Sony sat down with
Eurogamer at the Develop conference last week, and had some interesting things to say about its
new motion controller technology -- including a bit of polite smack to talk about the
Wiimote. Unfortunately, we're not sure that Paul Holman, SCEE VP of R&D, was referencing
MotionPlus when he said that Sony's tech is "another generation forward, or even a couple of generations" ahead of the Wiimote. Holman, along with Kish Hirani, head of developer services, sidestepped questions about MotionPlus specifically, but were more than happy to talk down
Project Natal -- with a couple generations of EyeToy already under their belt. What's more interesting is what they revealed about their own product, including built-in microphone that can detect the direction of audio, and the availability of the glowing ball to developers to add immersion -- it can be lit with any color in the spectrum. They wouldn't confirm much about what buttons the controller would have, other than that it would have buttons, but it seems Sony's main objective is providing developers with a broad buffet of control options to pick and choose and implement. They're also sticking by that Spring 2010 date, though the launch could be somewhat contingent upon what games are ready by then.
[Via
Joystiq]
posted July 21st 2009 4:28PM
it sure is
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It would be kind of sweet if the orb turned red based on your proximity to bad guys, sort of like Frodo's Sting in Lord of the Rings.
OR how about this...say you are playing a hack 'n slash FPS and have a green ball, lets say, in your left hand for your shield and red in the right for your sword. Just by knowing the color, you know your weapon/item of choice and what hand its in rather than needing to work through a menu, or having an OSD that you need to look at.
I agree with Sony
Exactly. I mean something that looked extremely difficult to use in the demo, is not yet released, and looks like a dildo is most definitely "generations ahead". Just like OSx is "the most advanced operating system in the world". Just because I company talks up their product like that does not make it so.
Jordan shut up and go play with your wii
Sony aim for better controlling and its much more accurate the the wii plus People will make real games for it not mini games BS
Wow..Cuz I never mentioned the Wii....
Well, of course. Because being a generation or two ahead of Wiimote is such an achievement! :D:D:D
And Natal is a generation or two ahead of them. Perfect.
Not really. They're practically the same thing but with an IR sensor to detect depth, and no controller. I'm sure for some games the lack of controller is really going to help the immersion... but sometimes you just need a controller. Let's hope the final thing doesn't look as ugly, though. And I'll be interested to see where button placement goes on the thing, not to mention how many it'll have.
Yeah, you can use your 360 controller with Natal at the same time, but with both your hands tied up, what more are you going to be able to do, kick your legs? Hop around the living room? I don't see it. I think it's going to take developers a long time to really figure out how best to use Natal.
Sony's approach makes the most sense at the moment. It's the most logical step forward. Natal is exciting, and maybe non-gamers will like it, but real gamers will most likely find it frustrating. They don't find controllers confusing like non-gamers do, and aside from maybe button/joystick placement.
Immersion's great, but not at the expense of gameplay.
Or you could hold the controller in one hand(left or right) and have a trigger, bumper, an analog stick, and still have full body mocap.
The number of people who assume that just because they can't figure something out, nobody else can either, astounds me.
And I'd still prefer good old virtual reality gloves.
Not another Sony vs MS argument. Let me bring this to a swift end:
http://i32.tinypic.com/29f8j1x.jpg
That's it. No more discussion needed. Xbox gamers should hang their head in shame.
'Yeah, you can use your 360 controller with Natal at the same time, but with both your hands tied up, what more are you going to be able to do, kick your legs? Hop around the living room? I don't see it. I think it's going to take developers a long time to really figure out how best to use Natal.'
...OR, they can dust off the circa 1986 PowerGlove. I've always wanted to see a sequel to 'The Wizard' anyway.
Sorry bit it's not. we have the Microsoft dev kit and had a chance to play with the Sony kit behind closed doors in Brighton. Right now, the Sony want is like 100x better than Natal, and has loads more posibilities, it's also much more accurate than Wiimote, even with the WiiMotion+
I know it's trendy to hate Sony (or at least it was in 2007), but really have the best tech, so you really ought to change your opinions of them, as the only one thats missing out is YOU.
We have 4 PS3 exclusives being worked on 5 multiplats, and NO Xbox exclusives, it's simply no longer worth it, the Xbox cannot push gaming anymore, the PS3 is where we now lead, and multiplats for everything else.
@ serious
My first thought when I saw that was, "OMG Anthony Keiedis replaced his sock with a copy of CoD2"
http://rhcprock.free.fr/lebedeva/anthmoscowpensive.jpg
Sure she's naked, but you can do better.
