It's been a long, messy road, but now that TiVo's
beaten a victory out of EchoStar in that
seemingly-endless DVR patent lawsuit it sounds like the company is trying to exert some muscle -- it's already in talks to bring its service to Time Warner Cable, and sources have told
Bloomberg the ultimate plan is to eventually collect royalties from every pay-TV provider in the US. That might sound bullying and even a little trollish, but keep in mind these patents have
withstood pretty much
every legal challenge EchoStar could throw at them, so TiVo's operating from a position of some certainty here -- especially since it's got license agreements with huge players like Comcast and DirecTV to use as leverage in negotiations as well. Of course, none of this solves any of
TiVo's actual problems with its products, and the company's topsy-turvy balance sheet has some analysts thinking its ripe for a buyout by one of the bigs, so things could change dramatically at any minute, but for right now it sounds like your chances of getting the TiVo interface on your cable or satellite company DVR just went up, and that's almost certainly a good thing.
posted Jun 22nd 2009 1:46PM
For the love of God please come to Cox. PassportEcho SUCKS!
no kidding, there are LOTS of other, BETTER IPGs out there. Passport is garbage.
I bet Macrovision scoops up TiVo.
If you think Passport is the worst IPG out there then you have no idea what you are talking about.
It also means you're cable provider isn't using the latest version OCAP as well. So blame your provider, not the software.
I never said it's the worst, it just sucks really bad, and once you pair it up with the terrible Cox remote, it's a very awful experience. It would be very nifty if you could rent TiVo HDs through your service provider.
And how many others on cable do you think are better? SARA users hate their guide and Navigator users hate their guide. By comparison few people who have used all three hate Passport the most. Even if it's the old version. If you think Passport is a bad IPG there are far worse things you could be using.
Tivo still looks like it was made for kids in the 80's, so that needs updating. Moxi is hardly used so not much comparison there. So that leaves what? Not much else.
I've had both Passport Echo and Navigator here on TWC - and Passport Echo is way, way better than Navigator. Now, to clarify, that's not because Passport Echo is that good - it just means that Navigator is *just that bad*. (Having to deal with Navigator was the one reason I finally switched back to TiVo and bought a TiVo HD.)
I've never used SARA. From what I've seen, I'm not missing out on much.
I had the displeasure of having to use Navigator at the house my family was renting in Palm Springs over the weekend and I agree that it sucks a hell of a lot more than Passport, but Passport is still pretty bad, especially when compared to TiVo. I'd liken Passport to Windows 95, Navigator to Windows Me, and TiVo to Windows 7.
would love it if cablevision and tivo did something together but since that probably will never happen because cablevision is such a pathetic excuse for a cable service provider, im just gonna buy a standalone tivo.
If it comes to BrightHouse Networks I will be upgrading my HD DVR in a heartbeat.
Now if only the nearly 3 year long Comcast/TIVO project would finally be realized in my area FFS. I fully blame Comcast on this one.
Hear, Hear! The wait has gotten ridiculous now.
I totally agree. I waited on getting a tivo for six months when i heard that deal was coming - at a certain point I just gave up hope. It's been two years since. I can't stand the software on the comcast DVRs - it's easily the buggiest, slowest and most awful user experience I've seen in years.
if it comes to Queens, NY area, IT IS MINE.
TW is my local cable monopoly but I'd sooner give up TV completely than become a subscriber.
I guess I'll wait semi-patiently for DishTiVo's to come out so I can finally get HD.
After upgrading my internet service to a higher speed, I think I will be done with DVR/ cable services altogether. Everything I want to watch is available on Hulu, SideReel, or on the official websites of shows.
That's what I did, though admittedly there's only a couple of TV shows that I care to see...
