Verizon's getting very keen on entering the
app store industry, but not without some rough decrees to its smartphone partners. According to
GigaOm, VP Partner Management Ryan Hughes said in an interview Friday that its VZW-branded shop will house content from all the major platforms under one roof, with purchases being billed through the customer's Verizon account and not requiring a separate signup / credit card entry. Convenient for consumers, and devs are also being promised a more streamlined approval process and a "competitive" revenue-sharing program, but here's where things take a turn for the worse: according to Hughes, non-VZW app stores like BlackBerry
App World or
Windows Mobile Marketplace won't be bundled with the smartphones out of the box, meaning consumers will have to take the initiative to download those portals for themselves. An incredibly jerk move, and an extra burden on developers who'll be having to submit two approval applications if they want inclusion on Verizon's own store. Of course, that large subscriber base is the reason it can get away with it, but let's hope we hear some better justifications other than "because we can" when the full details are rolled out at the Verizon Developer Community Conference on July 28th.
posted Jul 13th 2009 8:23PM
This doesn't make sense.
First it says, "its shop will house content from all the major platforms under one roof".
Then it says, "non-VZW app stores like BlackBerry App World or Windows Mobile Marketplace won't be bundled with the smartphones out of the box".
Let's step up the writing quality a bit here.
Makes sense to me.
Verizon is going to make its own application store for all major platforms (read: WinMob and BlackBerry). It will come pre-installed.
Non-Verizon stores (BlackBerry App World/Windows Mobile Marketplace) will not come pre-installed on Verizon smartphones.
What don't you understand about that? Seems quite clear to me...
As I understand it, Verizon will have an app store for all phones. This app store will include any Blackberry or WinMo apps that devs submitt to it and can be billed to the Verizon bill.
If a user realizes Verizon's app store is the devil and want to get apps another way, they'll have to side-load or download the App World or whatever other non-Verizon app store they wish to use...but Verizon won't let it come loaded on the phone, to promote use of the Verizon store.
It's kinda confusing, I guess. All you need to know is that Verizon is up to something that consumers should ignore.
Time to step up the reading quality. Engadget has flubbed a lot lately, though I don't Ross was responsible for any of it, and there's nothing wrong with this post.
I've never really been tempted by VZW, and I'm glad about that today. There's nothing good about additional carrier control of smartphone apps. They do enough damage indirectly. Let's just hope this doesn't catch on with other carriers.
It's quite simple, really. Verizon wants people to use its network because of its service and apps, and not because of the phones they carry. If they didn't do this, more people would follow the phones (e.g. iPhone) and those people would have no problems to jump between AT&T, VzW, Sprint, etc... which is what most Engadget readers do anyway :-)
classic god damn verizon. i swear, CDMA is always pulling one thing or another, whether crippling phones, locking out gps, or basically...stuff like this
opps, forgot to throw in carriers there. cdma carriers
Well, that pretty much does it for the Calgary and the Android Market... I'm so glad I'm not on Verizon.
Yep another fup uck by Verizon and another stupid post by an OP who didn't read carefully enough or isn't capable of understanding English.
Dude, how about you read more carefully before you criticize? You Lose!
Nah my brotha it's Verizon. If you look Sprint, Alltell, US Cellular (while it's still alltell) and other CDMA providers don't gimp their phones.
One would assume you would read the post a couple times to be sure before you take the time to blast Engadget. I, on the other hand, love Engadget - keep up the good work guys!
"its shop will house content from all the major platforms under one roof"
Which makes adding those platforms separately REDUNDANT. That's what doesn't make sense. Verizon's store already provides access to the content from the others, and there's no mention of an additional markup.
Think it through.
Verizon's app store now charges monthly subscription fees (3.99 for ebay) or insanely high year rentals (that "cool golf app!")
No one should collaborate with Verizon for their app stores. No developers should submit to this store. This should not be supported by, or used by, anyone.
Unless, of course, someone would prefer to pay a subscription fee through Verizon rather than a purchase price through the genuine store. Seeing as how Verizon's been doing this for so long, I'm starting to believe people don't mind. It seems to be working for the "app friendly" enVs.
The trouble is that if that is on a large chunk of your customers phones, then you don't have much choice. If you don't put your app there, it wont sell.
What this does is fnargle up Microsoft and RIMs attempts to make neat easy to use and understand competitors to the App Store. It makes purchasing apps on their platforms messier.
The best part about VZW apps is that next to none of them are free. Why should I pay 2.99 for something that would be free on a non-Verizon phone?
They're even charging $6/month for an app that loads up Wikipedia articles.
