Last minute Apple rumor roundup: iPhone HD video out, no new iPod touch?
By Nilay Patel 
posted September 9th 2009 11:23AM
posted September 9th 2009 11:23AM
There's also been an interesting press release this morning from Harmon Kardon, which is touting that its new Bridge III iPod / iPhone dock and AVR 2600 and 3600 receivers can "play back HD video from iPod or iPhone products." Seeing as there's no (official) way to even get HD video onto an iPod or iPhone right now, that seems to indicate there's a change a-comin' -- and seeing as we've already gotten the iPhone 3GS to play back 1080p video, the addition of HD video support to at least some of the i-line seems like a no-brainer. We'll see what's true and what's just wishful thinking soon enough -- the liveblog starts in just a little bit!
Update: And just in case you couldn't get enough sketchy cases, Cygnett has some listed on its site that seem to show a new nano screen size, as well as a new touch with a camera. Things are definitely heating up, stay tuned.
Read - AppleInsider leaked list of new iPod models
Read - Harmon Kardon says new dock can play back HD video from iPhone
For the last time, the 3GS played back 1080p video just fine -- it only failed at super high bitrates and when it tried to decode surround audio. The normal 1080p file didn't have any problems. Go watch the video again.
That's disastrous if true. Merely matching one of the Zune HD's features but keeping the same hardware lineup for the iPod Touch kills it in comparison. Not to mention the fact that in the referenced 1080p test, the 3GS barely managed to convert 1080p video, with frequent stuttering and crashes. I have to say I doubt the 2nd gen Touch's ability to play any HD video, meaning that's likely for the 3GS only. Sure, the iPhone 3GS is competing fairly equivalently against the Zune HD at that point, but without a standalone iPod that comes anywhere close to what the Zune HD offers... (Before anyone bashes me for bringing up the Zune: Too bad. It's incredibly relevant and you're amazing shortsighted if you don't see that)
Regardless of what Apple does, it will still sell well - case in point: iPhone 3GS.
But those of us who actually know what we're doing will be getting a ZuneHD.
"But those of us who actually know what we're doing will be getting a ZuneHD."
That's a heck of an assumption. I'm sorry but the ZuneHD has a lot to prove and a long way to catch up. Flashy hardware does not make it a competitor yet. I'll give it a good 6-months before even considering a ZuneHD as we need to see whether it will succeed as a platform. Right now the safe investment is the iPod Touch.
Dude, the 3GS played back 1080p video with stereo audio just fine. It was a 30MBps 720p video it couldn't play back -- a file that exceeds the Zune HD's specs as well. It also failed to decode surround audio in the Avatar file and crashed, which isn't rocket science to fix. Go watch the video again -- does it or does it not play back GI Joe perfectly?
Bigger point here wasn't the crashing or stuttering(though that's important as well), but the fact that it was just down-converting video which is a lot less strenuous than actually outputting it. This leads me to believe that any HD output should be the same 720p as the Zune HD. The biggest point of all here, though, was that said video was played on the 3GS. There's no way in hell the iPod Touch(without any hardware upgrade) will be able to handle the same.
How is decoding a 1080p file and *scaling it down* less strenuous than just playing it? And if it is less strenuous, why do you think the lower-powered hardware in the touch can't do it?
@Screw Harry: Because it's not actually playing it at 1080p. The CPU is does the downscaling and then it sends the information from that to the graphics chip. The main strain of actually playing HD video(or any video for that matter) is on the graphics chip. When the CPU takes away all such work by down converting the video, the graphics chip doesn't have to do anything but play an already known to be working resolution. As for the original iPod Touch not being able to handle it: A: If it was, don't you think we would have seen it, rather than only seeing it happen on the iPhone 3GS? and B: I'm talking about being able to actually play HD video at an HD resolution, down converting an HD video and then playing that is of no practical use.
>> seeing as we've already gotten the iPhone 3GS to play back 1080p video
Uh, you mean when the video froze and there was no audio? You know, when it downconverted the video?
and the reason for the session today is for apple to advertise that they have nothing new to offer?
not likely
I imagine the event will be like this now that I am depressed from this news:
Steve Jobs: Check out my new glasses. Converse made them! Oh yeah and iPhone has HD, GOODNIGHT EVERYBODY!!
*4 hour rock show starts*
Nice try Engadget (wouldn't expect anything less misleading and sensational from Nilay), but no one with any common sense buys this sort of tripe:
"seeing as we've already gotten the iPhone 3GS to play back 1080p video"
If by " already gotten the iPhone 3GS to play back 1080p video", you guys mean:
- stuttering
- freezing
- altogether crashing
Virtually every step of the way, then sure, you got it to play back 1080P video alright, but by the same token, so could my rigged Ti-89 calculator.
If true, do you really think that this is what is going to be demonstrated? If this is what is going to be unveiled today then I put money on it that it will work.
FM Radio on Nano PLEASE Please please.......
I agree this would be nice, but it's NEVER going to happen.
Sweet, my Harman Kardon 2600 just shipped yesterday.
Yay!
Wat is more useful on a mp3 player a camera or a FM/DAB Radio......... RADIO
Why not Medium Wave? Sorry but the only radio stations that I listen to are on either MW or LW so FM/DAB is damned useless to me.
