Earlier this week the internet alarms rang loud with word that Microsoft had added an app "kill switch" to its upcoming Windows Mobile 6.5 platform. Of course, such a kill switch is not unprecedented, as both the
Android and
iPhone platforms have their own variant. A Microsoft rep recently relayed a message of peace to assuage fears, telling
Ars Technica that the vast majority of app rejections won't cause a remote uninstall, and it'll only be used if the app "exhibits harmful behavior or unforeseen effects" -- not that we're entirely assured by the latter scenario, but wording aside, it does echo statements from the aforementioned companies that have so far been very conservative with its use (i.e. we can't recall a single instance of its use). "While we hope to avoid this scenario," he said, "we will make refunds available in such cases." Only time will tell just how trigger happy Microsoft gets, assuming they ever use it. Hey, just be happy we know about it -- remember the last time we were surprised to
discover such a feature?
posted Sep 18th 2009 5:57PM
METAL!!!!
Yes, MS COPY MACHINE won the gold medal as expected. :)
if they do that tho they wont have their 70000 apps ;)
It should have a hard key that says ABORT!
Killswitch Engage is your idea of metal? How sad.
No actually not. I hate killswitch, i would prefer arch enemy.
"Kill Switch..Click" is better, and had their name long before KSE ever stole it and made crappy metal.
App store? Meh, I'll stick to installing my own cab files, thankyouverymuch.
THIS... IS... MY... CURSE!!!
does this mean the end of winmo heartache? it must not fail.
only reason im posting is because of guitar hero
Then you shouldn't have posted.
if your knowledge of music and bands comes from guitar hero you should be ashamed of yourself.
that has to be my favorite picture i have seen on engadget in the 4 years i have been here. awesome!
Kill switch? Meh, that's fine.
They can kill switch whatever they want.
I can still get apps from wherever I want, unlike certain other companies.
Look_Around_You,
Spot on.
XDA-Developers, PPCG, PPCW, Handango, PocketGear, etc are loaded with apps for WinMo, be it paid apps or free ones.
Isn't choice a wonderful thing.
For Apple fanboys (taken from dictionary.com):
Main Entry: choice
Pronunciation: \ˈchȯis\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English chois, from Anglo-French, from choisir to choose, of Germanic origin; akin to Old High German kiosan to choose — more at choose
Date: 13th century
1 : the act of choosing : selection
2 : power of choosing : option
iTools should be mindful of definition 2: "YOU have NO choice"
@ WindowsFTL,
1 word:
redsn0w
@ look around you
You're right for now. What I'm concerned about is if the Marketplace starts locking down exclusive distributions.
@ WindowsFTW
Don't forget the actual developers. Some of my best PDAware experiences, especially with premium apps, have been dealing directly with developers. Put a middleman inbetween and the entire experience from beginning to end starts to degrade.
logicbomb.de:
one word: illegal
also: celltower terrorism
When Apple did it, all hell broke loose in the comments...
"We're sorry. Your use of OpenOffice is *harmful* to our profits. It has been uninstalled for you. If you wish to use productivity software, please enter your credit card number, and the already-installed Microsoft Office suite will be activated."
Learn to read tard. Windows MOBILE 7, not Windows 7. Whose using Open Office on Windows Mobile when it already comes with Office?
How is he a tard? You wouldn't be okay with it's use on your desktop, why should you be okay with it's use on your phone? We have already seen the effects with Kindle, and as mobile platforms evolve, and take on more capabilities (what if Apple came out with an ebook reader for their iPhone for example and pulled a 1984), we may yet see it again.
Just because they haven't yet doesn't mean they won't. It only depends on whether or not they can get away with it and I would prefer for these companies to recognize that 'Hey! It's my device, so don't **** with it without my permission'.
PG: You're correct in that I was scanning over the article too quickly and missed the "Mobile" part.
That doesn't excuse your poor manners. I hope you resolve whatever insecurities you have that result in this behavior.
In any case, my original comment may be taken as a foreshadowing of what you may see in the future on your desktop.
Because people are jumping to conclusions, it's no different than antivirus software removing malware/viruses. There are already tools like this built into Windows and now OS X snow leopard too - they detect malware and block them from running. This is just doing the same thing on a mobile device. Or would you rather malware would keep running on thet network - chewing up bandwidth, slowing down the phone, sending massive text messages, making outbound phone calls without your permission?
None of these app markets have access to authors source code so don't know what exactly is being released. I could very well make an app for the iphone right now that when launched would let them play a game but at the same time sends massive amounts of spam without them knowing. Apple would have no idea until later either, and with no kill switch no way to stop the app from continuing it's damage.
Quit jumping to conclusions.
@PG, last time I checked I the user chose when to download anti-virus apps and when to use them. So your comparison doesn't work. If this was such a great idea, then why don't they use it for Win 7? Also why haven't they already implemented this before? Doesn't WinMo have loads of apps out there in the wild?
