High five,
Tesla fans -- everyone's favorite incredibly controversial electric car company has just been granted $465m in loans from the Department of Energy's Advanced Technology Vehicle Manufacturing program. The bulk of the money will go towards that
postponed Model S factory, while the remaining $100m will be used to fund an electric powertrain manufacturing facility that will sell parts like motors and battery packs to other carmakers. Tesla wasn't the DOE's only big winner: Nissan received $1.6b (billion!) to build batteries and EVs in Tennessee and Ford received an undisclosed amount to build two upcoming electric cars, but since those companies have largely drama-free upper management that isn't
constantly involved in lawsuits, it feels a little more routine. Still, it's an exciting time -- let's hope all these tax dollars turn into affordable, convenient electric transportation sooner rather than later.
Update: A "congressional source" has told the AP that
Ford's getting $5.9 billion, so yeah, the Oval's still the big dog.
Read - Tesla
Read - Ford
Read - Nissan
posted June 23rd 2009 2:13PM
*Sigh*
Both Ford and Nissan made electric cars nearly 10 years ago. Where are those? oh yeah, they decided there wasn't a market for EVs, so they stopped making them. Now that there's free government money involved, look who wants to sell a freakin' electric car. This makes me mad. They had the opportunity to create a market and instead they chose to ignore it. The market for EVs has been present for a long time, but ignored because Auto companies didn't feel it was worth their time or money... Now that it's someone else' money, I guess it's worth their time. Why isn't this a loan? What are the string attached to this?
Hey, no worries guys! Pretty soon all this spending will catch up to us, inflation will kick in and a few billion wont seem NEARLY as much! Of course then we'll move to a single world currency where the rich will stay rich and the poor will get poorer. (http://www.reuters.com/article/gc08/idUSTRE52T64520090331)
Oh look, Japan is already trying to secretly move their dollar reserves, and no one west of Great Britain wants anyone to know about it! (http://www.examiner.com/x-14143-Orange-County-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m6d21-134-billion-dollar-bond-caper-full-of-holes-and-inconsistencies)
so honestly, why is everyone so pissy over a few billion?..
When government gives taxpayer money to private business it's basically fascism. The US is so gone it's unbelievable.
From Wikipedia (so take it with a grain if you need to)
Fascism, pronounced /ˈfæʃɪzəm/, comprises a radical and authoritarian nationalist political ideology[1][2][3][4] and a corporatist economic ideology.[5] Fascists advocate the creation of a single-party state.[6] Fascists believe that nations and/or races are in perpetual conflict whereby only the strong can survive by being healthy, vital, and by asserting themselves in combat against the weak.[7] Fascist governments forbid and suppress criticism and opposition to the government and the fascist movement.[8]
"When government gives taxpayer money to private business it's basically fascism."
I like how you slide "basically" in there because you know you're full of shit. either you're writing this because you're 16 and don't know any better, or you're 80 and completely senile. or you're wearing your dr paul-tinfoil hat.
@gunboatdiplomacy
I appreciate and commend the great effort you applied to try to educate or friend here, but I believe your energy is wasted upon deaf ears.
Please don't feed the animals.
I am just going to throw this out there and let you come up with your own conclusions.
"The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power.”
— Franklin D. Roosevelt, "Message from the President of the United States Transmitting Recommendations Relative to the Strengthening and Enforcement of Anti-trust Laws"
All that indignation about gubmint giving taxpayers money to US companies... What about the government giving money to totally sleazy FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS, for years? Israel, Colombia, Egypt, Pakistan, South Korea until recently, god knows whom else...
Amazing. Electric cars have been buried since the late 1800's.
They have more power then gas vehicles,
waaaay better acceleration,
less parts to fix & imagine the electric vehicles from the DVD "Who killed the electric car" from Sony Pictures
cost under $20 per month to charge in your own garage.
You don't think that will help the American economy? I guess giving $100 - $400 in gas every month is better for most American or (insert any other countries) families.
There is a reason most people are brainwashed to think gas vehicles are more powerful, have better designs, etc,
Tesla motors was smart, by designing a good looking electric car. Gas companies invest in major car manufacturers, to make sure dorky electric & hybrids will be built. It protects their bigger profit center.
