Microsoft Kin notifications have up to fifteen minute delay
By Sean Hollister 
posted April 13th 2010 2:04AM
posted April 13th 2010 2:04AM
Microsoft's new Kin phones promise to let "Generation Upload" stay in touch with their friends via integrated, streamlined social networking. It's the main draw, the big selling point, the reason why teens, tweens and those who want to share pictures of huge fat men eating Chipotle burritos will get one. But unless you hit a manual refresh button, Microsoft says Kin will only let you stay in touch in fifteen-minute intervals. That's how often the company's servers will ping Facebook, Twitter, MySpace and Windows Live to grab info from the cloud. "We didn't want the device always pulling data from the network," said one engineer, citing battery life and immature social network APIs as primary reasons why. Our take? This might be how Microsoft intends to leverage cheaper data plans out of Verizon -- by subtly throttling data usage -- providing an always-on 3G experience at a tween-affordable price. We'll just have to see if "Heather M." appreciates that, when her clothing recommendation is subject to a quarter-hour delay.
As if the Kin needed more fail.
Fail comes in a package, and Kin is this package.
@TareG QUICK somebody notify the next of kin
meanwhile, 15 minutes later; Captain, we have received a sub space transmission; it simply reads DERP
@TareG
I'm in my 30s and I know everyone, maybe even MS, believe it's targeted towards teens but this could be pretty useful for my meager requirements from a phone since I use Facebook and Twitter (I haven't seen too much of the phone yet so can't make a final judgment on whether to get one). But for my old self, 15 minute intervals are fine, I check Facebook maybe only twice a day and Twitter maybe once a day. If anything, this might keep me more "connected" than I plan to be. I don't mind getting my emails in 15 minute intervals, whoever wrote me can expect to wait at least 15 minutes for a reply.
@jasonhaley
If you check Facebook once/twice a day, then this is DEFINITELY not for you. Either way, here's an easier solution: ANY ANDROID PHONE WITH A FACEBOOK WIDGET.
@TareG WTF?
@jasonhaley
I hear you, but maybe you're too old. Everyone uses social networks for faster communication, otherwise we'd still be married to email. Social networks are like SMS with pockets...
@TareG
Fail? the "immature social network APIs" argument is valid. Most social networks relay on polling instead of using a subscribe/publish messaging architecture. My guess is that their service will become more streamlined (no pun intended) once their service becomes better integrated with the different social networks. Collaboration is key in the mobile advancement of the web.
@TareG
The Kin OS is missing some features that, in my opinion, are crucial for social networkers. First of all, there's no native calendar nor is there support for syncing your Outlook or Google calendars. If Kin's main goal is to connect people together, then why isn't there a way to create and share events via a social calendar? There's also no native IM client, which seems strange for a phone that's built for messaging. Lastly, Kin lacks support for uploading photos or videos to Twitter. You can upload videos to your Facebook or Myspace profiles, but forget about Twitter. Also, if you're a heavy app user, you'll be disappointed to learn that there's no software development kit currently available for the Kin phones, nor is there an app store. For now, you're stuck with what's preloaded on the device which doesn't even have some sort of photo editing or video editing software built into the studio. To edit a clip or photo, you have to download it to your PC first, edit it in a third-party program, then re-upload to the Kin Studio to share with your friends.
If this isn't a fail, I don't know what is.
@TareG They probably will circumvent this by expading the number of words allowed by message, if this is going to be forever, they will lose the teen market that ALWAYS stay connected.
Is the average kids sending 5 messages a minute? why they accept 1 every 15 minutes? I think someone will need to upgrade their servers.
@TareG
Honestly, what teen uses a calendar. I don't know anyone who uses a calendar unless they do for work. I don't think the calendar is going to be a huge deal. You are also describing things that a smart phone has, which this phone is not. Yes so regular phones have calendars and IM but the calendars are hardly usable (don't sync natively for example).