Tivo is great but it will depend on the added price especially in this economy. my problem isn't with my cheap hd dvr recording it's that the darn thing lags like a S.O.B. when you try and change channels. It does suck at rewinding too. So hopefully more choice will lead to cheaper services and better products. not holding my breath though.
glad to hear it isnt just mine...i try to change HD channels the screen goes black, signal drops for about 2 seconds then it pops back up...quite annoying
Just buy a friggin' TiVo.
Bought the Series 3 when allowed to bring over my lifetime Series 2 subscription for $199. Plus $300 for the unit, $500. At $12.95 a month, the Series 3 will have paid for itself after 38 months. I've already owned it for 18 months. In 20 months it will have paid for itself....then it's a freebie from there. Sure I can't do PPV, but PSN and Amazon have those covered now.
So suck it up, buy one and be done with it. Cable companies are evil.
And TiVo isn't evil? I'm surprised they haven't tried to sue Microsoft yet for Windows Media Centre. Who knows, maybe they're the next on the list?
Ya your Tivo will be paid off in 38 months too bad when Tivo bricks your bricks your box in 24 months well after the 12month warranty you will have to buy a brand new box. Where as if my local cable provider bricks my box for whatever reason I can just call them and they will replace it. Enjoy shelling out another $500.00 to buy yet another Tivo when that one dies. So for 9.99 a month I'd much rather have the peace of mind that I can take my dead box right down the street to the TW store to have it replace.
TiVo beat EVERYONE to the punch, and they aren't sitting on some bogus ambiguous patents.
Quite simply, they deserve the DVR market because they CREATED it. You cannot compare them to other evil companies (Take your pick) that grew up with each other. TiVo was all alone until everyone started copying what they did.
Yeah, I think my point was lost. My original point was that the purchase of a real TiVo device, if bought the right way, can easily pay for itself, where the cable company will just keep billing you forever. I've done this with two TiVo devices already. My original Series 2 paid for itself a LONG time ago.
Yeah, I pay like $7 per month for HD DVR. As long as I get new HW every 6yrs, I am still better off than paying $500 up front. Of course, the service isn't as nice as TiVo.
Yes. Tivo is evil.
They managed to get themselves a patent on:
cat /dev/video0 > tivo.mpg; mplayer tivo.mpg
and managed to find a judge senile to let them keep their BS patent.
The fact that they managed to find a senile enough judge/jury doesn't alter the
fact that they are trolling oportunists that just happened to patent the obvious
once technology was sufficiently advanced to allow a computer based VCR.
please please please please. EVERY TIME I use my Motorola DVR from Insight I scream at least once. What a piece of crap. Sue then compromise by selling your wares. I like it.
If the means of executing the DVR functionality is what's in question here, couldn't SageTV, BeyondTV, Microsoft MCE, and any of those packages that perform the time-shifting of television could be targets...?
With the low price of refurb TivoHD receivers ($150 - $200), I consider that a very small price to pay for the UI, lack of lag, NetFlix, Amazon Unbox, tivo-to-pc transfer, and pc-to-tivo transfers through software like pyTivo. I made due with Motorola/Comcast HD DVRs for several years and would not go back. I eventually even upgraded the bedroom Tivo S2 to a TivoHD. Well worth the price.
Okay, so I think this is good.
On the other hand, I already have Tivo with cablecard (RCN), and it works great. What would I gain if RCN offered Tivo? I'd probably get screwed on teh cable card, pay more for Tivo because I'd be paying for the box as part of the monthly subscription, and who knows how it would be crippled.
I hate my Fios dvr.... but it is cheaper than paying for a Tivo, cable card fees, and a subscription (plus I loose on demand without the fios box). If fios offered a Tivo lease option... I'd pony up a few $ a month over what I pay now to get it.
ah booo, hell with Tivo, Moxi is way better hands down period, plus its a one time price with no subscription, and has little to no limitations with cable provider. now i have cablevision and they may not be the best when it comes to TV programming etc, but their internet and phones service is one of the best, to date in the US they have the fastest internet available 101mbs for a little over 100$ plus they are torrent friendly and have no caps on bandwidth usage. nuff said.
