Okay, to be honest, how many people actually watching blu-ray on their computers? The regular consumers are more than happy with cheaper SD DVDs. The geeks are probably watching HD movies from torrents. Videophiles would prefer watching blu-ray on their stand alone player with their home theater setup. The biggest problem of blu-ray is that it is heavily advertised as a movie medium instead of data storage. With Apple having HD movies via iTunes, and the focus trend of eliminating disc media with the Macbook Air, I don't think we would see an official BD equipped Mac/movie playback support from Apple anytime soon.
As an Mac user, can I ask that we please stop making excuses for Apple all the time on shit like this? Every time Apple does something that is clearly not in the best interests of the consumer, all the Applevangelists chime in with, "oh, you're not in the target market, the market doesn't want that, xxx."
Would this type of corporate apologetic-ism be tolerated if any other company was the subject at hand? No. If this was Microsoft we'd all be fuming, and rightfully so, just as everyone should be mad at Apple's stubbornness and blatant anti-consumerism.
As Mac users, it is _in our best interests_ to ride the fuck out of Apple every time they do something wrong. If we bend over constantly eventually we're going to realize that we're stuck with fashionable bricks and a closed ecosystem (yes, even more closed than it is already).
I don't watch Blu-Rays, but maybe if my MacBook supported them I would. I love my Mac, but fuck if Apple doesn't make me want to give it all up sometimes.
@Uncontrol: I'm not making excuses for Apple, but merely stated the way the market is for blu-ray. Is it really in the best of interest of the consumers for Apple to have OS X infested with DRM to the satisfaction of the movie industry? I think Apple has a different strategy and belief of the future of digital entertainment consumption. It's not like there are no other option to play blu-ray movie on a laptop, Sony has many Vaio laptops with blu-ray playback capability. Are people fuming over Linux for not supporting commercial blu-ray playback out of the box?
By the way, I'm also pretty pissed at Microsoft for not including native Bluray support with Windows 7. I'm crossing my fingers and hoping that the final version will have it, but...
I have a 1920x1200 24" display and I intend on using it to its fullest.
This thing puts out a better/crisper picture than most HDTV's as far as movie playback goes, plus I have a 5.1 500+ watt surround sound system (Z5500's), once again better than many home theater setups, and I plan on using them as well.
Just because you guys don't have the option doesn't mean that you have to sit here acting like you don't want it or don't need it.
I guarantee you the minute Apple gets Blu-Ray support added to their OS, the same detractors and denouncers will be praising them, making idiotic comments like : "Apple waited to make it just right, we weren't ready for it before, and besides Steve Jobs will show everyone now how Blu-Ray is supposed to be implemented", or some other foolish nonsense.
And I'm already streaming HD content from my Windows Home Server (finding and switching discs is so 90s). That doesn't mean the regular consumer is doing it. So 1 or 2 people are watching blu-ray on computers. Big whoop. Just because you want/use something techy, doesn't mean it's relevant to the market or whatever business decision a company chose. The main consumer are fine with SD DVDs. iTunes already offer HD movies. Consumers are not even aware of HD, let alone blu-ray. Again, do I see people fuming that Linux doesn't offer blu-ray playback out of the box? Even Vista doesn't have support for H.264 out of the box. Apple has their own idea of digital content distribution. So be it.
You are a quintessential example of an apple mind-controlled (via the RDF) fanboy.
You're spouting the same typical, nonsensical, apple fanboy talking points that I've come to expect from your side:
"We don't need it, because if we did, Lord Jobs would have provided it for us"
With that sort of mentality, we'd all be stuck in the dark ages of computing still.
Your side already has its' choices made for it -- i.e., you don't have that many choices, just whatever scraps Jobs throws your way every 12-18 months or so.
Thank god we don't have to limit ourselves to one machine, one company, one standard, and one man's vision.
Remember, choice is a good thing, and advancing technology is also a good thing.
Also, why do you suppose Blu-ray drives for PC's can now be had for < $100????
Think about it (hint: it has something to do with supply and demand -- so much for that theory of yours...)
Those z5500's are mediocre at best. You should upgrade if you want something better than some home theater setups. I'd recommend a nice used pair of Klipsch Pro Media 5.1 Ultras.
I'm sure you have some crap TN panel LCD. Compared to Vizio LCD's I'm sure it does look better.
Actually I could have gotten the Klipsch 5.1's but quite honestly they are EXTREMELY lacking in terms of features.
If you've done your homework, you would know that.
As for my monitor, WRONG.
I am not your typical ignorant mac fanboy, I am a well educated computer engineer who knows his hardware inside/out.