Luckily, we live in an age where nerd-dom is almost as cool as being 'sexy', so no matter what is being built will probably have
buyers once more people see how much better pure electric cars are.
This news made my day : )
Ooh hey, Nissan's getting some? An electric GT-R would be a nice idea...
finally.... im looking forward to it :))
The government doesn't respond to free market forces; case in point, bailouts that fail to bail out. Where some of these car companies should have gone through bankruptcy due to failed practices so they could restructure to become leaner and more profitable (capitalism, it works), government steps in with its political agenda and begins dictating how the company will be run, creating more inefficiency. Anyone who thinks that there aren't strings attached is smoking something. Salary caps for companies who were forced to receive bailout money anyone? And before you go whining that they were overpaid, again, government is inefficient, and government run anything costs much, much more than private solutions. My brother worked at a military base as a bio analyst, couldn't get anything done because of bureaucracy, went to a private contractor, and is now back being subcontracted out getting paid twice what he was before to do the same thing that the our genius government couldn't get done by themselves. And this isn't free money. No such thing as free money. We can't keep printing money indefinitely. To the person who used the poker game analogy, this IS like a poker game, and right now the Chinese seem be holding all the right cards.
Honestly, its always been like that, but before our gov. didn't tell you that, there was no transparency, just double talk, distraction, and misleading information if you received any information at all. So are you telling us with this statement that now that we are seeing whats going on in our government that its a bad thing?
Remember that guy Rumsfeld? "I am not going to give you a number for it because it's not my business to do intelligent work." -asked to estimate the number of Iraqi insurgents while testifying before Congress.
Now that is what we used to get, do you really want to stay dumb about whats going on? I am part of the Y-GEN and i think i speak for us all when i say "We hate Stupid"
I want to know if they are going to use this electric car "stimulus" money to actually build something the average joe can afford. Nobody wants to buy a electric car if it's got a $32,000 or more base price like all of Tesla's vehicles when a fossil fuel car new goes for as low as $9559 (the lesser nissan). Now if Nissan could turn out a $9k dollar electric car, I'd buy one.
This rocks!! Our President rocks! Its about time something that will be productive in the near future than investing in the "LETS DRIVE A SMALL SCHOOL BUS TO WORK EVERYDAY" (ie. Escalade) mentality that was so prevalent before this administration. The reason our car companies failed was because they saw the future, but didn't face the future till it was to late, and still they went with the 'stick my head in the ground" tact.
Taxpayers do not have unlimited funds -- but the government continues to spend money like it's their own pocket book.
When capitalism's business cycle veers into discomfort (unemployment, slowing sales and borrowing, etc.) -- the State (government) now suppresses recession with monetary policy (making money cheap and abundant) and fiscal policy (quantitative easing, injections of liquidity, stimulus programs, etc.) so nobody feels pain. But the problems are still there, just hidden for a time by the bailouts. They will continue to grow until another bailout is needed (e.g. Chrysler).
Capitalists and those that embrace the free market reject this narrow notion for many reasons. Chief among them is that fact that experience and progress is the byproduct as we surmount difficulty. The Marines say, pain is weakness leaving the body. These downturns are inefficiencies leaving the system. These loans will be used to prop up inefficient systems. Nobody truly learns. Nobody truly grows. Nobody progresses.
--
Stop the paronioa: You do not need to boycott car manufactures that accept bailouts. Capitalism thrives when you make a decision that fits you. You should find the car that you want -- and that meet the criteria important to you. Car manufacturers that accept bailout money will be required to add inefficiencies to their business model and are at a disadvantage to produce the car that meets your needs the best. You should make car manufacturers and dealers compete for your business.
So if you are thinking about a car, check out this process on this blog: http://excarsalesman.typepad.com/
Tesla looks pretty cool, hopefully they can produce a marketable vehicle that works
www.yovia.com/blogs/timlara
Funding electric car companies is a step in the right direction but I get the feeling that the government is doing this all wrong. First of all, we should also be funding electric cars that will be mid-level and inexpensive. Secondly, lithium ion batteries are worse than NiMH batteris in cars for several reasons (more dangerous, shorter life). The government should be enacting eminent domain over the patent for high powered NiMH batteries owned by cobasys / chevron. For more information on the subject, I would recommend the book "Two Cents Per Mile" by Nevres Cefo.