Ask Engadget: Good input device(s) and user interfaces for the 'over 80 crowd?'
By Darren Murph 
posted Aug 20th 2009 9:03PM
posted Aug 20th 2009 9:03PM
"I am trying to configure out a really dumbed down and intuitive PC for my grandmother. She recently had a stroke and while she is under my care I would like to repurpose a laptop for her to surf and email her children. Anyone have any experience with what input devices and UI's are really understandable for the over 80 crowd?"We know this is a bit "out there" for Ask Engadget, but we get the feeling Mike isn't alone here. Anyone have any experience with unorthodox input devices and UIs designed for those with limited mobility and / or weakened vision? Spill the goods in comments below!
Anything from Verizon will do ;)
JitterBug!
DOS?
haha actually, I hate to admit it, but OS X does tend to be simplified enough for the over 80 crowd...
damn.
All the old guys at our work (two in their seventies and one who just turned 80) use XP actually. Don't ask me why, but the main selling points on that are the giant title bars and controls on windows ('X' '-' '' or whatever), and the fact that it's so old that it runs smoothly at really low resolutions (we're talking in the 600ish by 400ish range here :P).
My grandma actually likes Vista best though (I guess she needed an OS that would make her feel fast again)...
Also, Universal Access (larger fonts and such) is a pinch to set up (though Windows definitely has the same features).
Does anyone know of any ports of XO's Sugar OS? That or a netbook OS seems like the best choice.
P.S. How's your law blog going?
The Bob Loblaw Law Blog is doing well, thanks for asking!
PS: We're talking about Arrested Development :P
Good points here on the large titlebar and stuff. I have never messed with the OS X accessibility features, but I do know for a fact that XP and up have pretty good settings (also the DPI scaling on Vista and 7 is spectacular....not the crap that it is on XP).
Assuming OS X's accessibility functions are on par with Windows, I would recommend something you are comfortable with troubleshooting over the phone. They WILL screw it up and have questions, and I doubt you want to trek to their house every time to fix it.
As far as input, see how they handle a mouse. A trackball is what I would try next. You can also find large print keyboards.
@Annoying Poster, yea a custom Linux shell should be best. There are just to many damn things a old person can screw up.
Thank god we have remote desktop or tech support would be hell.
You sir are a mouthful!
Just don't lob a law bomb at me...
Well, OS X is pretty simple. AND it has the speech recognition feature which will help open programs without moving the mouse around.
Win7 and Vista have voice, it's not that great and if she just had a stroke her voice could be off. So voice controls should be kept away from for the time.
Wow. I totally forgot about that speech thing. *goes to turn it on*
"Tell me a joke."
"Knock, Knock"
"Who's there?"
...
"Who is there?"
...
"WHO IS THERE?!"
"Orange"
>:U
TRUE.
Oh yeah...I had no use for that feature either until now. It's so fun!
From the perspective of an allied health professional, computer access is not just about how one can navigate around the user interface. It's a far more complex cognitive and motor process that requires coordination of a number of systems. Is it possible for the author to provide more information on things such as cognitive abilities, language skills, fine motor skills, visual skills, etc regarding his grandma? It would be much easier for the readers to find out what may be suitable for her if we have such information at hand. The author may also want to provide information on what her grandma, not the author, wants to achieve. Cause the last thing you want to do is to force an old lady into a rehab program that she is not motivated to do at all.
Yeah...
"Oh, by the way, grams has alzheimer's"
XD
I have no direct experience with this, but my guess would be something designed for very young children would also work well for the elderly and/or disabled.
Also, even though I'm a certified Mac fanboy I will say that Windows still has far superior accessibility options and features.
Maybe MacOS 10. I find that my parents thought it was very easy to find out how to use.
Hackintosh if ur cheap else buy her an iMac
A few areas that you may want to consider are:
1. visual skills - poor visual tracking skills and deteriorated sight may requires a simple, easy to read, high contrast interface with minimal distractions (e.g. wall paper, small icons, etc). Depends on what kind of stroke she had and whether her visual processing skills are affected or not, you may also need to consult with SLP / OT on visual information processing (SLP) and positioning of the monitor (OT).
2. fine motor skills - some stroke patients may have rather limited fine motor skills, resulting in difficulties using the normal input devices. You may need to look into assitive devices starting from simple items such as keyboard w/ keyguard to devices such as switch interfaces for people with very limited motor skills.
3. language skills - accept it, you need to be able to understand what's on the monitor to operate a computer. make sure that your grandma is not affected by any accquired language disorders (often a result of stroke or TBI). you may need to look into visual strategies which your SLP will be able assist you on.
