Color us
unsurprised, but it's still notable to hear that Adobe is stopping investment in its software's capability to port content over to iPhone OS. The company's great hope on this front,
Packager for iPhone, will still ship as part of Flash CS5 as planned, but beyond that Adobe is essentially giving up on Apple's mobile OS until further notice. In spite of being repeatedly
rebuffed by Jobs and company before, the Flash maker had kept up hope that it could sway (or
nag) Apple into validating its wares, but the final straw in this relationship seems to have been Apple's
dev tool lockdown. So what will Adobe do now? Principal Product Manager Mike Chambers tells us that Android is doing
kind of okay and his company will shift its attentions to it and other mobile platforms. Of course, we're just giving you the cleaned up version -- for the full finger-pointing diatribe against Apple, you'll have to hit the source link.
Update: Right on cue, here's
Apple's terse response: "Someone has it backwards--it is HTML5, CSS, JavaScript, and H.264 (all supported by the iPhone and iPad) that are open and standard, while Adobe's Flash is closed and proprietary."
posted April 21st 2010 3:25AM
@desinerd
And Macs can use flash just fine, so that's irrelevant. And which Apple users are you talking about, specifically? Can you name them? Or are you just being an idiot and using a strawman argument because you know there is no such thing as "Apple users" that all behave in one specific way?
I mean you're being far more of a douche than any Apple users I know.
@Jack
I was talking about people like you.
I didn't say all apple users; I said "apple users who think they are better than people around them" and you my friend are one of them... and I enjoyed pissing you off
btw, I own an iPhone and Mac mini if that makes you feel any better
@desinerd
What message should I put inside tag? How about "Stop being a douche - switch to Android or wait for Dell Lightening"
@desinerd
Were you talking about me, or were you talking about people like me? Again, name them. Stop using a strawman to hold up your bitch sessions.
But since you're so sure about this, what gives you the idea that I think I'm better than people around me? Is it because I'm correcting people like you who are saying things that are factually incorrect? Don't you think that the problem is really the people who are saying things that are wrong? Or did that not occur to you?
Owning Apple products doesn't prevent you from being stupid, obviously, and what I said previously still stands - you're being more of a douche than I am, or anybody else that uses Apple products as far as I can tell. I mean how childish is it to pseudo-retaliate against iPhone owners simply because they own iPhones?
Seriously, grow up.
It's weird that the videos on Apple website still need quicktime and I have to use the crappy iTunes to sync my music and photos to iPhone
Apple really just took a dig at a technology for being closed and proprietary? Really?
@Bluesk1d
Flash IS proprietary and closed. It's not a dig, it's a fact. Apple, on the other hand, uses open standards like html5, opengl, opencl, png, mp3., mp4, H.264 etc. See the difference?
Steve wants to use HTML5 to make ads that impose on the iphone user http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wLuA9tPFfE. His own presentation. He just wanted something to deliver ads for free on the side of the dev. No need run up the tab there when the advertising part will be paying Apple for the time it is displayed. According to Steve, 1 ad can show on the screen during 3 minutes and that will be magical.
@fast
Actually, iAds is for 3rd party developers, not Apple. And since you seem to be confused, here are some facts about iAds:
1. iAds is OPTIONAL. Nobody has to use it.
2. revenue split for iAds is 60/40% in favor of the ADVERTISER, not Apple.
3. Did I mention it was OPTIONAL?
4. It's a way for developers of free apps to make some money. This isn't new, look at shareware sometime.
5. Your outrage and paranoia is hilarious. Go take a valium and take your tin foil hat off.
@ everyone that is supporting HTML 5
It is the future, or at least something similar to it will be the future.
but the question all of you keep avoiding is: What about now?
Yea HTML5 has amazing potential and everything but right now.... it kinda sucks because the current standard is Flash. I take nothing away from the format except that it still needs time to pick up, but until that happens everyone needs flash. If Jobs thinks HTML 5 is so amazing, why not put flash on the i-phone OS and prove that is not desirable in the face of HTML 5. If his predictions are true HTML 5 will prevail in the long run regardless of "buggy" Flash made by "lazy" Adobe.
Huh, there have been hobbyists trying to use javascript and html to create games in the past and some of them have created some cool and fun hacks but what I'm really wondering is if anybody has read up on what HTML 5 offers. It is created for marking up *text*.
Go look up the new HTML elements like 'header', 'footer', 'menu', etc, one big one will be 'canvas' that may allow for some cool hacked games, but these updates are meant to better display and layout web pages-- they are not meant to compete with flash... yet. HTML5 still cannot compete with Flash's vector graphics, collision detection, event listeners, existing libraries and tools, etc... stuff that make good *apps* (like games). The point here is that Apple knows this; Flash doesn't compete with HTML5 (they can coexist just fine) but the app store and it has always been this way. If you take Flash (or silverlight i guess) out of the web or make it less common, your only option to get the same experience is to run native apps... like iphone apps.
