Upcoming Xbox 360 Netflix update is still gimped, Microsoft thinks you want it that way
By Tim Stevens 
posted Aug 5th 2009 9:26AM
posted Aug 5th 2009 9:26AM
If you haven't been lucky enough to preview the upcoming Xbox Live dashboard update like we did, there's a good chance you're eagerly awaiting its August 11 release so that you can finally modify your Netflix queue straight from the box. If so, prepare to be disappointed... or, uh, thrilled when you find out that the new experience isn't quite as comprehensive as you might have expected. It restricts users to perusing the Top 50 films in any of a handful of categories, meaning no searching by title and no browsing alphabetically. Why? According to Microsoft's Ben Smith, Director of Program Management for Xbox Live, that's how you want it. He says: "I think when people come to Xbox they're not really looking so much for functional, they really want to have fun, they want to be wowed." We're saying "wow," all right, but for entirely different reasons. There is a morsel of good news, though: if enough people indicate they actually like function and want an honest-to-goodness, full-featured Netflix experience Microsoft is fully prepared to upgrade the service. Again. Eventually.
[Via Joystiq]
I would say that is dissapointing but that even a weak adjective.
Sounds like rebranded laziness to get it rolled out on time.
Exactly
Cone on, now. They have obviously put a lot of thought into this. Look how well everything flows together. Scooby-Doo, Hannah Montana, Spongebob, and Californication? Sit down your 8 year old and let them have at it.
I have to agreed with Microsoft, it's like using computer without keyboard or mouse.
It's like editing a document on Windows Phones, you have the software and tools.
But don't you want the proper keyboard and mouse to do the job instead of using the keypad or touch screen?
It's better than it was.
Kinda like how it's better to get punched in the gut, than punched in the the face.
Rebranded laziness is right. This is retarded.. just add in a search feature and be done with it already.
@Kit My X-Box controller has a keyboard and your can too for about 30 dollars.
I DONT CLAIM TO BE A JEANUS BUT WHY CANT WE HAS BOFF ? TOP FIDDY AND SEARCH ? uhhh HELLLLLLLOOOOOOO.
Wow! I am glad you do not claim to be a genius.
Politicians and corporate handlers.
Both hopelessly out of touch with what people really want...and don't want.
Its actually 100 in each category.... unless they are going to change it in the final release.
that said I think its a good system.... I dont want to scroll through thousands of movies one at a time. I do want a real search though but hate how the current alphabetical organization works for the other movies. I DO NOT want that brought to netflix. Give me a real search.
I don't want to scroll through thousands of movies either. The key here is a search box. There needs to be a simple search box that will bring up results from their inventory of streamable content. Perhaps an active search, showing results after typing one or 2 letters would be appropriate.
I re-signed up for Netflix after I was admitted into the preview for the 360 update (I canceled the first time because of the simplistic interface) . Essentially, there is no more functionality than there was before in terms of usability.
I might just have to re-cancel.
::facepalm::
well, you got to love his nervous excuse...
What in the hell are they smoking? ...or... What in the hell do they think we're smoking? Of course we want to have fun. Watching some crap I've no interest in doesn't = fun.
lol this is Ben Smith shedding some light on the Xbox 360...
I think when people come to Xbox they're not really looking so much for functional....
Oh so that explains the RROD!
...they want to be wowed
As in wow this PoS doesn't work like they said it would?
I'm a proud 360 owner but Ben Smith should be taken out back of Redmond and beaten with reeds for saying something so incredibly stupid.
Users don't want functionality? Fuck you guy.
Sounds like something Microsoft would do
as long as "The Room" makes the top 100 in a category.....
Wow, I was just thinking it was something Apple would do.
If you don't like our way, you're doing it wrong.
Dude I loved "The Room" !
Amazing what you get exposed to with unlimited streaming!
Actually, kinda DOES sound like something Apple would do.. and god DAMN it's stupid. Everything else about Netflix on my 360 works great, and I love that I got added functionality for no extra cost.. but why the hell don't I at least want the OPTION of choosing a movie directly from the XBox rather than having to go to a computer and deal with this queue concept? The queue makes total sense for mailing, but makes no sense at all for streaming. Sure, tell me what's in my mailing queue so I can watch instantly if I prefer, but that's no reason to not have a search option.