This is a new phone, first generation with the ability for over-the-air updates. If Microsoft finds it critical to have an IM client, they'll make one and push it out. When they're ready for the calendar they'll push it out. The key feature of these devices and WP7 devices is the over-the-air updates. We don't have to wait for the carrier to decide when they're ready to update, Microsoft will just do it Windows Update style. They can easily port Facebook apps and other things if people who use these phones express that it is what they want. Right now it's just a bunch of techies saying it should have this and that, where in reality a 13-year old kid would be discovering the capabilities for days if not weeks or months as they see how the timeline builds.
To us they look like crap and are missing a lot of features but then again, how many of us were running and analyzing surveys and discussing with their target demographic?
@TareG
You mean Apps. Yeah, I hear there uh... pretty common nowadays on...
Oh... this is a feature phone? Thanks Microsoft...
@TareG
photos & videos to Twitter??? R u ok?
@TareG
If you only check once or twice a day this could work for you. Android is always on and always downloading.
@Birdman yes and android costs probably more, has more expensive data plan, is bigger and droid much heavier, does not last more than a day on battery and does not sync everything with central web site and ...
dude, this is simply phone with really interesting media features, nothing more, nothing less. You probably own iPhone or Droid. Get over it, this phone is not for you.
@TareG , I agree that for me a calendar is critical. But look at the other top phones that Kin is competing against, phones like the EnV or the Rave. None of them have calenders either. I agree that a calendar would be a great feature, but I wouldn't overplay its importance to a market segment that generally hasn't used one.
@TareG the whole "fail" and "win" thing is really really played out.
KIN has no Instant Messaging
REASON: It can't be done on a 15 minute delay
LOL Fail
@bighap CTRL + R DAWG
@AlexSanchez
Real men use F5.
@spongebob92 I'd rather use Ctrl + W.
not for me
@uck I think people are misinterpreting this info. It checks every 15 minutes for new updates, right? So if your friend updates and your system checks it a minute later it will be shown. That's not a 15 minute delay, that's just a smart cycle of events. I for one do not care for the constant updates on my friend's bowel movements, so this phone is not for me anyway, but I can't see how this would be a deal breaker. Conserve bandwidth, and automatically keep your facebook fiending to 15 minute intervals!
I never liked the idea of always on. I can just text on my phone for days, but as soon as I turn on auto updating, my battery goes bye bye. I wish there was some sort of system SMS that carriers/OSes could use to minimize data usage. There's plenty of information that can be sent in 160 characters, and if it looks important enough, you can just pull the rest of the data
@EGOvoruhk There is. Motorola supports it. I believe it's basically an offshoot of the notification method used to indicate to you when you have voicemail (the notification icon).
@EGOvoruhk I do think at least part of the goal here is battery life, the "weekend without a charge". However, if that were the only goal, I'd say let there be a choice. Teens do want these notifications faster, there are the teens who send hundreds of facebook messages, texts, everything, if you are delaying their world they would consider doing things around the house or sacrifice 30 bucks to get the bigger contracts, or just beg daddy.
@EGOvoruhk
In 15 minute interval pings, you will see a very minor drain on batteries. It's only when the phones are set to every second - 5 sec ping that will drain your battery.
15 minutes is actually a good compromise without killing the battery.
For example, even on the E71, if I set the phone to ping services (about 3 services) and update accordingly, the battery lasts about 10 hours. Ok so you're thinking 10 hours is good, but for an E71, 10 hours is pretty horrid.
Once I set it to check every 5 minutes, the phone will last almost 2 full days.
For the target audience these devices are aimed at who probably don't know or care enough to fiddle with settings, auto-setting it at 15 min intervals is a good solution. The reality is, even with per second pings, you usually dont get ppl updating that quickly anyhow. You find that in practical terms, you will get an update every 5-10 minutes from the friends on your networks.
15 min intervals, obviously, is too long if you are a power-user.
@ounkeo I find the point of making the target audience too ignorant for settings to be a kin to computer makers 15 years ago thinking kids wouldn't be smart enough to be hackers and typists, when in fact, it was their youth that gave them advantages to learning new skills and technologies. Yes, they don't know the settings today, but these are the same guys who will be able to use the iPhone, and Android phones better than their parents. (partial fail IMHO to both you and MS for thinking any different).
It's a freaking dumbphone, what do you expect?