The sad thing is people are actually buying it. Verizon bundles basic mobile WAP internet with mostly all of their plans. Do people not realize they can simply browse to the actual Wikipedia website on their phone?
On dumbphones, there's even a new $5/MB data charge, in addition to the piles of BREW DRM-filled crippleware.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BREW
As soon as Verizon switched to LTE I was planning on switching from ATT to them. But now that they pull this crap I'm staying with the death star even though I could just use an unlocked phone. It's just the principal of the thing!
yes it does. they will have their own app store. if you want the one native to the device, you have to download it yourself
F#%k you to, Verizon. =(
Indeed. We're getting better and better phones when the separation between carrier and phone manufacturer is more distinct. In my perfect setup, the two have nothing to do with each other, just as my ISP doesn't have any influence over my desktop OS. Verizon don't understand their role in this model. I'd never want to be with such a carrier.
I am absolutely against all carrier branding and other crapware they put on their phones as if I'm loyal to them - I'm loyal to whoever has the cheapest price and best network for as long as I'm contractually obligated to be. Their brand means nothing to me, just as I don't care for the brands of my other utility providers.
I'm so happy I dropped Verizon Wireless for Sprint years ago. Although their FIOS TV/Internet service kicks ass - it's night and day.
So to some up: HATE Verizon Wireless, LOVE Verizon FIOS.
I hate Verizon, but the headline made me think that they were going to ban other app stores, not merely fail to bundle them.
Just adding: F#ck Verizon.
Oh, yeah, I added the same thing. Because that's how people feel.
I've never been burned or hurt by Verizon, I'm not bitter, I just hate them. I had them for 9 years and by the end I came to realize how horrible they were. Its things *EXACTLY* like this that makes them completely suck.
*VERIZON ABSOLUTELY DOES NOT GET IT*
I just f*cking wish they knew.
-Taylor
And the LAMENESS continues. There will NEVER be an iPhone on Verizon! Ivan and Steve just wont see i to i, PERIOD!
Verizon being restrictive? Would have never guessed that was coming!
Well, from what I read in the article it seems you would have to download the app store app. And there would be a Verizon app store on the iphone instead.
Verizon keep Moto tools from working on their phones for NO GOOD REASON.
The company is as much, or more, big brother than Apple.
Stay clear.
I for one am totally, utterly, shocked that the company that insisted on replacing the UIs on every single phone with their garbageware for years, the same company that actually charged people to use the built in bluetooth features on their phones would ever do such a thing. I'm pretty sure when they replaced the UIs they also jacked half the ring tones just in case you would ever think of not paying them for stuff that comes free with every other carrier.
How uhh unexpected, not.
I remember when my brother and I both had Motorola RAZRs except he had the much newer phone that was supposed to be much better hardware...except he had the Verizon version and I had a regular one. So even though I had the old crappy phone, I could actually use all my features and didn't have to deal with an interface that ran at what can only be described as hilariously slow.
I don't know why anybody puts up with this phone crippling idiocy. Seriously if I was a handset maker I would just plain refuse to deal with these numbnuts because they just about ruin every single phone they lay hands on and it probably harms the phone manufacturer's reputation because people think they're responsible when it's really Verizon taking every decent phone and just sh*tting on it.
American capitalism can be more restrictive than a North Korean government. Thank God the EU steps in regularly to rein in the anti-competitive practices of US multi-nationals. Can you imagine the uproar if Vodafone or T-Mobile tried pulling a fast one like this across Europe...
So doesn't this basically closes the door for a Verizon iPhone, even in the mythical LTE future? I mean, you know Apple's not going to stand for anyone controlling their platform except for them.
That's why Verizon didn't get the iPhone in the first place - they wouldn't let Apple control it the way AT&T would. The Verizon CEO all but admitted it back in 2007.
That's the first thing I thought of as well. I can't imagine Apple will play along with this plan.
Yeah, I'm thinking this may kill the possibility of ever having the iPhone on Verizon.
i freakin hate verizon for that reason. apple would never go to them for that exact reason. if anyting please go to sprint ;)
VZW IS THE WORST
Haha.........today, I was talking with my friend, who has that one phone with the changing keyboard (landscape and portrait keyboard, physical). It was on Verizion network. My family's phones are on the AT&T network. I was saying about getting an iPhone on the Verizion network if it happens. Now that I read this, goodbye Verizion. You suck.
LAME!!
It wallows in lameness.
In a way, I could argue Apple is being restrictive too with their app store...
However, it's no where near as bad as what VZW is proposing.
