Windows 7 E coming to Europe without Internet Explorer
By Ross Miller 
posted June 11th 2009 10:11PM
posted June 11th 2009 10:11PM
posted June 11th 2009 10:11PM
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So... no browser.. and how are they to download a browser? How will they get updates?? Bad move EU.
The windows update service runs independent of browsers now doesn't it? and software has auto-update services or menu options often.
WHY THE HELL DOES IT EVEN MATTER WHO HAS THE LARGER BROWSER SHARE, THEY'RE ALL FREE
Well not completely, chrome gets money from seeing what you do, and IE8 has a special helpful address bar that also tells MS what you seek and that's a sneaky commercialisation too,
So they seem free but are making money off of you via the backdoor.
without a browser then, how to download it?
easy :ftp
MS can create a hyperlink into the desktop that do such task.
Oh god, stop, stop, you're hurting yourself. This isn't EU imposing the law on MS, it's an MS decision. And the original case with IE, MS and monopoly was when IE couldn't be removed. Besides, most new PCs (and by most I mean all of them) don't even have a retail Windows disc, they have a custom OEM disc that installs all sorts of bullshit with it. Or a drivers disc that does and that's included by default.
Not a real dig at Apple as I am a long time converted OSX user, but if Microsoft have to remove IE then surely Apple should unbundle Safari. Apple have over 75 million OSX users worldwide...I don't see the them being hunted down!!
I love Firefox, but it's becoming a beast. It zorched my color profiles. Thanks Mozilla. You succeeded where IE failed.
And do Europeans pay for FF, Opera or Chrome???
What is the damn point???
Nobody pays for browsers, but obviously shops can ask people if they want a CD/DVD bundled with a browser, or an USB stick if it's more modern and service-oriented.
The term retail channels doesn't mean you pay necessarily, it means, I think, shops will have CD's with browser, probably for free, but that IS risky since they'll be tempted to take money to pre-install the wonderful 'toolbars' spyware with their free browser CD I bet.
Or there will be a browser war were MS offers benefits to shops if they put free IE CD's on their counters.
There's so much that can go foul now.
Or shops can just allow people to bring along USB sticks and they'll put a browser installer on that, for the people who have no friends with computers at all (are there such?)
I think they should have demanded that everyone delete IE6 from their computers, IMMEDIATELY, or face jail time...
~ Mike Web Designer
So, IE sucks, but what is the big deal if MS ships it with Win? Don't use it. OS X ships w/Safari & that sucks too. The point is is that you use IE to dl FF or Chrome or Opera or something else, then ignore IE or Safari. Other wise your average user would have a hard time dl'ing a browser to use. Sometimes these anti-trust guys are morons. Oh wait, they're government types aren't they? Now it makes sense.
agreed 100%
the EU can shove it. Bastards. I suppose they won't let auto manufacturers sell a car with AC already installed because that is anti-competitive as well. Might as well ban windows, doors and wheels too. Make everyone build their own damn cars.
EU reacted displeased on this news, they said they wanted there to be a selection of browsers bundled and have MS offer people a choice, safari/opera/firefox/IE what have you.
That was the idea.
why should Microsoft be required to offer their competitors products bundled their own? Why is it Microsoft's responsibility to market and distribute someone elses goods? Should auto manufacturers be required to offer a full selection of aftermarket wheels for all their cars so customers can have that choice? Its ridiculous. The EU is lucky they are getting windows 7 at all honestly. If i ran Microsoft i'd just suck it up, take the hit in revenue and not distribute any of my products in ANY european country. See how long they survive on linux and macs. Microsoft has NEVER built in any mechanism into any version of windows that prevented you from installing firefox, netscape, aol, or any other browser you want. All they did was include their own browser as part of the OS, and you know what? it worked well enough that people were willing to not bother getting a better product. In fact the original release of Windows 95 didnt include IE at all, and when i first got a modem, it was a hassle to get a hold of a cd to install a web browser. Once they started bundling it in Windows 95 OSR2 that problem had a solution! What a concept!
They aren't';t required, obviously, but that was what the EU people hoped they would do, offer some automatic choice system, required is a whole different thing though that you made up.
to me it was implied, however I still stand by my point that Microsoft has done no wrong here IMO. There is and has been a way to change your default browser in windows for quite some time now. Distribution of other companies products shouldn't be something they have to do and I would never expect them to do it unless a legal decision is reached asking them to.
How do I download web browsers if there're no web browsers in my computer?
Use ftp from console :)
EU peeps will now have the ability to *pay* for their own choice of browser! Err... But wasn't this supposed to be in the interest of the consumer?! Try to stick to what you can understand (nothing), bureaucrats!
Pay? What are you smoking?
That's is ridiculous. How can they ask Microsoft not to put their own browser in their own product? Then why don't they ask Mac not to put Safari in Mac OS!?!
