Ballmer says tide has turned on Apple, "paying $500 more to get a logo on it" won't work in this economy
By Paul Miller 
posted March 20th 2009 10:35AM
posted March 20th 2009 10:35AM
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posted March 20th 2009 10:35AM
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Yet users can download free condoms from AVG or Avast you sad douche
You tell 'em Steve!
I just took a Dreamweaver class at a local New York university and was mortified to learn the class was conducted on PCs in the lab. I brought in my MacBook and plugged in to the local network so I could work on a machine designed to use graphic building software. My MacBook made the PCs and the whole Windows interface look like a poor Fisher Price product.
Yeah, but it made you look like a jerk.
You do know they both run on x86 now days. This Macs are built for graphic design nonsense is bullshit now days. Get with the times an HP workstation performs just as well if not better than a MAC Pro in a professional setting.
Time to update your opinions my friend.
And Windows 7's aesthetics rapes the old, outdated, antiquated, brushed-aluminum look that your over-priced and underpowered Mac has going for it.
so basically what he is saying is that people cant afford to pay for a quality product and will once again have to resort to a crappy windows machine.
Microsoft can no longer rely on their products to generate sales, they have to rely on the fact that people have to buy ramen noodles and run XP (no thanks to vista) and this for some reason makes them happy
microsoft needs to pull its head out of its but .. FIX YOUR XBOX .. FIX VISTA and quit worrying what apple is doing.
They did you moron, it's called Windows 7, which is vastly superior to anything that has come out of Cupertino or will come out of Apple in the foreseeable future.
Furthermore, Vista sold more copies in 2 years than Apple has sold copies of all of its' OS's in 20 years.
Steve Ballmer still doesn't get it about technology.
If it's not going to save time and save money, then the technology is useless (unless it's for entertainment).
Apple's not selling computers, Apple's selling comparatively trouble-free computing to people who don't like fuss.
Although I must admit that the premium paid for using OSX might be a bit too high. But it depends on how much your time is worth anyway.
Here is a "challenging proposition for the average person":
Run Windows.
Bottom line:
%u201CActually, a MacBook is in the same ballpark [in terms of dollar-for-dollar value] as a roughly similar Dell or HP, and less than a Sony. If you%u2019re tempted by a MacBook and can afford its pricetag, go ahead and buy one%u2013it%u2019s a decent deal.%u201D
This man is RIGHT!! I'd never pay $500 for a logo.. but what I do pay for is the stability and reliability of a system. I haven't rebooted my MBP for over 5 weeks now.. could NEVER do that with my Toshiba Windows laptop. Having moved from Windows to MAC after 15+ years of 'terror' I'll pay the extra little anytime...
Nor have I rebooted my Windows XP work machine in a few months, my Vista desktop since the last Nvidia driver (I think it was 3 weeks ago), and my Windows 7 netbook since I installed beta 7048 when it was leaked.
Whats your point?
it appears some people still have outdated image of windows. It may have been that way when you switched to mac but it certainly aint that way now.
yeah i only reboot vista when i'm forced to for updates and installing software. my pc often runs for more than 2-4 weeks without being shut down.
@Ruben: Bullshit. This year (~3 month) there were already at least two updates for XP which require restart.
SteveB would have a point IF it was only a logo on an PC like an expensive Vaio that is running Windows. BUT Apple hardware comes with a different OS and THAT is the reason people buy it, not because of the logo.
SteveB get back in your cave!
Total cost of ownership. 'Nuff said. Until the idiots understand that, nothing else will convince them.
Balmer...always the a$$clown!
Ballmer, can you just shut-up and work on Windows Mobile 7? Oh, 6.5 is not even out yet? Yeah, Apple has high margin products, what a surprise. Hey look at Dell's Adamo, HP Firebird, etc. In this downturn economy, everybody are turning into higher margin products to gain profits even with low volume sales.
Blah Blah Blah, flaming anti-Apple zealots.