Eh, at&t seems to have a veto over what goes in the App Store, so really it almost seems like the Verizon App Store is more open- only VZW will be rejecting your apps, not some combination of VZ and MSFT/RIMM (and in a mythical magical world, AAPL)
Though VZW, being VZW, will probably be more expensive, so forget what I just said.
In a way you could..in a way that would be wrong.
@ Epsilon
its one thing to say an app can't stream Live television its another to force the developer to submit everything in duplicate just to make a dime off of it?
but..but I thought Verizon had an "open" network.....
I don't quite understand????
*****joins the dark side****
FAIL FAIL FAIL VERIZON!
GO AT&T AND IPHONE.
CRUUUUUUUUUSH THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No Android for VZW?
Verizon : "We've got the best network EVA! You can hear me now!.... but we will cripple all your featured phones and we're going to try and force feed you your apps at exorbitant prices."
AT&T : "We've got the phones! And bars and stuff! But don't expect 3G to work reliably in huge metropolitan areas. And sorry about that dropped call."
Sprint : "We're not going out of business. Honest. Really. Don't ask about or subscriber numbers."
T-Mobile : "Yes we are still here too. We've got Catherine Zeta Jones, and she's still hot. 3G is a figment of your imagination."
Sigh...
Verizon's network*GSM+AT&T's phones=best carrier ever
There were rumors abound that T-Mo could've bought Sprint a little while before the Pre was launched.
They really should've done that. Thier customer service + android + Sprint's High Speed data would've been a real winner.
how does that work? sprint is cdma and tmobile is gsm. isn't that an issue?
Guess this will kill hope for the iPhone on VZW LTE network by 2011. Cant imagine Apple playing that this game with VZW
April 24th 2010 couldn't come any sooner.
what does this have to do with april 24th 2010?
Verizon. i hate you. go kill youself. goodbye
Good luck with that Verizon. Enjoy your feature phones while Apple, RIM, Microsoft, Palm, Google, and Nokia stick with a more profitable model with ATT and T-Mobile. Besides, GSM is the world standard, so why would they want to further alienate internationally used platforms?
LTE
I'm not in love with the kind of stuff Verizon pulls, but don't kid yourself into thinking that it has had much of an affect on their bottom line.
Verizon consistently adds subscribers, regardless of the crap they pull. When you have the best network in the country, you can get away with this type of stuff.
They ONLY have the "Best" network because ALL of their phones are crippled, and they sell very few smart phones that actually use data like an iPhone or Android/Pre user. If people were hammering it with a phone like the iphone their network would be smoked just like att's.
Tsing Tao, you don't seriously believe Verizon's network is better because it isn't used as much, do you? They have more subscribers and most will agree they cover a greater area. Also, all of the phones aren't crippled. That's just one of those things people on message boards toss around without actual knowledge. In the past there have been phones that did not have wi-fi so customers would have to use their data network. Verizon's "crippling" actually forces the consumer to use their services. More people probably use data with their phones because they have to.
Truth
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/5167/factbest3g.gif
Results were determined before Verizon's aquisition of Alltel and the transition of their towers to Verizon's network. I can't imagine how great their coverage and speed will be by this fall. Sure it doesn't change their questionable business practices but a savy consumer can find their prefered contract with any carrier. I myself have been using an old 49.99 unlimited data/text/minutes promo contract that I haven't canceled or changed on my Blackberry. Silly contract nay-sayers.
@Tsing Tao
Keep telling yourself that, fanboy.
If Verizon's goal is to get rid of customers they're doing an excellent Job. This, along with the crippled software, high prices, mandatory smartphone data plans, etc are the reasons why I plan on leaving Verizon as soon as my contract ends.
Join the club
Just leave now. I left mid-contract and sold my blackberry curve to cover the ETF and still had some cash left to put towards a new phone on a different carrier.
So much for that "open network" promise with the 700mhz spectrum. I guess they technically are not preventing other stores, just not letting them in out of the box. Verizon has always been heavy handed on what goes on and in their phones, the broken bluetooth saga comes to mind. If Verizon's apps where known for there outstanding quality that would be one thing, but I have been on Verizon and that is not the case, plus they love to brand brand brand. I still do not understand the Verizon Rhapsody thing. Why not just have Rhapsody on the darn thing. I know I have Verizon as me cell phone company, it says so and the front of the phone, its banner, and the bill each month. Why the extra branding? I'm waiting for the standard dial tone to be replaced with Verizon, Verizon, Verizon.
another reason why i switched from verizon to at&t. freaking app nazis
most of verizon's phones stink anyway, all the apps in their app store will probably be cruddy java apps, even for the smartphones
my curve 8330 didnt come with app world installed any way... so whats the difference here guys? so you have to make a few extra clicks to get appworld on... get over it...
why is everybody sh!tting their pants over this!? if you're gonna use any type of app portal, you better get used to downloading and installing sh!t for yourself. get over it.
probably verizon thinks that everyone will install malware and with verizon oversight they can prevent malware on their networks. plus vodafone owns roughly about 45% of verizon stock though verizon wants to buy it back, and verizon has poor upper mgmt.
this sucks
Sprint >> Verizon
I'm tired of their close minded and crippling features of their phones.