Probably. Based on the videos, the 1:1 tracking looked incredibly precise. And the Wiimote, while innovative at the time, has serious limitations. I personally can't stand it.
Let's just hope devs use it right to make a game properly immersive rather than trying like hell to show off a flagship feature (*cough* SIXAXIS)
gey
Wow, you can't even spell that right?
Didn't MS and Sony say there were "a generation ahead" of the Wii in terms of hardware already? Didn't they down the Wii as "last gen" and "gimmicky"?
The more things change.....
The only "generation" they should be worried about it is the younger (and older) generations currently buying the Wii in droves.
Makes sense, but the games on Wii are just so unbelievably low in quality overall. There are a few gems, sure, but you'd expect a lot more from a system that seems to be so popular.
I think the Wii is beneficiary of good marketing than good gaming. Motion controls was the foot in the door for the Wii and made people take notice. Keeping supply intentionally low for so long did wonders to keep demand up for a device that gets so boring so quickly. But it goes to show you that when you combine cheap hardware and overwhelming install base, you get games that are mostly shovelware.
Clearly they are appealing to somebody.
Ones man's shovelware is another man's game of the year.
The fact that games are being made with another audience in mind simply makes current reviewers jaded. We are simply mad that the Wii is not last gen........we are.
How true.
But just because Nintendo's going in a different direction from the competition doesn't mean the Wii or the Wii's games are visionary. They have appealed to the mass market a bit more than hardcore gamers, and I would agree with you that those reviewing games may not be looking at them in their intended light. But we can all agree that when a game isn't given a large enough budget and is pushed out the door, it's overall quality can (and often does) suffer.
My main argument would be that despite Wii games targeting a different audience, and despite reviewers judging them through perhaps a different lens, they are often of poor quality simply because they don't have to be. When a game console is so cheap to develop for and when the install base of that console is so incredibly large, games don't have to be very good in order to get a large return on their money. When a console or game is so cheap, then your games only have to be just good enough or have just enough brand recognition to appeal to the impulse buyer.
Put another way, a PS3 or Xbox 360 game costs more, but generally sells less. A Wii game costs much less, but often sells much more. So for Wii developers, it's more about quantity than quality. It's smart business.
@ Derbeste
One gamer's shovelware is a bored girlfriend's game of the year
fix'd.
@Mike
So while Nintendo's understanding of gaming may not be visionary, their understanding of the market is.
So while MS and Sony understand hardware and software, Nintendo understands people. Which do you think has proven more successful to these businesses?
As for the quality of the games, I won't venture to disagree or agree. I don't have the credential to do so. I'm not casual.
@Surfaced
Haha! That was actually pretty funny (not to mention accurate). The thing is though...that bored girlfriends wallet has just as much value (if not more so than the boyfriends). She is just as worthy of being entertained as we are.
It's sad to see that most people still don't get why the controls of the Wii is lightyears ahead of those introduced by Sony and Microsoft.
Especially that Natal project. NO CONTROLLER OMG. Yeah, now try walking, aiming and shooting at the same time. Oh wait.
Yes, because once you buy Natal you have to throw away your controllers. Using a controller with small gestures accomplishing other tasks? Blasphemy!
@ Mark: oh wow, let's use a standard controller with some small gestures.
It would look like, wel... how about the sixaxis controller?
Thanks for proving my point, dumbass.
wow, you are braindead. wake up fanboy, natal is far ahead of both of the other techs
Wow, so the sixaxis controller can detect the movement of your other limbs? And it has a built in microphone to receive spoken commands as well? Wow, then you must be right, especially given how Natal is a totally fleshed out product and there's absolutely no possibility of them bundling it with an optional more simple controller(or even a dummy one with fake buttons where Natal just watches your fingers' locations to determine button presses).
You guys sound ridiculous, you know.
Calm down. You're fighting about products that haven't even been released yet.
Explain please.
@ AnnoyingTech: I don't deny Natal is technically impressive. But that doesn't mean it will function just as good as a Wii remote in a usual household environment. They demoed it in places with 20m2 free space.
@ Mark: oh wow, voice recognition. Impressive, because we just love to scream commands while playing games. Limb detection is really nice when you're sitting on a couch with a table in front of you. And tracking minimal finger movement with a camera that's 2 meter away will be no doubt as precize as pressing a real button. Yeah, you convinced me.
Why can't you do what you do with the WiiMote? There are many devices that the WiiMote fits into - tennis raquets, golf clubs, guns, steering wheels, etc. that you can use if you physically want to hold onto something. The difference is that you do not have to snap a controller into the piece of plastic. It would not be required, but you can do it. Hell, you can even use a real tennis raquet, a real steering wheel, a real gun (OK, maybe not a good idea), and have real immersion rather than a 2 foot long plastic prop. but if you don't want to use a device to make it feel more real, just point your finger at the TV screen and play.