I think now I'll buy TWO Apples. Jesus christ why can't you little kids just buy what the f$%k you want and be happy? Your continuous whining and bitching about Apple is childish and shows just how uneducated most of you are.
Sorry Steve-o but you're wrong. In this economy there are still people willing to pay a premium for a premium product.
It's the people buying mid- to high-mid-grade stuff that is cutting back.
In other words, in this economy, no one will pay extra to put an expensive, proprietary, operating system on their hardware.
It's not a premium product.
With cracking cases, overheating video cards, exploding batteries, an old and antiquated OS that looks like dated next to Windows 7, and hardware that is always months old and perpetually playing catch up to the latest and greatest releases for PC's, Apple users are getting shafted and yet still insist on defending mediocrity.
You guys are a bunch of shills who are being preyed on by Apple due to your own ignorance.
I'm missing the $500 difference...
Dell Latitude E3400 : $2152
13.3" screen, 2.4 ghz c2d, integrated webcam, bluetooth, wireless b/g/n, 128gb SSD, 2gb RAM, 3 yr warranty, dvd burner, no productivity software or any other options
Apple Macbook (NOT pro): $2223
13.3" screen, 2.4ghz c2d, integrated webcam, bluetooth, wireless, 128gb SSD, 2gb RAM, super drive, 3yr apple care, no other options
I'll pay the $71 more for the Apple here. Thanks. No... not all the systems are this close... but they're not all $500 more either if you're comparing spec for spec. I'm sick of hearing this crap.
tough call.
I built a family computer thats going on 7 years of good service to them. Built it as a family/semi-gaming rig for about $1300 sans monitor. I also built my bro a pure gaming rig...also XP. I have a XP laptop that I recently converted to Linux, and I recently upgraded to a MacBook Pro.
I work with both, inside and out, and I love both of them.
Also, I come from a design background. I deal with the pressures of designing and presenting those ideas in a way thats sleek, elegant, and most appealing to the viewer, but best exemplifies my idea. That takes time, and it takes money. I won't deny part of the reason for the Mac was the design of the machine; not even looking that it ran OSX (which it did), or what the specs are).
I think Apple is very much image as much as computing and marketing...and for some reason people knock on them for this.
Despite what some may perceive, design runs this world, and image does matter to some people.
Like I said, a large reason for the Mac was the design of it. I must admit, I do love the OS and some of the simplicities of the Mac.
So $500 more for a logo? I think he needs to realize 'anything' can be more. A computer doesn't have to just run Office or surf the net...it can be aesthetically beautiful as well.
[/long post] ha!
I am a recent switcher, There is simply no merit for the "paying for the logo" anymore. Yes with macs some options available on windows boxes are not available, like HDMI and BluRay, but equaly configured the cost are almost equal. I think the sales simply went down overall due to the economy. The reason Mac market share slipped and PC market share rose is the netbook. Many people want a 200-300 dollar computer and thats not a market that apple plays in. Just like how BMW and Lexus don't sell 16000 dollar cars. I think that apple will release a low cost device this summer that will play in that netbook market and their market share will continue to rise.
dude Apple can't be Lexus or BMW if they don't have Blu Ray or HDMI or other features sorely missing. BMW doesn't sell a car that's $70,000 and missing a nav system or FM radio.
@Jacob:
> dude Apple can't be Lexus or BMW if they don't have Blu Ray or HDMI or
> other features sorely missing. BMW doesn't sell a car that's $70,000 and
> missing a nav system or FM radio.
Well, as cars go, nav system is a standard on BMW only in US. e.g. in Germany it's an option.
Apple TV has HDMI. You can also have it on Mac through MiniDP->DVI->HDMI output. Not very nice, yet pretty niche feature. (e.g. my Windows PC has HDMI, but thanks to all the bugs of nVidia drivers which make simple attachment of TV a husstle (with optional crash/reboot) I'd say Macs do not miss much).