There should definitely be an opt-out for people who are smart enough to go around downloading untested apps.
Cdice - another tard. It's called Windows Defender; its included and built into Windows Vista and Windows 7. OS X Snow Leopard also comes with a malware detection utility that blocks 2 known malwares floating around; you have no choice - both block malware and are included in the OS. You believe in UFO's, bigfoot and the boogeyman too? Your conspiracy theories are ridiculous.
It's not meant against malware, it's meant to control your stuff, and that is for commercial reasons.
Also on the subject of windows defender, that is still optional AFAIK and can be uninstalled.
And on a personal note: I freaking hate viruskillers that won't let you exclude files from being detected, since half the useful utilities you can get are considered 'virus' or 'malware' when in fact it's just not playing their corporate DRM game and allows capturing steaming video for instance, or allows you to monitor your system, dumb and compliant is how they like you.
Some times I think the guys at infowars are right.
Then i come to my senses and realize they are still a bunch of crazies.
While yes, the simple solution is if you don't agree with the companies policy, don't buy their products, as we are seeing an increasing number of products with these same time of "Corporate Self-Governing" policies, its scary to think we might hit a point were there is no company left WITHOUT such policies.
Personally I think any form of corporations taking the law into their own hands should be considered vigilantism, which is illegal and should be treated as such.
If they believe someone is doing something to affect the integrity of the network, or something illegal, they need to go through the proper channels of law enforcement.
meh, Apple and Microsoft both kinda feel like they have to protect themselves, is my thought on this whole shpiel. When your Iphone/windows mobile phone gets slow and buggy, most people will go ahead and blame microsoft/apple, since they made the damn thing. Why damage your reputation when the iFart app turns malignant instead of just getting rid of the damn thing...
Problem is, at this point, I'm stuck on either a Palm OS device, a WinMo 6.1 device (what I have now,) or a dumbphone.
Oh, or soldering a GSM cellular module to a netbook. That would work too.
I can see it now -- The desktop versions of Mac OS 11 and Windows 10 will have kill switches....
I'm pretty sure we'll all be on mobiles by then.
Windows already has one, when you get windows updates there is a Malicious Software Removal Tool update that will remove well-known trojans, viruses, etc.
I am sure some of the iFans will have a fit about how people yelled when Apple did this, so why is it OK for Microsoft? Here is the difference - the Malicious Software Removal Tool specifically lays out what is removed and the circumstances under what is removed (see the description at http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=ad724ae0-e72d-4f54-9ab3-75b8eb148356&displaylang=en). If Apple were to say specifically what they will remove, and have a good reason (no, taking up too much cell network is not a good reason, yes, an app that purposely deletes data they should not be is a good reason), and reimburse the cost of any paid app they remove, then that is fine. Microsoft says what they are removing in the link above, but if they decide to remove apps simply because they do not like them, then they deserve whatever criticism they get.
Also, compare the imgae for this article for the one for the iPhone: http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/07/iphone-hacker-says-the-device-calls-home-to-apple-allows-apps/ Nah, no favoritism towards Apple.
Thank you for the nod to Killswitch Engage. They are amazing.
No they aren't. Please venture outside of your little box that contains the "metal" bands on MTV.
meh.. I accidentally saw them live a couple months ago and thought they were pretty generic sounding for a metal band. They seemed like total douchbags too. Lots of fire and shiny things onstage though, but no one seemed into it.
@mason:
They're great, it's your opinion that they aren't. You should grow up and quit shopping at Hot Topic and talking about how corporate America is killing the world.
See what I did there? I assumed. Kind of a douche move, isn't it? Seem familiar?
But I don't do either of those things. It just that if someone thinks KSE is "amazing" they haven't scratched the surface of metal because they are many more interesting bands out there.
No, you're still assuming. I like KsE, but that doesn't mean I don't know about OTHER metal bands. It just means in the spectrum of heavy music, Killswitch happens to be one of the bands that I like. You're just not giving the guy the benefit of the doubt at all, man.
I trust Microsoft more than I trust Apple or Google. Still, kill switches are bogus in any case. The ONLY way I would condone this is if the kill switch was reserved for Apps gotten from the App store and MS keeps their hands out of sideloaded apps (which they had BETTER allow).
It's to stop malicious applications on the network mainly. It will probably be rarely used if at all.
What's it matter? The underground KITCHEN Community will just rewrite the ROM and kill the kill-switch anyway. It's the best part of a WinMo phone; every aspect can be modified and improved upon...