If you're going to talk about products that aren't out yet and so far are just tech demos(although incredibly successful ones), at least do them the justice of being at least a little open minded. Yes, I do think being able to say commands instead of having to go through some menu in a squad-based tactics game(akin to Rainbow 6) would be a hell of a lot better(let alone the obvious argument of: "Impressive, because we just love to waggle our arms while playing games"). Also, yes, limb detection would be good sitting at a couch with a table in front of you, since it can detect arm movement(even when not touching the controller such as, say to throw a grenade), finger movement, and head movement, none of which require standing or moving much at all, just like the Wiimote. I own a Wii, so I'm definitely not bashing it and I can't wait to see what Nintendo comes up with as its next big leap forward, but at least give credit to obviously superior technologies.
@ Mark: MS and Sony are simply failing to see what made the Wii a succes. The success of the Wii controller is that it's really versatile. Most games don't even need 1:1 gesture tracking, sometimes holding it sideways and tilting it is the way to go, other times the pointing functionality is all you want while moving your character with the nunchuk. Playing with your hands is still the most comfortable way, so head movements etc is just tiring. I don't have anything against the PS3/360, love to play a lot of games the classic way. I just don't think they really know how to beat the Wii. All they see is the motion controls so they're trying to make an over the top motion controller.
Voice recognition. Come on. Games like Rainbow Six are made to be played online. A regular microphone will do the job. And it's not like a regular microphone with some software isn't capable of doing voice recognition.
Besides that, their demos weren't even that impressing. A dumb jumping kid playing some 3D arkanoid clone and a racing game. Racing games are the easiest to demo, all they require is left/right/gas/brake inputs. They didn't show why their method of playing was actually BETTER than playing the oldskool way, something the Wii already did for a lot of games.
even an IR has limitations of depth, supposedly the person is front of the camera and trying to hit all pseudo buttons like he was holding a remote remote; surely the IR would not be able to differentiate which button he pressed as the thumb is behind the palm of his hand that is facing the infrared. with sony's control module, you could be swinging with a sword and on command with a push of a button transform the sword into a mace, flail or shield. whereas in natal you would have to perform a gesture to change weapons and lose frame and also get shot down by an opponent.
I think Project Natal has so many possibilities, if it is as precise as advertised.
I think imaginative developper will have a lot of idea. And they can combiene that to the use of the controller too.
For example, in a FPS, you could use it normaly or with one hand and the other hand could be the gun, if you want to change gun, just change props. You take the one representing the sniper rifle, when you lift it to your eye, the game zoom automatically.
Then you if you're surrounded by ennemy, instead of shooting you, they could ask you to surrender and the camera could check if you raise your hands. Could add immersion in the story.
Also, a friend could help you, for example, holding doors with his hands while you're doing something else, could protect you with an energy field (in games involving super powers ) etc ...
I can find so many ideas, they might be boring because I'm not that creative but imagine all they could do with their creative power!
@Chris
that is if you are playing a multiplayer game, but for 1st person shooters and frag games that doesn't really help, by the time you change props using gestures only without using a controller with buttons you will have to restart the game again... therefore sony's idea prevails you can still do gestures if sony implements it as it was already in the eyetoy with the added motion controller. gesture plus click of a button = quick transformation and still life saved.
Sony is just playing catch-up with Nintendo's innovation. Their "upcoming" product is of course going to be a generation or two ahead of the system Nintendo released 3 years ago. I'm sure Nintendo has something up their sleeves that would blow Sony's motion controls out of the water and continue ruling the gaming console war.
Except there are numerous videos of Sony R&D perfecting this tech during the PS2 era...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PtoxKDcCXc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9AViYmfWR4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYHr0I-iFHE
It looks like they like to try and test things out to find the best method of input.
IS there a blog out there with more informations and images of this device?
vaporware is vaporware.
until this shit is in market sony should just shut it.
Vaporware?
did you say Natal?
@ Magallanes
Natal was actually playable at E3 unlike Sony's product. Engadget even reviewed the product.
Nice try though
At least Sony's controller has a timeframe of release instead of "somewhere in either 2010 or 2011".
Anyone else find it troubling that it has the person is holding the device at one angle while in the generated video the sword is pointing in the other direction?
That's a lie. PSMC has perfect 1:1 mocap, I read it on a forum somewhere.
/jk