For BluRay .... well M$Windows doesn't support it either. Support for BluRay is developed and included by OEMs, not MSFT. But that's actually most demanded feature for Macs. As there are yet no ultra-slim factor BD drives, sadly I do not expect Apple to gain BD support soon. Or probably they try to push more their digital download service. (I personally prefer download service anyway, though I might need BD-R in very near future.)
sorry you guys are all so poor
"A fool and his money are soon parted", about sums up the Apple experience.
It's funny, because if Apple rolled out the first netbook they'd be RULING THE WORLD right now.
Even funnier is if Microsoft rolled out zune first they'd be ruling the universe.
Thats about correct as well right?
This is great news! Every time this tard opens his mouth, it turns out to be WRONG! So that could only mean the Mac marketshare is going to grow.
Balmer is such a douche. God kills kittens whenever he opens his mouth.
Which is slightly better than what he does when you two morons speak. In fact, he doesn't kill them.
Just volently rapes them and leaves them to survive and remember.
I reluctently am going to have to buy a Mac soon only because I need Final Cut. I like Premiere better myself, but everybody I collaborate with uses Final Cut so I'm going to have to give in. Looking at hardware, there is absolutely NO POINT in buying an imac. What an overpriced piece of crap. Having my monitor and everything all in one? No thank you, there isn't much freedom of choice to begin with in a mac but not being able to choose a monitor, well now there is even less. The hardware choices are pathetic as well.
That leaves me with a MacPro. Am I happy about spending spending over 3000 on a computer just for a video editing program? Not in the least bit. I will be running Windows on this thing 95% of the time. The ONLY time I will use OSX is for Final Cut.
I have an iPod and an iPhone. I don't mind my iPod - it's an mp3 player nothing too special. iTunes sucks, and I don't like being tied to it, but I can live with it. The iPhone is definitely a glorified piece of eye candy. Maybe I won't mind it so much once os 3.0 is released, but right now there are so many things that cannot be done with it that it feels almost like a cell phone from the 90's with a pretty color touch screen and internet access.
Looking back I'm glad I didn't have OSX over the last 8 years. Paying all the time for service packs. Don't kid yourself, that's what they are. The version numbers are proof enough. They can give it a different kitty name and new features if they want, but all they are are service packs. How much does Microsoft charge for service packs? I can't seem to recall ever paying for one...
Yawn. Get over it and take your career seriously then. If you need Final Cut, that's the tool you need. And you know what? You can run Windows on your Mac when you get it. Check back in here in 6 months and tell us what you think then. Hopefully you'll be too busy working and you won't even remember your rant about all of this.
That's ummm exactly what I said. By getting this I am taking my career seriously. And obviously I know windows will run on it since I stated that Windows will be running on it 95% of the time. Care to try again?
you buy an all in one because that's what you want... uhh and all in one. it's not a freedom thing.. other companies do make all in ones, dell, gateway, sony, hp.. it's not a purely mac thing (they just do it better) and it's not intended as a pro's computer (hence the name umm mac PRO).
So i guess the reason that every phone company out there is trying to build the next "iphone killer" (and i might add.. failing) is because it's just glorified eye candy.. that makes sense.
and no.. they call service packs system updates which happen every few months... personally i see leopard as very different from tiger, but i guess that's because i actually use a mac.
I'm a happy switcher former screaming hater. You'll get it soon (assuming you aren't just some goober trying to add validity to his hatred of something he can't afford.)
Its crap to say Vista is poor OS.
I have a $600 PC that runs for weeks at a time, has never crashed due to Vista (Just the crappy freeware I load onto it) and is virus free due to a decent no-cost anti-virus program.
I had the misfortune to sit at a macbook the other day. After 20 minutes trying to figure out how to do anything, I gave up. Yes it's pretty, but that's about it.
To me, Macs are to the computing world what AOL was to the internet. A shiny, user-easy system, attractive to people who can't do much more than click an icon. (Sorry to Mac power users, I'm referring to the masses here)
The biggest problem with Vista was that MS led people to believe that their 4 year old minimum spec machine would run it. With a few extra bucks for ram and a decent video card it works just fine.