4. cognitive skills - besides understanding what's written and what's represented on the screen, your grandma needs to be able to make sense of all these things happening. Again, assessments by a SLP / OT is required.
Feel free to let me know if you have any further questions.
Vista and OS X both have great accessibility features, where she can speak to her computer instead of using a mouse and keyboard.
If you're going to go Vista, though, maybe a capacitive screen computer (HP Tablets, for example) would work, as pushing down on a screen is easier than moving around with a mouse and clicking the left and right buttons.
That will depend on the fine motor skills of the client. No doubt that touch screen is more direct and intuitive compared to the usual mouse / pointing device, but tremor and involuntary hand movements can wreck havoc to the whole experience and no OS in the market features settings that can compensate for these conditions.
As much as I would love to say some Linux Variant, Im going to have to say OSX for the simplicity of the OS.
However, I dont think thats the best choice for the most basic scenerio. Go XP (will work on hardware you already have) and just have it start IE (or FF) in Full Screen Mode right off boot. That eliminates dealing with menus and all that stuff.
This.
Let's face it, she probably won't be poking around most of the operating system. Just set up a browser to automatically launch at boot with a customized home page (like iGoogle), and pre-logged in websites that she'd use set up in a one-click bookmark bar at the top.
Pre-set some high dpi options in your favourite windows OS (xp or vista) and you're all set.
Most everything (chat, mail, photos, etc.) can be accessed via the web, and it streamlines the experience to have everything all in one place. There's really no need for her to even separately launch a chat client to talk to her children/grandchildren, because Web-based is simpler.
A bonus is that a browser such as firefox can zoom pages no problem so that she can see them easily.
Basically, the key to this setup is to make it all ready for her so that she won't experience any hiccups along the way to accessing her stuff.
I set it up so that I can take control over other peoples computers to fix their problems. As long as they didn't cut their ethernet cable everything is good.
I was showing my grandma how to use a computer a while back with windows 7 and she seemed to get the idea. Although had to max the size of all fonts and everything. She like the voice commands, but wouldn't really work out unless i wrote a list for her.
Windows XP. With the accessibility options, and lots of programs available to use with XP. And disable if you can any hot key combinations. People who are excellent with computers accidentally turn these on, let alone some one who isn't so skilled with computers.
Lets face it were not talking about "baby boomers here" most people of that age are too cheap to buy a mac. Although, with recent price drops the iMac is the most affordable all-in-one pc I would buy. That said I'm a Windows guy, but the offerings from HP and Sony are overpriced and Dell uses Intel integrated graphics in most models in the same price range.
I mention all-in-one units as I would guess that would be a sensible option as most people of that age have downsides their living space.
Windows is a great option if you consider it supports off-the-wall products that old people may buy.
Agree with what you mentioned about after market addons with windows. Currently, most adaptive / assistive technologies for computer access are designed for windows based system. Considering the client's condition may further deteriorate in the future, it would be sensible to put this into consideration.
OSX needs to have a Simplified Finder that OS-9 used to have.
Not Simple Finder. No , OS-9 had a very simple interface designed primarily fro kids that made two larger "folders" available as your "desktop."
One shows available applications with big icons. The other was documents you created, with big icons.
That's it.
To get back into the Finder, you had to use a password.
Very elegant and it did the job it needed to do very well.
I would think that a Linux distribution would have something like this,
or OLPC's Sugar on a Stick might work if tweaked properly.
Microsoft Bob!
Sorry for the rant, but with the information that we have here, most users' replies are more or less like trying to complete a lunar mission without even sending the probes to the moon first. We need to know what's needed before something can be recommended. Otherwise, it will just be a guess, be it MacOS, windows, linux or DOS.
Or a box that connect to the TV with a wireless keyboard.
Does she really need it? And do they really need it? Sounds like creating problems to me.
Exactly.
We don't even know what she needs and what she wants. We have no idea what level she is at skill-wise.
What people here doing are just guessing and they're not even educated guesses.
Uneducated guesses or not, it is unlikely that the "client" will come onto a gadget blog and post her exact condition, her prescriptions, and her social security number. People are suggesting various different options, which other people looking for answers may stumble upon, helping them develop a solution that fits in their individual situation.
No need to sound like a tool.
Why not pay a child (in basic staples such as food, shelter, breathing holes in its sleeping box, etc) to do the 'inputting' for her?