Im sporting the HP LP2475W, and if you knew anything about these monitors, then you'd know that these are arguably some of the finest 24" units on the planet. They are in fact only one of about 3 different 24" H-IPS panels on the market.
I guess all those HDTV's and blu-ray players being sold (more and more every year at that) totally mean that the consumer has no idea of the existence and benefits of blu-ray.
iTunes has its own DRM which is even more restrictive than what Blu-ray has. With iTunes you have to not only download the movie first (thereby possibly quickly running up against the ever-increasing prevalence of arbitrary usage caps set by ISP's), but you can only "authorize" a set number of computers to play the item as well. If you max out that limit, you're out of luck. While you can de-authorize a computer to authorize another, it means on the computer you de-authorize you suddenly cannot use the content you paid for on that computer any more. In addition, the HD quality of a movie from iTunes is limited and not as thorough as a disc.
It's not that people don't understand that there are other computers that have the ability to play a blu-ray disc, it's that they want to play it on their platform of choice, without having to resort to running multiple, incompatible, platforms. OS X already has HDCP, so why not blu-ray support?
A blu-ray player in a macbook would allow people to do with their chosen platform what I can already do with my HP laptop that has a blu-ray player. Take my machine to any TV in my house/apartment or to a friend's/families' house/apartment, hook my machine up, and play a disc I brought with me with no problems.
While I can conceivably do the same with iTunes and my Macbook, that sort of defeats the purpose of digital content don't you think? Heck, if they have a blue-ray player, I can leave the computer at home completely and just bring the disc. The DRM with a blu-ray disc is universally supported by a convenient disc I have and blu-ray player the user has, the player doesn't call back home asking permission to play the disc, it just plays it. While it is still DRM, it's still far more convenient than what iTunes does. Why wait to authorize my friend's comp to play my file and then wait for it to download from iTunes and play in less quality when I can just pop the disc in and play it with full quality?
You do make a couple valid points, but unfortunately, the condescending and flippant tone you use do much to harm any credibility they had.
As for why people are not up in arms that Linux does not support commercial blu-ray out of the box? I would venture to guess that there are people upset that there isn't blu-ray support out of the box. However, I would also hazard a guess that those who do care would much prefer an open source approach to blu-ray support as opposed to a closed, proprietary solution. It goes back to the basic, underlying philosophy which drove the creation of Linux in the first place. While OS X is built on top of an open source OS, the operating environment that is the UI of OS X is anything but. The good thing is that if there were ever an open source blu-ray player developed for Linux, I can pretty much guarantee you it will very likely be ported to OS X (or at least be able to be used in X11 on OS X) post haste.
Hamidxa - Oh, one of the finest panels? Really? H-IPS?
You were aware that Apple's 24" Cinema Display has a white LED backlight and an S-IPS panel, right? So either you're not the expert you think you are, or you're perfectly happy to use inferior hardware. Since you're such a Microsoft shill, I'm going to guess that you're perfectly happy to use inferior hardware.
"expert", hahahaha. And you're proud of your H-IPS monitor. You're a tool.
@Hamidxa: Huh? So you're saying anybody that for whatever reason doesn't follow your OT ideas = Apple fanboy? I pointed out that blu-ray is not that mainstream yet for regular consumers, let alone people watching on computers. I already stated there are options for those that want to watch blu-ray, aka Sony Vaio computers, etc. Obviously reading comprehension is not your strongest point. Apple chose not to do blu-ray today, it's their business choice. They don't care what 1 or 2 people want. It's not like you're buying Apple products in the first place. Who's defending Apple? I have a PS3 for my blu-ray enjoyment. My whole entertainment HTPC setup are windows (Vista + XBMC and Windows Home Server). I'm an Apple fanboy? Sounds more like you're simply trolling showing everybody that you have a fancy monitor and know some model numbers. Again, big whoop. Go compare your e-penis at digg or something.
@Eh? Condescending? Sounds more you and Hadmidxa are the ones with condescending tones, feeling that you're superior that you know blu-ray and watch them on your computers. Big whoop. Consumers don't care about that. SD DVDs are perfectly fine for most people. You already have options. So what if Apple don't put blu-ray drives on their machines? There are many PCs equipped with blu-ray drives already.
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Okay, to be honest, how many people actually watching blu-ray on their computers? The regular consumers are more than happy with cheaper SD DVDs. The geeks are probably watching HD movies from torrents. Videophiles would prefer watching blu-ray on their stand alone player with their home theater setup.
The biggest problem of blu-ray is that it is heavily advertised as a movie medium instead of data storage. With Apple having HD movies via iTunes, and the focus trend of eliminating disc media with the Macbook Air, I don't think we would see an official BD equipped Mac/movie playback support from Apple anytime soon.