If you consider the freedom to pick from thousands of software titles, almost unlimited hardware choices, and all for a lot less money, I fail to see the attraction to a locked down machine and OS.
There was a time when Macs blew windows machines out of the water on performance, thus creating their loyal fan-base of video and graphics jockeys. Those days are gone, but the perception remains.
OK, I've put on my i-sbestos underwear...flame away.
...And yet, it's Windows that's the lowest-common denominator OS, used by grandparents, parents, and people who just don't give a fu&k world-wide. Couldn't figure out a MacBook? That's your problem, not mine.
Whiners living in Mom's basement rail about how they can't afford stuff, or how they don't care about software because they can steal it - LOL. Get a job, maybe even a life, then you might start to understand why Apple is kicking ass, and Ballmer is trying to keep his job.
Maybe if you were not a teen working at mcdonnald in your 1 1/2 room appartement you would understand that people with REAL life, not the sorry one you believe is yours, involve House morgage, car payement, kids educations, etc. When you factor all of those, paying extra for a logo does sounds rediculous.
I don't own a MAC. I do own an Ipod though and I've had my share of problem. The only reason I stick with Ipod is because they are almost standard now. It's hard to get peripherals for other MP3 players. The level of ipod only accessories and integration sort of force people into using them. I'm thankfull it's not the case when it comes to PC.
Engadget is going to have to either disable replies to comments, or hide them by default.
Otherwise everyone's gonna be "replying" to the first comment instead of posting their own comments.
I have both, and I love both. I love my Vista Media Center, and my MAC is my creative machine.
That being said...and not to sound like one of those MAC is best people. I'm not paying $500 for the logo....I'm paying $500 for a machine that doesn't need to load device drivers, doesn't have crazy issues like when I upgrade to 4gb of Ram on my Windows PC that my Soundblaster soundcard stops working. There's just too much hardware out there to support fully with a PC.
That's not saying that MAC is BETTER than PC, but I personally think that there is something to be said about how Apple does things with certain hardware, and not permitting clones that expand the amount of support needed.
I dunno if that makes sense to everyone...but ultimately there's room for both PC and MAC in my house.
wait.. let me get this straight... your argument is that there is too much hardware out there for PC to fully support? your saying its bad that there's a lot of options for PC users and comparatively nothing for Mac users? I dont know why everyone complains about drivers, i got vista on launch day, and from then up until now (using windows 7 beta) i haven't once had to go out of my way and find a driver on the Internet to install, i just plug it in and either it works right out of the box, or it finds the driver by itself from windows update, which again.. i dont have to even click anything from plug in to working. and i use tons of extra hardware too, ive upgraded ram, have had 3 different printing and scanning devices, have 2 digital cameras, a gaming mouse, 2 gaming joysticks including an x360 controller.. the list goes on.
plus 500 dollars for a driver convenience that is more than negated by the availability of third party hardware, not to mention software... i dont find that worth the money when for 500 more, i could go for a tablet, gaming, or just good looking PC.
Well, this visionary typically gets things right so Apple might be in trouble. He nailed it when the iPhone first came out, and he needs to be respected for the amazing growth he's given MSFT since he became CEO. The company really has a lot of focus now.
ORLY?
http://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&chdd=1&chds=1&chdv=1&chvs=maximized&chdeh=0&chdet=1237579200000&chddm=98923&q=NASDAQ:MSFT&ntsp=0
This is the one-year financials of MSFT (Microsoft). They have steadily dropped since Ballmer took the reins.
sarcasm bro
Nice example there genius.
http://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&chdd=1&chds=1&chdv=1&chvs=maximized&chdeh=0&chdet=1237579200000&chddm=98923&cmpto=NASDAQ:MSFT&cmptzos=-18000&q=NASDAQ:AAPL&ntsp=0