Microsoft needs to learn three simple terms: design, usability, research. They can't seem to get any of those right.
don't tell me what i want microsoft.
p.s. i DO NOT want ads, so quit that horse ASAP
? I have the update and i think its perfect for checking out new stuff ... If there is something i really want i will get rent/buy it on Blu Ray .. It is 1000% better then it was before so why be negative
you're being a bit of an apologist. I agree that it's better now, but compared to what? the bar was set so low on the first release of Netflix on the Xbox. they have fixed a lot of my gripes and the movies absolutely stream better now which was my biggest complaint. but why not add search? it seems so fundamental.
this is their pattern though, get it wrong, slightly fix it, slightly fix it some more, some more fixing, get it right.
why add search to just the 360? Why not LG, Sony, Roku, Samsung players etc?
The interface is exactly the same on all those other platforms and the Roku box is their official product! So you're complaining that the 360 is not getting even more functionality than it currently has over every other platform the NFLX players is on? Holy shit you can't even watch HD at the NFLX site itself, just be glad it actually works on the 360 at all.
And as I've said before, the content is so limited that adding a comprehensive text search tool would be pointless and a waste of typing. 90% of movies you would search for would not be available. You can flip through almost the entire catalog faster than it takes to type and wait for a result to not show up.
I want search on all of the platforms, not just the 360. Actually, I'd rather have queue management on my TiVo, because I'd much rather deal with a TiVo-style interface than a Microsoft one.
I tend to see this as being a "basic" implementation. Having access to the newest and most popular items is probably good enough for most of the time. However, on those occasions when you want to see something else, having access to a search function will be appreciated. Certainly I would not want to have to go and find the video using another means if Netflix did already have it. Sounds like more work required to me.
Note: I neither own a 360 nor have access to Netflix.
I don't give a dime to corporations who think they can dictate to me what I want.
doesnt every corporation do things they think you want...thats kinda how they make money
Not with freaking movies they don't...
Great so the top 50 of each category...at least I can use my laptop to add stuff I can't find in this wonderfully castrated updated. I wonder if the full functionality proposed in the Netflix update will be out before or after WinFS, because a lot of people wanted that too.
So is this actually less functionality than the current client? Why on earth would they limit it so pointlessly? I joined XBox live just for the Netflix service, and I'm really thinking it was a waste of money, I won't renew if they don't fix this.
The current Netflix client on the Xbox doesn't even let you add any movies/videos to your queue, so the updated version definitely has more functionality. The only problem is that they give you the top 100 per category, and not the WHOLE catalog. You also can't type in a search box for a particular movie, actor, etc. So in that respect it is "gimped," but it's a definite improvement over the current (soon to be old) app.
I suspect they'll continue improving the system anyway. I'm happy with what they're doing so far, but yes it can be improved. At least now we can browse the top 100 vids for a particular category, and not have to go onto a computer/mobile device to add an item to our Play Now queue.
Sounds like an assumption Microsoft made like they do with everything else. If they had done a peer group analysis, it would have been clear that most users would want a full blown search capability with Netflix. Thanks Microsoft for your genius assumption!!!
Do you have data to back this up or does your random sampling of Engadget comments (not a representative sample of average users) qualify? I've seen a ton of comments that say "well of COURSE everybody wants this" with the sole backup being that the individual wants it.
Also, consider that it may have been a question of "browse top 50 by categories *or* add search functionality", resources are limited and code takes time to write. Search may be coming later for all anybody knows, but maybe the decision (which might have even been made with the use of a focus group, we don't know) was made to prioritize browse over search as that was more compelling for the target audience.
All this internet outrage seems super overblown. Damned if you do, damned if you don't I imagine. I'm sure if search was added people would just find something new to kvetch about. :)
The I.T. Crowd is sooooo hilarious. Can't wait for season 3 to reach these shores.
Season 2 of that show is really good. Season 1 was kind of crap. I do miss the old boss, though.
Agreed!! I already saved it on Netflix.