To top it all off they charge ~$50 more a month for what I now get on Sprint and my Pre.
As usual, monopoly is where the money is and that's the bottomline!!!
they don't even have a market yet how could they have a monopoly?
this could blow up in their faces and they could lose all the money it cost to develop software for a 1/2 a dozen different UI's
you can bet Verizon with block the ports the phone makes apps stores use.
I just hate how on the dumbphones they advertise APPS APPS APPS! but their really crappy and aren't as sophisticated as apps from other platforms. If its an app it must have at least some use of the phone hardware like the camera and a lot of them should be free.
So I guess it is safe to assume that this kills any hope of ever seeing a Verizon iPhone. Sounds like I may have to have the "it's not you, it's me" conversation with Verizon.
the others network are going to have a feeding frenzy with this, and the cellphone makers wont want to play ball as this will cost them 100's of millions in lost revenue
Yes, this sucks. But at least they're not going out of their way to block access to other app stores.
In that sense they're at least a little bit less douchey than Apple.
Apple only makes 1 phone. Apple is not a cellphone company.
@Keegballs
WTF, did you read the article, THEY ARE BLOCKING OTHER APP STORES !!!! that's the whole point of the article- dumbass
Direct quote from the article:
"non-VZW app stores like BlackBerry App World or Windows Mobile Marketplace won't be bundled with the smartphones out of the box, meaning consumers will have to take the initiative to download those portals for themselves. "
Consumers will have to download the portals themselves, they won't be blocked. Don't go calling other people dumbasses if you're going to look like one yourself.
F*ing Verizon. I'd switch if it wasn't the best coverage around here in SoCal, as well as staying on the Family plan we have....
How big a deal is this? Of course Verizon is pushing their app store, but it doesn't appear they will limit or block access to anything else. They aren't actually restricting anything. They just won't have a single link or .cab installed that the users who will really use will find on their own.
For the record, I'm not saying it is okay. It's a dickish move, but it's not preventing or limiting access.
How is it dickish?
Right now, there is no Verizon App Store. I buy apps for my Blackberry from individual websites like Crackberry.com, or BB App World. I will still be able to do that after Verizon makes their own store.
Sure, you'll have to download BB App World on your own... but nothing is preventing you from installing apps without buying them from Verizon.
It's Verizon being greedy. For people that read about these plans months in advance on a tech blog, yeah, it doesn't really make a difference. For the mainstream consumer who just wants things to work, they are now paying subscription, or inflated, fees for basic apps. Or they're not buying, and it hurts developers.
Mainstream consumers want things to just work, or they won't bother. This is why iTunes was such a victory for the Pre, they don't want to be told that they can go to a website and download this to do that in place of that. Most will never find out this information, and others won't care to go through the process. It needs to be in front of them.
Did you read what I was responding to, Michael Scrip? Myself. I just wanted to elaborate a little bit. It will be slightly annoying for some and it could detract from those who don't know their phone's capabilities. That's why I said it was slightly dickish.
@sitruc >> Yeah, I did read both of your comments.
I was asking why you considered it dickish. A true dick move would be where ALL apps must go through and get approved by Verizon (sound familiar?)
But... Verizon is making an app store AND you can still add apps the old-fashioned way if you want to. That's fine with me.
"Dickish" would mean that you could ONLY use the VZW app store to add apps to your phone.
This is actually the best of both worlds. People can buy apps for their enV phones... and the rest of us can buy apps for our smartphones the same way we've always done it.
@Michael
What's concerning is that while Verizon may not be blocking access to the manufacturer's app catalog, the article says they won't allow it out of the box. This means the nice little icon labeled "App Catalog" on my Palm Pre through Sprint will not be on the Verizon Pre, but rather an icon for the Verizon store. How many Jane's and Joe's off the street will know about Palm's native app store? What will be the differences between the amount of apps between Verizon's store and Palm's? Will there be non-Palm approved apps available in Verizon's store? How will this affect pricing? Surely the same app in the 2 stores will be priced different, and if they aren't, Verizon is still getting a cut. This means it's either coming out of Palm's pocket or the developer's.
