was, why does a personal use item HAVE to have a capacitive screen for it not to be immediately considered "garbage" as you called it. Just because a supermarket should have something that can withstand abuse doesn't mean that my phone HAS to have this tech too. Do you only buy Toughbook laptops too?"
Well because to me hooterman, releasing old tech as new because of some software fixes is garbage. To me, having used plenty of resistive screen gadgets, the tech is garbage. Have you EVEN used capacitive stuff? I mean other than an iphone? Other companies realize this as well, that's why they phased the tech out. They didn't give up on the nice profit margin they were enjoying using resistive tech until they realized that the problems and break/fix was too much. Just look at HP.
It's the same with the current resistive screens on the market now. They stopped including stylus' with them and started calling them touch. You and I both know a lot of them didn't change a damn thing and just got rid of the pen to be able to call it touch. I could do that with my old Palm pilots too, woopie, but they are garbage compared to capacitive.
No I don't only buy toughbook laptops. I don't buy them at all actually but if I was going to you can be DAMN sure that I would look to see how they worked out for a large group of people vs. your singular experience.
You apparently like old tech. I do not. I do not like old tech whether you rerelease it as new or with some software enhancements or whatever. The tech is still old and outdated crap and the ONLY reason they are doing it is because it COSTS them less and MAKES more money from people like you. So go ahead and bite on it, they'll be happy.
Just because a technology has been out longer than a competing tech instantly makes it garbage? Ergonomic keyboards are 'newer' than standard keyboards. Does that mean standard is garbage? XP has been out longer than Vista. Does that instantly make XP garbage? Digital watches are newer than analog ones. Personal preferences aside you can't instantly judge these things just because of their age. You don't like resistive screens, great, end of story. Tons of people use them everyday with no problems.
"No I don't only buy toughbook laptops. I don't buy them at all actually but if I was going to you can be DAMN sure that I would look to see how they worked out for a large group of people vs. your singular experience."
I really think you're failing to understand what I'm trying to relay with my comparisons. Stop taking them so literally. And yes, you should definitely see how well a product has done for many people, that's just smart shopping. But apparently you require your products to be certified to be handled by children and bears (please don't take the bears comment literally) all day long. Luckily this isn't on my checklist of needs in my personal products.
"You apparently like old tech. I do not. I do not like old tech whether you rerelease it as new or with some software enhancements or whatever. The tech is still old and outdated crap and the ONLY reason they are doing it is because it COSTS them less and MAKES more money from people like you. So go ahead and bite on it, they'll be happy."
I have no problem with 'old tech' if it still gets the job done. And from this demo this stuff definitely seems to get the job done. Hopefully the fact that they're using 'garbage' resisitve screens will help keep the cost of the products below a comparable capacitive screen, sounds like the best of both worlds to me. Right now you're showing a very 'Apple' point of view. In that just because there's a new version of something out the old one is instantly junk. I love tech and gadgets as much as anybody on here, but I don't share that point of view with you.
P.S. - How come you seemingly refuse to use the "Reply" button?
"Just because a technology has been out longer than a competing tech instantly makes it garbage? Ergonomic keyboards are 'newer' than standard keyboards. Does that mean standard is garbage? XP has been out longer than Vista. Does that instantly make XP garbage? Digital watches are newer than analog ones. Personal preferences aside you can't instantly judge these things just because of their age. You don't like resistive screens, great, end of story. Tons of people use them everyday with no problems."
I never said capacitive was out longer and apple sure wasn't the first to have it. I said it's old tech. which it is, capacitive may be as well but capacitive is generally looked at the next evolution of the tech. Why don't you reply to my comments about companies doing this to try and save a buck? If that even happens since apparently it's old tech with a twist in that they had a custom screen made. My gawd, why don't you come back with how a notebook and pencil work great for you too!
"I really think you're failing to understand what I'm trying to relay with my comparisons. Stop taking them so literally. And yes, you should definitely see how well a product has done for many people, that's just smart shopping. But apparently you require your products to be certified to be handled by children and bears (please don't take the bears comment literally) all day long. Luckily this isn't on my checklist of needs in my personal products."