+1
...season 3 is awesome as well. Apparently there's a Christmas special coming, followed by a season 4 next spring. The episodes in S3 with the "electric sex pants" and "friendface" (facebook spoof) were top shelf.
Well, clearly they had some focus group of retards tell them this. Given that we've already had two people say they like it, allow me to provide a counterpoint. I am hanging out with my friends and we decide to watch a movie. Someone suggests something a little niche, but everyone agrees that we'll give it a shot. We then turn on the xbox and load up netflix. Now we either have the option of running to a computer on a different story and putting it on the cue or searching through a large list of movies for something that may or may not be there. By failing to add a search feature, Microsoft has made the experience VERY FRUSTRATING for anyone who already knows what they want to watch beforehand. I believe that in many cases this guy is right in that many people will just scroll on over to the netflix tab and see something they like and watch it. However, this is an incomplete solution and really fucking frustrating if I want to watch the original battlestar galactica or something.
That really looks like a Microsoft move...
If it helps anyone, there are free netflilx aps for iphone and winmo that actually do let you search. It's still lame, but at least you don't have to get off the couch.
Microsoft will add full search capabilities...right after Roku, TiVo and all the DVD players get their Netflix update that will (hopefully) include the feature.
The people do want. Why do I want to go to my computer, find a movie, and then go back to my couch and watch it. Why can't I just select it from my xbox right away?
Hahahha... that's the PR line of the year:
"I think when people come to Xbox they're not really looking so much for functional, they really want to have fun, they want to be wowed."
The quickest way to WOW me is with something dysfunctional, I guess?
i think it is a typo WOWED --> VOWED
:3
Microsoft: Not Really Looking So Much For Functional.™
why the flying fork would you NOT want your movies organized alphabetically (unless they are alphabetic AND by genre) the lack of a search function is stupid as well, its as if they are trying to make it a anger inducing experience just so you won't actually use the damn service. you will just sit there for a few hours watching ads so they can make moniez.
"I think when people come to [Microsoft] they're not really looking so much for functional..."
Yep, that's pretty much it.
It works better than before. I think i added like 50 movies the first day i got the preview. Its kind of a pain in the ass to do it from the computer and winmo phone!
There is just to search function.
It sounds logical to me. I mean who wants to scroll through hundreds of horrid movies using their 360 controller...To be fair, the top fifty is probably the only decent movies on the list. The Netflix play instantly selection is pretty poor. I really only ever look at about the top fifty. I'll take it. It's still an improvement.
Agreed, I don't have the keyboard attachment for the 360 controller and I certianly wouldn't want to waste time fumbling through a search. This is better than what was available and anything I can't find, I'll hop on my computer. If the masses want to search, so be it, I'm fine with this.
Yeah, but not everyone has the same tastes in movies. And 50 movies isn't really a lot, considering there are probably over 50 major movies made every year (pulling that number out of thin air here, but you get the point). Why wouldn't you want the ability to browse all of them? Why not show the top 50, and then have a button you can press to see more?
eh... we'll see. A little over blown don't you think engadget? I mean I've used the online client for netflix...it was neither easy nor fun to locate movies and determine what was streamable or not (I always seemed to pop in and out of the streamable section) Part of the reason I dropped it after the trial was over. MS is actually making it a lot more streamlined with this update.
I think MS is looking to make it a visual experience...which make searching a lot easier. Alphabetizing by letter and sifting through a lot of crap is annoying. Just try doing it on the current xbox movie marketplace. I'm going to take a wild guess and say MS most likely benchmarked a lot this to see what user habits were... and determined it based off that.
Question to all the current netflix users... has Netflix streamable library gotten better? or is it still just a bunch of crappy 80's movies?
Oh my God shut up.
@grammer police
i wasn't trying to be snarky, its a legitamate question... i want to get back into Netflix...just waiting till the selection gets better. Its been several months since i tried it...I'm just looking for what the experience is like now.
So sorry to offend you ....douche.
"it was neither easy nor fun to locate movies and determine what was"
You are dumb.
"MS is actually making it a lot more streamlined with this update."
Offering a tiny, worthless fraction of Netflix's enormous archives is not STREAMLINING.