PointerWare is actually probably the best option for the older crouwd
The most useful device remains grandchild. No matter what, you'll need somebody to solve the basic problems regularly -- I just got the phone call "I left for 30 minutes and everything's black!" today. Program-wise, elderly people need 1: a web browser with favorites 2: an e-mail client (or just yahoomail -- my father still uses excite)., and 3: a way to connect their digital camera and save their pictures. Feature-wise they need accessibility. I've never met an elderly person that could understand speech commands intuitively, but magnifiers & on-screen keyboards.
An EKG monitor?
I don't think the Operating System matters.
A completely untech user isn't going to care about the subtleties that the different OS's provide.
Make the fonts big. Put big Icons to the programs they use on the desktop.
"You click on this one for the Web, and this one for email"... and that's pretty much all they need. Unless your gran is writing an essay.
Does anyone know a good website out that gives advice on this topic? I saw some simple suggestions on eHow (http://www.ehow.com/how_2362466_help-elderly-become-comfortable-computers.html), but there must be something more comprehensive out there.
How bout an abacus?
At age 84, my Dad was charmed by the first HP TouchSmart he saw, and had to buy it. He's in pretty good health and has never had a stroke, but apart from playing solitaire and demonstrating how to use that touchscreen he just doesn't have the inclination to use the computer. He loves to have his visiting kids and grandkids use it, though. He often asks us to look something up, or check a particular website, or get photos printed. He enjoys being included in photos or videos, and he sits or stands behind us to look at photos or videos, maybe read an email message. I check his email for him regularly, and he dictates his replies. We watched a ball game at MLB.com but he really prefers his regular TV.
I'd guess that if your grandmother doesn't already have a computer, she may not have the inclination either. And if she's recovering from a stroke, she may not have the energy. But she may well appreciate having the computer to watch her family interacting with it, so long as the cost of Internet connection is not a burden for her. You might ask her if you can install one, and if it's OK with her, set it up so she can use it easily too, then see what happens.
My dad bought a laptop for my grandpa who is now 87. Get her a mouse. Basically, he set it up so my grandpa could open the internet, have his Gmail account open, and read his email - my Grandpa wanted to get these stock digests. Anyway, I would suggest installing LogMeIn on her computer, so if she ever has a problem, you can log in and fix it for her :).
Dell has some reasonably priced all-in-ones. You can get them with or without a touch screen.
WHAT? Input devices for people over 80? The only input they need is from the death panels.
Hand/eye coordination problems are especially prevalent (e.g., essential tremor), so a roller ball mouse is best, and it is best to teach keyboard equivalents of mouse actions, where possible.
I have to disagree on the roller mouse. I do think it would be more confusing than a regular mouse, both of my grandfathers used a regular mouse pretty well and have few problems.
Hmm, as I am currently helping my grandfather with his computer, I think I can help. Get a big mouse, no really, get it big but not unwieldy, don't bother with the scroll wheel. No offense to anyone over eighty, but most will NEVER figure it out. Keyboard, the clickier the better, it will help them associate better. The monitor should be large so that everything can be huge on it, but at the same time, an old CRT will do the job just as well.
As for OS, I have to throw in my hat with XP. Vista is ok but with the UAC, it is very confusing, so if you get Vista just disable it. Now, I knew a guy (my step(?) grandfather) who was 95 and had a ball with the mac OS, but at the some time, he had a computer tutor come twice a week... so in my eyes that is not a ringing endorsement.
Install all the virus and spyware stuff you can get your hands on, old people are gullible. We had to trash my Grandfather's last computer because he kept on opening spam and downloading anything he was told to. Also, make sure it is fully automatic. Set up the desktop as simply as possible and explain everything in detail.
My final word of advice is just not to do it honestly. You will never again have a day of peace, your phone will ring off the hook with questions (especially with ones you answered many times before).
I have to agree with your comment about old people are gullible. My family recently purchased a laptop for my grandmother's birthday, and we got her a white MacBook with OS X Leopard. My grandfather owns an HP which he bought for himself, and is proficient enough with it, and the one he had before it, to transcode records to MP3 CDs, a system which he setup himself. He is 82 and my grandmother is soon turning 80. Anyway, the other day I got a call from them while they were using the mac. They had accidentally clicked on a bad link in Google and ended up on one of those pages with the fake Windows style box saying that they had a virus. Fortunately, not only were they smart enough to call me, but it wouldn't have given them any viruses or spyware since it was a mac. So I think macs are the best machines for those who don't know much about computers. It keeps them safe.
Look into Windows Steady State if you use XP or Vista, soon to support Windows 7 I think.
It will let you lock down all the shortcuts and access to only things you want them to access, library/school computer lab style.
Lots of problems disappear when you do this.
I also suggest Firefox as a browser so you don't always have that stupid popup bar coming down to ask if you're really sure you want to use the internet.