So it comes down to whether people want easy/free to develop ,platform-independent apps like Flash apps, or tightly regulated, subscription based development on a single platform for a single platform. Problem is that lots of people are already unintentionally casting their vote simply by buying a gadget that looks cool-- the debate is being 'won' not by logic and arguments but by sneaking it out from under our noses.
@lifetime
Platform independent? You need to install a proprietary plugin for flash to work. That is not the definition of "platform independent". And if people were only buying the iPhone because it looks cool, people would have stopped buying them years ago.
Not only have people not stopped buying them, the number of iPhones being sold is INCREASING. After THREE YEARS. Marketing doesn't do that, "cool factor" doesn't do that. A solid product does. So stop with the complete BS and face reality please.
@lifetime The issue is that people are confused... rather than saying HTML5, CSS3, JavaScript and WebGL, they are shortening everything to HTML5. Those four in combination are poised to reduce the need for Flash, not HTML5 alone. All four are open standards, and developers are free to use them if they don't want to be forced to use Apple's proprietary development platform.
My beef with Adobe is not necessarily with their "flash" on mobile devices, but with the company itself. Try upgrading their CS suite every year at a premium price of about $600, just for the upgrade. And these upgrades don't really give you much for the price they charge. They are greedy and like Steve said, "lazy". Apple is just embracing the future, just like they did when USB came out and most of the PC used that serial plug. For years people had to buy adapters to use USB, now it's standard. If Adobe would just make flash work without taking up so much of your device's resources, (especially battery consumption), we wouldn't be having this discussion. But they don't want to do that. So out with the old and in with the new. I'm stopping at CS 4 premium, I can't afford to keep up with their $600 minor upgrades.
"Someone has it backwards--it is HTML5, CSS, JavaScript, and H.264 (all supported by the iPhone and iPad) that are open and standard, while Adobe's Flash is closed and proprietary."
I thought crApple's SDK was closed and proprietary. Are the apps written in HTML5 and CSS are are they written in something called Objective C?
@desinerd
How is that relevant in the context of flash vs. HTML5? Every OS is written in some language. You're not making any kind of point here. And anybody can become an Apple developer by the way. So how is it closed again? You know, if anybody can do it?
@Jack
But when I make an HTML (including the ones with Flash animations) website, I don't have to kiss apple's but and do not have to ask their permission. After I make the website, I do not have to get it approved. I do not have to worry about which software I use to write the code. I can use Notepad or I can use Dreamweaver to make the website.
Even if I am using Flash, I do not have to get Adobe's approval to publish my website. Adobe doesn't care if I use any code not published in their actionscript library. People don't need to go to "Flash Store" to see my site.
So that's why Apple has it backwards
@desinerd But Apple don't have it backwards... they are not forcing anyone to use their proprietary tech to get their stuff on the iDevices. They are letting you choose.
- If you want deep device integration and access to their APIs, pay $100 for an annual developer license to put things on the store. The tools are free (and you can download them without paying the fee if you just want to learn or make apps for your own device only).
- If you don't need or want that deep hardware access, use open, standards-compliant web technologies. They fully support standards that don't require the user to download plug-ins and the developer to buy an expensive software license.
And I've said it before, but Apple are no different from any of the major game console manufacturers. You can't just publish software for Wii willy nilly, but you can build web sites that work with the Wii browser.
@desinerd
I'm assuming you meant you don't have to kiss Adobe's butt. But that whole thing is pretty hilarious, I mean are you under the impression that you have to get Apple's permission to make a web site? Using HTML5?
Seriously? Are you that dumb? HTML5 is open, buddy. Apple doesn't own it. You're not making an argument that makes any kind of sense at all. You don't have to get Apple's permission to make anything. If you want to develop for them, you can sign up to become a developer. Just like you have to do for Windows.
I'm still waiting for you to make any kind of point that makes any kind of sense. If you're trying to say that developing a web site is different than developing an application for a specific platform - um, DUH? You're not telling us anything we didn't already know, and it's certainly not a strike against Apple. Try a little harder, maybe?
Apple shot itself in the foot! It will take at least 5 years until HTML5 is the standard and used by 90% of the Internet.
We are talking about 3-4 phone generations. Nobody can even imagine what we are going to use for communication in 2015 if you take a look at the last 5 years.
Microsoft Phone 7 and Android will fill the hole.
Hilarious! "Someone has it backwards--it is HTML5, CSS, JavaScript, and H.264 (all supported by the iPhone and iPad) that are open and standard, while Adobe's Flash is closed and proprietary."
If Apple cared so much about being open and standard where is my FLAC support for iTunes?
H.264 open? Since when? H.264 is patented. The MPEG LA licenses the codec and while they have chosen not to collect royalties so far, their licensing terms are renewed every five years. And should they suddenly spring it, those fees add up.