As an Mac user, can I ask that we please stop making excuses for Apple all the time on shit like this? Every time Apple does something that is clearly not in the best interests of the consumer, all the Applevangelists chime in with, "oh, you're not in the target market, the market doesn't want that, xxx."
Would this type of corporate apologetic-ism be tolerated if any other company was the subject at hand? No. If this was Microsoft we'd all be fuming, and rightfully so, just as everyone should be mad at Apple's stubbornness and blatant anti-consumerism.
As Mac users, it is _in our best interests_ to ride the fuck out of Apple every time they do something wrong. If we bend over constantly eventually we're going to realize that we're stuck with fashionable bricks and a closed ecosystem (yes, even more closed than it is already).
I don't watch Blu-Rays, but maybe if my MacBook supported them I would. I love my Mac, but fuck if Apple doesn't make me want to give it all up sometimes.
Thanks Uncontrol, I knew there was a Mac user with a brain somewhere out there.
@Uncontrol: I'm not making excuses for Apple, but merely stated the way the market is for blu-ray. Is it really in the best of interest of the consumers for Apple to have OS X infested with DRM to the satisfaction of the movie industry? I think Apple has a different strategy and belief of the future of digital entertainment consumption. It's not like there are no other option to play blu-ray movie on a laptop, Sony has many Vaio laptops with blu-ray playback capability. Are people fuming over Linux for not supporting commercial blu-ray playback out of the box?
I watch movies on my 27inch dell lcd that is connected to my imac. I also bought a ps3 to watch blu ray movies though..
I think you're just too self centered
By the way, I'm also pretty pissed at Microsoft for not including native Bluray support with Windows 7. I'm crossing my fingers and hoping that the final version will have it, but...
@pika2000 FYI OSX already has HDCP.
as noted here:
http://www.engadget.com/2008/11/17/apple-itunes-multimedia-throwing-hdcp-flags-on-new-macbook-mac/
the exclusion of Bluray in the system that's touted to be the best for movie editing is kinda bizarre and wholly sad.
I do.
I have a 1920x1200 24" display and I intend on using it to its fullest.
This thing puts out a better/crisper picture than most HDTV's as far as movie playback goes, plus I have a 5.1 500+ watt surround sound system (Z5500's), once again better than many home theater setups, and I plan on using them as well.
Just because you guys don't have the option doesn't mean that you have to sit here acting like you don't want it or don't need it.
I guarantee you the minute Apple gets Blu-Ray support added to their OS, the same detractors and denouncers will be praising them, making idiotic comments like : "Apple waited to make it just right, we weren't ready for it before, and besides Steve Jobs will show everyone now how Blu-Ray is supposed to be implemented", or some other foolish nonsense.
Just watch.
And I'm already streaming HD content from my Windows Home Server (finding and switching discs is so 90s). That doesn't mean the regular consumer is doing it. So 1 or 2 people are watching blu-ray on computers. Big whoop. Just because you want/use something techy, doesn't mean it's relevant to the market or whatever business decision a company chose. The main consumer are fine with SD DVDs. iTunes already offer HD movies. Consumers are not even aware of HD, let alone blu-ray. Again, do I see people fuming that Linux doesn't offer blu-ray playback out of the box? Even Vista doesn't have support for H.264 out of the box. Apple has their own idea of digital content distribution. So be it.
pika,
You are a quintessential example of an apple mind-controlled (via the RDF) fanboy.
You're spouting the same typical, nonsensical, apple fanboy talking points that I've come to expect from your side:
"We don't need it, because if we did, Lord Jobs would have provided it for us"
With that sort of mentality, we'd all be stuck in the dark ages of computing still.
Your side already has its' choices made for it -- i.e., you don't have that many choices, just whatever scraps Jobs throws your way every 12-18 months or so.
Thank god we don't have to limit ourselves to one machine, one company, one standard, and one man's vision.
Remember, choice is a good thing, and advancing technology is also a good thing.
Also, why do you suppose Blu-ray drives for PC's can now be had for < $100????
Think about it (hint: it has something to do with supply and demand -- so much for that theory of yours...)
@Hamidax
Those z5500's are mediocre at best. You should upgrade if you want something better than some home theater setups. I'd recommend a nice used pair of Klipsch Pro Media 5.1 Ultras.
I'm sure you have some crap TN panel LCD. Compared to Vizio LCD's I'm sure it does look better.
A-Style,
Actually I could have gotten the Klipsch 5.1's but quite honestly they are EXTREMELY lacking in terms of features.