Good thing everyone is not you Kelmon, but way to speak up for the rest of us...ahem.
The iPod classic 160gb has been out just wasn't available for purchase .. i've seen them at flea markets and my gf got one from a tech convention she went to. so 160gb isn't a new model ... it's prolly just being sold from the website after today.
Bring on the Nike+ integration into the nano! One less piece to worry about losing. Hopefully they can add an HRM and update the software to allow for intervals.
Wow, if you are serious enough about training to want that much out of Nike+, why not get a Garmin with HRM? It does all you're asking with much better accuracy.
"and seeing as we've already gotten the iPhone 3GS to play back 1080p video..."
ummm....ok
"but there were some major hiccups: high bitrate 720p video off the GH1 stuttered during playback, and loading the Avatar trailer consistently crashed the phone's audio driver until we restarted."
yeah, thats what I thought.
This would be a very bad move if Apple did not come out with a new ipod touch..
They had a problem with the camera, what do you want them to do?
I wasnt being negative about it but I was just looking at it from an investment point of view. The market is so fickle that if Apple did not lead up to expectations..well ya know
Epic Fail, for once I hope engadget is wrong.
Ditto, I'm rooting for the Zune HD to do well, but I want to see that happen against tough competition. If there's no new iPod Touch... It's just not really a fair contest.
@ Scott
how do u know they had issues with the camera?
"leading some to believe its upgrade has been delayed due to rumored technical issues with the camera module"
I must be the only one that wants a hard drive Ipod Touch in addition to the flash models. ; )
No, you just haven't learned that it's not possible yet. The spinning magnetic disk in a hard drive interferes with capacitive touch screens, meaning that it's just not possible to have a hard drive in one of these and have the touch screen actually work.
Thanks for the explanation. : )
I have an iPod Touch 1G and a friend here in Japan just bought an iPhone. She showed it to me. It's a camera and a video camera that takes crystal clear video. The human eye can't tell much difference on the iPod Touch screen greater than 720p. 1080p is just a waste of everyone's time unless you are going to port it to TV. But Apple understands that nobody actually wants to do that. Microsoft seems to think so.
Her iPhone also has an external speaker and a microphone. I can't think of too many more features that could be added other than GPS.
So Apple should just focus on adding GPS, perhaps a new shell design in different colors, tweaking the already great OS, and possibly stopping the Apple store from disabling my free apps.
My only complaint with my iPod Touch 1G 8GB is the Apple Store disabling my free apps.
I bet Zune HD is going to be a big let down once people see how fuzzy the video is resizing 720p to fit the screen. We'll just see. Perhaps it won't even work out of the box. After all, the original Zune HD project manager quit.
You don't seem to understand how HD playback works... the Zune HD and the iPod Touch/iPhone have lower than VGA max resolution(420x272 and 420x320, respectively), meaning any HD video played on the actual device will be down-converted to that resolution first. So it'll be playing at the same resolution of the screen on the device and look crystal clear. It doesn't actually play 720p on that screen(or 1080p for that matter).
Mark... don't feed the troll. Ren isn't interested in an honest technical discussion. He just wants to bash the Zune HD and praise the iPhone/iTouch.
I encode video to about 900p for iPod touch. There is no lag watching unless the video was originally encoded incorrectly. I also free up all available memory using smbprefs.
Our poor, poor thumbs.
There are MANY legal way to get HD video into iTunes, most, if not all, of the podcasts I watch are available in 720p at a very good bit-rate. I'm SO sick of people only being concerned with resolution as well, high bit-rate 720p will look better than much lower bit-rate 1080p with high motion content ANY DAY!
knowing apple, the iPhone HD out cable will be iPhone->display port, forcing you to buy a Displayport->DVI adapter
Well, I kinda already knew there wasn't going to be a new Touch. I work in the Electronics department at a local Wally World and for the past two weeks, we haven't received any Nanos or Shuffles, but we HAVE been getting plenty of 8 and 16GB Touches. I just assumed they were releasing new Nanos and Shuffles and skipping over the touch. Despite the fact that the new 3GS hardware would be nice for those wanting to game on the thing.
No new Touch? Not even a 64GB model?
Damn.
What press conference was I watching?
"I seriously doubt you are ever going to see GPS in the touch. The iPhone doesn't do GPS by satellite signal, it does it by cell tower triangulation."
This is not true. There is a real GPS in the iPhone 3G and 3GS. They can also do cell tower triangulation as well as use Skyhook WiFi registry information to get their location with less precision. Where some confusion may occur is that the iPhone GPS on the 3 series is AGPS, which has come to have two meanings, but both are real GPS. Fist some phones offload the GPS computations to the cell network, and call this AGPS. Those phones must be in a cell to have a GPS location, this is still real GPS not just using the cell tower information. The second usage (and this applies to the iPhone) is that the cell tower can assist in making a lock faster for the GPS unit. It is optional for the iPhone and others in this category. Their GPS works perfectly fine outside of cell tower range in the hinterlands.
In either case, AGPS is real GPS. It just has two recognized definitions unfortunately. But rest assured the iPhone 3G or iPhone 3GS will find a lock on the GPS satellites even if you are in some backwoods area or even over in a foreign country where the assistance is not available from the cell system.
Best regards,
Tjp