I'm sorry that I cannot understand your non literal whatever you may be thinking comparisons. I believe your gist on the supermarket tech was that the problems are caused by the idiots who press too hard and I'm saying that no, they press so hard cause it's worn out. Something MADE to handle tons of people using it still breaks quite frequently. Again, you say this isn't on YOUR checklist and again I say that I am using real world examples while all you do is spout your personal preference which means nothing to most people. MY personal preference doesn't mean anything to most people either. I believe in my assertion and have tried to use examples. You have come up with some great off base non literal ethereal comparisons and then fall back to whatever YOUR personal pref. is.
"I have no problem with 'old tech' if it still gets the job done. And from this demo this stuff definitely seems to get the job done. Hopefully the fact that they're using 'garbage' resisitve screens will help keep the cost of the products below a comparable capacitive screen, sounds like the best of both worlds to me. Right now you're showing a very 'Apple' point of view. In that just because there's a new version of something out the old one is instantly junk. I love tech and gadgets as much as anybody on here, but I don't share that point of view with you."
I don't even own an Apple product and we aren't talking about newer versions with slight twists nor are we talking about the iPhone being the capacitive deal maker. Again, that is why I specifically asked whether you had even used anything capacitive OTHER THAN THE IPHONE? Which of course you didn't answer. I have, and it was before the iPhone came out.
Again, I get it, for YOU PERSONALLY this works. Unfortunately, my post was meant for people in general and not just for you.
P.S. - How come you seemingly refuse to use the "Reply" button?
Because your posts have no reply button and I don't see the point in replying to myself.
"I never said capacitive was out longer and apple sure wasn't the first to have it. I said it's old tech. which it is, capacitive may be as well but capacitive is generally looked at the next evolution of the tech. Why don't you reply to my comments about companies doing this to try and save a buck? If that even happens since apparently it's old tech with a twist in that they had a custom screen made. My gawd, why don't you come back with how a notebook and pencil work great for you too!"
If companies do it to save a buck and the end result is crap then I'll be right with you calling it junk. If a company modifies older tech and makes it as good as or better than newer tech and still saves a buck, then why would I care if they make a little extra money off their innovation? Good for them.
"I'm sorry that I cannot understand your non literal whatever you may be thinking comparisons. I believe your gist on the supermarket tech was that the problems are caused by the idiots who press too hard and I'm saying that no, they press so hard cause it's worn out. Something MADE to handle tons of people using it still breaks quite frequently. Again, you say this isn't on YOUR checklist and again I say that I am using real world examples while all you do is spout your personal preference which means nothing to most people. MY personal preference doesn't mean anything to most people either. I believe in my assertion and have tried to use examples. You have come up with some great off base non literal ethereal comparisons and then fall back to whatever YOUR personal pref. is."
Maybe your supermarket analogy doesn't hold the same water with me. As I can't remember the last time I ran into a broken touchpad in my local wal-mart or bank. Granted I don't live in New York, but I do live in the capital of my state so it's not like I'm living in a town of 1,000 people. What I meant is a the general public can and do unknowingly abuse these types of things, which is something that will not happen to MOST people's personal items (phone, mp3 player, etc). I didn't ever even say that I personally prefer resistive screens. All I've been doing is trying to get you to stop instantly calling something 'garbage' just because it's resistive.
"I don't even own an Apple product and we aren't talking about newer versions with slight twists nor are we talking about the iPhone being the capacitive deal maker. Again, that is why I specifically asked whether you had even used anything capacitive OTHER THAN THE IPHONE? Which of course you didn't answer. I have, and it was before the iPhone came out."
Again, I was not implying that you were an Apple owner. I was just comparing you to a lot of the 'Apple Hipsters' that dismiss any old technology just because it's older. And of course I've used other capacitive screen devices, and I've still yet to put down capacitive screens. I have nothing against either technology, they both have pro's and con's.
If companies do it to save a buck and the end result is crap then I'll be right with you calling it junk. If a company modifies older tech and makes it as good as or better than newer tech and still saves a buck, then why would I care if they make a little extra money off their innovation? Good for them.
Uhh, they are producing a new screen which houses mainly old tech. You still have no response to what they are doing now with resistive screens that WOULD come with a pen but they want to hop on the touch bandwangon. Even in the video you notice he loses contact with a finger which sure LOOKS like it's still touching the screen. Resistive is garbage because it's not as durable, harder to clean etc...plenty of other reasons but I'm sure you'll reply with only YOUR personal experience.