Next time they should throw a Lamb of God logo up there alongside a picture of Randy from Lamb of god cutting out steve jobs donated liver. (that he cheated to get...alongside everything he else he's gotten in life...See: Steve jobs Wiki)
A "kill switch" makes sense to me...If an application does "exhibits harmful behaviour or unforeseen effects"
I don't think it'll be in the interest of Windows Mobile 7, Android or iPhone platforms to be "trigger happy"...
Love the picture!! Band's good too (and not just the guitar hero song)...
"assuming they ever use it"
They spent money to make it. They'll use it. Be happy we know about it? FU. FU's all around.
This is gay, I thought winmo was all about unlimited unrestricted apps. Unless I'm missing something here.
Using gay as a derogatory term? What you're missing is a brain, obviously.
@Cheesus(Crust)
Just for the Marketplace. You can still get CAB files from anywhere and install them.
Ah! Then I agree, this is a nice feature! MY TOUCH PRO LIVES ON!!
It used to be, but:
- To better expose applications to users, Microsoft need to set up a store
- Obviously, if its an official store, Microsoft won't distribute malware
- Hence restrictions are necessary
On the iPhone, for example, I believe the killswitch is limited to apps that abuse CoreLocation. There are apps that Apple have approved and then pulled (such as NetShare, which allowed unrestricted tethering). These apps continue to work for people that have already purchased them. No remote uninstalling, even though it annoys the carriers. I'd totally expect them to remote uninstall it, but they haven't. I don't expect it'll be used lightly (look at the backlash it caused for Amazon!)
Who says you can't?
For WinMo you can *STILL* get your apps from:
XDA-Developers, PPCG, PPCW, Handango, PocketGear, and more. They are loaded with apps for WinMo, be it paid apps or free ones.
Furthermore, you can even share apps (via their respective cab files) between users via:
Email
Bluetooth
Networking
even IR on devices that support it
Isn't choice a wonderful thing.
@L
I actually think using the term "gay" here is very appropriate. Just like the word "cool" can easily be used to describe the opposite of Steve Jobs, or his hypothesized average body temperature.
(i.e. we can't recall a single instance of its use).
You never heard of Amazon?
"it does echo statements from the aforementioned companies that have so far been very conservative with its use"
Amazon isn't one of the aforementioned companies.
Microsoft copying Apple and Google? Since when is that news?
Thank Apple for starting this trend.
Has the remote kill switch EVER been used on any platform?
I'm quite positive that no distributer would ever risk the bad press they'd get from remote uninstalling an app that anybody would actually want. This seems to be an emergency measure put in place in case a trojan is discovered. If something is ever remotely uninstalled from your phone, changes are pretty good that you'll be happy it was.
So this app will remove windows mobile 6.5? it could have lagging effects on your hardware
That is one badass image, whoever made it.
Whatever Apple does, there is Microsoft to do the same.
i know something about you, Flatlander Woman.
KSE! Awesome band. Fantastic album too.
Obviously, someone told these pricks that this sh!t was funny.
Who's next, Palm OS?
in the Mobile OS where Apple has been, is where M$ will go.
When Apple introduced the App Store all the M$ drones banged on about how draconian Apple was, I am glad Android and WinMo have followed.
If you want to steal software and services by all means jail-break your phone but thankfully the vast majority of users just want their phones to work without all the viruses and malware.
I take it that you've never used a WinMo phone, because if you did, you'd know that Apple's policies of allowing applications on your phone (pretty much only through the App Store), and Microsoft's policies of allowing applications on your phone (through anywhere) is completely different. Also, you'd no that viruses and malware on WinMo are typically non-existent.
you dont know what your talking about. winmo doesn't need to be jail-broken because it isn't locked down to begin with. does it have drawbacks? yes. is one of them restricting how i use my own device? nope. and that's why ill stay with it. period. also, viruses? what viruses? i've heavily used winmo since its beginning and before that i used all the other mobile versions of windows since ce. i've used them with very heavy use of the internet and always have. i've never had a virus and i think you'd be hard pressed to find someone who has. in summary, please only intelligent comments in posts from now on. thanks
This has been a registered service on later wmo 6.1 builds and in all wmo 6.5 builds to date. What is ironic, you can simply disable the app kill deal by simply disabling the service on the device. The service on the all late model builds is called SoftwareDisable. You can use Dot Fred's task manager to disable it. http://www.dotfred.net/TaskMgr.htm It has no I'll affects on the wmo device.
Unless Microsoft implements some option to check to see if the service is enabled for an install from Marketplace, I do not see how they will be able to enforce this.
at least its winmo which differs from the other platform in at lease one important way: they aren't restrictive about winmo software developers. meaning you can just about get a program to do just about anything you like, in many cases completely free. also meaning it is easily "hacked" and modified to change behaviors and settings you don't like. for those still not following me, this of course translates into someone coming up with a hack or piece of software to defeat any killswitch microsoft attempts to implement. this is impossible or at least extremely difficult with the other platforms.