Microsoft just has all the rights to put anything in their products. I am not saying that IE is doing a great job. But at least, just for those beginners, they don't have to figure out what the hell is a browser or to figure where to get it! It is just a standard application that has to come with!
It is not that Microsoft is prohibiting users to get another Browser on Windows. Users have all the choices and use whatever they like. I don't use IE ever since 2003. So does Windows include IE matters?
EU is just trying to find all the ways to kill off a successful company... like what Alex said.
Well... EU.... trying not to be childish anymore... put your time to figure a way to make your own OS...
So you will still get outlook express? Isn't that also pushing a mail client and anti-competitve? But anyway, if you do you could get a browser installer by mail, so mozilla should quickly set that up, a mailservice that on requestmail sends you firefox.
Same applies for the other browsersuppliers obviously.
One BIG problem... I've only read a few comments, but haven't seen anyone pick up on this yet.
Without a browser pre-installed, how are new users going to be able to connect to the internet to download a browser in the first place???
First thing I do on any new build is use Internet Explorer to download the latest version of Firefox...
Without a browser it won't be possible to retrieve ANYTHING from the internet unless you know the exact FTP location and can access that through windows explorer.
I've never heard of anything so stupid - trying to figure out if it's microsoft's stupidity or the EU's
What would happen if MS made the statement that it was withdrawing from the European market and would no longer sell or offer support for products there? The EU could no longer extract money from them and the European economy would be completely destroyed. Certainly MS would never do that, but I think it could make that credible threat if the EU keeps pushing these BS rulings.
For sure, MS has abused its monopoly power in the past, but I don't think bundling software is a big issue. If some company makes a better product than what I get bundled with another purchase, then I will use the good one. Windows came with search, but now everyone uses Google because its drastically better. Should Google not be able to develop more products and have links to them on its home page because other companies want to make internet mail, online maps, etc.?
If MS was seriously abusing their power, then that would be a different issue. But their software is somewhat reasonably priced, considering for the cost of two months of cell phone+data plan or two weekends of drinking, you could buy any version of Windows you want. Not to belittle the utility of $150, but people spend it on much more useless things than an operating system.
What the government should be worried about is the damn monopoly and oligopoly power that cable, internet, and cell phone companies use. How is it that cell phone plan, cable TV, and internet costs are always going up? Aren't things supposed to get less expensive over time? And not only do costs always go up, but customer service is terrible, but enough with that tangent.
http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=MEMO/09/272&format=HTML&aged=0&language=EN&guiLanguage=en
"As for retail sales, which amount to less than 5% of total sales, the Commission had suggested to Microsoft that consumers be provided with a choice of web browsers. Instead Microsoft has apparently decided to supply retail consumers with a version of Windows without a web browser at all. Rather than more choice, Microsoft seems to have chosen to provide less."
So they asked Microsoft to put some other browser on the install disc.
... yet another reason for the UK to leave the EU as soon as possible. They're fucking stupid, most consumers will want IE anyways and No one wants to have to install IE when they get their new PC, and certainly dont want to have to install IE just to be able to download FF or Opera etc (if they dont have another PC) when they could have IE installed and do it as soon as they recieve their computer.
Yes, IE may be anoying, but I'd rather have it on a new PC / install, and then be able to un-install it, than have to download another browser on another PC and then transfer it to my new PC / install. Thats too much hassle tbh.
/end rant
just shows how ridiculous the eu is. they aren't protecting anyone with forcing microsoft to do this. only inconveniencing them and arbitrarily putting favor on other products that obviously need no help considering the market success of firefox. they just can't admit they are wrong.
anyways the whole thing was a circus. now if microsoft had blocked its users from downloading and installing other browsers the eu would have a point. but people were always free to install whatever they wished on the microsoft windows. so their objections were totally baseless. the idea that you can be slammed for including too many features with your product is ridiciulously arbitrary. do cell phones with clocks and calculators and alarm clocks have unfair advantage against clock/watch/calculator manufacturers? by the eu standard everything should be stripped from a BMW that doesn't have to do with driving. bye bye fancy car stereo etc.
anyways...the eu just makes my blood boil sometimes. esp when they kick around american companies for no good reason.
Nice!
Hope you can get whatever browser you want via Windows-Update.
Google needs to go to Dell or HP or one of the other big OEMs and say "what would it take to get you to bundle Google Chrome with your PCs as the default browser" and then make whatever changes to Chrome are required to make that happen.
there are still people that use windows? and there are still people that use IE??? weak up guys exist other o.s. faster and better than windows and there are several browser faster that the junk IE...by the way I'm still waiting for chorme for linux :)
So dose anyone know how we are going get any explorer without a primary one there since we'll have to do a clean installation getting rid of any browser that we have. Can they just include it with links to or shortcuts to another browser that exist