"Maybe your supermarket analogy doesn't hold the same water with me. As I can't remember the last time I ran into a broken touchpad in my local wal-mart or bank. Granted I don't live in New York, but I do live in the capital of my state so it's not like I'm living in a town of 1,000 people. What I meant is a the general public can and do unknowingly abuse these types of things, which is something that will not happen to MOST people's personal items (phone, mp3 player, etc). I didn't ever even say that I personally prefer resistive screens. All I've been doing is trying to get you to stop instantly calling something 'garbage' just because it's resistive."
Or maybe you are just trolling after spewing about seeing people abuse them but not seeing any broken ones. You know, you jumped to supermarkets, we were talking about department stores too, which get less use yet theirs are broken or respond badly plenty as well.
Sorry, I am going to call a horse a horse. Resistive is old, clunky, garbage technology. You can do pressure sensitivity on a capacitive. The fact you have to flex the screen at all is baaaad. Enjoy flexing it all the way when you try to drag and drop something. It doesn't work as well. I'm not going to praise and old tech. mixed with a little new so you'll buy it because it's called multi-touch but plenty will, I'm sure it will be the same people that think they got something other than a rehash of crap tech on their resistive phones they have now that don't come with a stylus. Similar to the video here posted a day or two ago with I believe a sony phone with resistive touch and the guy doing the demo had to use his fingernail to make sure it registered.
"Again, I was not implying that you were an Apple owner. I was just comparing you to a lot of the 'Apple Hipsters' that dismiss any old technology just because it's older. And of course I've used other capacitive screen devices, and I've still yet to put down capacitive screens. I have nothing against either technology, they both have pro's and con's"
Oh please, that's exactly what you did. BTW, show me some posts of Apple owners "dismissing any old technology just because it's older" when it isn't Apple hardware, because all I've ever seen is them do it with their beloved company. I have yet to see them blanketly toss old tech unless it's so they can justify buying new apple hardware.
"Uhh, they are producing a new screen which houses mainly old tech. You still have no response to what they are doing now with resistive screens that WOULD come with a pen but they want to hop on the touch bandwangon. Even in the video you notice he loses contact with a finger which sure LOOKS like it's still touching the screen. Resistive is garbage because it's not as durable, harder to clean etc...plenty of other reasons but I'm sure you'll reply with only YOUR personal experience."
I haven't responded to your cries of screens on the market now because that's not what I'm talking about, and that's not what the article is about. I already told you that if a company releases a crappy touch screen that I would have no problem siding with you and calling it garbage. If a company has a touch device out right now that doesn't work properly because of the touch technology then yes, it's trash. But again, that's not what the article is about, it's about a resistive screen that looks like it works amazingly.
"Oh please, that's exactly what you did. BTW, show me some posts of Apple owners "dismissing any old technology just because it's older" when it isn't Apple hardware, because all I've ever seen is them do it with their beloved company. I have yet to see them blanketly toss old tech unless it's so they can justify buying new apple hardware."
Oh please, that's exactly what I did not do. I'm sorry, I will admit that I worded what you quoted wrong from what I meant. I meant Apple owners doing it towards Apple hardware. But my comparison still stands. They do it because new has to be better. Aside from the fact that capacitive screens are more durable to being scratched, with this new tech that they're showing off resisitive looks to be able to do the fancy tricks of a capacitive.
Anyways, i'm pretty much done watching this thread, and I'm about ready to go home for the weekend. I appreciate you keeping me busy most of the day at work. I still stand to my original point. Most people, or at least the people that I know with resistive screens, do not have issues with worrying about scratching their screens under normal usage. If you're careless or rough with your stuff then that's a different story. To each is own, and I'm going to bow out of this argument assuming that we're both right and we're both wrong. ;)
Have a good weekend.
But doesn't the film on the surface of the resistive touch screens make the screen more grainy?
Also, doesn't the film scratch after a while?
If im not mistaken, you could easily integrate Wacom's EMR technology into this (the sensor for the pen goes behind the lcd). Not only would you have multitouch pressure sensitivity, but you could have pen pressure sensitivity as well. A tablet like this would be the sweetest thing ever.
WOW, LETS SEE THIS SOON HTC!
HOPEFULLY HTC CAN SEE THIS!! HOPEFULLY YOU GUYS GET HOOKED UP WITH THIS COMPANY AND KNOCK OUT THAT ROTTEN FRUITPHONE!!
AMART79196
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