If you've done your homework, you would know that.
As for my monitor, WRONG.
I am not your typical ignorant mac fanboy, I am a well educated computer engineer who knows his hardware inside/out.
Im sporting the HP LP2475W, and if you knew anything about these monitors, then you'd know that these are arguably some of the finest 24" units on the planet. They are in fact only one of about 3 different 24" H-IPS panels on the market.
Yeah, chew on that for a while.
Huh pika?
I guess all those HDTV's and blu-ray players being sold (more and more every year at that) totally mean that the consumer has no idea of the existence and benefits of blu-ray.
iTunes has its own DRM which is even more restrictive than what Blu-ray has. With iTunes you have to not only download the movie first (thereby possibly quickly running up against the ever-increasing prevalence of arbitrary usage caps set by ISP's), but you can only "authorize" a set number of computers to play the item as well. If you max out that limit, you're out of luck. While you can de-authorize a computer to authorize another, it means on the computer you de-authorize you suddenly cannot use the content you paid for on that computer any more. In addition, the HD quality of a movie from iTunes is limited and not as thorough as a disc.
It's not that people don't understand that there are other computers that have the ability to play a blu-ray disc, it's that they want to play it on their platform of choice, without having to resort to running multiple, incompatible, platforms. OS X already has HDCP, so why not blu-ray support?
A blu-ray player in a macbook would allow people to do with their chosen platform what I can already do with my HP laptop that has a blu-ray player. Take my machine to any TV in my house/apartment or to a friend's/families' house/apartment, hook my machine up, and play a disc I brought with me with no problems.
While I can conceivably do the same with iTunes and my Macbook, that sort of defeats the purpose of digital content don't you think? Heck, if they have a blue-ray player, I can leave the computer at home completely and just bring the disc. The DRM with a blu-ray disc is universally supported by a convenient disc I have and blu-ray player the user has, the player doesn't call back home asking permission to play the disc, it just plays it. While it is still DRM, it's still far more convenient than what iTunes does. Why wait to authorize my friend's comp to play my file and then wait for it to download from iTunes and play in less quality when I can just pop the disc in and play it with full quality?
You do make a couple valid points, but unfortunately, the condescending and flippant tone you use do much to harm any credibility they had.
As for why people are not up in arms that Linux does not support commercial blu-ray out of the box? I would venture to guess that there are people upset that there isn't blu-ray support out of the box. However, I would also hazard a guess that those who do care would much prefer an open source approach to blu-ray support as opposed to a closed, proprietary solution. It goes back to the basic, underlying philosophy which drove the creation of Linux in the first place. While OS X is built on top of an open source OS, the operating environment that is the UI of OS X is anything but. The good thing is that if there were ever an open source blu-ray player developed for Linux, I can pretty much guarantee you it will very likely be ported to OS X (or at least be able to be used in X11 on OS X) post haste.
Lulz...let me guess you're still watching tv shows on that massive 13" black and white and setting up your VCR to record the shows you miss?
Hamidxa - Oh, one of the finest panels? Really? H-IPS?
You were aware that Apple's 24" Cinema Display has a white LED backlight and an S-IPS panel, right? So either you're not the expert you think you are, or you're perfectly happy to use inferior hardware. Since you're such a Microsoft shill, I'm going to guess that you're perfectly happy to use inferior hardware.
"expert", hahahaha. And you're proud of your H-IPS monitor. You're a tool.
@Hamidxa: Huh? So you're saying anybody that for whatever reason doesn't follow your OT ideas = Apple fanboy? I pointed out that blu-ray is not that mainstream yet for regular consumers, let alone people watching on computers. I already stated there are options for those that want to watch blu-ray, aka Sony Vaio computers, etc. Obviously reading comprehension is not your strongest point. Apple chose not to do blu-ray today, it's their business choice. They don't care what 1 or 2 people want. It's not like you're buying Apple products in the first place. Who's defending Apple? I have a PS3 for my blu-ray enjoyment. My whole entertainment HTPC setup are windows (Vista + XBMC and Windows Home Server). I'm an Apple fanboy? Sounds more like you're simply trolling showing everybody that you have a fancy monitor and know some model numbers. Again, big whoop. Go compare your e-penis at digg or something.
H-IPS > S-IPS
@Eh? Condescending? Sounds more you and Hadmidxa are the ones with condescending tones, feeling that you're superior that you know blu-ray and watch them on your computers. Big whoop. Consumers don't care about that. SD DVDs are perfectly fine for most people. You already have options. So what if Apple don't put blu-ray drives on their machines? There are many PCs equipped with blu-ray drives already.