"Alphabetizing by letter and sifting through a lot of crap is annoying."
No, it isn't if it is done right. Or if you know the alphabet.
ITs really really really really really really easy to tell which movies you can stream. When you hover over the add button it give you 2 choices, i know that sounds scary, what with it being red for regular que and blue for streaming. Hopefully you figure it out.
Why not "wow" me with functionality? If I want a useless piece of shit that just looks awesome I'll buy a fucking Jaguar. Instead of modeling the user experience on the defunct Blockbuster Video store model (just browsing the top favorites), why not model it on something that looks great and is beyond functional (and just so happens to blow their goddamned doors off) the AppleTV. Hell, if you're going to copy them back in the 80's-90's, why not do it in the 2000s?
Personally, between my XBOX and my AppleTV, I'll adopt whichever one does systematic closed captioning / subtitles ... Since federal law hasn't caught up to streaming video, there's no incentive for either of them to adopt something so necessary to so many people. Deaf folks aren't numerous or moneyed enough to marginally impact Apple & Microsoft's business models, I guess. Jerkoffs.
The IT Crowd is on Netflix? If you haven't watched it already, you Netflix subscribers owe yourselves!
You have to admit though, that is some Grade-A professional spin doctoring!
so you live in a hole? how are you communicating to us right now? telepathy?
dammit that comment was to nazgulnarsil
"shakes fist at engadget comment system"
You assume wrong this time M$...
I see all these comments from people complaining about not wanting some company to tell them what they want ect ect....
I have to wonder how many of them own Apple products, since that is exactly what the house of Jobs does. When Apple does it it's "Apple just wants to make things more seamless and easier for people to use!", when anyone else does it it's "Screw them and their big brother policies."
Outside a search scrolling through 100 movies takes to long.
It doesn't bother me the way it's set-up. I think this is more nick-picking.
Yeah, that's kinda like Windows...I don't want functional, but I do want the fun of crashing, data loss, insecurity, and ever-dwindling system resources. Wow.
Not that the Netflix recommendation engine is all that, but I should be able to browse those on the 360. "Top 50" or "Top 100" - are they my top recommendations? I don't think so.
How sad. Microsoft has every oppertunity to dominate the market in a host of options (actual codec support for video ala Popcorn Hour and the like, awesome netflix experience, great facebook experience, etc) and they continue to disappoint us, EVERY SINGLE TIME.
Any user with the chatpad could navigate a proper netflix interface in an instant, and those without would still have no issues. They keep getting the chance to slam the door in Sony's face, and someone manages to slip a wedge in front of it right before it closes.
WAKE UP MICROSOFT.
this isn't MS. This is NFLX. This is their setup, their coding, their application gateway. Their terms.
Heh, I'm really going to be amused if a 3rd party service like "PlayOn" provides the ability to modify your queue from the console before Microsoft. Mediamall might already be moving that way.
If you had a ps3 you could just do it from the browser there and then watch your movies from playon. Sure am glad my console has a browser for all that functionality that apparently people dont want on their xbox.
You can do it that way on the PS3, true. And I have, but a native integration should have a bit more leeway to go nuts.
the ps3 cant play hd films on netflix when netflix ready devices can (xbox and netflix box and some bluray players)
If you're an iPhone user, I wholeheartedly recommend the Now Playing app, which includes Netflix queue management. Sure, you have to set your XBox controller down for a moment to use it, but at least you can search for and add whatever you want.
I am dissapoint.
Microsoft sucks. Where's the proof that we the users wanted it that way? Hide behind that Corporate snobbish we know what you want crap. They make commitments, rush the programmers, can't make it, adjust what the programmers output just to make the date - and we get crappy user interface trash code.
Hey! Microsoft kows what you think...not! Un-freaking-professional! That's a newbie response. What about honesty! Yeah, we are not happy with it, but we are working on improving it to the customers satisfaction. The customer is always right. Why can't they just be market driven to us and not to their freakin snobbish boss trying to save money by cutting down programming time. ASHES and you know what I mean.
That sounds like a very "Microsoft" attitude. Ignore what the users say, we know what you really want.