I'm sorry, but I had a Moxi for three days and it went back. You simply can't compare the two. It's great you like yours, and appears it does what you want it to do, but I found it lacking in every respect. I'll be sticking with my Tivo HD.
And for what it's worth, Moxi is more expensive than a Tivo HD with lifetime.
except Moxi still requires you to rent a Cablecard from your cable company and it doesn't work with any channels on SDV.
So you're screwed twice there. Once for having to use the card and the technical drama that goes with it and the other for missing channels.
as with both Moxi or Tivo there will always be something missing, its the nature of the beast... about pricing if you get Moxi or Tivo you still need a cable card for both which will cost you, if Tivo is integrated into the cable companies it will cost us all extra too i mean seriously is that so far fetch. needless to say though the price of a Moxi is 799 with no subscriptions, the price of a Tivo HD XL (not Tivo HD because its like comparing the iPhone to a blackberry curve) 599 + life time subscription fee 399 that almost 1k. also not everyone will like Moxi nor Tivo everyone is different because you didn't like it doesn't mean someone else wont, I was simply giving people options besides Tivo...
What? And give up my crappy Scientific Atlanta Box??? From my cold dead hands Time Warner... Cold Dead Hands!
I'll explain. its really simply, its all bout human nature and wanting to be in control of their life's and time. the ability to watch a show when you want how you want etc is priceless. we are now free to do as we like when we like to, like watching a sport game and needing to go to the thrown, in the past we had one of 2 choices enjoy a good session and miss part of the game, or rush the experience during a commercial brake so you don't miss any part of the game but the downside was you felt like u where just raped. DVR's have fixed this once and for all, yes we now can have our cake and eat it to. i prefer MOXI over tivo because its better, it does everything tivo does but better.
http://moxi.com/us/home.html
TIVO, BRING ME STREAMING!!!!!
I've let this go long enough. It's time to step into the 90's and include streaming on your product. WHY in the world can't you just pull files form a windows share?
I want a second TiVo, but you're holding me up here. Time to improve your product, or I'll look elsewhere.
PS: After having used my TiVo S3 and my parents DishNetwork VIP22, there is no contest. I can't even figure out how to switch between tuners on the Dish while the TiVo does it in the background. Beautiful. But if I have to build another windows PC and use WMC to get streaming, I'll do it (I'm antenna only anyway).
How does Comcast decide who gets Tivos next? Their Motorola box is terrible.
If it's a Motorola box, then by definition it is NOT a TiVo. Only TiVo makes TiVo.
DVR does not equal TiVo.
Comcast does not give you a "Tivo" box they upload some sort of crappy Tivo wanna be software that crashes all the time. And is So slow it is unusable. Not to mention all the extra features you do not get with Comcast Tivo (Network Transfer, Online scheduling, IPTV, etc.)
Had that crap for 6+ months. Had Comcast replace the crappy moto box 5 times! Went with a TivoHD with free cable card and would never go back.
nice
Unfortunately, I don't think it is possible to completely explain why TiVo is quite possibly the greatest invention ever (no offense to the cotton gin, the internal combustion engine, the airplane, sliced bread, transistors, Pop rocks, the little cardboard sleeves you put on your coffee cup so you don't burn your hand, and even, *gasp* the iPod and iPhone). Partly this is so because each of TiVo's individual components/functions are not groundbreaking or even that special, but collectively TiVo has built a box that not only "records TV shows," but can actually save you time and allow you to only spend your time watching the TV you want to watch and never have to flip through channels just to look for "something to watch." It is this synergistic effect that really makes TiVo a magic box.
But, I suspect since you only think DVRs "record TV shows," you won't ever take the plunge and buy a TiVo (or the MOXI that Malicaide linked to, which also looks pretty awesome).
Wonder how much extra they would charge monthly to enable a "skip commercials" mode? Or how about HBO on demand with more than 20 B-list movies from 15 years ago?