There is something very wrong with all of this.
We pretty much agree on things and there are all these comments from other posters with misinformation and you want to argue over the definition of dickish, Michael Scrip?
This is why I'm never switching to Verizon. Yes, they have a fantastic network, but I like to do what I want with my phone. I have multiple phones and I like to switch between them easily and simply, and I like my smartphones to run whatever the hell software I feel like. If you only use your phone to make calls and you don't mind paying more than any other carrier than yea they're the best, but if you want flexibility, it has to be Cingular or T-mobile.
>> "This is why I'm never switching to Verizon. Yes, they have a fantastic network, but I like to do what I want with my phone."
Right now... there is no Verizon App Store. You can buy apps for your Blackberry from individual websites like Crackberry.com, or the BB App World. You will still be able to do that after Verizon makes their own store.
I still remember when they brought out the 3G RAZR. Like 2 years late, crippled bluetooth, replaced UI and $300 to boot. Their employee data plan was more expensive than the Sprint normal price for unlimited data. I haven't been with Verizon for a long time but I wondering how good the network has to be for people to put up with their crap at a premium for that matter. Guess the commercials work very well.
Dear Phone Companies,
You are just Wireless ISPs. That's all we want from you.
thankyou.
Truer words have never been spoken.
Google Voice + smartphone with data plan only = goodnight, mobile telephony rent-seekers
If you buy your phone full retail price, then yes, you can ask them to be nothing more than an ISP.
But an overwhelming majority of people are buying their phones as subsidized rates, which makes phone companies unlike your ISP. If you got a free computer for signing up with Comcast for 2 years, you can bet there would be comcast stuff on that computer as well. but you're not. You buy your computer elsewhere and then used it on their network, so you (rightfully) ask for control over what is (and isn't) on your computer.
Until all phones are purchased at full retail by customers, carriers can continue to justify locking them down.
But this isn't even that. This is an app store so that customers can purchase apps and have those purchases put on their bill. With the current APP world you need a paypal account to get anything. How many "typical" customers are going to be happy with the fact that they have to sign up for a totally unrelated program to pay for their purchases?
If you still want to do this, you can get the normal app stores (I wouldn't even be surprised if they were in the verizon app store to download) or you can have everything come through your one bill and purchase them through verizon. From what I've heard, this is a total rewrite of their app store idea, so you'll see a change in pricing (I believe) But people here are blasting it before they even know anything about it. Verizon knows that they have to make the apps accessable, and that they can't charge $6 for an app you can get for free.
When I read this, the thing that jumped out most was the fact that it would be for all platforms, and that you could have the charges on your bill (like get it now) instead of using a third party like app world. This should mean that should something happen to your phone and you get a warrenty replacement, you'll be able to re download those apps for free on the new phone like you can with Get It Now.
Oh Verizon, you never fail to amuse me.
Seriously, they never miss an opportunity to shoot themselves in the foot (recall that they turned the iPhone down, lol) and now they follow it up by stabbing themselves in the leg.
Yeah, I bet devs will be falling all over themselves to develop VZW-only apps. /sarcasm
>> "Yeah, I bet devs will be falling all over themselves to develop VZW-only apps."
There will be somewhat of a rush to create apps for dumbphones like the enV 3 and enV Touch. It's "new" platform.
Otherwise... the developers can continue to make apps for Blackberry and Windows Mobile like they always have. And distribute them like they always have.
You realize that you don't *have* to buy apps from only one place if you have a Blackberry or Windows Mobile phone, don't you?. I've bought and installed apps for my Blackberry long before there was the BlackBerry App World. You can visit a website in the BB browser.. click a link... and it's installed.
Verizon isn't limiting the use of "other" methods of adding apps to your phone... (yet)
@Michael You keep saying this and it keeps exacerbating the fact that you just dont get it. The smartphone market isnt about people who read engadget that want to hack roms and download apps from 100 different places. Its about people who suck at technology, that’s who all this easiness is designed for and why the iPhone app store and android/pre app store are useable. Yes i know you can sideload apps on these platforms, but a very small percentage of people ever will.
After 1 year of watching the iPhone app store success and some of you guys just dont get it. Why do you think VZW is even developing an app store? The more crap you cram in front of people the less they use, normal people are scared by tech and easily overwhelmed and VZW just self imposed that situation onto all of their phones, just so they can sell more shitty java apps.