I think Microsoft should make an engadget app. :hilarity ensues:
Only 50 per category? I thought it was 100.
Anyway, I have the update and I think it's great. It's definitely better than what it was. The "handful" of categories are pretty much the only categories I can think of, comedy, thrillers, sci-fi, action, classic TV, children & family, drama, romance. Also, there are the new arrivals tv, new arrivals movies categories if I want to see what's new. There are also the "Like" categories that have other films/shows that are like other movies or shows that you've watched. Needless to say, I haven't been going to the website to queue any instant watch content since the update.
I also think it adds genres based on what you've watched, as I remember there being a documentary genre and movie classics added to my list of genres after using it for a day or two.
Boo Freakin Hoo .. Bunch of Wieners
I tell ya
Boy am I really getting frustrated with Microsoft's consistent inability to relate to non-business users of software applications. Business stuff (Sharepoint, Project Server etc...) fine, but when it comes to rolling out stuff to make our personal lives more rewarding with easy-to-use, intuitive and feature rich applications they just flat out continue to miss the mark.
How hard is it really add a feature rich search function to this?
I don't see what the problem is, okay I'd like to be able to search titles. But the fact that the newest titles arent' in ABC order, who the hell cares. If you go on the Netflix site, it's not in order of title but of date or popularity. So I say back off and let it be. I have to agree with Quix, SUCK IT Apple!!
Welp, this renders the update useless. The idea of being able to do everything on my Xbox coupled with the hope that maybe Netflix would finally get a good amount of content kept me continuing my Netflix subscription. Now: not so sure.
If you're using Netflix on your 360 right now you'll definitely like it a whole lot better after the update, even if it doesn't list all of the instant watch titles or include a search box.
So... where would we go to 'indicate' to microsoft?
Microsoft doesn't want to complicate things for you guys. You know, like renting movies was so difficult at netflix
"I think when people come to Xbox they're not really looking so much for functional, they really want to have fun, they want to be wowed."
That anyone would actually issue such a stupid comment completely floors me.
At least searching all titles by name should be there.... Probably they think it will be too much band with to leave out such an obviously useful feature. I however bet that 90% of users will never use it.
Starting a vote? I vote yes.
we see you liked ghost in a shell. my we suggest scooby doo?
*calls up netflix*
Well, these same people thought we wanted Vista.
I actually see about 100 movies from any of the particular categories. It is pretty annoying to scroll through everything, especially if you don't know exactly what you're looking for and just browsing. It would be alot nicer to have a split screen where on one side, you had a search box and as you typed, the other side filled up with movies that might match. That's how the FiOS channel search works, and it seems pretty intuitive to me.
What's so hard about adding a search box, allowing 'by title', 'by artist', 'by director'? This would be soooo helpful.
Are you kidding me Microsoft? Too lazy to code the proper search functions in? I have Netflix and use it on my 360 regularly but the whole point of the update was adding any movie from their Instant Streaming library. Now were restricted to what most users like compared to what I actually want to watch. Way to ruin things AGAIN M$.
i have the new update and a search feature would be super cool. if i want to find a uncommon video i have to do it on my pc an thats just stupid when you should be able to do it on the xbox.
How is it two steps back at all? They added a ton of new content, they just didn't add text search. So maybe it's one step forward when you wanted two steps forward, but it's hardly a net step back.
Microsoft obviously has it wrong. I was picked to do the X-Box Preview Program and this new update is better but it's like taking 1 step forward to take 2 steps back. I still have to go online to search movie's that I can't find on my x-box. This is not the original idea Microsoft nor Netflix wanted obviously. Ben Smith is obviously out of reach with the customers and doesn't realize that Netflix needs a search option. If it didn't than why does every Netflix box enabled (Ironically Including Windows Media Center in XP, Vista, and 7!!!!) have a search capability in it. I can't stand it going across several screens or Comedy to find out the one I'm looking for is not showing up on the whole list than to go online and search for it and put it in my queue. Why are we living in the past. Ok if they don't want to do the queue thing than why can they just have lists because we all know X-Box Live is all about lists. Alphabetical, Newest, etc.... Show me the whole catalog Ben Smith not what you think I want to see you obviously are out of touch.