$200/month bill ftw!!!!
After using Tivo for years, switching to Dish because Comast was cramming too much HD down the pipe, I consider sacrificing image quality to go back to Tivo... It's THAT much better than Dish.
Tivo still has the PVR dialed in better than anyone on the market from what I can see. I would LOVE to have it back.
All you people who are miserable - just suck it up and get a cablecard and a free-standing TiVo box. It is a bitch to get them to set it up, but the FCC makes them offer the option. Yes, the money is steep in the beginning, but, generally, you pay less per month with a cable-card and Tivo subscription than if you rent the DVR from your cable company. After a number of years, it will pay for itself. But that's not really the point - the point is why should you put up with a DVR that makes you want to throw things at the TV, when there is something better out there? TiVo is not perfect, but it just works.
I would like to see TiVo start winning some business with the cable companies - so they can spread their development costs over a bigger installed base, bringing down the price. That's why the free-standing HD boxes have such eye-popping prices right now - too much development cost being spread over too small of an installed base. If they have to use their patent rights to muscle their way into a deal with the cable companies - that is nothing but good news for consumers. Nobody would choose a Motorola DVR over a TiVo DVR if they were available at anything close to the same price.
nice... time warner's DVR boxes are pieces of crap and are horribly slow
Could not agree more. How many times have I pressed a button and waited..and waited...and waited for something to happen.
Turn off your TV. It has replaced the human imagination.
I hope it comes to Comcast, Comcast DVR blows compared to TIVO. Of course most DVR interfaces are incredibly bad compared to TIVO, but comcast's is pretty bad.
I would like for Tivo to come to Calblevision, but Cablevision needs to improve on its shitty GUI before it worries about supporting Tivo STBs. And it also needs to fix it's issue with quality as well. I watch Speed Race on HBO over the weekend and it was low-bit rate city. It was like watching an upscaled DVD during a lot of scenes.
TiVo UI sucks big time compared to what Dish has on their latest units. Ability to create custom folders, move shows around and what not. I can record 4 HD shows at a time (2 from Dish, 2 from OTA tuner), while watching a recorded one. No lag in changing channels, single box feeding signal to 3 tvs in different rooms without any additional fee. Try beating that with a TiVo. My Series 2 has been sitting idle for months now. TiVo got contented with what they had and never tried to improve. Dish has added a fair amount of value to the DVR space. It hurts to see them getting fined for their efforts! I just wish I dont have to go back to their CRAPPY UI.
Good. I have a TiVo. My roommates have a Time Warner DVR. What a POS the Time Warner box is. It's slow, unresponsive, and ugly in comparison. TiVo on the other hand is very snappy, easy to figure out, and all around more fun - especially considering all the free content you can download. Yeah they both do the same basic function, but until you've used TiVo you have no idea how crappy your cable company DVR is.
HD DirecTivo would be reason enough for me to switch back to DirecTV. But I will never consider going back to comcast even with HD tivo service.
Recently went from the Comcast HD DVR ( http://www.comcast.com/MediaLibrary/1/1/Explore/ProductPages/DC/DVR_top.jpg )
to the TivoHD in Washington DC. to say the upgrade was immense would be an insult to the Tivo box.
I have yet to lose a recording that I've scheduled (a daily event with the comcast box) or have something mysteriously disappear that I've set to "remove when I delete" (a weekly even with the comcast box). The guide is better, the channels change faster and the built-in ASTC tuner is great.
Now if comcast offers a Tivo-Tivo instead of a generic box with "tivo" branding and added bloop sounds i'd consider it, until then i'll stick with my multistream cable card.
I need some help out there. I am SICK of paying to Time Warner. I keep thinking of going to something like TiVo, but what about the phone and internet access. Is it more costly to purchase each separately? Here's what I want:
Internet/email access
TV access: HD not needed - but capturing films and series is
Phone