Government killing off LORAN-C navigation system, deems GPS good enough

Spare a thought for the noble LORAN network. It helped bombers and ships across the Atlantic in WWII and, since then, has served as a reliable system for helping sailors, domestic and otherwise, to find their position. Of course, now that everybody and their kid cousin has a GPS receiver in their back pocket the need for limited, complex, radio-based geolocation is somewhat reduced. So, the US government is killing it off, shutting down most of the towers on February 8, with those that stay online over the summer going decidedly offline this fall. The savings? $190 million over five years. The cost? No backup for our GPS system, meaning we'll be totally blind when the first wave of EMPs hit -- and don't try to act like they're not comin', man.

[BigD145 Posted Jan 20th 2010 2:46PM]

@Elaith What cost? It's a net savings over time.

[Jban Posted Jan 20th 2010 11:05AM]

Dark Angel all over again... first the EMPs, then, Jessica Alba in tight leather.

[paul34 Posted Jan 20th 2010 11:08AM]

@Jban

Even though JA always looked good, I actually liked her more in the Dark Angel days. mmmm

[Jban Posted Jan 20th 2010 11:10AM]

@paul34 ... mmm ...

[Cin Posted Jan 20th 2010 1:55PM]

@paul34
That's because she was like 17 when filming Dark Angel :P

Don't worry though, I agree, lol

[onlymyrailgun Posted Jan 20th 2010 11:24AM]

Btw, there will be 4 GPS systems operated separately by the US, EU, Russia and China by 2020, if my facts are correct. Allying with one of them should get you a backup when yours are fried (targetable intense microwave beams? I don't know) and theirs are not.

[MacBandit Posted Jan 20th 2010 12:43PM]

@onlymyrailgun

That's unless they all turn to high grade encryption the moment a war breaks out.

[edf Posted Jan 20th 2010 11:39AM]

Amelia Earhart will never make it home now.

[Jban Posted Jan 20th 2010 12:20PM]

@edf I do believe that she has already arrived home safely, as evidenced by her appearance in the movie "Night at the Museum: Battle of the Smithsonian."

[MacBandit Posted Jan 20th 2010 12:41PM]

Well if GPS goes down we can always revert back to using a sextant.

Besides if the EMPs hit for one they will have to hit in orbit and if they are dedicated enough to get them into orbit then I'm pretty sure they'll hit surface based targets as well meaning that most ships aren't going anywhere with or without GPS.

[Solidstate89 Posted Jan 20th 2010 12:50PM]

"we'll be totally blind when the first wave of EMPs hit"

And pray-tell how might radios still work after an EMP hit?

[funkyheff Posted Jan 20th 2010 12:53PM]

If there's one thing battlestar galactica has taught me, its that this is a horrible idea

[QMCMDean Posted Jan 20th 2010 12:56PM]

As a long time marine navigator (retired Navy 22yrs), I will note that no electronic system considered EMP back-up for another. The back-up is Celestial Nav... shooting the stars, still trained and practiced by seasoned navigators worldwide, along with maintaining a good dead-reckoning track. But I definitely wish a fond fairwell to that old friend Loran C, who joins it's older sibling Loran A and younger ones, Omega & SatNav, into the great electronic beyond courtesy of GPS!

[GV2811 Posted Jan 20th 2010 1:13PM]

I don't think they will cut it out, it's known that GPS satellites will stop working around 2012-2016.

[ambroid Posted Jan 20th 2010 1:24PM]

As a still practicing marine navigator i can only concur with QMCMDean's comment... However i will add that the biggest threat to the GPS system besides selective availability (the error until recently inserted by the US military) which is hopefully (in Europe anyway) being addressed by the new Galileo system which is due in 2014. But from solar flares, which could quite easily knock out the system as it stands today. and are a very real threat, as solar activity has been increasing dramaticaly over the last 7 or 8 years. Loran is just one of the many tricks up the mariners sleeve, but a valuable one at that, hence the european system has not only recently been given a reprieve but has been given quite a substantial overhaul!

just my 2p's worth

[rcappo Posted Jan 20th 2010 2:35PM]

I don't think they should tear it down, but have it as an emergency back-up system that might be able to get turned back on.

But yeah, we do need to cut some government costs to become more efficient so we can help victims of natural disasters and improve health care.

[onlymyrailgun Posted Jan 20th 2010 2:40PM]

I'm safe as long as I have the "Compass" app on my iPhone. Truly technological breakthrough...

[Freudslipped Posted Jan 20th 2010 3:23PM]

What, they don't watch 24???

[Troglodad Posted Jan 20th 2010 4:07PM]

So when do we get to buy some hardened, nuclear-proof LORAN bunkers the gubmint no longer needs?

[jeromestanley Posted Jan 20th 2010 7:37PM]

It would be a good time to "sneak in" a massive system upgrade under DHS funded projects a new/hardened system. They wait a year and turn on the next-gen system (eLoran?)

Unless the USgov decommisions all the sites, sells off the land all the towers and transmission sites are sitting on and then breaks down the equipment as surplus (building, xmitters, generators,) I don't believe in a total LoranC shutdown.

This site has good pics of the internals and good map of the coverage - everywhere you'd want to go in a crisis moment. http://www.jproc.ca/hyperbolic/loran_c_xmitter.html

[jtweed Posted Jan 21st 2010 5:04AM]

The U.S. Coast Guard’s notification of the termination of the LORAN-C signal also signals the end of an era for a certain generation of mariners... Couched appropriately inside a safety alert, the news might evoke certain memories for older mariners and serve as a word of caution for newer professionals… You can listen to a podcast on this topic here: http://commoditypodcasts.com/blog/2010/01/20/finding-our-way-home-again-with-marex/