Push notifications rarely works, and at least Kin users get to see a list of notifications!!!
I'm a user and lover of the iPhone OS, but even this is better. Seriously.
@jellotime91
This is better? Are you on crack? Even iPhone haters don't think this is better.
@tonicboy Yeah a 15 minute delay is pretty bad, but as I said in my first post, push notifications rarely work, and at least on this you have a history you can look back on when you miss something.
I love my iPhone and I truly believe it's the most well-rounded OS out there come 4.0, but the notifications suck bawls.
@jellotime91 Well I sometimes get my notifications instantly. Rarely its more than a minute.
@kyphem the point is that it's not 100% reliable anyway.
@jellotime91
I think your point is weak,
Push works well for everyone otherwise people will make huge deal out of it! It always push me the information within a minute, maybe you set something wrong there. How can a 15mins delay be better?
@Geekelo I am not saying the 15 minute delay is better. I'm saying that push doesn't work in every application, look at Facebook's horrible implementation. And plenty of applications that have too many users suffer from very slow, delayed, and never occuring push notifications.
What I'm saying is, the delay sometimes occurs anyway on iPhone OS (although it's not likely as long a delay, but it's not always instant), and at least this piece of crap OS has a list that displays notifications you've received, instead of iPhone OS where you can only possibly have/view one at a time.
@jellotime91 I don't get why 15 minutes is bad. Its not like you can't just hit the refresh button?
@jellotime91
Well, don't tell MS its a dumbphone... they see it as their first batch of WP7 phones....
:'( you made ballmer cry
By the way, the name is still... so... very weird to me... first Bing now this?
At least Amazon's getting some free advertising
@suprizechainsaw
because that defeats the purpose of a notification service, does it not?
That would be like "pull notifications"... nothing about that sounds appealing.
@Wesscoast
This is not WP7.
It's Windows DumbPhone 7.
Big difference, even though Windows Phone 7 is pretty damn dumb.
@Wesscoast
Kin devices are not a Windows Phone 7 devices. They are a series of the Windows Phone family. Kind of makes sense of the whole Windows Phone 7 Series naming. I'm guessing if they would have kept that name these might have been Windows Phone Kin Series. Which actually sounds even more horrid.
@jellotime91
I know, they're going to phase WP7 in over time, but... I'm failing to see the 'customer loyalty' they're going to set up for WP7... by releasing this thing.....
@Wesscoast
first bing, now Ballmer..does sound a little weird, you are right..
@fastharryDOTcom Push Works great in my iPhone, and when I click "ok" it takes me to the facebook app. How is that poorly implemented?
@Colrath Uh, well first of all when facebook first got push, it barely worked for anyone, notifications were delayed, and it is still somehow unable to make sounds on alerts...
Not to mention when it alerts me to tell me someone commented on my status, I click ok, and none of the comments are visible even ones I have loaded before! Plus there is no way to refresh it and even when I exit the app and go back in still nothing loads...
The facebook app sucks bawls and their PNS rarely works properly.
Why delay? my BB gets spam instantaneousnessly after some asshat comments on my wall.
@n0ne I think we're being unfair when we compare Kin to smrtphone platforms. MS is going for the teen and tween market, and I see this phone as a messaging phone with Facebook, Twitter, and Zune features added on top of it, rather than a full smartphone platform.
Of course, we still don't know how much these phones will cost and what data plans will be required for them. If pricing is comparable to smartphones, it may be fair to put them in the same league as smartphones. But something tells me MS is going to make these really cheap to differentiate Kin from smartphones and especially their Windows Phone 7 line of phones.
@ai4281 I really hope they will offer it without data plan. It has WIFI, some of us have no need to read email, facebook, ... every 15 minutes if we have WIFI at home and at work or at school.
@n0ne
It's so funny reading these kinds of threads.
It's effing Fifteen Minutes! If you are anything like some of my Facebook addicted friends, you will be spending at least that much time writing on everyone else's walls! Perhaps all you guys just need to be permanently plugged into The Matrix.
It doesn't do IM.
The rest of this is just peanuts.
Where did you read it or hear it get mentioned?